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Did Trump commit treason today?

TexArcher

By TexArcher
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Did Trump commit treason today?  

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  1. 1. Did Trump commit treason today?


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Eastwood

Eastwood 4394

Posted
Posted

I voted yes, not because what was said in public today was actually treasonous, but because this is the last event in a series of events that lends large amounts of credibility to the theory that Trump is a Russian asset, whether knowingly or unknowingly on his part, has been for some time, and is actively working against the best interests of the United States and towards the benefit of its largest enemy, Russia. 

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29226

Posted
Posted
Just now, Eastwood said:

I voted yes, not because what was said in public today was actually treasonous, but because this is the last event in a series of events that lends large amounts of credibility to the theory that Trump is a Russian asset, whether knowingly or unknowingly on his part, has been for some time, and is actively working against the best interests of the United States and towards the benefit of its largest enemy, Russia. 

He knows he's a Russian asset. No malignant narcissist would ever be so consistently obsequious towards another person unless they knew that other person had some extraordinarily damaging dirt on them. He's never said one even remotely negative thing about Putin. That's not new, that goes back to at least 2013. The only remotely rational explanation for that fact is that Putin has dirt on him and he knows it, and is intentionally doing what Putin wants to keep Putin from releasing it.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45546

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Well he's an idiot, so...

I don't think it's that so much as the fact that he always expects to be lauded, because that's what his hangers-on have done his whole life.  He truly believes he's a genius.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
39 minutes ago, Caracara said:

I don't know if junior's excitement amounts to all that.

To all what?

The Trump campaign colluded with Russian agents on multiple occasions in order to influence the 2016 election. There's no rational doubt about that. I neither know nor care whether or not it was to a criminal extent or if it is possible to convict in this political environment. But if you argue that there is no evidence of collusion you are either profoundly stupid or lying.

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29226

Posted
Posted
Just now, bad_teammate said:

To all what?

The Trump campaign colluded with Russian agents on multiple occasions in order to influence the 2016 election. There's no rational doubt about that. I neither know nor care whether or not it was to a criminal extent or if it is possible to convict in this political environment. But if you argue that there is no evidence of collusion you are either profoundly stupid or lying.

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Eastwood

Eastwood 4394

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

He knows he's a Russian asset. No malignant narcissist would ever be so consistently obsequious towards another person unless they knew that other person had some extraordinarily damaging dirt on them. He's never said one even remotely negative thing about Putin. That's not new, that goes back to at least 2013. The only remotely rational explanation for that fact is that Putin has dirt on him and he knows it, and is intentionally doing what Putin wants to keep Putin from releasing it.

Either way, the danger is now readily apparent for even the most cautious of American political participants and I hope to see the midterms reflect that. For example, I have never voted in one myself, but will be this year. 

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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3868

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Mojo Hand said:

Doris and Francis are up next.  Might as well ban them now:

http://www.surlyhorns.com/board/index.php?/search/&type=core_members&start_after=1527120000&start_before=1527638400&group[4]=1&group[3]=1&group[10]=1&group[6]=1&group[7]=1

Looks like there are a least half a dozen bots on that page. Impressive that little old Surly gets that much attention from the GRU.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23393

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, Grandioso said:

If Putin didn't outright blackmail Trump yesterday, he definitely repeatedly hit the raw nerve he has about having a legitimate and convincing electoral win. He probably was like, "Donald, you won the election without anyone's help. We did nothing. If America thinks that we influenced the election, it takes away from your victory. Don't let them do that!" He would have manipulated Trump's pathological need to have an untainted, unassisted win. Putin would reinforced Trump's belief that - Admitting Russian influence = Admitting that I am an illegitimate president.  

 That's why Trump immediately interpretted every question about himself and his legitimacy. Listen to NYT "The Daily" podcast from today. It's interesting.

No one is saying we can't/shouldn't engage Russia in diplomacy.   But we are saying you can't just roll over like a puppy looking for a belly rub.



The way Trump‘s mood is being reported is hilarious. Everyone is saying he was upbeat and positive immediately after the summit and completely unaware and surprised that there was negative reaction to it across everyone. The dude had no idea what had happened.  

I think that at this point there is a legit argument for removal via the 25th amendment. We do not appear to be dealing with dementia here as some have suggested in the past.  What we are dealing with appears to be a profound and pervasive personality disorder.  I am not sure at this point that Trump has any real agency to control his response or actions.  His perception of reality is intimately tied to his psychopathology.  He was upbeat and positive after the news conference because his perception of reality is that it came off splendidly.  That is simply his reality. He is an elderly man with a pathologically severe mental condition, easily manipulated if you understand the fundamental wants and needs that drive his reality, and stroke the right chords. At this point, after the display yesterday, go ahead and roll out the 25th amendment. He is clearly impaired. 

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GhostRider

GhostRider 169

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

I think that at this point there is a legit argument for removal via the 25th amendment. We do not appear to be dealing with dementia here as some have suggested in the past.  What we are dealing with appears to be a profound and pervasive personality disorder.  I am not sure at this point that Trump has any real agency to control his response or actions.  His perception of reality is intimately tied to his psychopathology.  He was upbeat and positive after the news conference because his perception of reality is that it came off splendidly.  That is simply his reality. He is an elderly man with a pathologically severe mental condition, easily manipulated if you understand the fundamental wants and needs that drive his reality, and stroke the right chords. At this point, after the display yesterday, go ahead and roll out the 25th amendment. He is clearly impaired. 

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Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13546

Posted
Posted
The way Trump‘s mood is being reported is hilarious. Everyone is saying he was upbeat and positive immediately after the summit and completely unaware and surprised that there was negative reaction to it across everyone. The dude had no idea what had happened.  
Not hard to see him doing the double finger pistols strut from the presser all Ron Burgundy style after telling America to go fuck itself.
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Js1

Js1 85095

Posted
Posted
Just now, Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand said:
36 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:
The way Trump‘s mood is being reported is hilarious. Everyone is saying he was upbeat and positive immediately after the summit and completely unaware and surprised that there was negative reaction to it across everyone. The dude had no idea what had happened.  

Not hard to see him doing the double finger pistols strut from the presser all Ron Burgundy style after telling America to go fuck itself.

LOL he did the same thing after he fired Comey.  He thought he would be universally praised for it.

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riloh05

riloh05 107

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, DixonHur said:

I can't believe anyone could even half-way compare the two, but let me hit some high points...

  1. Medvedev isn't an evil despot who was once a KGB agent.
  2. I'm not saying Medvedev was a "good guy", but he was a reformer and at least mildly friendly toward the west...aka why Putin seized complete control
  3. What Obama did was called diplomacy.  You don't put your missiles in Kaliningrad, and we won't increase our missile defenses in Poland/Czech Rep.  What Trump did was capitulation.  What did the US get in return for Trump throwing us under the bus?  A soccer ball?

No one is saying we can't/shouldn't engage Russia in diplomacy.   But we are saying you can't just roll over like a puppy looking for a belly rub.

thanks for engaging here for a discussion... regarding #3 and the last sentence- how do you know what "trump" did? and how do you know we rolled over for a belly rub? what specifically points to that? i am just looking for some actual substance and I cant find any. thanks for helping me fill in the blanks.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104561

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

 

 

 

I think that at this point there is a legit argument for removal via the 25th amendment. We do not appear to be dealing with dementia here as some have suggested in the past.  What we are dealing with appears to be a profound and pervasive personality disorder.  I am not sure at this point that Trump has any real agency to control his response or actions.  His perception of reality is intimately tied to his psychopathology.  He was upbeat and positive after the news conference because his perception of reality is that it came off splendidly.  That is simply his reality. He is an elderly man with a pathologically severe mental condition, easily manipulated if you understand the fundamental wants and needs that drive his reality, and stroke the right chords. At this point, after the display yesterday, go ahead and roll out the 25th amendment. He is clearly impaired. 

I mostly think that you are a loathsome equivocating toad with no political or moral courage.

But every once in a while, you hit the target dead-center.  I'd rep you if I had some left to give today.  I share this take pretty much 100%.  And i note that it is not one that paints Trump as some sinister collaborator - rather, he's just so self-absorbed and clueless that he can be manipulated at will by anyone with the skillset (which, let's be clear, a former KGB agent CERTAINLY has).  Trump isn't taking orders from Putin so much as reacting exactly as desired when Putin pushes certain buttons, which is functionally the same.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31265

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I mostly think that you are a loathsome equivocating toad with no political or moral courage.

But every once in a while, you hit the target dead-center.  I'd rep you if I had some left to give today.  I share this take pretty much 100%.  And i note that it is not one that paints Trump as some sinister collaborator - rather, he's just so self-absorbed and clueless that he can be manipulated at will by anyone with the skillset (which, let's be clear, a former KGB agent CERTAINLY has).  Trump isn't taking orders from Putin so much as reacting exactly as desired when Putin pushes certain buttons, which is functionally the same.

Yep, I have a hard time deciding whether he's pathological or pathetic.  I guess it's a bit of both, but mostly pathetic. 

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Brandywine

Brandywine 1312

Posted
Posted

It appears like Trump was played by Putin. Doesn't surprise me because he does nothing to prepare for a meeting like that, thinking his massive brain and gut will carry him. Putin knows that and knows how to play his game because he's a master politician. Trump goes into the meeting alone because he doesn't want anyone, outside of his interpreter, to see how unprepared, way over his head and out of place he is. No telling what kind of stupid things he said and Putin is laughing his ass off. This was a major disaster, and anyone who expected different is just as stupid. But as with gun violence, give it a few days to blow over and the Reps will be right back where they were - in his court saying how great he is, stroking his ego. Come to think of it, I don't know who's playing who. 

 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Sidenote, do "we" think a rational President would have postponed the meeting or canceled it altogether?  Once you have this meeting, is there any way to diplomatically handle this?

A rational president would not have needed to cancel or postpone.

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Lobwedgephil

Lobwedgephil 1139

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Most notably siding with a former KGB agent’s assertion over the multiple US intelligence agencies’ fact-based findings.  I know it’s hard to keep up.  

Gotcha, just looking for the actual quote where he said that. 

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thrillhammer

thrillhammer 683

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Eastwood said:

Either way, the danger is now readily apparent for even the most cautious of American political participants and I hope to see the midterms reflect that. For example, I have never voted in one myself, but will be this year. 

This is where the rubber meets the road.  right now, well before yesterday, he had a 90% approval rating from republicans.  90% support him.  that's astonishing.  I see an imbecile, a buffoon, someone that has made us all worse off as Americans, and the worst president in the history of our country.  And what they see?  Full steam ahead!  Great job, Mr Prez!  Astounding. 

I voted no on this for several reasons.  Russia is not our hostile enemy for one, and he didn't help them for two, and he didn't betray us for three.  I'm as liberal as they come but this isn't treason.  I'm against the guy that's out there trying to impeach him, and I was against the gop when they tried to impeach Clinton for sleeping around with Monica Lewinsky.  We have to quit seeing things on party lines.   Right is right, and wrong is wrong, no matter what party the other guy is on.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, thrillhammer said:

This is where the rubber meets the road.  right now, well before yesterday, he had a 90% approval rating from republicans.  90% support him.  that's astonishing.  I see an imbecile, a buffoon, someone that has made us all worse off as Americans, and the worst president in the history of our country.  And what they see?  Full steam ahead!  Great job, Mr Prez!  Astounding. 

I voted no on this for several reasons.  Russia is not our hostile enemy for one, and he didn't help them for two, and he didn't betray us for three.  I'm as liberal as they come but this isn't treason.  I'm against the guy that's out there trying to impeach him, and I was against the gop when they tried to impeach Clinton for sleeping around with Monica Lewinsky.  We have to quit seeing things on party lines.   Right is right, and wrong is wrong, no matter what party the other guy is on.

Of course 90% of Republicans support him.  The GOP is becoming entirely his brand.  There has been a corresponding decline in the number of people who identify as Republican.  It dropped by 5% between his election and December.  I imagine it has dropped even further since 2018 has been a complete shitshow for Trump and the GOP so far.  Even guys like Tahoe who were defending away in 2017 and early 2018 are nowhere to be found now.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23393

Posted
Posted
37 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Sidenote, do "we" think a rational President would have postponed the meeting or canceled it altogether?  Once you have this meeting, is there any way to diplomatically handle this?

It should have been cancelled when the indictment drops, or at a minimum postponed.  I think that the condition for any F2F meeting should have been extradition and a pledge for a fair and open trial. There is of course no chance that that would ever occur, but it should have been the starting point demand for negotiation on a F2F. 

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DiceHands

DiceHands 349

Posted
Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I mostly think that you are a loathsome equivocating toad with no political or moral courage.

But every once in a while, you hit the target dead-center.  I'd rep you if I had some left to give today.  I share this take pretty much 100%.  And i note that it is not one that paints Trump as some sinister collaborator - rather, he's just so self-absorbed and clueless that he can be manipulated at will by anyone with the skillset (which, let's be clear, a former KGB agent CERTAINLY has).  Trump isn't taking orders from Putin so much as reacting exactly as desired when Putin pushes certain buttons, which is functionally the same.

People thinking that trump is just too dumb to realize that he is being a puppet is just as likely as it is that hes compromised in some way by putin/russia.  Yes, it would be better for us all if it was the prior, but there is too many things that point to it being the latter at this point.

Either way, its all super fucked up and anyone still supporting trump at this point is a fool.  He has to go.  

 

Sidenote:  if he really is too dumb to realize hes getting played, then we need to dump his ass on the curb because we cant have someone that ignorant in the most powerful position in the world.  

Edited by DiceHands
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Huckleberry

Huckleberry 32695

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Of course 90% of Republicans support him.

Will never drop below 80% as long as that (R) is by his name. Because so much of the populace is composed of team-first morons the best hope for the GOP to salvage some dignity is to dig up a bunch of clips of Trump championing liberal ideas and replay them on Fox News constantly. Show the Republican base that he's not actually a Republican.

Edited by Huckleberry
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DanTheHorn

DanTheHorn 4897

Posted
Posted
14 hours ago, Message Board User said:

we can certainly take an educated guess - lots and lots of fellatio (literal & figurative)

I would say there was only one man on his knees but it was probably hands and knees because Putin is fairly short and got no tickle action.

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

Posted
Posted

So, if his statements rise to the level of treason then have Congress convene hearings, and take a vote on charges to remove him from office.

Pence as a president ?  He's a career politician so knows the language, game, do's and don'ts, and will toe the GOP co. line.  He's a lame duck the second he takes the oath I'd guess.

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Clob94

Clob94 121

Posted
Posted

it's not treason. 

stupid and ill advised, yes. 

Treason is when you give actual aid to your enemy. Some would say a plane loaded down with money being flown into a hostile enemy combatant's territory and unloading said dolla bills to them constitutes treason. 

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DiceHands

DiceHands 349

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

They have not left his side.

Tons of republicans are coming out against what happened yesterday.  They may have not left his side, but they are atleast being more outspoken on this than anything else that has happened so far.

My guess is that they will all accept this damage control bullshit conference today and point to it saying that its definitive proof that trump is with the US, completely ignoring what he just said in front of his daddy putin. 

 

Edited by DiceHands
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Brandywine

Brandywine 1312

Posted
Posted (edited)

Trump is a master of confusion. One moment he says he believes in Russian interference, next moment he says he doesn’t. Now his staff says Trump left out one word when he spoke which would have changed the whole meaning of what he was trying to say. This is BS. It’s a game he’s played with people his whole life and gotten away with. Time to make it stop and for him to be held accountable for his actions.

Edited by Brandywine
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DiceHands

DiceHands 349

Posted
Posted
Just now, Brandywine said:

Trump is a master of confusion. One moment he says he believes in Russian interference, next moment is says he doesn’t. Now his staff says Trump left out one word when he spoke which would have changed the whole meaning of what he was trying to say. This is BS. 

He will say what ever pleases the crowd he is front of.

In front of Putin?  I believe Russia.

In front of US congress?  I believe our intelligence agencies.

He is a fucking treasonous traitor.

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Mojo Hand

Mojo Hand 4580

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Most notably siding with a former KGB agent’s assertion over the multiple US intelligence agencies’ fact-based findings.  I know it’s hard to keep up.  

It was also a total betrayal of our country when he was asked if he held Russia accountable for anything and answered with a false equivalency that paid lip service to both sides and then primarily blamed the US for investigating Russia's attack on us:

QUESTION: Thank you.

Mr. President, you tweeted this morning that it’s U.S. foolishness, stupidity and the Mueller probe that is responsible for the decline in U.S. relations with Russia.

Do you hold Russia at all accountable for anything in particular? And if so, what would you — what would you consider them — that they are responsible for?

TRUMP: Yes I do. I hold both countries responsible.

I think that the United States has been foolish. I think we’ve all been foolish. We should’ve had this dialogue a long time ago; a long time, frankly, before I got to office.

And I think we’re all to blame. I think that the United States now has stepped forward along with Russia, and we’re getting together and we have a chance to do some great things, whether it’s nuclear proliferation in terms of stopping — you have to do it, ultimately that’s probably the most important thing that we could be working on.

But I do feel that we have both made some mistakes. I think that the — the probe is a disaster for our country. I think it’s kept us apart, it’s kept us separated.

There was no collusion at all. Everybody knows it. And people are being brought out to the fore (ph). So far that I know, virtually none of it related to the campaign. And they’re going to have to try really hard to find somebody that did relate to the campaign.

That was a clean campaign. I beat Hillary Clinton easily. And, frankly, we beat her — and I’m not even saying from the standpoint — we won that race. And it’s a shame that there could even be a little bit of a cloud over it. People know that, people understand it. But the main thing — and we discussed this also — zero collusion.

And it has had a negative impact upon the relationship of the two largest nuclear powers in the world. We have 90 percent of nuclear power between the two countries.

It’s ridiculous. It’s ridiculous what’s going on with the probe.

 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104561

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

All solved he misspoke

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/07/17/trump-says-misspoke-on-russian-meddling-during-press-conference-accepts-us-intel-findings.html

It happens.

Quote

A man is standing in line at the ticket counter in his local airport when he suddenly notices that the girl at the tickets counter has the largest breasts he has ever seen. Transfixed, he continues to stare at her chest while the line moves forward. Finally, he reaches the front of the counter. Upon being asked his destination, he asks the girl if he could could please have two pickets to Titsburgh. Horrified at what he's just said out loud, he stammers his way through an apology, and hurries to catch his flight. All through the flight, he can think of nothing but what he said to the ticket girl,and all through the following day. Untill the guilt finally consumes him, and he has to tell somebody what happened. He blurts out his story to one of his friends over lunch. "can you believe I said two pickets to Titsburgh?" He asks? "Sure." replies his friend. "It's called a fruedian slip, I do them all the time. In fact, just the other day over coffee I asked my wife to pass the sugar, when what I really meant to say was, "You ruined my life, you fucking bitch!"

 

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Barbara

Barbara 120

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

To all what?

The Trump campaign colluded with Russian agents on multiple occasions in order to influence the 2016 election. There's no rational doubt about that. I neither know nor care whether or not it was to a criminal extent or if it is possible to convict in this political environment. But if you argue that there is no evidence of collusion you are either profoundly stupid or lying.

Post the evidence.

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thrillhammer

thrillhammer 683

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, Barbara said:

Post the evidence.

barbara, why don't you come out and represent who you really are?  your words are empty now, and would have much more weight, if you would stop hiding and posing, and be your real self.  speak from the heart.

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