The Kids (Aren't) Alright - World Happiness Report

[Thetexashammer 1062]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

I confess that I have a weakness: I think that mean people suck.

I guess they really are the poor, mistreated portion of our society.  We should definitely treat them with kid gloves, and empower their shittiness.

Naah, I'll keep on loathing people who don't give a shit about others/have zero empathy for their fellow human beings, who celebrate cruelty, and champion being shitty.  I'm good with that.  The one group I'm not very tolerant of is that group.

Surly's own Al Sharpton race baiter thinks mean people suck LOL. Almost every single one of your posts is an attack on other posters. I can provide examples if you prefer. 

I say with no hostility, you should take a break. You are out of control.

Edited March 21 by Thetexashammer

[MissingInAction 25019]

Race bater?

[956 Worldwide 34704]

The public sector is inefficient compared to the private sector as experienced by the client because the public sector’s budgets, hiring authorities, and revenues are set by the legislative process which is not responsive to shifting demands, technologies, etc.  Even the highly professionalized public sectors are vulnerable to this, as you can see when the Army decides it doesn’t need a base anymore but Congress says it does. And we keep electing people who tell you outright that they are going to deliver less efficient and good services in exchange for lower taxes.  
 

You can’t throw some genius MBAs at that simple dynamic and fix it. There are not a bunch of geniuses who ruthlessly manage geniuses in the private sector.  They just are able to redistribute and invest resources in a quicker and more focused way because they don’t have a whole bunch of elected barons who are only accountable to voters they can dupe calling the shots. 
 

LOL, the private sector actively fucks up the public sector. The IRS has a pilot online filing system in some places that’s actually pretty good.  It took this long and you can’t use it because private tax preparers have been lobbying to keep the IRS paper based and shit.  

Edited March 21 by 956 Worldwide

[52-80 19147]

1 hour ago, Captainant said:

Lol a FRED graph showing averages, which we know are extremely top heavy thanks to median data, and then a couple of percentage increase graphs which really nicely conceal the truth of how fucking far apart those pay numbers are

Truly, you are a master of graph based communication. 

Fellas, dont let the federal reserve, the census office, the bls, or the cbo trick you with numbers and lines. 

Its the weaboo cisco technician and his gut feelings that really has a pulse on the national economy. 

[52-80 19147]

We all know averages are fake news because theyre skewed by all those high earners in fabrication and warehousing and shipping; and the upper crust of the slice of people in below-supervisory roles, like assistants to the regional manager. Theres a real hiearchy down there too! 

[TwiceHorn 31440]

Plenty of corporate drones give zero fucks, too. 

 

Like none of yall ever seen Office Space. 

Edited March 21 by TwiceHorn

[52-80 19147]

None of that “FRED” fucking bullllshit is going to convince me that cost of groceries isnt out of control until its compared against the bottom earners of people working in diners and coffee shops using a superior statistical measure like median. 

Rigor!

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Plenty of corporate drones give zero fucks, too. 

Only on mondays. 

[Sandman 3403]

55 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

The public sector is inefficient compared to the private sector as experienced by the client because the public sector’s budgets, hiring authorities, and revenues are set by the legislative process

As a state employee, I can't tell you how many times I've had people tell me our rules and requirements are stupid and ask why we don't "fix it". And I say to them "This is how the statute is written. We have no authority to change anything. If you don't like it, contact your legislator and tell him.".

[fattyflattie 4639]

2 hours ago, Celery Man said:

The specific metric was wages quadrupling over 10 years, which is stupid. Of course as we’ve discovered, what he meant was something somehow even stupider.

No it wasn’t, dumbfuck. It was my anecdotal experience, and that was clear.  You aren’t really this fucking stupid?  Or maybe you work in govt? 

[fattyflattie 4639]

3 hours ago, 52-80 said:

well, the thing is, fatty was right.  maybe not in the percentages, but the fact that the cost of eating out (black) matched wages (dashed red)-- specifically wages for individual, non-supervisory employees in mostly very blue collar jobs.  the other lines are cost of food at home, and blended total food spend.

This is impossible. Food companies make profit, I mean gouge. And for profit corporations barely even pay living wages. Some people even die trying to make it to director.  
 

4 hours ago, Captainant said:

Hard work is not rewarded. Networking and "working smart" is rewarded. I've watched many of the adults in my life growing up work themselves to death in dead-end jobs believing that if they worked hard enough, they'd get recognized and finally get that promotion to director. But it turns out that it doesn't make a shit how hard you work, and it's really about if you're drinking buddies with the hiring manager.

 

This post tells me so much.  I wish you would have posted this years ago, I’ve spent a lot of time trying to figure you out. I got the healthcare thing, and now, the economics   

 

[BabaYaga 15289]

4 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

My old man worked for a safety regulator for 20+ years.

I regularly cross paths with people who bust their asses to make sure that shitheels like you don't die - whether it be from lack of water, sanitation, disease.  

And people like you treat those folks with nothing but disdain.  You're the assholes leaving your shit behind for "the servant class," about whom you give zero shits, to clean up.  You simultaneously take them all for granted, and heap scorn upon them.  Yet, they still keep doing their jobs.  Because even fucking assholes deserve clean water and pipe lines that don't explode next to their house.  They do their job, for you, in spite of the fact that you don't deserve a goddamned thing.

Please thank them for their service for the rest of us.  

[BabaYaga 15289]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Plenty of corporate drones give zero fucks, too. 

 

Like none of yall ever seen Office Space. 

Difference is how easily they can be fired and replaced.  

[Frank Drebin 5661]

5 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

You're a piece of shit, who treats people like shit, and then wonders why they don't all bend over backwards to serve you.  

Wait, this is from the guy whose entire online existence here and in thousands of posts is bitching about how everyone in Texas and the United States he encounters are selfish assholes?

 

Edited March 22 by Frank Drebin

[Herbie Hancock 7345]

You and Brisket both suck. And as annoying as he is, and believe me it’s substantial, he’s quite tolerable as compared to you.

[hayden_horn 11362]

5 hours ago, alincoln said:

Another awful thread.  Well done

no fucking shit

no wonder the kids hate you olds. good christ the insufferability level on this thread fucking exceeds 11.

[wild_turkey 3159]

This thread is a microcosm of America. Just a bunch of people arguing with each other and flinging shit at each other over the dumbest of things.

Our politicians, media, and social media have increasingly polarized the country. There is very little room for respectful discourse anymore. Everyone thinks they are right and the other side is wrong on every single topic (education, religion, climate, immigration, womens’ rights, LGBTQ rights, healthcare, guns, electric vehicles, crypto, Russia, Gaza), and eventually people find justifications for being mean to each other or outright hating each other. They actually trained people to hate each other merely on the basis of wearing a mask or not wearing a mask during a pandemic. Unbelievable.

So this all gets amplified by social media and of course this trickles down to kids because they see it in their parents’ behaviors, so naturally everyone is less happy.

I personally feel happy with my life but I sense despair in the world around me and it’s hard to not think this country is doomed. We are riding on past successes and that will eventually dry up if we don’t get our affairs in order, find a way to treat each other better, and work together for the common good.

[Hefeweizen 5310]

I am glad the rest of you feel the need to work extra hard so I can enjoy the fruits of your labor.  At least I’m an honest asshole.  

[F250 28764]

24 minutes ago, Herbie Hancock said:

You and Brisket both suck. And as annoying as he is, and believe me it’s substantial, he’s quite tolerable as compared to you.

Herbie Hancock jumping in from the top rope.

 

[Herbie Hancock 7345]

Herbie Hancock jumping in from the top rope.

 

[Captainant 27639]

re: muh kids are overly politicized!

https://krdo.com/news/2024/03/20/students-hold-walkout-calling-for-resignation-of-three-widefield-school-district-board-members/

Maybe it's that a bunch of adults are just acting like shit heel bullies and throwing around slurs like "retard" and "schizo", and the kids are just calling out bullshit amirite @52-80

[Da Fino 2776]

10 hours ago, Captainant said:

Networking and "working smart" is rewarded. I've watched many of the adults in my life growing up work themselves to death in dead-end jobs believing that if they worked hard enough, they'd get recognized and finally get that promotion to director. But it turns out that it doesn't make a shit how hard you work, and it's really about if you're drinking buddies with the hiring manager

Did you really think this wasn’t the case?  

Edited March 22 by Da Fino

[Goredho 17397]

8 hours ago, MissingInAction said:

Can confirm. Shit you're lucky to get the bare minimum from most.

In my experience it breaks down like this:

20% actually give a shit and want to make a difference 

40% can't get a job anywhere else.

20% Contractors

20% completely fucking useless.

If only the government was as well run as Boeing, X and Purdue Pharma, all our lives would be hunky dory.

[Thetexashammer 1062]

 

[SydneyCarton 48064]

16 hours ago, F250 said:

My youngest had to make several attempts to register to vote and numerous attempts to get his license. He also has a non-American name. He had no issues getting a passport.

I'm not trying to be an asshole here, but what exactly is a non American name? I assume you mean something ethnic sounding, verson something like Smith or Jones?

We're supposed to be a melting pot. It makes me sad that you have to think of you and your sons own names in that light.

[hayden_horn 11362]

5 hours ago, Thetexashammer said:

 

lofl.

i have a ton to say on this stupidity but I'll have to wait until after work. 

but this sounds a lot like "some people are saying that these people falling down and shaking are actually sick! everyone knows it's demons and if they pray harder and ignore their disease it'll go away."

[Helobious 9451]

17 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I'm not trying to be an asshole here, but what exactly is a non American name? I assume you mean something ethnic sounding, verson something like Smith or Jones?

We're supposed to be a melting pot. It makes me sad that you have to think of you and your sons own names in that light.

I understand what he’s saying, even knowing there’s no such thing as an “American” name (names like Smith, Jones, Miller, etc didn’t even originate in America) I have a very generic hispanic name,  but it was pretty standard in the part of the country I grew up in so I never really thought twice about it till I was an adult and traveled other places in the US. I know F250 doesn’t live in the same kind of area. 
 

Ironically I think the most American names would be something like De’Shonthony or Quantavion. You won’t find names like those anywhere else in the world. 

[gsoda3 3251]

18 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Now......tell me how that differs materially from most every other workplace -- Dunder Mifflin Paper Company, Initech, etc.

It doesn't.  The 80/20 rule applies fucking EVERYWHERE.  Private sector, public sector, church committees, all of it.

no, it doesn't.  the incentives to succeed are different.  your life as a private company depends on your ability to succeed. the directors have skin in the game beyond their paycheck (if they're receiving a paycheck at all).  as a public agency you're pretty much guaranteed a job-  i worked in a public agency.  my wife works in one now.  we have BOTH been told to slow down our work pace because the results are outpacing the agency's expected output which would result in less funding next year.  in my current private company (finance) we have 5% reviews every year-  the bottom 5% are fired.  it works the same way at microsoft, google, apple, etc.  that doesn't happen at TCEQ or TRS.  

[TwiceHorn 31440]

11 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

Difference is how easily they can be fired and replaced.  

Theoretically, yes, but the vast majority of private-sector employees don't work in some competitive thunderdome.  A whole hell of a lot of em just get by.

[Brisketexan 105080]

I understand what he’s saying, even knowing there’s no such thing as an “American” name (names like Smith, Jones, Miller, etc didn’t even originate in America) I have a very generic hispanic name,  but it was pretty standard in the part of the country I grew up in so I never really thought twice about it till I was an adult and traveled other places in the US. I know F250 doesn’t live in the same kind of area. 
 
Ironically I think the most American names would be something like De’Shonthony or Quantavion. You won’t find names like those anywhere else in the world. 

The distinction is “generic white people names” vs….not that kind of name.
“De la Torre Gutierrez” or “Hoang” ain’t “REAL American.” Texas DPS will even “Americanize” your Spanish name - changed my middle name from something like “Jorge” to “George.” Unilaterally.

[BabaYaga 15289]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Theoretically, yes, but the vast majority of private-sector employees don't work in some competitive thunderdome.  A whole hell of a lot of em just get by.

And then get RIF'd in mass at the whim of the company.  

[TwiceHorn 31440]

32 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

lofl.

i have a ton to say on this stupidity but I'll have to wait until after work. 

but this sounds a lot like "some people are saying that these people falling down and shaking are actually sick! everyone knows it's demons and if they pray harder and ignore their disease it'll go away."

She seems to use a lot of anecdotes and stereotypes of dubious validity to prove her points, or actually generate outrage.  Like her generalization about how US troops are treated for PTSD.

Some of her points are probably valid to a degree, though.  There is a lot of overindulgent parenting going on, but I don't think it is in any way exclusively a librul phenomenon or centered around polarizing ideas like gender identity or whether kids are getting good therapy.

[Brisketexan 105080]

Theoretically, yes, but the vast majority of private-sector employees don't work in some competitive thunderdome.  A whole hell of a lot of em just get by.

And how much of a PITA it is to replace them, train someone new, etc.

[956 Worldwide 34704]

11 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

This thread is a microcosm of America. Just a bunch of people arguing with each other and flinging shit at each other over the dumbest of things.

Our politicians, media, and social media have increasingly polarized the country. There is very little room for respectful discourse anymore. Everyone thinks they are right and the other side is wrong on every single topic (education, religion, climate, immigration, womens’ rights, LGBTQ rights, healthcare, guns, electric vehicles, crypto, Russia, Gaza), and eventually people find justifications for being mean to each other or outright hating each other. They actually trained people to hate each other merely on the basis of wearing a mask or not wearing a mask during a pandemic. Unbelievable.

So this all gets amplified by social media and of course this trickles down to kids because they see it in their parents’ behaviors, so naturally everyone is less happy.

I personally feel happy with my life but I sense despair in the world around me and it’s hard to not think this country is doomed. We are riding on past successes and that will eventually dry up if we don’t get our affairs in order, find a way to treat each other better, and work together for the common good.

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?

A: Fucking government workers. 
 

LOL. Completely unserious. 

[Brisketexan 105080]

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?
A: Fucking government workers. 
 
LOL. Completely unserious. 

Well, you missed the main answer. “Because they’re all snowflake pussies, everything is actually great…thanks to us [older people]. BOOTSTRAPS!”

[Captainant 27639]

32 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Theoretically, yes, but the vast majority of private-sector employees don't work in some competitive thunderdome.  A whole hell of a lot of em just get by.

This is true not just for the IC's but the management and executives too. Just because someone is paid a shit ton doesn't mean that they've done anything to earn it. Hell look at pretty much any silicon valley unicorn startup founder, like Adam Neumann for example. Dude created a massive ponzi scheme with WeWork and sold it off to SoftBank which nearly tanked them. Their entire product was the stock symbol and FOMO. 

Now Neumann is getting into the rent to own apartment business and has already raised $300,000,000 after causing over $15,000,000,000 in losses. There's objectively no consequences for failure at the tippy top of the pyramid, as long as you are rich and charismatic enough 

[Goredho 17397]

6 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?

A: Fucking government workers. 
 

LOL. Completely unserious. 

Yeah, the discussion has been successfully redirected towards the usual political suspects.

[Rip76 4925]

12 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

This thread is a microcosm of America. Just a bunch of people arguing with each other and flinging shit at each other over the dumbest of things.

Our politicians, media, and social media have increasingly polarized the country. There is very little room for respectful discourse anymore. Everyone thinks they are right and the other side is wrong on every single topic (education, religion, climate, immigration, womens’ rights, LGBTQ rights, healthcare, guns, electric vehicles, crypto, Russia, Gaza), and eventually people find justifications for being mean to each other or outright hating each other. They actually trained people to hate each other merely on the basis of wearing a mask or not wearing a mask during a pandemic. Unbelievable.

So this all gets amplified by social media and of course this trickles down to kids because they see it in their parents’ behaviors, so naturally everyone is less happy.

I personally feel happy with my life but I sense despair in the world around me and it’s hard to not think this country is doomed. We are riding on past successes and that will eventually dry up if we don’t get our affairs in order, find a way to treat each other better, and work together for the common good.

This.

All of it.

[utee94 15808]

13 minutes ago, Goredho said:

Yeah, the discussion has been successfully redirected towards the usual political suspects.

And it's been successfully redirected by the usual political suspects as well.

[F250 28764]

1 hour ago, gsoda3 said:

in my current private company (finance) we have 5% reviews every year-  the bottom 5% are fired.  it works the same way at microsoft, google, apple, etc.

[Foosters 17843]

52 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?

A: Fucking government workers. 
 

LOL. Completely unserious. 

That's the current working theory.

Remember it started with:

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?

A: We're being too nice to them

[Celery Man 20933]

I think there’s an intersection of the social media thing and the mental health thing as far as grabbing labels, getting mired in self diagnosis, whatever stuff like that. The attention feedback loop, maybe some reverse star bellied sneetch stuff. For lack of a better term, there started to be some romance and fashion to being tragically broken in a lot of 2000s youth culture. But it’s also good that people who *do* genuinely have mental health struggles are less stigmatized when they speak about it or get help. I’m also skeptical of studies pointing to fewer instances back in the good old days -how are they understanding the majority of cases that people just didn’t talk about?

 

 There’s some incentivization stuff with the kids as well - if your kid is designated as having special needs, the classroom gets an additional helper? I know that that is a thing I’ve heard about in a few cases where parents were being encouraged to get a diagnosis.

 

lots of talk about how people work in public vs private sectors when really it seems like the important thing about the public sector is its ability to do things for the public benefit. Privatized roads and eliminating public schools would/will be a disaster. Prisons, the military, oversight, etc. 

[utee94 15808]

Anyway, the public/private sector discussion is a red herring, it really doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand.

The FACTS are, that we know that an increasing percentage of the population is unhappy enough to answer as such in surveys.

And we know that the negative responses disproportionately skew to those under 30.

Beyond that, this thread has really been nothing more than speculation as to why.  There's some plausible speculation, and some stupid-as-shit speculation, and some insensitive "don't care got mine" responses as well.

What I'd be most interested in finding, is WHY those who responded as unhappy, did so. I'd like to find it out directly from the original set of respondents.  And I'd also be interested to view similar past surveys over time, of the same age ranges, to see what the trends look like for those age ranges, over, say, the past 60-80 years.

As a solid GenXer, I can say that plenty of my peers had some fairly negative views of their surroundings, from ages 18-30.  In some ways it was expected or even fashionable to behave so-- youthful rebellion, young-person's angst, and all that.  But as I, and my peers, have become older, and gained perspective,, and learned how to live a contented life, much of that angst and fear and anger, have faded and been replaced by happier feelings.  This is only anecdotal of course, but that's my own experience.

That's why I'd be interested to see the trends over time, from generation to generation, of such a survey.

Edited March 22 by utee94

[F250 28764]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

I'm not trying to be an asshole here, but what exactly is a non American name? I assume you mean something ethnic sounding, verson something like Smith or Jones?

We're supposed to be a melting pot. It makes me sad that you have to think of you and your sons own names in that light.

A Spanish surname. It's just one of those things that is always in the back of your head.

We are melanin-challenged in my family. So I've heard different variations of "You look different than I expected" then they pronounce my last name and make one of those "huh" faces. My sisters never got these questions but people often assumed their last name was their married names.

When you experience this all your life you get an understanding that your last name on paper will generate assumptions.

People often expect this guy to show up when they see my name.

Spoiler

 

 

[Frank Drebin 5661]

49 minutes ago, Foosters said:

That's the current working theory.

Remember it started with:

Q: Wow, young people are really down and pessimistic, what’s going on?

A: We're being too nice to them

That is not the premise I was discussing.  It is not nice to give kids therapy when they do not need it.  It is not nice to practice what is called "gentle parenting" with no structure or rules.  It is not nice to be a bulldozer or helicopter parenting.  These things are destructive, no matter how well meaning you are.

[Celery Man 20933]

Even more destructive to systematically deny them lifesaving care.

[F250 28764]

39 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

That is not the premise I was discussing.  It is not nice to give kids therapy when they do not need it.  It is not nice to practice what is called "gentle parenting" with no structure or rules.  It is not nice to be a bulldozer or helicopter parenting.  These things are destructive, no matter how well meaning you are.

I understand Shrier is an attorney and an opinion columnist which makes me skeptical of her science background.

Is there data that indicates that these things that you listed are happening on a scale large enough to influence an entire or significant portion of a generation of children?

I ask because most of this just sounds like someone bitching about participation trophies and pronoun usage being the cause for the downfall of civilization.

[Goredho 17397]

53 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

That is not the premise I was discussing.  It is not nice to give kids therapy when they do not need it.  It is not nice to practice what is called "gentle parenting" with no structure or rules.  It is not nice to be a bulldozer or helicopter parenting.  These things are destructive, no matter how well meaning you are.

Like most things, there's a happy medium between coddling and harsh discipline. Going too far in one direction or the other is destructive.  I mean, look at the kids in Footloose.  They just wanted to dance, for chrissakes.

[Biff Tannen 45665]

1 hour ago, utee94 said:

 

As a solid GenXer, I can say that plenty of my peers had some fairly negative views of their surroundings, from ages 18-30.

And y'all took it and made some pretty bad ass music.  I'm looking around at Gen Z right now and...not seeing that.

[Captainant 27639]

Just now, Biff Tannen said:

And y'all took it and made some pretty bad ass music.  I'm looking around at Gen Z right now and...not seeing that.

 

[CHIEF 5078]

5 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

And y'all took it and made some pretty bad ass music.  I'm looking around at Gen Z right now and...not seeing that.

When you are not glued to a screen consuming 16 hours of social media, or have access to hundreds of TV channels at your fingertips a lot of creativity can come from staving off boredom. It was also used as a great coping mechanism. Writing great lyrics, catchy hooks and riffs, and getting a little notoriety was great for the ego, especially when your friends and hot girls would bring lawn chairs to your garage to hear your buddies and yourself play.

CHIEF