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Did Trump commit treason today?

TexArcher

By TexArcher
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Did Trump commit treason today?  

217 members have voted

  1. 1. Did Trump commit treason today?


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troph

troph 24562

Posted
Posted

With his words at a press conference? No.

 

Did he agree to do something in the meeting that’s treasonous? We’ll see.

 

Publicly though he’s running our closest military allies into the ground, going to war with tariffs on our neighbors, publicly humiliating leaders of democracies we need support from while speaking highly of and to Russians and North Koreans. What the hell?

 

 

As for collusion... I’ll wait for the investigation to run its course.

 

 

 

 

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
Posted

Treason by common parlance, and not in the strict legal sense but close, which was my vote.   And that's just from what we saw in public; I suspect he commited stone-cold treason in the private meeting, and has in the past as well. 

Regardless of the precise legal classification, what we saw today was the most disgraceful, pathetic, and traitorous moment in presidential history that I can think of.   It was that bad. 

 

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8349

Posted
Posted

No but close. Russia is not technically our enemy. I think, but do not know, that most other nations have a looser definition of treason, and by those definitions, it would have been yes.

We can't forget our founding fathers knew all about treason themselves. That's why it's the only crime specifically addressed in the Constitution and also why it's so hard to convict. 

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lemonlime

lemonlime 5503

Posted
Posted

I don't know how you separate out one press conference as though treason could be committed by making some statements in a few minutes.  The press conference is part of a larger pattern of treasonous conduct.  We don't know enough of things like what Trump said to Putin to know for sure his actions meet the legal definition of treason.  But it's incredibly obvious Trump's a traitor to this country.

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Rimbo

Rimbo 25773

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, TheRealRonWeaver? said:

In light of the history leading up to this point and his ongoing refusal to do anything to counter the threat to our country, yes.

Well put. It's not the one event alone ...

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honolulu horn

honolulu horn 6157

Posted
Posted

I didn't vote for that sonofabitch and I don't pretend to understand the mindset of people who did. But our rah-rah MAGA president who runs on a platform of America first and trots out patriotism and Americana as the foundational conservative base is clearly eroding ties with our closest democratic allies (Canada, Britain, Australia, Germany, France) and is on magazine and newspaper covers shaking hands with some of our most bitter enemies (North Korea and Russia). What a fucking joke.

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21098

Posted
Posted

I voted yes, but it’s not treason in the legal sense...as we can’t assume what was said/promised in private.  

Ill say I’ve never seen the US President disrespect its people like this.  MindBoggling...even for this putz of a Prez 

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Grandioso

Grandioso 2592

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

I don't know if he technically committed treason, but it's obvious to anyone with a brain that Donald Trump is compromised.

I really want to know what the Russians are holding over his head.

I bet Robert Mueller knows. Donald Trump knows he knows.

Buckle up.

1. Money in the form of oligarch investments, loans, and probably just straight up briefcases full of cash. Putin is coming to collect. It's like Mike McFaul says - Putin creates leverage.

2. Kompramat in the format of information about Trump Casino money laundering, tax evasion, and/or white collar crimes

3. Kompromat in form of weird sex tape

 

I think it's all of the above.

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TexArcher

TexArcher 37508

Posted
  • Author
Posted
2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

I really want to know what the Russians are holding over his head.

I bet Robert Mueller knows. Donald Trump knows he knows.

My best guess is that Trump (or his campaign, with his knowledge) actively colluded with Russia to rig the election.  And now Putin has pointed out the fact that he can spill what he knows and Trump will hang while nothing much happens to him (Putin).  So now Trump has no choice but to be Putin's bitch and to try to discredit the FBI before they finish connecting the dots and bring the hammer down.

I mean, what else makes sense? What else could drive this egomaniac to grovel like this?  What else would cause a sitting US president to defame federal law enforcement, of all things?

I think he's going down, one way or the other.  But in the meantime, he's Putin's personal marionette and fuckdoll.

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RPM

RPM 26215

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Grandioso said:

1. Money in the form of oligarch investments, loans, and probably just straight up briefcases full of cash. Putin is coming to collect. It's like Mike McFaul says - Putin creates leverage.

2. Kompramat in the format of information about Trump Casino money laundering, tax evasion, and/or white collar crimes

3. Kompromat in form of weird sex tape

 

I think it's all of the above.

A Trumpfecta

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, TexArcher said:

What say you?

Edit: we're referring here to his publicly siding with and defending Putin while throwing the entire U.S. intelligence network under the bus.

Ah, the public press conference is the only thing under consideration. Not the 2 hour solo meeting without those pesky advisers listening in. 

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TexArcher

TexArcher 37508

Posted
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2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Ah, the public press conference is the only thing under consideration. Not the 2 hour solo meeting without those pesky advisers listening in. 

Right, since we don't know what was said behind closed doors.

The question here is: were his comments alone enough to constitute treason?

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HOOK'EMHOOAH

HOOK'EMHOOAH 1606

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

I don't know if he technically committed treason, but it's obvious to anyone with a brain that Donald Trump is compromised.

I really want to know what the Russians are holding over his head.

I bet Robert Mueller knows. Donald Trump knows he knows.

Buckle up.

Pee. Tape.

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troph

troph 24562

Posted
Posted
I don't know if he technically committed treason, but it's obvious to anyone with a brain that Donald Trump is compromised.
I really want to know what the Russians are holding over his head.
I bet Robert Mueller knows. Donald Trump knows he knows.
Buckle up.


Life in prison for financial crimes and forfeiture of his financial empire most likely. When trump is done he’s probably hanging out on a beach with oligarchs at his hotels on the Black Sea is some shit.
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Huckleberry

Huckleberry 32695

Posted
Posted

By the Constitutional definition? I don't know but I bet he did in that private meeting. Per the Constitution it's not just levying war against the United States but also "adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort."

By the lay definition? Absolutely. He betrayed the United States of America.

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Viper

Viper 12025

Posted
Posted

voted no, not close after I read this

https://reason.com/blog/2018/07/16/trump-putin-presser-russia-disgraceful

Quote

Trump's Presser with Putin Was Disgraceful. But No, It's Not 'Treason' to Meet with Russia.

"A person can be in favor of improving relations with Russia, in favor of meeting with Putin, and still think something is not right here."

Robby Soave|Jul. 16, 2018 1:46 pm

During a joint press conference Monday morning, President Donald Trump told the world that he accepted Vladimir Putin's dubious assertion that the Russian government did not meddle in America's 2016 election. In doing so, Trump contradicted his own intelligence officials, who remain confident that Russia was indeed responsible for the hack of Democratic National Committee emails, regardless of whether anyone within the Trump campaign colluded in this effort.

That Trump could stand next to Putin and go out of his way to please the autocratic leader was "disgraceful," in the words of CNN's Anderson Cooper. If Twitter is any indication, Cooper's sentiments are widely shared by people in media and politics, and not just the left-of-center ones. Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) wrote, "I never thought I would see the day when our American President would stand on the stage with the Russian President and place blame on the United States for Russian aggression. This is shameful." Fox News's Guy Benson called this one of Trump's "worst days as president." The Federalist's Mollie Hemmingway said Trump should have chosen different words. Even Rep. Peter King (R–N.Y.), ordinarily a reliable defender of Trump, said he "strongly disagrees" with the president's take on Russian interference.

This disappointment with Trump's behavior is well-justified. The president didn't have to bow to Putin, fully embracing every obvious lie the Russian leader had told him. He could have been polite without being craven. He could have signaled a desire to work toward more peaceful relations without coming across like a dupe.

 

But this does not mean it was a mistake for Trump to meet with Putin in the first place, or that the theory—promoted just days ago by New York magazine's Jonathan Chait—that Trump is some sort of Russian agent (and has been since 1987!) holds water. Former CIA chief John Brennan claims that Trump's performance was "nothing short of treasonous" and that it "rises to & exceeds the threshold of 'high crimes & misdemeanors.'" That's plainly wrong. And Rep. Eric Swalwell (D–Calif.), a frequent spokesperson for the #Resistance on cable news, was engaged in unhinged fearmongering when he tweeted this over the weekend:

FDR didn't meet w/ the Japanese after Pearl Harbor. George H.W. Bush didn't meet w/ Saddam after Iraq invaded Kuwait. And George W. Bush didn't meet w/ Bin Laden after 9/11. So tell me, @realDonaldTrump, what does America get out of you meeting w/ Putin after he attacked us?

— Rep. Eric Swalwell (@RepSwalwell) July 15, 2018

Unsurprisingly, the most reasonable response to the presser came from the reliably levelheaded Rep. Justin Amash (R–Mich.) who said, "A person can be in favor of improving relations with Russia, in favor of meeting with Putin, and still think something is not right here." Diplomacy is good, and Democrats shouting "Treason!" whenever the president does something dumb is as obnoxious in the Trump years as it was when the Republicans did it during the Obama years. It's a mistake to indulge in grand conspiracy theorizing—Manchurian candidates! The Americans! Urinating sex workers!—to explain the president's actions when mundane incompetence and egomania fit just as nicely.

 

 

It was dumb and tiring listening to shouts of treason every time Obama bowed to a Saudi prince or apologized for something, it's still dumb and tiring now that it's Trump.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31265

Posted
Posted

Here's the statutory definition, 18 USC 2381, pretty much lifted from the Constitution:

Quote

Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

The bolded kind of gave me pause.  Death!  Or five years.  Something like that.

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Viper said:

voted no, not close after I read this

https://reason.com/blog/2018/07/16/trump-putin-presser-russia-disgraceful

 

 

It was dumb and tiring listening to shouts of treason every time Obama bowed to a Saudi prince or apologized for something, it's still dumb and tiring now that it's Trump.

This was orders of magnitude worse than bowing or apologizing.  (Which Trump himself already matched long ago when he bowed and curtsied to the Saudis.). The comparison is absurd. 

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