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Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?

MaybeACoordinator

By MaybeACoordinator
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Spottieottiedopaliscious
Spottieottiedopaliscious

Hotez is far from bulletproof.       

MissingInAction
MissingInAction
Spottieottiedopaliscious
Spottieottiedopaliscious

Absolutely.    Would you like other guys pointing out Hotez deficiencies?   It was actually more about Hotez but whatever? Why stick around? All the constructive back and forth

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GRHorn

GRHorn 105

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Posted
1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

I'm not into the politics game but isnt 40k just a drop in the bucket?  That's like a token donation.  Not sure whether to be surprised or not that that's how cheap it is to buy favors and influence.

I don’t know the limits either.  A big part of the attention that is getting is that the mostly liberal media are surprised that he could think differently than them.  In reality they shouldn’t be shocked.  I believe he still has a decent relationship with PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel.  Besides that, Elon hasn’t gotten this far without knowing how to play the game.  His business model is dependent on govt subsidy.  He needs to stay on the right side of that. 

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8350

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1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

I don’t know the limits either.  A big part of the attention that is getting is that the mostly liberal media are surprised that he could think differently than them.  In reality they shouldn’t be shocked.  I believe he still has a decent relationship with PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel.  Besides that, Elon hasn’t gotten this far without knowing how to play the game.  His business model is dependent on govt subsidy.  He needs to stay on the right side of that. 

No, the attention he is getting is because he proclaimed he is a socialist on Twitter a month ago. He was mocked for saying that even before he he was found to have donated $35K to a PAC dedicated to keeping the House GOP. He probably thought nobody would ever know, because he is a semi-autistic manchild. 

 

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GRHorn

GRHorn 105

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8 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

No, the attention he is getting is because he proclaimed he is a socialist on Twitter a month ago. He was mocked for saying that even before he he was found to have donated $35K to a PAC dedicated to keeping the House GOP. He probably thought nobody would ever know, because he is a semi-autistic manchild. 

 

I guess we’ll just disagree.  I’m not gonna CR this thread any further. His business is dependent on the government and he’s covering his bases. 

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DigglerontheHoof

DigglerontheHoof 21548

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Probably both.  He's very smart and has visionary ideas; and Space X certainly seems to be filling a NASA void.  Teslas are cool but not very practical; I'll be impressed if they ever make money.

But, holy shit, he's making an ass out of himself over the Thai cave rescue.  However, it doesn't seem to be getting much attention, so probably won't matter. 

 

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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3873

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14 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Lol. Short short short, dawg. 

 

 

Which is why you're blind to what he is doing well.

Musk's needs to stay off twitter, for anything but news about his companies, and slamming people.  What the hell is it with narcissists and twitter?

Edited by ShaggyBevo RIP
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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8350

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27 minutes ago, ShaggyBevo RIP said:

 

Which is why you're blind to what he is doing well.

Musk's needs to stay off twitter, for anything but news about his companies, and slamming people.  What the hell is it with narcissists and twitter?

Too little too late on the staying off Twitter part. If I were him, I would start preparing my anus.  I predict there will be an announcement of a defamation lawsuit over the pedo Tweet within two weeks, and I've read the Thai defamation statute. Defamation can be criminal as well as civil, and it seems like there's a strong case for Musk's remark to be deemed criminal defamation. 

Quote

Civil Defamation

Civil defamation in Thailand is defined under the Thai Civil and Commercial

Code as a statement made contrary to the truth which is asserted or circulated as a fact which is injurious to the reputation or credit of another or his earnings or prosperity in any other manner. Under Section 423 of the said Code, any person liable under the same shall compensate the victim for any damages that the latter may suffered. It must be remembered, however, that the claim for damages under the Thai Civil and Commercial Code must be filed within one year after the defamatory act or one year when the offender’s identification is known to the victim or within ten years from the commission of the defamatory act.

Criminal Defamation

Defamation as a criminal act in Thailand is defined by the Thai Criminal Code as a statement made by a person who imputes anything to another in a manner which is likely to impair the reputation of the latter or to expose him to hatred or contempt. Under the same Code, such person is liable for an imprisonment up to two years or he can be ordered by the court to pay a fine of 200,000 Baht or may be both.

Burden of Proof and Available Defenses

In Thailand, it is not the duty of the victim or the prosecution that the statement made by the defendant is false. Hence, the burden of proof lies on the defendant to prove that his statements are true. The defense that the defendant did not know his statements to be false is not acceptable in Thailand. Regardless of the truthfulness or falsehood of the statement, once it became a source of an injury which caused damage to the victim, the defendant is liable. Also, although the defendant proves that his statement is true, he still has the burden of proving to the court the propriety of such statement. Nevertheless, the defendant may set up a defense that the statement was made by him in good faith to the person who he believes to be entitled to such information or has interest thereof. Statements made in court by the parties as well as their lawyers do not constitute defamation. Also, expressions of an opinion made in good faith are not considered as defamatory especially so when it is intended to protect legal interest, to comment on actions of an official under official capacity or to provide a fair comment to any person.

 

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52-80

52-80 19377

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45 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Yeah but does he even have any assets there they can take? In order to take assets in the US I believe they have to meet the US standards in court. Which would then have to be proven in US courts.

he just has to scrap plans of the Model Z plug-in Tuk-Tuks

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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3873

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1 hour ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Too little too late on the staying off Twitter part. If I were him, I would start preparing my anus.  I predict there will be an announcement of a defamation lawsuit over the pedo Tweet within two weeks, and I've read the Thai defamation statute. Defamation can be criminal as well as civil, and it seems like there's a strong case for Musk's remark to be deemed criminal defamation. 

 

^^^

When he tweeted that my first thought was, ' that will be a libel suit'.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

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On 7/14/2018 at 12:05 PM, Parliament said:

That effete ahole can't hold Tesla's jockstrap.

Space X is a good venture.  Tesla Motors is a joke.  They have a bigger market cap than Ford?!  Gonna be fun watching them crash.

Sadly, he was close to a great idea.  Become the lithium-ion battery supplier of choice, work with car companies to standardize quick charging, and work with gas stations, hotels, etc to install them.  In other words be the "Intel" inside of hybrid and electric vehicles.  Stay out of sight and do the hard work in the background.

Tesla motors may very well fail, and its stock is certainly overvalued, but it isn't a joke.  Sure, big auto will probably come in and dominate the EV market.  However, they would have never gotten off their ass had Tesla not forced them into action.

As far as shit like hyper loop and other things, he is just throwing things out there to keep his companies in the news.  I do expect the Boring Company to fail though, and I think its mission is a stupid one from the start.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13725

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17 hours ago, BrazilHorn said:

I would be very disappointed if the CEO of the company I work at went on Twitter and acted like a 12 YO.

It is one thing to defend your engineers and say how they worked around the clock to help etc but to respond like he did is amateur hour.

I would be very disappointed if the president of the country I lived in went on Twitter and acted like a 12 YO.

there seems to be a common problem today with some leaders and social media.  

 

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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3873

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Quote

TODAY

...Munro now claims that his cost analysis points toward a gross margin of over 30-percent for the Model 3. Something that Tesla CEO Elon Musk has been claiming to be possible for a while, but naysayers have ridiculed the suggestion – partly because of Munro’s own previous comments.

It’s actually a second teardown that points to the high gross margin for the Model 3 since a German engineering firm pointed to only $28,000 in potential material and production costs following their own teardown...

 

https://electrek.co/2018/07/16/tesla-model-3-teardown-profitability/

 

Oops!

 

Missed it by that much. /Maxwell Smart

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JimmyHoffa

JimmyHoffa 1188

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20 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

I've read most of the posts and some fall in line with my way of thinking which is as follows.

I'm very glad he is pushing the EV car envelope. He disrupted the market in a very positive way.

I don't believe he has the long term business sense to be ultimately successful as a car manufacturer, but I'm okay if I'm wrong on that point.

I don't want him getting any more susidies that any of the other majors aren't getting currently. I don't know that data point.

I think his investors are a little nutty or playing long odds. Neither of which bother me at all.

I agree with some that SpaceX is where he is mostly likely to be successful. I also hope he is as that is a bigger thing than electric cars, IMO.

I'm not a fan boi or a hater. I think he is brilliant, and a little bit of a con man. I think all the most successful inventors were throughout history save a select few. 

 

Agree on all of this. 

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Chapo

Chapo 104

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Just like great artists have to be fucked up to produce great works, visionaries that succeeds are the manics and assholes.  The ones that are likeable just do a good job of hiding it or extremely charismatic.

Edited by Chapo
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52-80

52-80 19377

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How would one categorize Musk tho?

some of these guys were polymath (Franklin, the Vinci) ... some are largely-independent inventors (Tesla)... others were visionary and succesful businessmen (Jobs, Ford)... 

 

how much of what Elon did/does is salesmanship?  fundraising?  engineering? product architecturing?  operations and business management?  

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 32071

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1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

Were Watt, Whiteny, Ford,  Hollerith, Bell, Franklin, Tesla, Da Vinci, Wright Brothers, Edison and Berners Lee all manics and assholes?

I don't know the answer to the question, except Edison seemed like a pretty big asshole and a political gamer and Tesla IMO one of the biggest visionaries seemed crazy a fuck. I'd love to watch a  unbiased documentary that actually dives into the personal side of the most important inventors in history. It would be a difficult work because history likes to rewrite the books in a positive light for such people, but some real digging would be fascinating to me. 

To be clear, I do not believe Musk to be any where near that group yet, but I can't say he won't be either. Time will tell that story.

How technical is Musk, though?  Most of the people you list weren't just visionaries dreaming improbable or unlikely shit up and hiring others to implement it (Jobs), but actual technical inventors in addition to "dreamers."

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Chapo

Chapo 104

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4 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

Were Watt, Whiteny, Ford,  Hollerith, Bell, Franklin, Tesla, Da Vinci, Wright Brothers, Edison and Berners Lee all manics and assholes?

If only they had Twitter back then.....

What would Bell tweet about Elisha Gray? Would we see Ford cursing out Jews for the whole world to read?

The lessons that we can all agree on is for these CEO, athletes, other famous people to stay off Twitter.

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52-80

52-80 19377

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1 hour ago, Chapo said:

 

What would Bell tweet about Elisha Gray? Would we see Ford cursing out Jews for the whole world to read?

 

It is my opinion that that pernicious Mr Gray is a most disagreeable fellow, who takes in the company of young men when it strikes his mood.  A God-less buffoon, of which I'm without doubt.

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Rusty Shackelford

Rusty Shackelford 414

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Just leaving this here:

http://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-settles-dispute-with-farting-unicorn-artist-tom-edwards-2018-7

Elon Musk has settled his bizarre dispute with an artist who created a mug featuring a farting unicorn.

The unicorn originally featured on one of Colorado-based potter Tom Edwards' mugs, which carried a positive message about electric vehicles. Musk tweeted in February 2017 that it was "maybe my favorite mug ever."

Months later, it was brought to Edwards' attention that the image was popping up inside the operating system of Tesla vehicles and on a company Christmas card.

Edwards hired a lawyer and wrote to Musk asking for a discussion about the farting unicorn's copyright. He did not want a big legal fight and said that he had always been a Musk fanboy.

But Edwards' daughter, Robin Edwards, called out the Tesla boss on Twitter. Musk, in now-deleted tweets, said legal action would be "kinda lame" and said his interest in the farting unicorn had "increased his [Edwards'] mug sales."

Edwards told Business Insider last month that Musk had been "arrogant." He added: "We're not sitting here with dollar signs in our eyes, we're really doing this because it's what right."

On Friday, Edwards blogged to say that the matter had been resolved.

"We have reached an agreement with Tesla that resolves our issues in a way that everyone feels good about," he said. "It's clear there were some misunderstandings that led to this escalating, but I'm just glad that everything has been cleared up."

Musk tweeted a link to the blog, with three emojis: A unicorn, a gust of wind, and a peace symbol.


It's the latest twist in a tumultuous week for Musk. The billionaire called Thai cave rescue diver Vernon Unsworth a "pedo" only to later delete his tweet and apologise. He was also criticised for a donation to the Republican party, which some said contradicted his support of climate change initiatives.

One of his followers observed wryly: "Dude you need to refocus and get on track! You had a rough week in the News." Musk responded: "Always look on the bright side of life …"

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 14803

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Tesla might finally be out of cash:

 

Tesla Inc. TSLA -2.08% has asked some suppliers to refund a portion of what the electric-car company has spent previously, an appeal that reflects the auto maker’s urgency to sustain operations during a critical production period.

The Silicon Valley electric-car company said it is asking its suppliers for cash back to help it become profitable, according to a memo reviewed by The Wall Street Journal that was sent to a supplier last week. Tesla requested the supplier return what it calls a meaningful amount of money of its payments since 2016, according to the memo.

The auto maker’s memo, sent by a global supply manager, described the request as essential to Tesla’s continued operation and characterized it as an investment in the car company to continue the long-term growth between both players.

While Tesla said in the memo that all suppliers were being asked to help it become profitable, it is unclear how many were asked for a discount on contracted spending amounts retroactively. Some suppliers contacted about the request said they were unaware of such a demand.

Tesla declined to comment on the specific memo. But it confirmed it is seeking price reductions from suppliers for projects, some of which date back to 2016, and some of which haven’t been completed. The company called such requests a standard part of procurement negotiations to improve its competitive advantage, especially as it ramps up Model 3 production.

The surprising requests raise further questions about Tesla’s cash position, which has dwindled after it struggled to boost production of its first car designed for mainstream buyers, the Model 3. After months of delays, Tesla last quarter reached its longstanding goal of making 5,000 Model 3s in a single week, which, if sustained, will help it generate cash.

 

Auto makers and suppliers have complicated relationships, each fighting for the best deal under immense pricing pressure. Supply-chain consultants say sometimes auto makers will demand a reduction in price for a current contract going forward or use leverage of awarding a new deal to get upfront savings on a contract. But they say it is unusual for an auto maker to ask for a refund for past work.

Dennis Virag, a manufacturing consultant who has worked in the automotive industry for 40 years, said a solicitation like Tesla’s could put suppliers in financial peril and jeopardize its future supply of car parts.

“It’s simply ludicrous and it just shows that Tesla is desperate right now,” he said. “They’re worried about their profitability but they don’t care about their suppliers’ profitability.”

https://www.wsj.com/articles/tesla-asks-suppliers-for-cash-back-to-help-turn-a-profit-1532301091

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