Starliner

[MonkeyDoughnut 10226]

First manned flight scheduled for tonight. After years of delays Boeing ready to go. I'm not sure I'd be as keen to fly on a new Boeing designed aircraft currently. To a safe and productive journey:

Before a door-size panel blew out of a Boeing 737 Max, leaving a gaping hole in the side of an Alaska Airlines aircraft shortly after takeoff; before whistleblowers came forward to say they were threatened for bringing up safety issues at the company; and before the Justice Department opened a criminal investigation into the blowout incident, Boeing was struggling with another set of issues, on another high-profile vehicle.

Its Starliner spacecraft, designed to fly astronauts to orbit under a $4.2 billion contract from NASA, had suffered a series of problems that put its launch with astronauts years behind schedule. Its onboard computer had failed during its first test flight. A second test flight was scrubbed after valves in the vehicle’s service module stuck and wouldn’t operate. Then, after the craft finally flew a test mission successfully without anyone on board, Boeing discovered that tape used as insulation on wiring inside the capsule was flammable and would need to be removed. The parachute system also had problems, which forced the company to redesign and strengthen a link between the parachutes and the spacecraft.

Now, a decade after NASA awarded Boeing a contract to fly astronauts to the International Space Station, Boeing will finally attempt to fly its Starliner spacecraft with people onboard. If all goes to plan, at 10:34 p.m. on Monday, the company is set to fly a pair of veteran astronauts, Sunita Williams and Barry “Butch” Wilmore, on a mission that will be one of the most significant tests for Boeing’s space division — and for NASA — in years.

 

 

[CycleTex87 2965]

Scrapped. 

[Anastasis 23454]

That sucks. 

 

[0xdeadbeef 1645]

It was a valve that was buzzing, and they didn't want to open/close it with crew on board. Sounds like they'll unload the crew and then on/off/on/off/on/off the thing. 

  

 

 

[Captainant 27620]

Artemis is one hell of a boondoggle. Nevermind that it's lunar landing mission plan requires more than a dozen orbjtal cryogenic refueling missions - which haven't been practically demonstrated even once yet 

Edited May 8 by Captainant

[MonkeyDoughnut 10226]

Launch pushed again due to another leak...

 

 

[MonkeyDoughnut 10226]

 

[thunderlounge 7813]

Bout damn time.

[Kwix 2186]

 

[Kwix 2186]

A5/Starliner CFT: A second reaction control system maneuvering jet has failed off; mission control has told Wilmore to hold at 260 meters from the station, the point where he had planned to test ship's manual control system. Instead, he's been asked to hold position at that point for hot fire tests that may get the jets back in operation

Edited June 6 by Kwix

[immamac 42832]

5 minutes ago, Kwix said:

A5/Starliner CFT: A second reaction control system maneuvering jet has failed off; mission control has told Wilmore to hold at 260 meters from the station, the point where he had planned to test ship's manual control system. Instead, he's been asked to hold position at that point for hot fire tests that may get the jets back in operation

This seems not good. 

[Kwix 2186]

Looks like they have been given the go ahead to attempt docking.

[RamjetFDO 10575]

Watching the Starliner approach to ISS, the PAO commentary difference between NASA and SpaceX is many orders of magnitude different (in a good way).

[Kwix 2186]

And they're docked.

[RamjetFDO 10575]

Contact.   Capture.

[thunderlounge 7813]

Now, how do we get them home safely?

Not sure I’d wanna ride that back. 

[Kwix 2186]

They seemed to dock without much difficulty.  I would think that was the biggest hurdle with thruster issues.

[UnivTex34 1763]

Just now, Kwix said:

They seemed to dock without much difficulty.  I would think that was the biggest hurdle with thruster issues.

Said earlier on the NSF broadcast, that the main difficulty now would be thrusting away from ISS. Especially if they continue having thruster lighting issues.

[RamjetFDO 10575]

I'm heading through my private grapevine that the decision is almost certain now that no one's flying home in this lemon. It's only a matter of time and checking all the legal boxes before they make the public declaration.

[thunderlounge 7813]

Bet that SpaceX bill is gonna set them back a couple of bucks. 

[0xdeadbeef 1645]

2 hours ago, RamjetFDO said:

I'm heading through my private grapevine that the decision is almost certain now that no one's flying home in this lemon. It's only a matter of time and checking all the legal boxes before they make the public declaration.

Damn. Eric Berger (and others) had an article suggesting that was a possibility, but I really didn't think NASA would make the call. This has to be the end of Starliner, right. 

 

[RPM 26315]

https://futurism.com/the-byte/signs-boeing-starliner-completely-failed

https://futurism.com/the-byte/retired-astronaut-boeing-starliner

[Captainant 27620]

https://arstechnica.com/space/2024/08/nasa-likely-to-significantly-delay-the-launch-of-crew-9-due-to-starliner-issues/

Wtf? Boeing changed the software between the last flight and this one, and now Starliner cannot autonomously undock from the ISS. 

 

The Crew 9 delay is relevant to the Starliner dilemma for a couple of reasons. One, it gives NASA more time to determine the flight-worthiness of Starliner. However, there is also another surprising reason for the delay—the need to update Starliner’s flight software. Three separate, well-placed sources have confirmed to Ars that the current flight software on board Starliner cannot perform an automated undocking from the space station and entry into Earth’s atmosphere.

At first blush, this seems absurd. After all, Boeing’s Orbital Flight Test 2 mission in May 2022 was a fully automated test of the Starliner vehicle. During this mission, the spacecraft flew up to the space station without crew on board and then returned to Earth six days later. Although the 2022 flight test was completed by a different Starliner vehicle, it clearly demonstrated the ability of the program's flight software to autonomously dock and return to Earth. Boeing did not respond to a media query about why this capability was removed for the crew flight test.

It is not clear what change Boeing officials made to the vehicle or its software in the two years prior to the launch of Wilmore and Williams. It is possible that the crew has to manually press an undock button in the spacecraft, or the purely autonomous software was removed from coding on board Starliner to simplify its software package. Regardless, sources described the process to update the software on Starliner as "non-trivial" and "significant," and that it could take up to four weeks. This is what is driving the delay to launch Crew 9 later next month.

[thunderlounge 7813]

Hop in, undock, spacewalk?

Who gives a fuck if it can navigate back on its own? We don’t need no water, let the mother fucker burn. 

[Captainant 27620]

1 hour ago, thunderlounge said:

Hop in, undock, spacewalk?

Who gives a fuck if it can navigate back on its own? We don’t need no water, let the mother fucker burn. 

NASA is worried about "bricking" the docking collar and permanently losing access to it 

[thunderlounge 7813]

Well sure, on auto. Can’t they do it manually?

I mean somebody suits up, undocks manually, and spacewalk back?

It just sounded like boeing was more concerned with saving their capsule vice saving the astronauts they stranded.

 

[RamjetFDO 10575]

Not the best thing to hear...

https://arstechnica.com/space/2024/09/starliners-speaker-began-emitting-strange-sonar-noises-on-saturday/

[RPM 26315]

Well, at least it didn't burn up.

[RamjetFDO 10575]

Not a lot of *NEW* info in this video, but it's a well-presented summary of the entire escapade.

 

 

 

Edited September 19 by RamjetFDO
(embed the video)

[MonkeyDoughnut 10226]

54 minutes ago, RamjetFDO said:

Not a lot of *NEW* info in this video, but it's a well-presented summary of the entire escapade.

 

 

 

Very well done video. Pretty damning for Boeing and their future.  When you have one of the astronauts asigned to help and oversee the process with Boeing say he's not willing to fly on Starliner... it's incredible.

[thunderlounge 7813]

[RamjetFDO 10575]

Very well done video. Pretty damning for Boeing and their future.  When you have one of the astronauts asigned to help and oversee the process with Boeing say he's not willing to fly on Starliner... it's incredible.

That was the one huge takeaway I had from that, too.

I feel bad for my friends at Boeing, but I thought the analysis of the MDD merger being the "beginning of the end" was a fascinating possible root cause.

[MonkeyDoughnut 10226]

27 minutes ago, RamjetFDO said:

That was the one huge takeaway I had from that, too.

I feel bad for my friends at Boeing, but I thought the analysis of the MDD merger being the "beginning of the end" was a fascinating possible root cause.

Yes, the MDF merger was something I forgot about but it tracks for all their current issues and the shift from an engineering culture to MBA culture.

[RPM 26315]

nm

Edited October 13 by RPM