Manafort Trial

[Grandioso 2592]

Uh, so this could be fun. Starts tomorrow. Not televised, but the reporting will essentially be realtime. 

 

[HOOK'EMHOOAH 1610]

Inb4 classics

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

[Grandioso 2592]

This dude is so good at installing Kremlin puppets, he fucking did it TWICE. I mean, the dude is pure scum, but you kind of have to admire his talent.

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

2 minutes ago, Grandioso said:

This dude is so good at installing Kremlin puppets, he fucking did it TWICE. I mean, the dude is pure scum, but you kind of have to admire his talent.

Also good at manipulating his wife into gangbangs. 

[texas08 1599]

Hai

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

If he gets off, this will bode poorly for Mueller going forward (and more largely, our country).  

[atomheartbevo 89735]

14 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

Also good at manipulating his wife into gangbangs. 

If your wife had a head injury that left her confused, and if you got her drunk to the point where she couldn't stand, I'm fairly certain you could manipulate your wife into gang bangs.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

8 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

If he gets off, this will bode poorly for Mueller going forward (and more largely, our country).  

I agree but they charged him with easily provable crimes in this case intentionally. 

The lawyers prosecuting this case are the best of the best and the judge seems solid. 

Manafort is fucked.

[Chad Fuck 17686]

This should be quite the spectacle.  In.

[JBJ 3655]

8 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

If he gets off, this will bode poorly for Mueller going forward (and more largely, our country).  

Meh.  It may reflect poorly on Mueller, but it's not really even a part of the Russian investigation.

[Red Five 40873]

If your wife had a head injury that left her confused, and if you got her drunk to the point where she couldn't stand, I'm fairly certain you could manipulate your wife into gang bangs.

Well I’ve got my week planned out now.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13515]

It's surprising that Manafort hasn't accepted a plea, assuming one has been offered.    the guy is almost 70 and from all appearances loves the good life.   Offer him a way of keeping his freedom and a decent amount of wealth, and I would think he would plead to killing JFK.      If I was his age and had even a small chance of being convicted, I wouldn't want to risk a big chunk, if not all, of my remaining life behind bars.  Even if I felt I was 100% innocent, it's a risk to take it to trial.

then again, perhaps there wasn't a plea offered that kept him out of prison.  

 

[ConferenceRoom 6144]

27 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

It's gonna be a lot longer than 3 minutes.

[sheeeit 129]

3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

It's surprising that Manafort hasn't accepted a plea, assuming one has been offered.    the guy is almost 70 and from all appearances loves the good life.   Offer him a way of keeping his freedom and a decent amount of wealth, and I would think he would plead to killing JFK.      If I was his age and had even a small chance of being convicted, I wouldn't want to risk a big chunk, if not all, of my remaining life behind bars.  Even if I felt I was 100% innocent, it's a risk to take it to trial.

then again, perhaps there wasn't a plea offered that kept him out of prison.  

 

I suspect Manafort will get convicted.  He can always take a deal at any point before sentencing.  Obviously the deal gets worse for him as time goes on.

 

[Foosters 17858]

7 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

I suspect Manafort will get convicted.  He can always take a deal at any point before sentencing.  Obviously the deal gets worse for him as time goes on.

 

Not necessarily. Prosecution has to offer a deal for him to take it.

[tantric superman 4667]

Will he file a last minute writ of replevin?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

25 minutes ago, JBJ said:

but it's not really even a part of the Russian investigation.

Not yet...

[Brisketexan 105161]

Meh. He'll get off/be pardoned/both.

At this point, my faith in our institutions, including the criminal court process, is pegged at "you want me to have faith, prove it."

[shnsajax 3591]

24 minutes ago, crackamacgowski said:

It's gonna be a lot longer than 3 minutes.

That's what the sign said for the line of the train leading to his wife. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

He'll get off/be pardoned/both.

Do you think Mueller hasn’t contingency planned for a Manafort pardon?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

 

[sheeeit 129]

53 minutes ago, Foosters said:

Not necessarily. Prosecution has to offer a deal for him to take it.

Of course.  I was just commenting that deals are still offered during trial. If the prosecution appears to be winning then the deals get worse for Manafort or there are none at all.  If Manafort's team comes up with some out of nowhere point then the deal might get better.  

I do not think Manafort has anything to offer.  Based solely on what we know (which isnt much) I see no reason for the feds to offer him any kind of good deal.  I think their case is probably pretty tight.  

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Manafort ain't flipping and they probably don't need his cooperation to get to the Trump people.  

Unless they desperately need another corroborating witness, Manafort would have to have information that Gates hasn't already provided to investigators.  Given how closely Gates and Manafort worked over the past 12 years, the amount of new information Manafort could provide is questionable. 

I think they could be looking for an outright signed confession of everything. 

Regardless of a deal, Manafort is looking at some serious jail time. 

 

[Kyrie Eleison 9312]

12 minutes ago, sheeeit said:

Of course.  I was just commenting that deals are still offered during trial. If the prosecution appears to be winning then the deals get worse for Manafort or there are none at all.  If Manafort's team comes up with some out of nowhere point then the deal might get better.  

I do not think Manafort has anything to offer.  Based solely on what we know (which isnt much) I see no reason for the feds to offer him any kind of good deal.  I think their case is probably pretty tight.  

good fucking God...

stay in your fucking lane, shitbag.  you know absolutely fuck-all about prosecuting criminal cases and strategy therein.

[Grandioso 2592]

LOL at the people cheering FOR Paul Manafort to beat this rap. I don’t even know where to begin.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Captainant 27682]

1 hour ago, Grandioso said:

LOL at the people cheering FOR Paul Manafort to beat this rap. I don’t even know where to begin.

That would be otherwise kind, loving, patriotic folks who watch fox news exclusively and genuinely believe that it IS fair and balanced. My grandmother and FIL are SURE that it's just Mueller being a bully because he listens to those 13 angry democrats.

[zork 629]

If he is found guilty for everything that he is currently being charged with, does that mean anything significant for Trump other than guilt by association?(with a long term political operative that turns out to be a shitbag who doesn't pay taxes or levies or whatever else he didn't pay by not reporting the money) 

Or are there mystery new charges still to be brought against Mr Manafort?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

There is obviously nothing to see here.

[atomheartbevo 89735]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Meh. He'll get off/be pardoned/both.

At this point, my faith in our institutions, including the criminal court process, is pegged at "you want me to have faith, prove it."

I think even Rudy would recommend against a pardon. The optics on that would be amazing. 

But it is Trump.  “I HAVE TO PARDON COFFEE BOYS LIKE MANAFORT WHO KNOW NOTHING BECAUSE THE ANGRY DEMOCRATS ARE PROSECUTING PEOPLE FOR NO REASON IN THIS FAKE WITCHHUNT!”

[Degenerate Gardner 4085]

10 minutes ago, zork said:

If he is found guilty for everything that he is currently being charged with, does that mean anything significant for Trump other than guilt by association?(with a long term political operative that turns out to be a shitbag who doesn't pay taxes or levies or whatever else he didn't pay by not reporting the money) 

Or are there mystery new charges still to be brought against Mr Manafort?

Just asking questions

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Trump needs at least one sacrificial lamb for this whole thing.  Manafort appears to be that guy for now but I’m betting others will follow.

Edited July 30, 2018 by Hugo Stiglitz

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

12 minutes ago, zork said:

If he is found guilty for everything that he is currently being charged with, does that mean anything significant for Trump other than guilt by association?(with a long term political operative that turns out to be a shitbag who doesn't pay taxes or levies or whatever else he didn't pay by not reporting the money) 

Or are there mystery new charges still to be brought against Mr Manafort?

It’s bad from the perspective that his millions and millions of secret money came from interests aligned with russia, then worked on a campaign that somehow switched the gop to being pro Russia.  So it’s less likely the pro Russia movement is some innocent organic Change in the world we live in. 

[zork 629]

3 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Just asking questions

Haven't been following Manafort's case since about 6 months ago other than the occasional headlines about his 2nd and I believe 3rd dip at new indictments?  Now we are going to have the trial so I was wondering if someone would give an executive summary?  If he doesn't rollover and there are no new charges then he goes away for money laundering and not reporting income and possibly not declaring as an agent perhaps?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

He has another trial after this one and probably a dozen other crimes he could be charged with.

This trial is on the most open and shut charges. Tax and financial crimes. 

Edited July 30, 2018 by Hugo Stiglitz

[TwiceHorn 31507]

7 minutes ago, zork said:

Haven't been following Manafort's case since about 6 months ago other than the occasional headlines about his 2nd and I believe 3rd dip at new indictments?  Now we are going to have the trial so I was wondering if someone would give an executive summary?  If he doesn't rollover and there are no new charges then he goes away for money laundering and not reporting income and possibly not declaring as an agent perhaps?

This trial is tax evasion and bank fraud.  No criminality really tied to Russia or Russian interests, other than he made a lot of the money he failed to report from Russian interests.

There is a kind of bizarre incongruity here because the gravamen of tax evasion is underreporting income to the IRS, while the gravamen of bank fraud is overstating income or other positive financial characteristics to a financial institution.  Of course, they're both to his benefit, but it is a small oddity.

The money laundering and failure to register have a little more nexus to Russian criminality than this, but Lord knows when that trial will take place.  The witness tampering charges were levied in that case.

The two cases were separated because venue for the bank fraud and tax evasion case was not proper in DC, otherwise it would just be one giant goatfuck.

Edited July 30, 2018 by TwiceHorn

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Lord knows when that trial will take place. 

September 17, which means November.

[zork 629]

6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

He has another trial after this one and probably a dozen other crimes he could be charged with.

This trial is on the most open and shut charges. Tax and financial crimes. 

 

5 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

This trial is tax evasion and bank fraud.  No criminality really tied to Russia or Russian interests, other than he made a lot of the money he failed to report from Russian interests.

The money laundering and failure to register have a little more nexus to Russian criminality than this, but Lord knows when that trial will take place.  The witness tampering charges were levied in that case.

The two cases were separated because venue for the bank fraud and tax evasion case was not proper in DC, otherwise it would just be one giant goatfuck.

thanks.  

[hayden_horn 11362]

14 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Just asking questions

actually, i want to defend zork. he's not coming from the sheeeit school of obtusity. he's legit.

[TwiceHorn 31507]

4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

September 17, which means November.

Or February.

[jimmyjazz 45986]

Best thing to happen today?  I learned a new word.  "Gravamen."  Never knew it existed.

[lemonlime 5503]

30 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

actually, i want to defend zork. he's not coming from the sheeeit school of obtusity. he's legit.

Not sure that's much of a defense.

[Brisketexan 105161]

4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Best thing to happen today?  I learned a new word.  "Gravamen."  Never knew it existed.

It's a cool law word.  Beats the shit out of "go hence without day."  Always hated that phrase.  Spent the first 10 years of my career deleting it from form pleadings.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

[Brisketexan 105161]

10 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

He'll get the week, quite likely two.  It's not likely he'll get all three, but then, judges can bend over backwards to accommodate the accused, so as to avoid creating ANY appellate points.

Still, the joint statement is something they should have been working on for a while.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

He'll get the week, quite likely two.  It's not likely he'll get all three, but then, judges can bend over backwards to accommodate the accused, so as to avoid creating ANY appellate points.

Still, the joint statement is something they should have been working on for a while.

I don’t think so.  They already gave them one week. 

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

Is it always in the Defenses best interest to delay a trial? As in, can we read into the actions here at all in regards to guilt/innocence? 

[Brisketexan 105161]

3 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

Is it always in the Defenses best interest to delay a trial? As in, can we read into the actions here at all in regards to guilt/innocence? 

Not a lot to read into it.  Remember every paper you ever turned in? Couldn't you have used more time?  You can ALWAYS use more time to prepare for trial.  That said, I've found endless delays to be a distraction, and at some point, you're just running away from the fight.

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

5 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Not a lot to read into it.  Remember every paper you ever turned in? Couldn't you have used more time?  You can ALWAYS use more time to prepare for trial.  That said, I've found endless delays to be a distraction, and at some point, you're just running away from the fight.

Thanks, and I guess that it where my head is at. It feels like if you are guilty, you want to use every tactic to delay the inevitable, and if you are innocent, you want to get the show on the road (factoring in enough time to present your case obviously).