Contractor Problems

[77horn 216]

Sister-in-law lives in a 3-2 house with Mother-in-law.(MIL is 93.)  SIL decided to have the kitchen and both bathrooms remodeled and replace ceramic tile in entry-way.

Contractor gave her a price and a 45 day time estimate.  SIL signed a work-order to do the job.  Work started approximate Feb 15.  As of right now none of the items are complete.

Kitchen is about 95% complete. Master bath is about 40% complete. Ceramic tile in entry-way has been removed it needs smoothing before installing new tile.  No work has been done on 2nd bathroom.

Basically no one ever shows up for work.  The last time anyone did was July 3.  As best as I can tell, when they did show, they would show about 2 days a week and then only partial days.  SIL will be told they will be there to work on a given day, and then about 9 am she will text him asking for an ETA.  Response is usually "on my way now, be there shortly."  Then he is a no-show.

SIL says she paid everything except retention.  (I have no $ figures or percentages).   SIL thinks he wants to do the work, but is pathetic at time management.  I suspect it is something deeper, like he is flat our lying when he says he'll be there or he has serious legal/financial problems.  SIL wants to give him a short list of items he must finish, and then take the rest of the work to someone else.  They are supposed to meet Monday, but I doubt he'll show.

I come on her behalf to seek the wisdom of the Surlys on what to do next, especially assuming he doesn't show on Monday.

On the "plus" side there are probably $1000 in tools in her garage and she knows where he lives.

[Gil Bang 26050]

Sister-in-law lives in a 3-2 house with Mother-in-law.(MIL is 93.)  SIL decided to have the kitchen and both bathrooms remodeled and replace ceramic tile in entry-way.
Contractor gave her a price and a 45 day time estimate.  SIL signed a work-order to do the job.  Work started approximate Feb 15.  As of right now none of the items are complete.
Kitchen is about 95% complete. Master bath is about 40% complete. Ceramic tile in entry-way has been removed it needs smoothing before installing new tile.  No work has been done on 2nd bathroom.
Basically no one ever shows up for work.  The last time anyone did was July 3.  As best as I can tell, when they did show, they would show about 2 days a week and then only partial days.  SIL will be told they will be there to work on a given day, and then about 9 am she will text him asking for an ETA.  Response is usually "on my way now, be there shortly."  Then he is a no-show.
SIL says she paid everything except retention.  (I have no $ figures or percentages).   SIL thinks he wants to do the work, but is pathetic at time management.  I suspect it is something deeper, like he is flat our lying when he says he'll be there or he has serious legal/financial problems.  SIL wants to give him a short list of items he must finish, and then take the rest of the work to someone else.  They are supposed to meet Monday, but I doubt he'll show.
I come on her behalf to seek the wisdom of the Surlys on what to do next, especially assuming he doesn't show on Monday.
On the "plus" side there are probably $1000 in tools in her garage and she knows where he lives.

Strongly-worded letter

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

If she's paid all but the retention then she's probably screwed. She can go after him in court and may win, doesn't mean she'll see a nickel from the guy.  Meanwhile she's got his tools, and she should hold em in a safe place he doesn't have access to (not the garage).

[BottleRocket 647]

My guess is the contractor has a cash flow problem and took your sisters payment and paid subs for other projects.  Once that happened, your sister's project became a low priority until the contractor gets another project's cash to pay the subs to work on your sister's house.  She done f'd up when she paid more than 50% prior to the job being complete.

[77horn 216]

I asked her if she was willing to spend a little to get a "strongly worded" letter over an attorney's signature, just to get him to show up, but agreed she'd never recover any $.  I was astonished when she said she'd paid him all but retention.....

[BottleRocket 647]

I would recommend that she call him and leave messages, send e-mails, and generally harass the shit out of him until he finishes the project.  She needs to be busting his chops every day, multiple times a day.  Make his life hell.  If he doesn't care about his reputation, that's about the only thing she can do to motivate him to finish.

[deadshank 24653]

She needs to ask for copies of all invoices and corresponding notarized lien waivers from all subs and suppliers that prove they've been paid for all work to date.  If he can't (or won't) prove he paid for such material and work that he drew funds for then she should contact the district attorney and file charges for misapplication of trusted funds.  

Strongly worded letters are pieces of paper.  Sherrif's deputies showing up with handcuffs will garner much more attention.  

Where is this happening?  If it is Harris County then the DA's office will actively pursue this in the post-Harvey rebuild climate. 

Edited July 21, 2018 by deadshank

[77horn 216]

She lives in Montgomery County

[deadshank 24653]

Pursue with that county's DA.  

[deadshank 24653]

May not get a dime but, if so, contractor may check into the Graybar Motel. 

[77horn 216]

Thanks deadshank, I'll let her know.

[deadshank 24653]

1 minute ago, 77horn said:

Thanks deadshank, I'll let her know.

I'm a contractor.  This stuff happens fairly frequently on remodels. The lack of labor in the post-Harvey recovery makes me think he wasn't paying his subs, as they go where the money is, and now they won't come back.   We pay our subs every Friday pending verification of their work and their invoice amount.  They sign the waiver and are back on the job Monday.  

Your SIL's contractor most likely paid off his last job with her money.   Light his behind up. 

Sorry she's having to go through this. 

[Upgrayedd 5821]

Pics of SIL?

[77horn 216]

 

Quote

Sister-in-law lives in a 3-2 house with Mother-in-law.(MIL is 93.)

So, do you really want pics?

 

[Upgrayedd 5821]

Don’t judge me 

[Gil Bang 26050]

fucking contractors.  Borrow from Peter to pay Paul every fucking time. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

42 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

fucking contractors.  Borrow from Peter to pay Paul every fucking time. 

It ain't no coincidence that contractor starts with CON......

[TwiceHorn 31570]

Deadshank gives good advice  About 15 years ago, Texas made all residential construction contracts, except "cost plus" contracts, fiduciary arrangements where the contractor holds funds paid him in trust for the benefit of the property owner and subcontractors.  Failure to pay subs after being paid is a criminal offense.

Forces the good contractors to be punctilious about their books and payments to subs, which may not have been needed, and gets the bad ones on the hook for other than a civil lawsuit that never gets paid.

[77horn 216]

Update.  Apparently the guy and two workers showed up today.  Contractor signed SIL's form stating the reduced scope of work, with a 2 week deadline and a statement that he would provide lien releases.  We'll see if he shows two days in a row.

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

Don’t want to start new thread so….

Wrapping up a year long remodel driven by designer that foisted contractor on us (mistake, I know, but that’s done).  We are in final throes of it now, but had to move back into house in October because lease was up even though lots of work still to be done.  They were supposed to be done in June but windows didn’t arrive until October and were too big.  We are about ready to do final punch out.    

Last week below daughters bathroom we hear clicking in the pipes.   It’s too low frequency and dull to be a drip. It’s like creaking, but too loud for a brand new build to be acceptable.  I put it on the list for them to check out.  Tonight we find a slow drip outside garage door below that tub.  Fuck.  Me. This bathtub was able to be used when we moved back in and we have been using it since October.  

Notwithstanding the fact that if he doesn’t move fast enough I need to get Servpro out here to deal with the water damage myself (which means tearing up drywall and maybe removing the new bath), and presuming these were pipes put in by his insured and bonded plumbers, am I still fucked because we’ve been living in the house?   I am at wit’s end with this guy (and him probably with us) and we still need them to complete two very specific things that are waiting on supply (last windows and a cabinet fridge). My guess is there is also more work to do than is left to pay him, but it’s a close call. 

I need to scare this dude to take care of this.  Thoughts?  We are in Austin so he is going to say the freeze last week did it is my prediction. But fuck that too if they are new pipes.  

Edited January 5, 2023 by A-Tex Devil

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

[deadshank 24653]

9 hours ago, A-Tex Devil said:

Don’t want to start new thread so….

Wrapping up a year long remodel driven by designer that foisted contractor on us (mistake, I know, but that’s done).  We are in final throes of it now, but had to move back into house in October because lease was up even though lots of work still to be done.  They were supposed to be done in June but windows didn’t arrive until October and were too big.  We are about ready to do final punch out.    

Last week below daughters bathroom we hear clicking in the pipes.   It’s too low frequency and dull to be a drip. It’s like creaking, but too loud for a brand new build to be acceptable.  I put it on the list for them to check out.  Tonight we find a slow drip outside garage door below that tub.  Fuck.  Me. This bathtub was able to be used when we moved back in and we have been using it since October.  

Notwithstanding the fact that if he doesn’t move fast enough I need to get Servpro out here to deal with the water damage myself (which means tearing up drywall and maybe removing the new bath), and presuming these were pipes put in by his insured and bonded plumbers, am I still fucked because we’ve been living in the house?   I am at wit’s end with this guy (and him probably with us) and we still need them to complete two very specific things that are waiting on supply (last windows and a cabinet fridge). My guess is there is also more work to do than is left to pay him, but it’s a close call. 

I need to scare this dude to take care of this.  Thoughts?  We are in Austin so he is going to say the freeze last week did it is my prediction. But fuck that too if they are new pipes.  

If the pipes and tub in question are part of the remodel then that work is most likely still under warranty.  The job is not even over.  

 

Notify your builder immediately via phone call AND email.  Get a reply to your email and save it.  DO NOT TEXT. 
 

Typical new construction / remodel warranty in Texas is  one year general workmanship,  two years for mechanical work (HVAC, plumbing, electrical) and ten years for latent defects. 
 

Consult your contract regarding how to pursue workmanship warranty claim issues as it may be very specific. 
 

Texas Property Code 27 is the ultimate key to notifying your builder / remodeler of workmanship claims against them.   It details how you must notify them, the timeframe in which you must operate, how long they have to respond and the access you must great them to analyze and address the problem. 

 

Good luck. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by deadshank

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

15 minutes ago, deadshank said:

If the pipes and tub in question are part of the remodel then that work is most likely still under warranty.  The job is not even over.  

 

Notify your builder immediately via phone call AND email.  Get a reply to your email and save it.  DO NOT TEXT. 
 

Typical new construction / remodel warranty in Texas is  one year general workmanship,  two years for mechanical work (HVAC, plumbing, electrical) and ten years for latent defects. 
 

Consult your contract regarding how to pursue workmanship warranty claim issues as it may be very specific. 
 

Texas Property Code 27 is the ultimate key to notifying your builder / remodeler of workmanship claims against them.   It details how you must notify them, the timeframe in which you must operate, how long they have to respond and the access you must great them to analyze and address the problem. 

 

Good luck. 

Thanks.  I think ultimately it will come down to whether the pipe that is leaking is one of the ones they touched or not.  He responded that me that if it’s his plumbers work they will fix it so I have that in writing.  

[deadshank 24653]

@A-Tex Devil   Save your Servpro receipts and get reimbursed by your contractor.    You mitigated damage (which is the right thing to do rather than idly stand by and watch the joint fall apart).  Your builder should refund your money or knock it off his final draw request.  
 

(This assumes the problem is your contractor’s and not yours)

Edited January 5, 2023 by deadshank

[deadshank 24653]

1 minute ago, A-Tex Devil said:

Thanks.  I think ultimately it will come down to whether the pipe that is leaking is one of the ones they touched or not.  He responded that me that if it’s his plumbers work they will fix it so I have that in writing.  

There you go.  Off to a good start.   
 

Get accurate pics of old pipe / new pipe bit.  Try to be there so plumber doesn’t try to pull a fast one.  

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

Thanks for all of this.  I have a friend that is a home builder (though not a GC) coming in as I have meetings in town I can’t miss and my wife (who is recovering from surgery) is likely to murder everyone involved, and I don’t need to deal with APD on top of this.  We haven’t called Servpro yet but have planned to today.  
 

Generally, I think this contractor has been honest.  I’ve audited his invoices pretty carefully and where I’ve questioned, he either has receipts or has worked with me.   He’s just extremely inexperienced, relies way too much on us to catch his subs’ mistakes (which has been by far my biggest complaint), and horrible at estimating how long something is going to take.   

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

For the contractors/inspectors out there do these stair rails violate Austin code?  It’s more than 7” on top and bottom. Within the 4” code in the middle  

Designer sold us on these and we really like them but we’ve had two subs warn us now that they don’t think they are to code.  We have another issue that might have us forcing them to rip them out and do it again. But this would give us more ammo.  
 

 

[Bevo 13601]

8 hours ago, A-Tex Devil said:

For the contractors/inspectors out there do these stair rails violate Austin code?  It’s more than 7” on top and bottom. Within the 4” code in the middle  

Designer sold us on these and we really like them but we’ve had two subs warn us now that they don’t think they are to code.  We have another issue that might have us forcing them to rip them out and do it again. But this would give us more ammo.  
 

 

Why would a company make a product that isn't to code? Regardless, I think if you change it out, it is your responsibility to pay for the new product and the installation of the new product. It is wrong to try to get the builder to pay for it.

[drt 640]

8 hours ago, A-Tex Devil said:

For the contractors/inspectors out there do these stair rails violate Austin code?  It’s more than 7” on top and bottom. Within the 4” code in the middle  

Designer sold us on these and we really like them but we’ve had two subs warn us now that they don’t think they are to code.  We have another issue that might have us forcing them to rip them out and do it again. But this would give us more ammo.  
 

 

Correct, not to code. If you didn’t pull a permit, you can change it if you’re worried about small kids or could see yourself selling in a few years. 

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

19 minutes ago, Bevo said:

Why would a company make a product that isn't to code? Regardless, I think if you change it out, it is your responsibility to pay for the new product and the installation of the new product. It is wrong to try to get the builder to pay for it.

 

12 minutes ago, drt said:

Correct, not to code. If you didn’t pull a permit, you can change it if you’re worried about small kids or could see yourself selling in a few years. 

hmmmm……

Permits weren’t pulled.  But other issue is that they painted those railings without properly protecting hardwood (which you see is really light)  and we have lots of black paint that has stained the stairs.  Basically the really light colored wood shows black paint in the grain on several steps now and around where the railings are in the steps.   The sub that did the stairs told us unsolicited they wanted to use it for examples of their work but can’t because railing team fucked it all up.  
 

So that’s on GC for not protecting the stairs, right?.  They are trying to sand/clean it out but it’s not coming out so we think they need to redo everything.  The railings not being to code is just further ammo.  
 

Curious why it is not GC’s fault for installing it not to code?  We are dumb. How are we supposed to know that? 
 

All that said, I am fatigued and can give or take most of this. Shit works just fine, and I am not as bothered.  But other half is incensed by both issues.  

[drt 640]

White oak has big open pores, so yeah I can see where it would be a bitch to clean out. That’s on GC or the paint sub. It sucks. I see why you’re upset, painter just wasn’t careful enough. 
 

There are a fuck ton of stairs that were built since the 50s that are no longer to code. Which is why I say: If you don’t have kids/grandkids to worry about safety or you’re not selling soon, wgaf. With that said…that’s the GC’s job to rein in the designer before it hits y’all’s desk or have the conversation with all parties in advance of install. 
 

Edit to add: it is kind of an easy code for inspectors to ding you on. It would be noticed by pretty much anyone. 

Edited February 13, 2023 by drt

[CooterBrown 18033]

No one is not going to buy a house because of the stairs railing. An inspector won’t even fucking note that on his report.

[Bevo 13601]

1 minute ago, drt said:

White oak has big open pores, so yeah I can see where it would be a bitch to clean out. That’s on GC or the paint sub. It sucks. I see why you’re upset, painter just wasn’t careful enough. 
 

There are a fuck ton of stairs that were built since the 50s that are no longer to code. Which is why I say: If you don’t have kids/grandkids to worry about safety or you’re not selling soon, wgaf. With that said…that’s the GC’s job to rein in the designer before it hits y’all’s desk or have the conversation with all parties in advance of install. 

 

I wonder if I could use the balusters. How are they connected to the railing - weld or screws? There probably aren't enough for my needs and my newels and railings are wood. Where are you located, A-tex? Who was your stair designer?

[Upgrayedd 5821]

Who approved the design?

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

10 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

No one is not going to buy a house because of the stairs railing. An inspector won’t even fucking note that on his report.

That is where my head is at.  I just am unclear how this usually goes if we want to make contractor do it again. 

10 hours ago, Bevo said:

 

I wonder if I could use the balusters. How are they connected to the railing - weld or screws? There probably aren't enough for my needs and my newels and railings are wood. Where are you located, A-tex? Who was your stair designer?

Don’t want to say too much else at this point because the GC, due to our inexperience/naïveté was foisted on us by designer, and designer probably known by someone here.  Designer selected three railing styles, we picked one, GC managed installation. But the only reason we bother with the code argument is extra ammo if we make them redo all the stairs because of the paint issue.  I don’t really want to rip everything out because I am super fatigued by the whole remodel.  But I also paid a lot for them to do it right  

This has been a helpful “crowdsourcing” exercise.  Thanks, all. 

Edited February 13, 2023 by A-Tex Devil

[Bevo 13601]

2 hours ago, A-Tex Devil said:

That is where my head is at.  I just am unclear how this usually goes if we want to make contractor do it again. 

Don’t want to say too much else at this point because the GC, due to our inexperience/naïveté was foisted on us by designer, and designer probably known by someone here.  Designer selected three railing styles, we picked one, GC managed installation. But the only reason we bother with the code argument is extra ammo if we make them redo all the stairs because of the paint issue.  I don’t really want to rip everything out because I am super fatigued by the whole remodel.  But I also paid a lot for them to do it right  

This has been a helpful “crowdsourcing” exercise.  Thanks, all. 

PM me. I am building a home in the mountains (not Texas) and would love to speak with a stair designed here to get ideas for out there. And code may not be an issue for me because I need only a building location permit although subs need their own permits.

[horn4life 3784]

pretty sure it's not to code as the idea is little heads not fitting anywhere through the gap and then the little one panicking, and strangling.  I would fix it if it were me. Too bad you did not know sooner. I might ride the contractor a bit to help you out here, saying that honestly he should have known.  Even without permits pulled that's a potential liability issue if some little one does strangle post remodel.

4 hours ago, Bevo said:

PM me. I am building a home in the mountains (not Texas) and would love to speak with a stair designed here to get ideas for out there. And code may not be an issue for me because I need only a building location permit although subs need their own permits.

DO THE MATH.  It's honestly pretty simple.  What IS a common mistake is to not properly account for the thickness of the flooring on the first step of the run.  Saw some townhomes off MLK that had stained concrete rather than the hardwoods they should have because of this. Otherwise that first step is too short and the rise is not to code.  

[Cleo McDowell 20]

Question I'm hoping someone can help with. This is on a boat dock, everything else appears to be cut correctly except for this one hip rafter that's like a foot too short. How big of an issue is this not going all the way to corner of the overhang?

Edited February 13, 2023 by Cleo McDowell

[Bevo 13601]

On 2/12/2023 at 11:07 AM, A-Tex Devil said:

For the contractors/inspectors out there do these stair rails violate Austin code?  It’s more than 7” on top and bottom. Within the 4” code in the middle  

Designer sold us on these and we really like them but we’ve had two subs warn us now that they don’t think they are to code.  We have another issue that might have us forcing them to rip them out and do it again. But this would give us more ammo.  
 

 

It looks like that style should have been installed like:

 

 

 

[Upgrayedd 5821]

^Ding 

[milkman 428]

Question I'm hoping someone can help with. This is on a boat dock, everything else appears to be cut correctly except for this one hip rafter that's like a foot too short. How big of an issue is this not going all the way to corner of the overhang?

Not much weight is carried on that rafter. If you are worried have them sister a 2x along side.

[Gil Bang 26050]

Not much weight is carried on that rafter. If you are worried have them sister a 2x along side.

That’s what I would do

[A-Tex Devil 2463]

Another one…….
 

In our remodel we replaced all of our gas appliances with electric and contractor capped off gas line to kitchen…..  fine.  
 

One evening after we took possession of house we had strong gas odor that wouldn’t go away.  Wife called 311 and AFD followed by Texas Gas Company came out.  Long story - there was gas detected but no leak after pressure testing, but…...  
 

Texas Gas came and asked us where the gas was capped off in kitchen. Shrug from me, so we called contractor. He said capped off behind new cabinetry, good night.  Texas Gas said they can’t access it and until they can see it and confirm it’s properly capped or disconnected, our gas is turned off.  We scramble another solution with contractor’s plumber next day to cut off gas line from a point outside, so kitchen is completely disconnected.  This is in lieu of busting open our brand new cabinets so Texas Gas can see the capped line. But now our kitchen is completely disconnected.  
 

Contractor wants me to pay for that work to disconnect the pipe. My view is that they covered up access to confirm it was capped and it’s on them to fix so that I can have gas and heat my house again.  Thoughts?  I am pretty pissed because now our kitchen is disconnected from the gas completely so it’s a pain for future owners if they want gas appliances.  Contractor maintains they didn’t have to provide accessibility to the capped off pipe and they just did me a favor to help get gas back on.  

[Upgrayedd 5821]

2 minutes ago, A-Tex Devil said:

Another one…….
 

In our remodel we replaced all of our gas appliances with electric and contractor capped off gas line to kitchen…..  fine.  
 

One evening after we took possession of house we had strong gas odor that wouldn’t go away.  Wife called 311 and AFD followed by Texas Gas Company came out.  Long story - there was gas detected but no leak after pressure testing, but…...  
 

Texas Gas came and asked us where the gas was capped off in kitchen. Shrug from me, so we called contractor. He said capped off behind new cabinetry, good night.  Texas Gas said they can’t access it and until they can see it and confirm it’s properly capped or disconnected, our gas is turned off.  We scramble another solution with contractor’s plumber next day to cut off gas line from a point outside, so kitchen is completely disconnected.  This is in lieu of busting open our brand new cabinets so Texas Gas can see the capped line. But now our kitchen is completely disconnected.  
 

Contractor wants me to pay for that work to disconnect the pipe. My view is that they covered up access to confirm it was capped and it’s on them to fix so that I can have gas and heat my house again.  Thoughts?  I am pretty pissed because now our kitchen is disconnected from the gas completely so it’s a pain for future owners if they want gas appliances.  Contractor maintains they didn’t have to provide accessibility to the capped off pipe and they just did me a favor to help get gas back on.  

Tell the contractor to go pound sand.  Never should’ve left a line for future use buried behind cabinets and inaccessible.  

[ballrific 215]

Makes sense why most of the contractor estimates we've seen last few years are "cost plus", less responsibility for the GC.

I'm doing a small kitchen remodel right now and looking at a few different estimates, is there anything specific I should look for in the contractors contract to protect my ass? There's some wording here and there I don't like but it looks fairly standard.

[Bevo 13601]

1 hour ago, ballrific said:

Makes sense why most of the contractor estimates we've seen last few years are "cost plus", less responsibility for the GC.

I'm doing a small kitchen remodel right now and looking at a few different estimates, is there anything specific I should look for in the contractors contract to protect my ass? There's some wording here and there I don't like but it looks fairly standard.

If you feel like you could trust the guy without a written contract, that is the one you probably want doing the work. And to the contrary, never do business with a guy you don't trust. But as for the wording of the contract itself, you might want time incentives and punishments but for a short project it may not make any sense. Under no circumstances should yo pay more than half before the job is done and under no circumstances provide money before the first day on the job.

Also, get an idea of what his costs will be before the project begins. This will help you both. A lot of homeowners think contractors are ripping them off when in reality the costs are higher than what they think they are. Know how much cabinets and sinks and faucets and appliances will cost. Know what a plumber costs for a day. Know how much a permit costs.

[drt 640]

10 hours ago, ballrific said:

Makes sense why most of the contractor estimates we've seen last few years are "cost plus", less responsibility for the GC.

I'm doing a small kitchen remodel right now and looking at a few different estimates, is there anything specific I should look for in the contractors contract to protect my ass? There's some wording here and there I don't like but it looks fairly standard.

Just FYI, smaller jobs tend to be fixed fee because margin needs to be higher. When you get to bigger projects cost plus makes more sense for both parties. Could be you see more cost plus because of scope or costs.