Iran attacks Israel attacks Iran

[Bevo 13,493]

1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

As it has been for a while, the Iranian power brokers' goal is to make the U.S. and Israel the enemies to distract Iranians from the destruction they've done to their own people.

Sure, by killing a bunch of innocent people from other countries with other religions.

[Macklemore 2,898]

17 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

Every generation believes they will be the one to put a stop to wars in the Middle East. These conflicts stretch back several millennia and will continue to happen for several millennia more. Thinking that this is a problem that has a simple solution, or really any solution, is a fallacy. The best to hope for is containment to the region and that the civilian population does not suffer too greatly if things escalate like they inevitably will.

Bullshit. There would be no Islamic terrorist proxies or hostilities between Iran and Israel if HIH Reza Pahlavi was on the Peacock Throne. Iranians don’t give a shit about Palestinians and are resentful that their hard earned money goes to that cause.

[Basil 742]

If I was Israel, I’d bomb the shit out of Iran.

[UpperWestside 6,104]

17 minutes ago, Macklemore said:

Bullshit. There would be no Islamic terrorist proxies or hostilities between Iran and Israel if HIH Reza Pahlavi was on the Peacock Throne. Iranians don’t give a shit about Palestinians and are resentful that their hard earned money goes to that cause.

Spend time reading more about the history of the region. Do not tell me that you have because if you had you would know the divisions go back for millennia upon millennia. This will go on into perpetuity. 

[LCHorn 2,582]

Adding on to @Macklemore, but Iran had established diplomatic and military relationship with Israel and was a non-shooting ally against the Arabs.  In fact, it was so strong that even when he was deposed, the Israelis and the Iranian elites continued the relationship through the Iraq war before Khomeini more firmly established his theocracy at the head of the government (bear in mind this means the Israelis were selling US supplied arms to Iran while we sold weapons to Iraq). 

I don't mean to pick on you @UpperWestside, but when people describe the middle east conflicts are perpetual and immutable, it makes it sound like they are somehow distinct from those in the West.  I think part of the perception is it's a place with 2000 years of preserved written history so we just know a lot more about it.  There's been huge swaths of time when there was relative peace and I don't think the region appears all that more given to violence than Europe or the new world up to WW2. 

The whole "death to Israel" shit is Khomeini and is because of his rivalry with the Saudi's for religious legitimacy. 

[troph 24,548]

8 hours ago, b_p said:

This site has some amazing footage of ballistic missile strikes and how fast they're moving.  It makes you understand the challenges of defending against hypersonic missiles that can change trajectory during flight.  I suspect all of this was more of a show of Iran's capabilities rather than an actual attempt at trying to take out Israel.  However, from a pure defense standpoint, I'd expect we're learning a lot about how to defend multi-wave and barrage attacks as well as the reliability and effectiveness of the Iranian systems.

https://www.twz.com/news-features/irans-retaliatory-strikes-have-begun

 

This attack by Iran and the Russian-Ukraine war have been invaluable to provide clarity on the next generation of war and the capabilities of two boogeymen - Russian and Iran.  I certainly don’t like these attacks and want more support for Ukraine but the intel on wide open display is probably extremely valuable to our military. 

[Brisketexan 104,465]

Adding on to [mention=5490]Macklemore[/mention], but Iran had established diplomatic and military relationship with Israel and was a non-shooting ally against the Arabs.  In fact, it was so strong that even when he was deposed, the Israelis and the Iranian elites continued the relationship through the Iraq war before Khomeini more firmly established his theocracy at the head of the government (bear in mind this means the Israelis were selling US supplied arms to Iran while we sold weapons to Iraq). 
I don't mean to pick on you [mention=4231]UpperWestside[/mention], but when people describe the middle east conflicts are perpetual and immutable, it makes it sound like they are somehow distinct from those in the West.  I think part of the perception is it's a place with 2000 years of preserved written history so we just know a lot more about it.  There's been huge swaths of time when there was relative peace and I don't think the region appears all that more given to violence than Europe or the new world up to WW2. 
The whole "death to Israel" shit is Khomeini and is because of his rivalry with the Saudi's for religious legitimacy. 

Bingo. Iran’s “enmity” for Israel is an entirely self-serving stunt by the islamofascist regime, with nearly zero historical basis.
I won’t stan for the Shah or our blanket and blind support for him (autocrats ain’t good), and our limited strategic thinking in that respect helped pave the ground for the Islamic revolution. But the shittiness of the current regime is on them.
What amazes me is to see people so blinded by their rage at Israel (which, again…is not without a great deal of merit) that they put a white hat on Iran as simply following international law, and Israel is the devil for killing IRGC leadership who were using an embassy as their planning grounds for further attacks on Israel (conveniently skipping past the finding this week that Iran was behind the attack on Israel’s non-combatant embassy in Buenos Aires…and then a bombing of a Jewish center that killed 85 civilians in BA). Yeah, Iran, super-champions of “international law.” Fuck that shit.

[UpperWestside 6,104]

15 minutes ago, LCHorn said:

Adding on to @Macklemore, but Iran had established diplomatic and military relationship with Israel and was a non-shooting ally against the Arabs.  In fact, it was so strong that even when he was deposed, the Israelis and the Iranian elites continued the relationship through the Iraq war before Khomeini more firmly established his theocracy at the head of the government (bear in mind this means the Israelis were selling US supplied arms to Iran while we sold weapons to Iraq). 

I don't mean to pick on you @UpperWestside, but when people describe the middle east conflicts are perpetual and immutable, it makes it sound like they are somehow distinct from those in the West.  I think part of the perception is it's a place with 2000 years of preserved written history so we just know a lot more about it.  There's been huge swaths of time when there was relative peace and I don't think the region appears all that more given to violence than Europe or the new world up to WW2. 

The whole "death to Israel" shit is Khomeini and is because of his rivalry with the Saudi's for religious legitimacy. 

Europe is the most bloodied continent in recorded history on the planet that also suffers from perpetual war. They are not the topic here. Again anyone that thinks they will solve the continual state of wanting to go to war and fighting over land there has not done any real purview of the history of the region. The Middle East will continue to bicker and fight long after we are all gone. 

[LCHorn 2,582]

8 minutes ago, UpperWestside said:

Europe is the most bloodied continent in recorded history on the planet that also suffers from perpetual war. They are not the topic here.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.  Do you think we shouldn't be arming the Ukrainians? 

The middle east isn't exceptional.  We should support other nations or people when our interests align and remove support when they don't. 

[Hank_Hill 18,458]

The conflicts in the ME will not continue for millennia. We’re going to kill the planet way before that.

[Hank Kingsley 20,635]

1 hour ago, Bevo said:

Sure, by killing a bunch of innocent people from other countries with other religions.

Look, I'm fully aware of their atrocities. The current President of Iran literally ordered the execution of my grandfather and 2 of his friend/neighbors in 1983 for not converting to Islam. They were also accused of being "spies" for Israel due to their main religious temple being located in Haifa. 

The regime needs to go. The only path that feels fruitful is a revolution that comes from within Iran. We've all been waiting for it to happen for a while now. 

But there are no "good guys" in charge in the Middle East right now. Everyone is a bad actor to varying degrees.  

[UpperWestside 6,104]

2 minutes ago, LCHorn said:

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.  Do you think we shouldn't be arming the Ukrainians? 

The middle east isn't exceptional.  We should support other nations or people when our interests align and remove support when they don't. 

Again the topic is not Europe. I have no issue helping to ensure that Israel survives as a nation. I’m cool with Netanyahu seeing a prison cell though. There just will never be a solution to the violence in the Middle East. They will fight amongst each other for the rest of our lives and again long after we are turned to dust.

[UpperWestside 6,104]

2 minutes ago, Hank_Hill said:

The conflicts in the ME will not continue for millennia. We’re going to kill the planet way before that.

Well sure we’re on target to do that as a species, but if we somehow are still here several millennia from now they’ll still be fighting. 

[Hook1997 5,269]

46 minutes ago, Basil said:

If I was Israel, I’d bomb the shit out of Iran.

 

[Evil Bill Obrien 3,164]

8 minutes ago, Hank_Hill said:

The conflicts in the ME will not continue for millennia. We’re going to kill the planet way before that.

[Poester 109]

I love how Iran wants to call it even as if they weren’t behind October 7th. Their leadership is very regarded. 

[Gatorubet 30,064]

Oil prices gonna go up, inflation gonna worsen, and the mortgage and real estate thread will be showing continuous footage of acts of poster Seppuku. 

[UTGrad98 2,257]

2 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Oil prices gonna go up, inflation gonna worsen, and the mortgage and real estate thread will be showing continuous footage of acts of poster Seppuku. 

Fill up your tanks today. Gas prices gonna jump this week.

[InkaUtexas 25,426]

Flights are getting back to normal.

[InkaUtexas 25,426]

Interesting. So if we got 70, others even more, how many of the 150 made it any target? Sounds like there is a lot of new scrap metal out there.

US forces intercepted 70+ drones and at least three ballistic missiles, US officials say

From CNN's Oren Liebermann and Haley Britzky

US forces intercepted more than 70 one-way attack drones and at least three ballistic missiles during Iran's attack on Israel, according to two US officials familiar with the situation.

The ballistic missiles were intercepted by warships in the eastern Mediterranean Sea, one of the officials said. Iran launched more than 100 ballistic missiles in total at Israel, according to a senior administration official.

The US Navy currently has two destroyers in that area, both are guided missile destroyers capable of intercepting missile and drone launches.

US fighter jets were also part of the response to Iran’s attack on Saturday and shot down drones launched towards Israel, another US official told CNN.

Edited April 14 by InkaUtexas

[Bevo 13,493]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

What amazes me is to see people so blinded by their rage at Israel that they put a white hat on Iran as simply following international law, and Israel is the devil for killing IRGC leadership who were using an embassy as their planning grounds for further attacks on Israel (conveniently skipping past the finding this week that Iran was behind the attack on Israel’s non-combatant embassy in Buenos Aires…and then a bombing of a Jewish center that killed 85 civilians in BA). Yeah, Iran, super-champions of “international law.” Fuck that shit.

And the bombing by Hezbollah of a Panamanian plane with 21 aboard including 12 Jews, 1 day after the Buenos Aires attack.

Edited April 14 by Bevo

[Bevo 13,493]

1 hour ago, Hank_Hill said:

The conflicts in the ME will not continue for millennia. We’re going to kill the planet way before that.

Not kill. Never kill. Only maim, or seriously injure.

[Bevo 13,493]

13 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Interesting. So if we got 70, others even more, how many of the 150 made it any target? Sounds like there is a lot of new scrap metal out there.

US forces intercepted 70+ drones and at least three ballistic missiles, US officials say

From CNN's Oren Liebermann and Haley Britzky

US forces intercepted more than 70 one-way attack drones and at least three ballistic missiles during Iran's attack on Israel, according to two US officials familiar with the situation.

The ballistic missiles were intercepted by warships in the eastern Mediterranean Sea, one of the officials said. Iran launched more than 100 ballistic missiles in total at Israel, according to a senior administration official.

The US Navy currently has two destroyers in that area, both are guided missile destroyers capable of intercepting missile and drone launches.

US fighter jets were also part of the response to Iran’s attack on Saturday and shot down drones launched towards Israel, another US official told CNN.

If we intercepted 3 out of more than 100 ballistic missiles, it makes me wonder how many we tried to intercept. You would think this would be a way to test our systems so 3 makes me question our systems. Maybe it depends on from where the missiles were shot.

Edited April 14 by Bevo

[MrBig 5,279]

1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Look, I'm fully aware of their atrocities. The current President of Iran literally ordered the execution of my grandfather and 2 of his friend/neighbors in 1983 for not converting to Islam. They were also accused of being "spies" for Israel due to their main religious temple being located in Haifa. 

The regime needs to go. The only path that feels fruitful is a revolution that comes from within Iran. We've all been waiting for it to happen for a while now. 

But there are no "good guys" in charge in the Middle East right now. Everyone is a bad actor to varying degrees.  

The situation in Iran is unique because the Islamic Revolution was a relatively recent event, historically speaking. A lot of the older people were in their teens and twenties pre-Revolution back when Iran was westernized. They have first hand experience of what life was like without the current regime.

The push for an internal uprising by the people of Iran has a chance to gain traction if it is properly supported by the West, but I don’t think many are interested in supporting that kind of war. There is interest in defending Israel from Iranian attacks, but there is not much interest in regime change in support of the Iranian people absent any aggression towards Israel. 

[Neonmoon 38,127]

36 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Oil prices gonna go up, inflation gonna worsen, and the mortgage and real estate thread will be showing continuous footage of acts of poster Seppuku. 

[Dewey 3,280]

Can't they just draw a line in the sand, play a volleyball game, winner gets to claim most peaceful religion? 

[Duane Moore 5,236]

16 hours ago, Ghost of LL said:

It’s a very rational response. It’s big and showy for the Islamic world to see that Iran isn’t going to take its consulate getting bombed without a response.  But the response is done in such a way that Israel can repel it with little difficulty and virtually no damage.

Israel can declare victory and call it a day based on the performance of its air defenses and the support it has received from its allies.  And, in fact, that’d probably be the smart play.

But it’s not the play that keeps Bibi in office and out of prison. So really no chance of that happening.

I have seen this argument a couple of places and it doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. If I am an observer in Oman, or the UAE, or Iraq and I see Israel fire one missile that takes out the commander of the Quds Force and several other high ranking members, and Iran’s retaliation is to fire 300 drones, cruise, and ballistic missile that collectively only manages to injure a poor little Bedouin girl, who comes off looking like the strong horse in this exchange?

I tend to think that they really thought they would inflict some pain on Israel. If they didn’t, it seems like a miscalculation, a waste of a lot of their arsenal, and it gives Israel another causus belli to come back after them.  If you’re going to break forty years of acting through proxies to do your dirty work, I would think you’d want a much better return on such a move. 

[elfenix 34,168]

3 hours ago, UpperWestside said:

Europe is the most bloodied continent in recorded history

china by itself says hi

Edited April 14 by elfenix

[Viper 12,011]

10 minutes ago, Duane Moore said:

I have seen this argument a couple of places and it doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. If I am an observer in Oman, or the UAE, or Iraq and I see Israel fire one missile that takes out the commander of the Quds Force and several other high ranking members, and Iran’s retaliation is to fire 300 drones, cruise, and ballistic missile that collectively only manages to injure a poor little Bedouin girl, who comes off looking like the strong horse in this exchange?

I tend to think that they really thought they would inflict some pain on Israel. If they didn’t, it seems like a miscalculation, a waste of a lot of their arsenal, and it gives Israel another causus belli to come back after them.  If you’re going to break forty years of acting through proxies to do your dirty work, I would think you’d want a much better return on such a move. 

It was absolutely an attempt to overwhelm Israeli defenses, I think they just didn't anticipate Jordan and SA helping down the missiles and drones too (who's help is probably the most encouraging sign here). 

I've also seen it referenced here and elsewhere but Israel never bombed or attacked an Iranian consulate, I guess people don't read past the headlines anymore. 

The real question now is does Israel respond. It probably should be what Jordan and SA will allow to keep them helping and not sitting out. 

[twosheds 370]

6 hours ago, Armybrat said:

A berder with no cheese?

and no Coke, Pepsi.

[achooloco 1,065]

2 hours ago, Viper said:

I've also seen it referenced here and elsewhere but Israel never bombed or attacked an Iranian consulate, I guess people don't read past the headlines anymore. 

Say what now? Haven’t paid the most attention but what’s the disconnect from this: 

The New York Times cited four unnamed Israeli officials as acknowledging that Israel was responsible for the attack.

Not saying there for sure was an attack but seems like the Iranian  embassy was attacked by Israel. 

 

[utee94 15,742]

5 minutes ago, achooloco said:

Say what now? Haven’t paid the most attention but what’s the disconnect from this: 

The New York Times cited four unnamed Israeli officials as acknowledging that Israel was responsible for the attack.

Not saying there for sure was an attack but seems like the Iranian  embassy was attacked by Israel. 

 

He's saying it's in question whether or not that was in fact an "embassy."  Israel definitely did it.

[InkaUtexas 25,426]

It was a designated Diplomatic location. Sanctioned by the Syrian Government. That makes it a diplomatic location.

[Armybrat 40,678]

My Brit friend (ex-RAF and Falklands veteran) just sent me this….

 

[Ted Lange 15,991]

 

 

[956 Worldwide 34,314]

4 hours ago, elfenix said:

china by itself says hi

Europe isn’t especially violent or war-prone but Europeans and their spin-off/mentee cultures are very, very good at war.

This is a big part of why Israel’s existence drives the Islamic world nuts, not really religion or even land for co-religionists. Jews left the Near East as tribesmen and came back organized as a Western nation with Western ways of war, thought, and social organization. Their existence in the middle of the Near East is a constant reminder of what the Islamic world believes is their humiliation at the hands of the West, which is supposed to be inferior. That’s why there’s so many comparisons to the Crusaders. 

[B00M 6,278]

Quote

"So much for the vaunted ballistic-missile capability of Iran," a US official said.

 

Do we really need to talk shit? Show some fuckin’ sportsmanship, act like you’ve been there before, etc. 

Edited April 14 by B00M

[Nicole44 22,023]

SIAP…it’s the truth. I hate it for the Iranian people. They had a good life until the Shah fell. 
 

 

[billfromlaketravis 11,352]

49 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

 

 

Is China’s tech really that shitty? It gives me somW hope for a free Taiwan. 

[MonkeyDoughnut 10,134]

Estimates of Israel's cost to defend against the one night barrage range from $550M to over $1B. That's a lot of coin.

[billfromlaketravis 11,352]

5 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Estimates of Israel's cost to defend against the one night barrage range from $550M to over $1B. That's a lot of coin.

Send the bill to the Saudis for fighting their war for them. 

[Bevo 13,493]

5 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Estimates of Israel's cost to defend against the one night barrage range from $550M to over $1B. That's a lot of coin.

Yes, it is a problem that has to be solved by the West. You shouldn't have to intercept $3,0000 drones with $1M missiles.

[achooloco 1,065]

2 hours ago, utee94 said:

He's saying it's in question whether or not that was in fact an "embassy."  Israel definitely did it.

Ah, gotcha. Thanks.

[miguelito 11,204]

39 minutes ago, billfromlaketravis said:

Is China’s tech really that shitty? It gives me somW hope for a free Taiwan. 

Let he who has not hit 'shift-w' instead of 'e' launch the first dronW. 

[Harrison Stafford 3,325]

52 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

SIAP…it’s the truth. I hate it for the Iranian people. They had a good life until the Shah fell. 
 

 

Be careful what you wish for.

[Mother mopar 3,291]

Yes, it is a problem that has to be solved by the West. You shouldn't have to intercept $3,0000 drones with $1M missiles.

You don't work in the defense sector, do you. War is not always symmetrical. Jamming, suppression, GPS denial is often a better fit for contested environments.

There's layers on a defensive posture. Just because the news doesn't talk about doesn't mean it's not there, especially with Israel.

[DaggerHorns 3,057]

2 minutes ago, Mother mopar said:

You don't work in the defense sector, do you. War is not always symmetrical. Jamming, suppression, GPS denial is often a better fit for contested environments.

There's layers on a defensive posture. Just because the news doesn't talk about doesn't mean it's not there, especially with Israel.

I don’t think he works in the financial sector either after seeing the number “$3,0000.”

[FartingMonk 3,606]

1 hour ago, Bevo said:

Yes, it is a problem that has to be solved by the West. You shouldn't have to intercept $3,0000 drones with $1M missiles.

It's easy.  You strap explosives to a True Believing America and have him run at the drone factory 

[ztejas 43,244]

4 minutes ago, DaggerHorns said:

I don’t think he works in the financial sector either after seeing the number “$3,0000.”

You don't know what three ten thousand is? What are you, a moron?

[DaggerHorns 3,057]

Just now, ztejas said:

You don't know what three ten thousand is? What are you, a moron?

I thought it was Threeventy thousands.