Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?

[Guadaloopy 10975]

4 minutes ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Finally tested FSD and holy shit I hate it. Having to pay attention and keep hands on the wheel is far more stressful than just driving yourself. FSD is useless unless the driver can fuck off while it's engaged. 

It’s a very uncomfortable feeling the first few times you use it.  I don’t think that’s an indictment of the system, but a natural response that comes from trusting a machine to do something that you have had control of for your entire adult life.  

[956 Worldwide 34727]

Elon is very worried about tax dollars being wasted as Israel (maybe) bombs the last of the F-14s that the Shah bought from us for 2 billion dollars in the 1970s.

[aggie08 21505]

1 hour ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Elon is very worried about tax dollars being wasted as Israel (maybe) bombs the last of the F-14s that the Shah bought from us for 2 billion dollars in the 1970s.

To be fair, that was a really good movie from 2022.

[F250 28787]

2 hours ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Finally tested FSD and holy shit I hate it. Having to pay attention and keep hands on the wheel is far more stressful than just driving yourself. FSD is useless unless the driver can fuck off while it's engaged. 

[Biff Tannen 45692]

2 hours ago, royiv said:

How many kids have run out in front of your Tesla while you’ve been beta testing FSD?

 

2 hours ago, Guadaloopy said:

I have driven around plenty of pedestrians and watched closely how the car reacts to them while in FSD.   It’s almost maddeningly cautious.  My experience has also been that the car sees and visualizes pedestrians on the display before I even notice them.     

I don't even really know what has been going on in this thread, but I will say that my Model 3 SLAMMED on the brakes in a god damn HEB parking lot when I was going 2mph in non-self drive because it thought it saw a person.  That wasn't nice.

[Biff Tannen 45692]

2 hours ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Finally tested FSD and holy shit I hate it. Having to pay attention and keep hands on the wheel is far more stressful than just driving yourself. FSD is useless unless the driver can fuck off while it's engaged. 

I don't have FSD, but instead the level below I guess.  Driving on long road trips on interstates and such is quite lovely.  One hand on the wheel and being able to eat or not pay 100% attention for a while is nice.  I don't know if I'll ever get to the point of trusting it to exit or even switch lanes on its own, but taking curves and adaptive cruise is worth it to me.  I'm sure other cars are doing this now too, or catching up quickly.

[Captainant 27682]

8 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I don't have FSD, but instead the level below I guess.  Driving on long road trips on interstates and such is quite lovely.  One hand on the wheel and being able to eat or not pay 100% attention for a while is nice.  I don't know if I'll ever get to the point of trusting it to exit or even switch lanes on its own, but taking curves and adaptive cruise is worth it to me.  I'm sure other cars are doing this now too, or catching up quickly.

Hell the adaptive cruise control in my 2019 Jeep will maintain a follow distance and keep you between the lines with it's relatively unsophisticated ACC. It does use cameras and some radar sensors though so it's got more data to work with than a Tesla in some ways

[C-Man 27234]

2 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Elon is very worried about tax dollars being wasted as Israel (maybe) bombs the last of the F-14s that the Shah bought from us for 2 billion dollars in the 1970s.

LOL at Elon saying “our tax dollars.”

[Hornius Emeritus 12472]

3 hours ago, InkaUtexas said:

Stop watching porn in your car.

I wish I had read this advice earlier.

[atomheartbevo 89735]

1 hour ago, F250 said:

One of Jack Handey's finest creations for SNL.

[HenryJames 66133]

6 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

I don't even really know what has been going on in this thread, but I will say that my Model 3 SLAMMED on the brakes in a god damn HEB parking lot when I was going 2mph in non-self drive because it thought it saw a person.  That wasn't nice.

Now imagine what it's like when the HEB is open.

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

Wait, they've sold less than 4,000 cybertrucks? LOL. 

Edited April 19 by Hank Kingsley

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

FSD is that asshole driver too? Who knew. 

 

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

Literally every major change this gob of goo made to Twitter encouraged engagement farming. Truly the dumbest "genius" in history. 

 

[4th&Five 41564]

51 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Wait, they've sold less than 4,000 cybertrucks? LOL. 

[High Plains Drifter 11050]

 

Should I even give a fuck about what engagement farming is?

 

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

7 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

Should I even give a fuck about what engagement farming is?

 

All you need to know is it's about 95% of the content on X. If Elon actually cracked down on it (he won't), the numbers for this app would plummet to the point that X would be worth less than a Cybertruck.

 

[Captainant 27682]

1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Wait, they've sold less than 4,000 cybertrucks? LOL. 

BBC reporting on it too

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9ezp0lv039o

The company says an "unapproved change" in the production of the pedal meant "lubricant" was used in its assembly, which means the pad did not stick properly to the pedal.

[Captain Ron 12883]

11 hours ago, Guadaloopy said:

It’s a very uncomfortable feeling the first few times you use it.  I don’t think that’s an indictment of the system, but a natural response that comes from trusting a machine to do something that you have had control of for your entire adult life.  

The whole point of it being only Level 2 is the fact that you CAN’T trust the machine to do the driving task. You still have to pay attention to pick up its messes. You can’t give up total control. 

[atomheartbevo 89735]

6 minutes ago, Captainant said:

BBC reporting on it too

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9ezp0lv039o

The company says an "unapproved change" in the production of the pedal meant "lubricant" was used in its assembly, which means the pad did not stick properly to the pedal.

I don’t know why everybody is upset, I mean “lubricant” is nearly the same thing as “adhesive”, right?  Everybody ends up in the hospital after sex, right?

[Guadaloopy 10975]

6 minutes ago, Captain Ron said:

The whole point of it being only Level 2 is the fact that you CAN’T trust the machine to do the driving task. You still have to pay attention to pick up its messes. You can’t give up total control. 

100% agreed.  It has to be monitored constantly, but even though you are monitoring it, you are still watching the car drive itself without your physical input.  That’s a weird feeling at first.  
 

It used to feel really weird, because the maneuvers were mechanical and herky jerky - more digital if you will.  As the system developed further and especially with the shift over to AI-trained V12, it is now much more analog and human-like with its maneuvers.  

[wildcat09 29355]

14 hours ago, Guadaloopy said:

 

 

Except that isn’t at all what I said.   I said that it was part of the test design intended to produce a specific result. 

This shit is so funny man. We get it, you like your car. You don't have to run around getting angry about "unfair" tests of its capabilities. I'm pretty sure most normal people think that if a FSD-ish system is going to be allowed to be used on our roads it should be able to avoid hitting children who are wearing neutral colors.

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

 

[Hank Kingsley 20986]

Another horrifying part of social media is the amount of attention products can get due to content providers being investors/shareholders in these respective companies. 

Less than 4,000 Cybertrucks have been delivered. I mean, holy shit. But constant support for the product online. If you go to the bios of any of these X accounts, the vast majority state they are Tesla investors. 

Imagine having to deal with Geo Twitter back in the 90s as GM investors try to gaslight you into thinking the cars are awesome. 

 

[Brisketexan 105161]

6 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Another horrifying part of social media is the amount of attention products can get due to content providers being investors/shareholders in these respective companies. 

Less than 4,000 Cybertrucks have been delivered. I mean, holy shit. But constant support for the product online. If you go to the bios of any of these X accounts, the vast majority state they are Tesla investors. 

Imagine having to deal with Geo Twitter back in the 90s as GM investors try to gaslight you into thinking the cars are awesome. 

 

Man.....that Geo Metro got the MPG, tho....can't argue with that!

[MrBig 5420]

13 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Another horrifying part of social media is the amount of attention products can get due to content providers being investors/shareholders in these respective companies. 

Less than 4,000 Cybertrucks have been delivered. I mean, holy shit. But constant support for the product online. If you go to the bios of any of these X accounts, the vast majority state they are Tesla investors. 

Imagine having to deal with Geo Twitter back in the 90s as GM investors try to gaslight you into thinking the cars are awesome. 

 

I’ve seen one State Rep from the valley selling Girl Scout cookies out of the back of his cyber truck while liking a bunch of Elon Musk tweets. His fans are everywhere. 

[bluto 4932]

Didn’t they just layoff a shit ton of the shop techs? So they announce a recall right after the ppl whose job it is to fix it get their headcount slashed? Or am I off base. 

[ConferenceRoom 6144]

35 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Man.....that Geo Metro got the MPG, tho....can't argue with that!

We had the Prizm. 

[Guadaloopy 10975]

57 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

This shit is so funny man. We get it, you like your car. You don't have to run around getting angry about "unfair" tests of its capabilities. I'm pretty sure most normal people think that if a FSD-ish system is going to be allowed to be used on our roads it should be able to avoid hitting children who are wearing neutral colors.

Never said it was unfair.  I said it was engineered to produce a failure.  The fact that so many complicating factors had to be introduced in order to generate the failure is an important piece of the story, IMO. 

My takeaway from the test is that Tesla has important work to do to address performance in these difficult edge cases.  But the good news takeaway is that the system performs so well in normal situations that the critics ignore those scenarios.

[Guadaloopy 10975]

47 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Less than 4,000 Cybertrucks have been delivered.

[Parliament 14262]

48 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

 

Imagine having to deal with Geo Twitter back in the 90s as GM investors try to gaslight you into thinking the cars are awesome. 

 

Woah there son.  My Geo Metro was awesome.  Always got me home (very slowly.)

[pantone159 719]

24 minutes ago, bluto said:

Didn’t they just layoff a shit ton of the shop techs? So they announce a recall right after the ppl whose job it is to fix it get their headcount slashed? Or am I off base. 

Don't worry, the remaining shop techs are all extremely hardcore.

 

[Pato del Muerto 52529]

I feel like geo and then Saturn were attempts by GM to create a new entry level so that they could raise prices on Chevy on up to caddy for no reason. 

[Captain Ron 12883]

12 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Rich, coming from a guy that barely pays taxes.

[Redneck Mutha 8006]

47 minutes ago, pantone159 said:

Don't worry, the remaining shop techs are all extremely hardcore.

 

Instead of working their usual 110%, they'll ramp up to 120% to make up for the 10% headcount loss.  Problem.  Solved.

[Stringer 1439]

Rich, coming from a guy that barely pays taxes and whose wealth is largely driven by government tax breaks and subsidies.

Updated.

[BurntEyes 6003]

3 hours ago, Hank Kingsley said:

FSD is that asshole driver too? Who knew. 

 

It's clear that was programed by a former Chicago cabbie. 

Edited April 19 by BurntEyes

[BurntEyes 6003]

1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I feel like geo and then Saturn were attempts by GM to create a new entry level so that they could raise prices on Chevy on up to caddy for no reason. 

The GEO line was a cross work with Japanese companies to make GM marginally engaged in that market, it failed.

The Saturn was an attempt at a "New Start" for GM post the 80s absolute debacle by GM and frankly every US automotive company. That the Buick Grand National is the penultimate vehicle of the US 80s with the GM 454 SS truck and arguably the Typhoon (both early 90s) being the only vehicles worth note in that entire era tells the story. Edit - Ford Escort RS should be added in here so should SVT Mustang.

Keep in mind VW was doing the GT, Nissan was doing the Z, Honda had the NSX and Civic S, Toyota was doing the Supra and MR2 during the same period. All of those are iconic in car world lore.

The US had a bad ass 3.6 liter turbo charged 2 door sedan and SUV and a rear wheel drive truck.

Edited April 19 by BurntEyes

[Pato del Muerto 52529]

And the lineup offered by geo and Saturn helped with that issue how?

[BurntEyes 6003]

2 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

And the lineup offered by geo and Saturn helped with that issue how?

It didn't dude. At all. It made them more laughable. It certainly didn't help them sell other cars in their lineup at a higher price. 

Edited April 19 by BurntEyes

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Man.....that Geo Metro got the MPG, tho....can't argue with that!

My ex-wife's uncle bought a Metro for his 30 mile one-way commute back in 95 or so.  It was a 3 cylinder, 5 speed with no A/C, no power options, etc

He said it would get around 50 a gallon.  Of course, the thing barely weighed more than a go-kart, probably made 60 HP, had the barest minimum of safety equipment, and did I say it had no A/C?

[F250 28787]

Mercedes is selling Level 3 cars in California and Nevada. Will other traditional auto manufacturers leap frog Tesla as well, turning Tesla into the next Sega Dreamcast?

https://fortune.com/2024/04/18/mercedes-self-driving-autonomous-cars-california-nevada-level-3-drive-pilot/

 

[KaiserSoze 998]

1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

The Saturn was an attempt at a "New Start" for GM

 

 

[Guadaloopy 10975]

1 hour ago, F250 said:

Mercedes is selling Level 3 cars in California and Nevada. Will other traditional auto manufacturers leap frog Tesla as well, turning Tesla into the next Sega Dreamcast?

https://fortune.com/2024/04/18/mercedes-self-driving-autonomous-cars-california-nevada-level-3-drive-pilot/

 

System only works below 40 mph with another vehicle in front.  Tesla could probably go through the motions to get their system certified at this level with these restrictions, but ...

[Storm the Field 5295]

 

[Hornius Emeritus 12472]

I'm no defender of Elon or Tesla, though I was impressed with a Tesla Model S that I drove, but recalls are part-and-parcel of operating a car company these days.  My Altima has had several.  Ford just recalled 450,000+ Broncos because they might lose drive power while driving, increasing the chances of an accident.  So I guess I don't understand the fixation that some have with regards to Tesla having recalls.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/fox-news-auto/ford-recalls-450000-vehicles-due-loss-drive-power




 

[Captainant 27682]

5 minutes ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

I'm no defender of Elon or Tesla, though I was impressed with a Tesla Model S that I drove, but recalls are part-and-parcel of operating a car company these days.  My Altima has had several.  Ford just recalled 450,000+ Broncos because they might lose drive power while driving, increasing the chances of an accident.  So I guess I don't understand the fixation that some have with regards to Tesla having recalls.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/fox-news-auto/ford-recalls-450000-vehicles-due-loss-drive-power

Tesla has ten times the market cap of Ford. Why are they making bush league mistakes on extremely limited runs of cars if they're supposed to be worth more than the next five largest automakers combined?

[Brisketexan 105161]

7 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Tesla has ten times the market cap of Ford. Why are they making bush league mistakes on extremely limited runs of cars if they're supposed to be worth more than the next five largest automakers combined?

Also, they are EXTREME, and HARDCORE.

The problem with touting yourself as WORLD-CHANING ZOMG THE BESTEST EVER EVERYONE ELSE IS SUCKY PUSSIES!...is that you've left little margin for getting called out on your bullshit. 

TLDR; Elon's wounds are almost all self-inflicted, chapter eleventy billion.

[Hornius Emeritus 12472]

14 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Tesla has ten times the market cap of Ford. Why are they making bush league mistakes on extremely limited runs of cars if they're supposed to be worth more than the next five largest automakers combined?

I have no idea why investors see Tesla as being 10 times as valuable as Ford. Is that Tesla's fault?

As far as your question, Ford has been in business for 121 years, has sold more than 400 million vehicles, and they're still making "bush league"  mistakes. It would appear that it's hard to make cars.

[Captainant 27682]

14 minutes ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

As far as your question, Ford has been in business for 121 years, has sold more than 400 million vehicles, and they're still making "bush league"  mistakes. It would appear that it's hard to make cars.

Making 800 errors in a run of 400,000 vehicles is one thing.

Making 800 errors in a run of 4,000 vehicles is another thing entirely. Especially while charging an absolute premium complete with waitlists for their shit box. 

 

Not sure why there's such a weird reflex to jump to elmos defense on Surly