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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 12:52 AM, Incredulity said:

The SS doesn’t have the audio from the communications that day.  Un-fucking-believable.

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They normally have audio. Just not that day. I know Cheatle referred to the fbi for the investigation but damn:

how many shell casings on the roof? Ask the FBI.  

Was there a second shooter? She said ask FBI.

Were there people in the building? Yes. Why didn’t any of them hear the shooter on the roof? Said to ask FBI.

Can you give us a timeline of the events? Yes. I have one with me. Can you breakdown what happened that day? My timeline is not specific. 

The oversight committee isn’t exactly a committee that “gets along.” About anything. They were all in agreement on this. 

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 1:15 AM, chainsaw said:

why is this a big deal though

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Yeah, I don't really fault her for that.  She's back in D.C. doing one debriefing after another, followed by internal inquiries, followed by committee prep, followed by hearings.  She has 5 direct reports and 11 underneath them, most of whom had some hand in this (or lack thereof).  Obviously on her flaws seems to be delegating to competent people.  But tooling around in Western PA for 36 hours when she's got a lotta people to interrogate and then a lotta people to give answer, not a big deal IMHO. 

Plus I'm quite certain there's a protocol way above my paygrade on how they interrogate local law enforecement for incidents like this.  But I'd rather some of them be showing my team around Western PA, while others are brought to DC to USSS HQ, on her turf to be questioned.  Get them outta their bullshit comfort zone and start answering tough questions.  They probably have a room where they can replicate the whole damn thing in 3-D anyway.  I realize that would put a wedge between local LEO and USSS going forward.  But guess what?  Too fucking late.   

Posted (edited)
  On 7/22/2024 at 8:18 PM, TexEx15 said:

This is a fantastic question.

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Actually, I'm not sure how good a question it is.  A competent sniper can make shots from 1000 yards or more, and they wouldn't use an AR-15 variant.  Really good shooters can hit at nearly 3000 yards, using some other weapon, like a .50 BMG.  Regardless, better, and very common bolt action rifles with optics are widely available and owned by many, e.g. deer hunters, and would have had a much longer lethal range.

Establishing a perimeter at 3/4 mile or more because of the possibility of snipers using common, but not AR-15, rifles isn't really realistic.

Unless the shooter was spraying rounds at pretty close range, an AR-15 variant, most of them, is an objectively bad choice.  

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 2:13 AM, TwiceHorn said:
Actually, I'm not sure how good a question it is.  A competent sniper can make shots from 1000 yards or more, and they wouldn't use an AR-15 variant.  Really good shooters can hit at nearly 3000 yards, using some other weapon, like a .50 BMG.  Regardless, better, and very common bolt action rifles with optics are widely available and owned by many, e.g. deer hunters, and would have had a much longer lethal range.
Establishing a perimeter at 3/4 mile or more because of the possibility of snipers using common, but not AR-15, rifles isn't really realistic.
Unless the shooter was spraying rounds at pretty close range, an AR-15 variant, most of them, is an objectively bad choice.  

This. If you were to assign any of a million hunters in Texas the “mission” of “take a dude out at under 300 yards,” functionally all of them would bring their own scoped rifle in 30/06, .270, .300 WM, etc. And almost all could hit the target’s center mass.
Give a decent shooter a clear shot at a large mammal inside 300 yards, and most will score a solid hit.
That sort of threat is the baseline the SS should be prepared for and should sweep for, in all cases.
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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:14 AM, Brisketexan said:

Give a decent shooter a clear shot at a large mammal inside 300 yards, and most will score a solid hit.


Yea on a perfectly still and crisp December morning shooting at a deer.

I’m guessing Bubba might be slightly less accurate when shooting at the fucking president knowing he will die in about 30 seconds after he pulls the trigger with the whole world watching.
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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:14 AM, Brisketexan said:


This. If you were to assign any of a million hunters in Texas the “mission” of “take a dude out at under 300 yards,” functionally all of them would bring their own scoped rifle in 30/06, .270, .300 WM, etc. And almost all could hit the target’s center mass.
Give a decent shooter a clear shot at a large mammal inside 300 yards, and most will score a solid hit.
That sort of threat is the baseline the SS should be prepared for and should sweep for, in all cases.

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I think you and TwiceHorn are missing the point of AOC's question.  

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Posted

Oh is this where we start talking about calibers and magazines vs clips and a bunch of other stupid gun bullshit?  Because that sounds super fun and definitely has never been done before. 

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 2:13 AM, TwiceHorn said:

Actually, I'm not sure how good a question it is.  A competent sniper can make shots from 1000 yards or more, and they wouldn't use an AR-15 variant.  Really good shooters can hit at nearly 3000 yards, using some other weapon, like a .50 BMG.  Regardless, better, and very common bolt action rifles with optics are widely available and owned by many, e.g. deer hunters, and would have had a much longer lethal range.

Establishing a perimeter at 3/4 mile or more because of the possibility of snipers using common, but not AR-15, rifles isn't really realistic.

Unless the shooter was spraying rounds at pretty close range, an AR-15 variant, most of them, is an objectively bad choice.  

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I mean if you are preparing for the plot of “Shooter” then yes you have a point. In reality the AR-15, as AOC rightly points out, is the soup du jour for these idiots.

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:20 AM, tbone_ said:


Yea on a perfectly still and crisp December morning shooting at a deer.

I’m guessing Bubba might be slightly less accurate when shooting at the fucking president knowing he will die in about 30 seconds after he pulls the trigger with the whole world watching.

Sure, there’s a pressure difference. But all you have to do is hit the target. That much kinetic energy on a human, anywhere near the vitals, and they’re generally fucked. The kid was at what, 200 yards? A real rifle with an optic, that’s a 90%+ shot. Which is what the SS should be protecting against. Protect against the higher percentage threats. They can’t stop a guy who can hit a target from 3,000 yards, the perimeter is too big. But that’s a much lower risk.
Posted (edited)

It feels like this barely even happened, lol. I’m starting to think it’s just evidence that Trump is widely hated, even his supporters understand that it wasn’t a left wing plot but one of their own (or at least a neutral attention whore). Nobody cares about your ear hole jackass.

Edited by 'stache
Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:28 AM, Biff Tannen said:

Oh is this where we start talking about calibers and magazines vs clips and a bunch of other stupid gun bullshit?  Because that sounds super fun and definitely has never been done before. 

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Clip it, Biff.  

Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:20 AM, tbone_ said:

 


Yea on a perfectly still and crisp December morning shooting at a deer.

I’m guessing Bubba might be slightly less accurate when shooting at the fucking president knowing he will die in about 30 seconds after he pulls the trigger with the whole world watching.

 

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I agree with your point.  However, he wasn't shooting at the "fucking president."  He was shooting at a convicted felon and rapist who happened to serve as POTUS previously.  

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:14 AM, Brisketexan said:


This. If you were to assign any of a million hunters in Texas the “mission” of “take a dude out at under 300 yards,” functionally all of them would bring their own scoped rifle in 30/06, .270, .300 WM, etc. And almost all could hit the target’s center mass.
Give a decent shooter a clear shot at a large mammal inside 300 yards, and most will score a solid hit.
That sort of threat is the baseline the SS should be prepared for and should sweep for, in all cases.

Expand  

I guess I should say when I'm talking "perimeter," I'm thinking controlled access rather than an area of overwatch.  They'd have to have overwatch out to 2500-3000 yards, just in case.

Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 12:52 AM, Incredulity said:

The SS doesn’t have the audio from the communications that day.  Un-fucking-believable.

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"Hey Scotty, did you see that guy with a rifle go up on the roof right above you?"

"Shhhh, busy playing candy crush here. Fuck off." 

 

Yeah, I can see why they wouldn't want to release that

Posted (edited)
  On 7/23/2024 at 2:53 PM, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

yeah, probably the worst prepped witness in history.  

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I am generally not a tinfoil hat dude, but her stonewalling was unbelievable.  

sniper gets to the absolutely most OBVIOUS spot, initial lame ass excuses(sloped roof, not our perimiter...), no audio from the day of, no answers for 60 days.....

 

Tin Foil Tinfoil Hat GIF

Edited by Incredulity
Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 2:56 PM, TwiceHorn said:

I guess I should say when I'm talking "perimeter," I'm thinking controlled access rather than an area of overwatch.  They'd have to have overwatch out to 2500-3000 yards, just in case.

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Or, you know, maybe not have these things outside in large spaces. But indoor venues cost money and Trump doesn't like spending any of "his" money.

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:00 PM, DDD Dad said:

I'm wondering when this was taped.  

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/golf/2024/07/22/bryson-dechambeau-to-play-golf-with-donald-trump-on-his-youtube-channel/

I have to assume this was done prior to the shooting (given the lack of any noticeable injury to his ear) but who knows?

 

 

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Jesus, what a choad. I wonder how much favorable editing they had to do before Trump signed off on it.

Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:41 PM, miguelito said:

BDC is listed at 6'-1".

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Question for the dudes: when yall say 5’10 that means what height? When guys say 6 foot or 6’1” that means? Because a lot of times (I am 5’8”) I will be around guys that say they are 6 foot and there is no fucking way. 

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:45 PM, Nicole44 said:

Question for the dudes: when yall say 5’10 that means what height? When guys say 6 foot or 6’1” that means? Because a lot of times (I am 5’8”) I will be around guys that say they are 6 foot and there is no fucking way. 

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i'm closer to 6'2" than 6'1, but always say 6'1 because lying about height is cringy as fuck.

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:45 PM, Nicole44 said:

Question for the dudes: when yall say 5’10 that means what height? When guys say 6 foot or 6’1” that means? Because a lot of times (I am 5’8”) I will be around guys that say they are 6 foot and there is no fucking way. 

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I'm "Six feet, in shoes". Which means 5'11".

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 3:00 PM, DDD Dad said:

I'm wondering when this was taped.  

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/golf/2024/07/22/bryson-dechambeau-to-play-golf-with-donald-trump-on-his-youtube-channel/

I have to assume this was done prior to the shooting (given the lack of any noticeable injury to his ear) but who knows?

 

 

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Fuck this cheating mofo. God I hate him. And also this is why I will never ever root for douchebag bryson.

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Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 12:58 AM, Nicole44 said:

They normally have audio. Just not that day. I know Cheatle referred to the fbi for the investigation but damn:

how many shell casings on the roof? Ask the FBI.  

Was there a second shooter? She said ask FBI.

Were there people in the building? Yes. Why didn’t any of them hear the shooter on the roof? Said to ask FBI.

Can you give us a timeline of the events? Yes. I have one with me. Can you breakdown what happened that day? My timeline is not specific. 

The oversight committee isn’t exactly a committee that “gets along.” About anything. They were all in agreement on this. 

Expand  

I'm unsure that the USSS has any investigatory authority over a situation like this. And honesty, I don't think we would want them to investigate their own. 

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Posted

I assume that the USSS purposefully does not maintain audio recordings because the people that they "protect" need to feel secure in that the current situation will not be broadcast. One agent needing to communicate to another agent regarding a secret meeting, legitimate or even a less than legitimate personal meeting.

If the protected person feels that confidential info is being recorded and maintained, they may look to get away from their security detail.

The downside is that when a situation occurs, we have to rely on personal memories or cover ups.

Posted
  On 7/23/2024 at 4:27 PM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I assume that the USSS purposefully does not maintain audio recordings because the people that they "protect" need to feel secure in that the current situation will not be broadcast. One agent needing to communicate to another agent regarding a secret meeting, legitimate or even a less than legitimate personal meeting.

If the protected person feels that confidential info is being recorded and maintained, they may look to get away from their security detail.

The downside is that when a situation occurs, we have to rely on personal memories or cover ups.

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If that is the policy and practice they should say as much.  That's not what is being portrayed, nor has it been in the past instances.



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