Alabama, WTF..you dumb mother fuckers

[Wally Fairway 5550]

Just now, Dahobbs said:

It is also expensive as shit. 

Try adding the cost of adoption to it after failed IVF. 
And people ask me why I am still working

[Welshy 907]

35 minutes ago, Chopper said:

not a fake

Fuck me...wait...wut?

[aggie08 21504]

But it's always important to remember, the other side is just as bad! Am I doing it right? Fucking unreal.

[safe sex 11735]

6 minutes ago, Welshy said:

Fuck me...wait...wut?

[Welshy 907]

Every time feels like the first time. 

 

[SimonBolivar 10958]

52 minutes ago, Chopper said:

not a fake

Led by...

 

Edited February 22 by SimonBolivar

[956 Worldwide 34715]

I want to take a moment to thank the IVF parents for offering your perspective on this thread, as it’s something that must be gut-wrenching to work through and watch happening. 
 

I saw about the ruling and was immediately pissed, but I did not have the context of where this case came from. I’m trying to extend some grace to the plaintiffs that sued. I can’t imagine being in the position they may have been in— desperately wanting a child and seeing that deeply held dream collapse because of a chain of awful management procedures at this hospital. I’m trying to empathize with their desire for some sort of recognition of the horrible way they were wronged and maybe watched their future lives crumple.

The decision is of course awful. I hope that these plaintiffs never had the goal of ending IVF for others and I can only hope this explodes in the faces of people who saw a chance to play a political game. 

[jimmyjazz 45971]

The whole "sex is not for fun" angle just shocks me.  I mean, if there is one thing that should cut across party lines, maybe besides greed, it's that sex is fun.  There is no way there are enough fundagelicals to prevail on this issue.

I'm not suggesting that there is anything wrong with waiting until marriage, or even thinking that sex is only for procreation, if that's your angle, fine.  It is NOT even close to the majority angle in this country or anywhere else that I know of.  It may be discouraged or even outlawed in certain countries, but here?  I don't believe people will stand for this, and the adjuncts of outlawing birth control, etc.  I mean, most people like to fuck, half of all marriages (even Baptists) fail because somebody fucked around, we all know the drill.  

[Guadaloopy 10973]

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

The whole "sex is not for fun" angle just shocks me.  I mean, if there is one thing that should cut across party lines, maybe besides greed, it's that sex is fun.  There is no way there are enough fundagelicals to prevail on this issue.

I'm not suggesting that there is anything wrong with waiting until marriage, or even thinking that sex is only for procreation, if that's your angle, fine.  It is NOT even close to the majority angle in this country or anywhere else that I know of.  It may be discouraged or even outlawed in certain countries, but here?  I don't believe people will stand for this, and the adjuncts of outlawing birth control, etc.  I mean, most people like to fuck, half of all marriages (even Baptists) fail because somebody fucked around, we all know the drill.  

Did they just rip Song of Songs out of their Bibles?

[MissingInAction 25106]

1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

are you asking because you are a pitcher or a catcher? (nttawwt)

Whatever it takes.

[aggie08 21504]

5 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

The whole "sex is not for fun" angle just shocks me.  I mean, if there is one thing that should cut across party lines, maybe besides greed, it's that sex is fun.  There is no way there are enough fundagelicals to prevail on this issue.

I'm not suggesting that there is anything wrong with waiting until marriage, or even thinking that sex is only for procreation, if that's your angle, fine.  It is NOT even close to the majority angle in this country or anywhere else that I know of.  It may be discouraged or even outlawed in certain countries, but here?  I don't believe people will stand for this, and the adjuncts of outlawing birth control, etc.  I mean, most people like to fuck, half of all marriages (even Baptists) fail because somebody fucked around, we all know the drill.  

If you aren't allowed to wear a condom, take a pill, pull out, have an abortion, or have a fertilized egg jeopardized in any way, maybe your unhappy spouse will think twice before cheating. Point for the Evangelists!

[Chewbacca 7780]

25 minutes ago, SimonBolivar said:

Led by...

 

What's his handle?

[Pancho 44856]

Just read how this all started. Jesus—

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guadaloopy 10973]

This is so maddening. 

I've been working very closely with Fertility Healthcare for over two years now.  About 75% of my billable hours are in support of a Fertility Healthcare company that owns clinics in CA, WA, UT, ID, NV, TN, and VA.  The fundies don't want to shut them down because they have "right to life" concerns.  They want to shut them down because a VERY large percentage of business for these clinics is for LGBTQIA+ intended parents.

It's such a disingenuous culture war play.   

[Samson's Wig 3192]

3 hours ago, Da Fino said:

Texags weighs in. Horrible people over there that probably say what many of my acquaintances say in private. Really disheartening stuff.

 

 

I'd love to have a chat in a dark alley with every single one of these pieces of shit.  These aren't humans, they're shit stains left behind when God last wiped his ass. Overgrown fecal humonculi. 

 

[aggie08 21504]

1 minute ago, Samson's Wig said:

I'd love to have a chat in a dark alley with every single one of these pieces of shit.  These aren't humans, they're shit stains left behind when God last wiped his ass. Overgrown fecal humonculi. 

 

Takes like "if you weren't ready to have ALL of your embryos become babies, then you shouldn't be doing IVF in the first place" make me not ashamed at all when I occasionally check the price of gold to see if it's worth pawning my ring today.

[Samson's Wig 3192]

Apologies for misspelling homunculi.  I may have been a bit angry when I typed that.

[Samson's Wig 3192]

The only thing that gives me any hope here is that too many people have friends, loved ones, and family who have gone through IVF and have a more direct understanding of all it involves for this to gain too much traction.   Those fuckwads on Texags are prime examples of people who have no clue what they're talking about and have never been exposed to these issues before.  My hope is that enough lawmakers, even the ones proudly wearing their pro-life stripes, will have either gone through this themselves, have friends who have, have an IVF grandchild, etc.    That's my hope.

[atomheartbevo 89718]

1 hour ago, Chopper said:

not a fake

26 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

The whole "sex is not for fun" angle just shocks me. 

The people who want to end ”recreational sex” are not the people having sex for fun.

55 minutes ago, Welshy said:

Fuck me...wait...wut?

There are groups who have been working to end access to contraception for a while.  Getting Roe v Wade struck down was a part of their strategy, because it’s tied into the Supreme Court rulings on contraception, gay sex, gay marriage, interracial marriage, etc.  Domino theory - knock one down, the rest will fall.

It’s pretty recent as well 1960s and 1970s   Before that  states could ban contraception.  And yes, there are lawmakers here in Texas who want to get rid of contraception   

https://www.kff.org/womens-health-policy/issue-brief/the-right-to-contraception-state-and-federal-actions-misinformation-and-the-courts/#:~:text=Currently%2C the right to contraception,married people to obtain contraceptives.

“Currently, the right to contraception is protected by two landmark Supreme Court decisions, Griswold v. Connecticut (1965) and Eisenstadt v. Baird (1972). In Griswold, the Court recognized that the constitutional right to privacy encompasses the right of married people to obtain contraceptives. Prior to the Griswold decision, many states outlawed contraceptives, prohibiting clinicians from prescribing, or even discussing, contraceptive methods with their patients. After the Griswold decision, some states continued to have these prohibitions for single people, only allowing married women to obtain contraceptives. These laws spurred the litigation that resulted in the High Court’s decision in Eisenstadt,where the Court extended the constitutional protections of Griswold to unmarried people.”

 

[ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2678]

23 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Just read how this all started. Jesus—

 

 

 

 

 

 

Terrible incident but I mean, come the fuck on. I'm sure there are other torts they could have pursued for damages, but hey let's go for the big one -- wrongful DEATH? There was only one way this was gonna go with them taking it to the retrogrades on SCOA. I'm sure they had some predictable interest groups "helping" them out too. Good job, moronic dickweeds. 

[Nicole44 22060]

1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

note to self - invest in companies that make chastity belts (I mean that is where they are going, right?)

 

Yes. 

1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

Edited February 22 by Nicole44

[Ghost of LL 15532]

27 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

I'd love to have a chat in a dark alley with every single one of these pieces of shit.  These aren't humans, they're shit stains left behind when God last wiped his ass. Overgrown fecal humonculi. 

 

These people don't even believe that shit.  Nobody believes that shit.  Know how I know?  Just do the old thought experiment with the trolley.  You're at the switch and a runaway trolley is coming down the tracks.  On one spur, there's a toddler.  On the other spur, there's a cryogenic container with 100 frozen embryos.

Is anybody flipping the switch to kill the toddler?

[HOOKEM4 5037]

We deserve this. We have allowed this. Just fucking vote while you can. This is insane.

[Welshy 907]

 

What color is the toddler? #alabama

Edited February 23 by Welshy

[BrickHorn 18237]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

The whole "sex is not for fun" angle just shocks me.

To be fair, the fucking losers advocating that angle are just reporting the honest feedback they receive from their sex partners. 

Edited February 23 by BrickHorn

[RDCanecutter 26447]

1 hour ago, Samson's Wig said:

Apologies for misspelling homunculi.  I may have been a bit angry when I typed that.

Who here has not angrily misspelled homunculi? There is no judgement here, brother.

In other news, wife just came in from the grocery store with a dozen Alabama chickens, and an untold quantity of future Alabama Potato Plants. Guess I best get to tillin up the back yard to plant them lest we become potato killers.

[Hagbard Celine 10870]

8 hours ago, Captainant said:

 

[Steel Shank 9428]

Man, I am so ready to fuck some chick right now it's crazy.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4976]

2 hours ago, Ghost of LL said:

These people don't even believe that shit.  Nobody believes that shit.  Know how I know?  Just do the old thought experiment with the trolley.  You're at the switch and a runaway trolley is coming down the tracks.  On one spur, there's a toddler.  On the other spur, there's a cryogenic container with 100 frozen embryos.

Is anybody flipping the switch to kill the toddler?

 I just stayed home all day with a sick toddler, so...

 

[Hank Kingsley 20966]

I mean, holy shit. 

 

[Biff Tannen 45691]

So, um, I just reported everyone on this entire thread. Because we have to be fair.  Belongs in cloak room. Because reasons. 

[Neonmoon 38129]

9 hours ago, RDCanecutter said:

Also, cremation is corpse abuse, meant to prevent them from rising up intact during the Rapture.

Pets are false children and therefore contribute to the non-life of unconceived children by people who dote on their dogs and knit them sweaters.

Hell I oughta run for office.

If you touch my dogs, I would make the John Wick movies look like a fucking Disney movie. 

[atomheartbevo 89718]

11 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

So, um, I just reported everyone on this entire thread. Because we have to be fair.  Belongs in cloak room. Because reasons. 

If they succeed in banning contraception in various states, sports forums across the land will be full of lots and lots of angry shit-posting. More angry shit-posting than normal, year-round and not just during shitty seasons.

[RDCanecutter 26447]

Just now, Neonmoon said:

If you touch my dogs, I would make the John Wick movies look like a fucking Disney movie. 

Your dog is no interest to me sinner-- thumbless animals are not responsible for you heresies nor can they swing a pick to mine salt.

(Well, it's actually coal, not salt, because that's what we have here.) Nonetheless, you shall soon get all the exercise you imagined you'd get when you signed up for that gym where you sit on the bench and play games on your phone, WHEN YOU EVEN GO. I do this to save your soul from the caked-on aura of EEEEEVIL that seeks to drag you down through the ground beneath your feet turned suddenly to foul pestilential boiling MUD.

But no, seriously, the dog is fine.

[Skipper 6136]

4 hours ago, yoladu said:

Also, to my recollection.. let's say they extract 15 eggs during the procedure. the doctors attempt to fertilize all 15 eggs, but after the blastocyst period before implantation, some are deemed superior, others not so much. I am not sure what the typical ratio (of good to bad) is or the criteria upon which each fertilized egg is evaluated, but they definitely cull out the bad ones and don't try freeze those.

are discarding the "bad" ones murder too?

This is exactly why they are pausing planned procedures.  They are being advised there is potential liability for ordinary course IVF decision making given this ruling. This isn't just an issue of a patient potentially no longer having the ability to "discard" currently frozen embryos.  It raises liability concerns about discarding embryos when there is a 0% chance of a viable birth.  Of course, the clinics/hospitals may also be facing liability for pumping their patients full of hormones and charging thousands only to now be forced to tell them "Sorry, your cycle is cancelled".  There will absolutely be lawsuits flowing that direction as well.  It's a mess.

For those that haven't been through this, it's not like an elective surgery that can just be postponed.  You have an extremely short window for a retrieval.  It's unbelievable what these patients are facing and I have no doubt their doctors are also distraught and disgusted.

 

[Dahobbs 17624]

23 minutes ago, Skipper said:

This is exactly why they are pausing planned procedures.  They are being advised there is potential liability for ordinary course IVF decision making given this ruling. This isn't just an issue of a patient potentially no longer having the ability to "discard" currently frozen embryos.  It raises liability concerns about discarding embryos when there is a 0% chance of a viable birth.  Of course, the clinics/hospitals may also be facing liability for pumping their patients full of hormones and charging thousands only to now be forced to tell them "Sorry, your cycle is cancelled".  There will absolutely be lawsuits flowing that direction as well.  It's a mess.

For those that haven't been through this, it's not like an elective surgery that can just be postponed.  You have an extremely short window for a retrieval.  It's unbelievable what these patients are facing and I have no doubt their doctors are also distraught and disgusted.

 

Yes. Each cycle costs 10s of thousands of dollars. And a lot of insurance doesn't cover it all. A lot of women went through a lot of painful injections and emotional turmoil, and now they are seeing that and 40 grand go up in smoke. 

[Blotto 23548]

5 hours ago, SimonBolivar said:

Led by...

 

Get a load of this fuckstick

Quote

In October 2021, it was announced that Roberts had been selected to replace Kay Coles James as president of The Heritage Foundation.[6][7]

Roberts said in January 2024 that he saw Heritage's role as "institutionalizing Trumpism," adding "the Trump administration, with the best of intentions, simply got a slow start. And Heritage and our allies in Project 2025 believe that must never be repeated." He said he did not believe Joe Biden had won the 2020 presidential election.[8]

 

[Pato del Muerto 52511]

9 hours ago, Nicole44 said:

For that matter, any masturbatory emissions, where the sperm is clearly not seeking an egg, could be termed reckless abandonment.

Reckless, hell!  I hit just where I was aimin’!

Edited February 23 by Pato del Muerto
IVF parent too so comment is true and accurate.

[troph 24821]

Don’t care had (gay) sex.

 

kidding aside these people are insane. It’s heart breaking that half the population (women) are in the cross hairs and by association their husbands too and yet it keeps happening. It’s just unfathomable. 

[wild_turkey 3159]

Don’t care had (gay) sex.

Enjoy that while it lasts.

[wild_turkey 3159]

We have one amazing child through IVF. We were late 30s when we started trying to become parents and had one natural pregnancy that resulted in miscarriage. After about a year of trying, we saw a fertility specialist who recommended skipping straight to IVF due to our age, and we got lucky on the first egg retrieval and implantation cycle and now have a happy and healthy one year old daughter. I know 4 other couples who are at various points in the infertility struggle, some of which are failing IVF, and I feel awful for them.

We also have several embryos frozen that we are unlikely to use because the first childbirth and recovery was physically very difficult for my wife. We don’t have much of an ethical dilemma over that because we don’t consider frozen embryos to be people.

I don’t understand why or how someone could define an embryo as a human being, and assuming most people who take that stance are doing so for religious reasons (radical Christianity), I’m genuinely curious where in the Bible this is even close to being defined? If not the Bible, then how do they arrive at these ideals?

(I realize the definition of when life begins is pivotal to the abortion debate, which I admittedly have mostly ignored until recently, so probably this has been beat to death.)

Also, it would be nearly impossible to argue against IVF without also opposing oral contraception and IUDs. Those methods allow fertilization to occur in vitro, but then prevent the fertilized egg from implanting into the endometrium. So I suppose everyone in Alabama is committing murder when they have sex while taking birth control?

It will be interesting to see if this gets adopted in other states. I thought IVF would be untouchable due to the fact that most people on both sides of the political aisle probably have family or friends who have used IVF and witnessed firsthand the joy it brings to the world, but here we are. Everyone who was paranoid about gay marriage, trans rights, and oral contraception was absolutely right to be worried.

[tx 3 putt 76988]

 

[Poester 109]

4 hours ago, Steel Shank said:

Man, I am so ready to fuck some chick right now it's crazy.

I can tell you’re not married. 

[Js1 85372]

5 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

Everyone who was paranoid about gay marriage, trans rights, and oral contraception was absolutely right to be worried.

After being told we were being dramatic and no one was going to go after those things 

[fuggled 576]

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/22/1233270447/alabama-lawmakers-move-to-protect-ivf-treatment

Quote

Six days after Alabama's Supreme Court ruled that frozen embryos are "children," upending in vitro fertilization treatments, a Republican state senator said he plans to introduce a bill that would protect IVF statewide.

 

State Sen. Tim Melson, who chairs the Senate's Health Care Committee, said the bill would clarify that embryos are not viable unless they are implanted in a uterus.

 

[CooterBrown 18014]

Terrible incident but I mean, come the fuck on. I'm sure there are other torts they could have pursued for damages, but hey let's go for the big one -- wrongful DEATH? There was only one way this was gonna go with them taking it to the retrogrades on SCOA. I'm sure they had some predictable interest groups "helping" them out too. Good job, moronic dickweeds. 

That incident sounds staged. It had to have been done on purpose with the result as the end goal.

[Captainant 27680]

6 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

We have one amazing child through IVF. We were late 30s when we started trying to become parents and had one natural pregnancy that resulted in miscarriage. After about a year of trying, we saw a fertility specialist who recommended skipping straight to IVF due to our age, and we got lucky on the first egg retrieval and implantation cycle and now have a happy and healthy one year old daughter. I know 4 other couples who are at various points in the infertility struggle, some of which are failing IVF, and I feel awful for them.

We also have several embryos frozen that we are unlikely to use because the first childbirth and recovery was physically very difficult for my wife. We don’t have much of an ethical dilemma over that because we don’t consider frozen embryos to be people.

I don’t understand why or how someone could define an embryo as a human being, and assuming most people who take that stance are doing so for religious reasons (radical Christianity), I’m genuinely curious where in the Bible this is even close to being defined? If not the Bible, then how do they arrive at these ideals?

(I realize the definition of when life begins is pivotal to the abortion debate, which I admittedly have mostly ignored until recently, so probably this has been beat to death.)

Also, it would be nearly impossible to argue against IVF without also opposing oral contraception and IUDs. Those methods allow fertilization to occur in vitro, but then prevent the fertilized egg from implanting into the endometrium. So I suppose everyone in Alabama is committing murder when they have sex while taking birth control?

It will be interesting to see if this gets adopted in other states. I thought IVF would be untouchable due to the fact that most people on both sides of the political aisle probably have family or friends who have used IVF and witnessed firsthand the joy it brings to the world, but here we are. Everyone who was paranoid about gay marriage, trans rights, and oral contraception was absolutely right to be worried.

Aside from the transparent attack on women's bodily autonomy, the logic of declaring every potential pregnancy a fully viable baby is fraught. A solid 20-30% of fertilized and implanted embryos fail to result in a healthy birth and viable baby, and end in miscarriage. That's not a moral or personal failure, biology can just be messy. But now can those women be prosecuted for """killing a child""" when they miscarry? 

It's just gonna get worse from here for women. 

[Captainant 27680]

Also I know it doesn't surprise anyone this point, but the judge who issued the ruling is a qanon loon.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/tom-parker-alabama-ivf-embryo_n_65d7ea34e4b0cc1f2f7b3e26

Quote

Parker was the featured guest on “Someone You Should Know,” hosted by Johnny Enlow, a Christian nationalist influencer and devoted supporter of former President Donald Trump. Over the course of an 11-minute interview, Parker articulated a theocratic worldview at odds with a functioning, pluralistic society.

 

“God created government,” he told Enlow, adding that it’s “heartbreaking” that “we have let it go into the possession of others.”

As reported by Right Wing Watch, Enlow has claimed that Trump “is on assignment” from God to work with the angels Michael and Gabriel to take down George Soros and Bill Gates, among others; he has claimed that Russian President Vladamir Putin is fighting “Luciferian pedophiles” in Ukraine, in a battle to stop them from deploying vaccines and 5G that would turn people into transhumanist semi-robots; and he has claimed that the majority of other world leaders are “satanic” pedophiles who “steal blood” and “do sacrifices.”

So yeah a real straight shooter that believes in covid vaccines being mind control, that putin is doing good things in Ukraine, and that satanic pedophiles are stealing blood from and sacrificing children. 

Totally the guy who should be dictating reproductive rights. 

God bless America, we are fucked. 

[DigglerontheHoof 21202]

This country would be 1000% better if we culled the fundies.  I hate those motherfuckers as much as I ever hated the cunts that flew planes into the WTC. 

[Ghost of LL 15532]

8 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

 

Nobody actually believes that frozen embryos are children.

I don't like to get into dissecting people's motives on things.  It's generally counterproductive.  I certainly doesn't address the logical failings of the argument.  But here, it's unavoidable.

Nobody believes that frozen embryos are children, as reflected in the runaway-trolly though experiment I referenced above.  I'm not saying there aren't plenty of people who will say "yeah, I think life begins at conception."  But such people generally haven't thought through the full implications of what that means. 

For those who have thought through the full implications--and that is to say legislators, judges, and other policy-makers and -influencers--they don't actually believe that frozen embryos are children.  And even if they were, they don't actually give two fucks about children, as reflected in the elimination of the summer food program.

This is about controlling women and taking away their bodily autonomy.  That's it.  And anybody who tries to engage these people in any kind of good-faith debate about when life begins is making a mistake.  Because these are not good-faith actors.