Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

[bad_teammate 13479]

6 minutes ago, Hawndoh said:

Anyone with the power and influence to change the rhetoric.

So... who? It's kind of important that you understand what you're asking for.

The reality is that "Defund the Police" didn't come about from some powerful figure who gave talking points to others under their control/influence. It spread organically because it resonated with millions of Americans. It didn't come from the Democrats and it's not even aimed at Democrats.

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I mean. I feel for her. But that's politics. She's absolutely not the enemy. But she's been demonized, and I'm not surprised that other party members have to resent running against their opponents and her shadow in states and precincts far away and wildly different than hers. I don't know how you solve that, but I get why she and other democrats are frustrated. 

The reason the Democratic leadership is all 80+ is that they don't embrace young energy, they smother it out of jealousy. The way to control it is to enact discipline in your caucus. "Don't talk bad about each other." is pretty simple.

But the leadership hate AOC and the progressive youth energy. This is what they want to happen, even if it's bad for the party overall, because it's good for them individually.

3 minutes ago, Brandywine said:

Dems have a major messaging problem, IMO. 

The problem isn't "Defund the Police", because that's not a Democratic message.

The problem is that they don't have a message.

[bad_teammate 13479]

3 minutes ago, Foosters said:

The Dems have an inherent disadvantage. They are up against a party that runs what has consistently proven to be the most successful political platform in human history: invaders are coming to take your freedom, your jobs, and your identity.

We could have a similar, and true, message that the 1% is coming to take our money, jobs, and freedom. And it would resonate.

[Foosters 18225]

Just now, bad_teammate said:

We could have a similar, and true, message that the 1% is coming to take our money, jobs, and freedom. And it would resonate.

But then who's gonna host the 25k plate dinners?

[DonkeyCigars 143]

I see what bad_teammate is saying in that you can't expect the Democrats to be able to put out a fire they didn't start and can't control, but I agree with Hawndoh insomuch as it does seem, and the perception to many folks who aren't card-carrying members of the left and get the newsletters, that the Democrats are associated with that language and, at best champion it or at worst, endorse it, all because a sizable group of those who identify with the Democrat party have created a viral message.

 

[Huckleberry 34407]

Just now, DonkeyCigars said:

I see what bad_teammate is saying in that you can't expect the Democrats to be able to put out a fire they didn't start and can't control, but I agree with Hawndoh insomuch as it does seem, and the perception to many folks who aren't card-carrying members of the left and get the newsletters, that the Democrats are associated with that language and, at best champion it or at worst, endorse it, all because a sizable group of those who identify with the Democrat party have created a viral message.

 

Okay, now explain what's wrong with defunding police. 

[washparkhorn 9967]

Just now, Huckleberry said:

Okay, now explain what's wrong with defunding police. 

It sounds scary to low information voters.

[bad_teammate 13479]

The Democrats could harness that energy and essentially co-opt it under a reform-focused banner around which they unify. There's a reason the Republicans perpetually hold power despite being largely unpopular and champions of unwanted politics and beliefs at large, they know how to utilize the power their base gives them.

The Democratic establishment hates its base and wishes they were only representing white suburbanites.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19279]

Think she’s a statewide winner by the end of the decade.  Probably Senate.  

There was a ton of NY State that went Trump, including Long Island and Staten Island. Given what has been going on in NYC with the uptick in crime, defund the police is a hard slogan to win with. Demilitarize or reform are much, much better.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

Just now, Huckleberry said:

Okay, now explain what's wrong with defunding police. 

The term misrepresents the intent and meaning and invokes extreme emotional responses by not being clear that police aren't going anywhere, you just want to demilitarize and put some money into social services or whatever the real policy would be.

[Biff Tannen 46061]

16 minutes ago, Foosters said:

The Dems have an inherent disadvantage. They are up against a party that runs what has consistently proven to be the most successful political platform in human history: invaders are coming to take your freedom, your jobs, and your identity.

[Biff Tannen 46061]

4 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

The term misrepresents the intent and meaning and invokes extreme emotional responses by not being clear that police aren't going anywhere, you just want to demilitarize and put some money into social services or whatever the real policy would be.

[henrygandorf 29221]

5 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

The Democrats could harness that energy and essentially co-opt it under a reform-focused banner around which they unify. There's a reason the Republicans perpetually hold power despite being largely unpopular and champions of unwanted politics and beliefs at large, they know how to utilize the power their base gives them.

The Democratic establishment hates its base and wishes they were only representing white suburbanites.

republicans use bumper sticker slogans because they understand how stupid the average american voter is.

once you have to start "explaining" what defund the police means, you've lost the simple messaging argument.

american voters choose simple over beneficial over half the time.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

21 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I mean. I feel for her. But that's politics. She's absolutely not the enemy. But she's been demonized, and I'm not surprised that other party members have to resent running against their opponents and her shadow in states and precincts far away and wildly different than hers. I don't know how you solve that, but I get why she and other democrats are frustrated. 

I like her and her platform, but she also attacks other Dems. In fact, her initial campaign included direct attack rhetoric on Dem moderates.  She should have expected that they would return fire.  Lately, she has come around to understanding the need to win swing districts and states.  I think cooler heads will prevail at some point and the intraparty attacks will slow down in both directions. 

As for running in her shadow, that's just another bullshit double standard Dems have to deal with. Meanwhile, Republican moderates never get saddled with Gaetz or the Q anon representatives, and barely get saddled with Trump.  Its easier to run on fear and hate than it is to run on actual policy. 

[ChickenSandwich 9918]

31 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

 Its easier to run on fear and hate than it is to run on actual policy. 

lol

Edited November 12, 2020 by ChickenSandwich

[wildcat09 29557]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

I mean. I feel for her. But that's politics. She's absolutely not the enemy. But she's been demonized, and I'm not surprised that other party members have to resent running against their opponents and her shadow in states and precincts far away and wildly different than hers. I don't know how you solve that, but I get why she and other democrats are frustrated. 

Assuming we're talking about moderate Dem candidates, you solve it by going on the offensive against Republicans instead of constantly playing defense. Make them explain why they're not nazis instead of sitting back and letting them make you explain why you're not a socialist.

[SydneyCarton 49325]

2 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Assuming we're talking about moderate Dem candidates, you solve it by going on the offensive against Republicans instead of constantly playing defense. Make them explain why they're not nazis instead of sitting back and letting them make you explain why you're not a socialist.

I feel like pointing out that Democrats are gutless pussies is mutually exclusive to my point. Because if you think the Democrats are going to wake up and start calling 40-50% of Americans Nazis, well...

 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19279]

2 hours ago, FondrenRoad said:

I like her and her platform, but she also attacks other Dems. In fact, her initial campaign included direct attack rhetoric on Dem moderates.  She should have expected that they would return fire.  Lately, she has come around to understanding the need to win swing districts and states.  I think cooler heads will prevail at some point and the intraparty attacks will slow down in both directions. 

As for running in her shadow, that's just another bullshit double standard Dems have to deal with. Meanwhile, Republican moderates never get saddled with Gaetz or the Q anon representatives, and barely get saddled with Trump.  Its easier to run on fear and hate than it is to run on actual policy. 

That is because the average American voter is an idiot whose attention span is about 140 characters.

[Bullneck 19454]

She's going to be Biden's pick for UN Ambassador.

[Bullneck 19454]

On 11/1/2020 at 3:20 PM, Hank Scorpio said:

Nancy Pelosi should be killed regardless of marrying or fucking. 

Really?  What is that?

[HenryJames 67116]

 

[jimmyjazz 46976]

On 11/12/2020 at 3:06 PM, Huckleberry said:

Okay, now explain what's wrong with defunding police. 

As a slogan, it sucks?  The binary perception, right or wrong, is classic Democratic Party step-on-our-dick swing and a miss.

[Gap03 3374]

17 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

[Dbeasy 15526]

That is because the average American voter is an idiot whose attention span is about 140 characters.

Didn’t read. Too long.

[Pescado_Rojo 19558]

double

Edited November 19, 2020 by Pescado_Rojo

[Pescado_Rojo 19558]

46 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

 

[Chad Fuck 18092]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

As a slogan, it sucks?  The binary perception, right or wrong, is classic Democratic Party step-on-our-dick swing and a miss.

This x 1000.  It turns off vast swaths of people.  It's terrible marketing. 

[elfenix 34658]

first two rules of twitter: 1) don't come at @wendys; 2) don't come at @aoc. 

[Huckleberry 34407]

3 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

As a slogan, it sucks?  The binary perception, right or wrong, is classic Democratic Party step-on-our-dick swing and a miss.

I didn't ask what's wrong with "Defund the Police." I specifically asked what's wrong with defunding the police.

I get the sloganeering argument.

[jimmyjazz 46976]

3 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

I didn't ask what's wrong with "Defund the Police." I specifically asked what's wrong with defunding the police.

I get the sloganeering argument.

I have no problem with the general concept, although we could all surely argue over the specifics.  Shifting mental health oversight away from untrained law enforcement to . . . trained professionals . . . well, that's just a stupid easy decision to make.

[elfenix 34658]

HPD homicide clearance rates have gone from 90% to 50% in the past 8 years (thanks, art!).  if HPD homicide were a school, conservatives would be trying to shut it down. 

[Longhorn_Fan68 34079]

AOC taking no prisoners. She's awesome.

[Underdog 29102]

Queen. 

[bad_teammate 13479]

i dig.

[elfenix 34658]

[strangulation! 1716]

that's the worst post of all time

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

AOC messing with Texas:

 

[elfenix 34658]

[washparkhorn 9967]

Righteous.

 

[Kyrie Eleison 9312]

[TwiceHorn 31987]

On 10/27/2020 at 11:08 PM, jimmyjazz said:

She's young, and she's idealistic, but she's not stupid, and I honestly believe SHE believes in what she is saying.  If this democracy survives, she will be a major player for decades to come.

Some people have "it", and AOC has "it".

 

On 10/31/2020 at 1:58 PM, Dahobbs said:

She would be great. Actually caring about the people and improving the nation would put her in the top 25% of Presidents automatically. 

I generally agree on both of these points.  Her apparent sincerity and effort are admirable.

The question, to me, though, is what's going to happen to her over the next 10 years or so while she "grooms" or prepares for higher/est office?

I do believe there is a corrupting or compromising element to lengthy service inside the Beltway.  Overall, I think the "corruption" (very broad sense, not illegality necessarily) is a result of both the people it attracts and the "culture" for lack of a better word.  It is both nature and nurture, but even the best nature doesn't escape the nurture.

AOC seems to be one of the better people politics has attracted in a while.  We shall see what happens.

[immamac 44199]

I like pissed off unstoppable just freshly re elected AOC. She's all gas no brakes.

[HillaryFan420 121]

I'm sure AOC is fine for her district and could maybe mount a competitive senate campaign in NY someday, but I don't see support for her being broad enough to be an effective leader for the party or to be successful in national elections.  

[HenryJames 67116]

Username checks out.

[gmr548 16681]

I'm sure AOC is fine for her district and could maybe mount a competitive senate campaign in NY someday, but I don't see support for her being broad enough to be an effective leader for the party or to be successful in national elections.  

Like... Hillary?

[wildcat09 29557]

Y'all remember when GOP-dipshit Rep. Andy Barr from Kentucky invited AOC to tour a coal mine and then cancelled the invitation when she called his bluff and accepted it?  Think on that for a minute and consider why he cancelled, and then maybe reconsider the whole idea you've got in your head that she's too "liberal" to appeal to working class people in the heartland.

People who have actually been part of the working class can speak to working class concerns. The GOP wants to have Fox clip a five second soundbite out of context and put a giant red "SOCIALIST!" label over her face in screencaps. They're terrified of her actually speaking to their voters. 

[elfenix 34658]

1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

Y'all remember when GOP-dipshit Rep. Andy Barr from Kentucky invited AOC to tour a coal mine and then cancelled the invitation when she called his bluff and accepted it?  Think on that for a minute and consider why he cancelled, and then maybe reconsider the whole idea you've got in your head that she's too "liberal" to appeal to working class people in the heartland.

People who have actually been part of the working class can speak to working class concerns. The GOP wants to have Fox clip a five second soundbite out of context and put a giant red "SOCIALIST!" label over her face in screencaps. They're terrified of her actually speaking to their voters. 

 

Quote

“But Ocasio-Cortez has a movement of millennials that follow her," Comer said. "Ocasio-Cortez is a lot more prepared when she comes to committee meetings. ... She is smart, and I think that we need to be very prepared when we debate her on issues that we’re having a hard time with. There's still a future for coal, but we need to make sure that we're debating the right people on that issue.”

"we need to pick on people who aren't going to hand us our ass on a platter"

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/gop-s-getting-scared-ocasio-cortez-swipes-back-after-republican-n995501

[Michael Knight 13187]

she owns ted

 

 

[jimmyjazz 46976]

Ted was allegedly a debate monster.

He should be better.

[406W30th 1111]

20 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Ted was allegedly a debate monster.

He should be better.

Yeah he's not tho