ATR-72 crash in Brazil

[DaysOff 7947]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13728665/brazil-plane-crash-sao-paulo-passenger.html

 

Looks like a classic stall, spin.

 

62 souls

[Dahobbs 17529]

7 minutes ago, DaysOff said:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13728665/brazil-plane-crash-sao-paulo-passenger.html

 

Looks like a classic stall, spin.

 

62 souls

 

Damn. That is terrible.

From the article:

Quote

 

It can fly a maximum altitude of 10,000 feet with a maximum speed of 316.9mph. DailyMail.com has contacted ATR for comment. 

The aircraft was PS-VPB, a 14-year-old ATR72-500, according to FlightRadar24.

Data from the flight tracker shows the plane lost 13,000 feet in elevation in under two minutes during the final moments of its ill-fated trip. 

 

I'm assuming there was a typo somewhere in there? 

 

 

[DaysOff 7947]

Journalism, man.

ATR-72 service ceiling is 25,000

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

How can you not get the nose down and recover at that altitude?  Feathered prop, loss of control surfaces, weight and balance issues?  Horrible video of that plane going down.

[Chad Fuck 17668]

20 minutes ago, DalTxHornFan said:

How can you not get the nose down and recover at that altitude?  Feathered prop, loss of control surfaces, weight and balance issues?  Horrible video of that plane going down.

At what altitude?  They didn't look high to me at all.

And they were on their way in for a landing, so draggy configuration.

As OP said, classic stall spin.  

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

3 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

At what altitude?  They didn't look high to me at all.

And they were on their way in for a landing, so draggy configuration.

As OP said, classic stall spin.  

The flight data seems to indicate the stall/spin started at 15,000 feet.  Also lots of variation in their flight speed prior to the bad ending.  It will be fascinating to figure this one out.

[InkaUtexas 25890]

Good luck we are all about to become experts in ATR flight operations and safety.

 

[Mittens 8260]

 

[Mittens 8260]

Boeing execs right now:

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

2 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Good luck we are all about to become experts in ATR flight operations and safety.

 

The ATRs have a pretty good safety record, except for when they get flown into ice.

[shakahorn 1645]

Seems odd that when it crashes, it doesn't make a sound.

[InkaUtexas 25890]

5 minutes ago, DalTxHornFan said:

The ATRs have a pretty good safety record, except for when they get flown into ice.

Yep, have flown on them before in Nepal and South America. Always liked them. Well not this one. This sucks.

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

Similar ATR 72 crash in Nepal last year due to improperly feathered engines, but they lost control at a much lower altitude.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeti_Airlines_Flight_691

[McCroskey 1504]

The ATRs have a pretty good safety record, except for when they get flown into ice.

1200 built and like 40 have crashed?

Is that a good safety record?

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

14 minutes ago, McCroskey said:

1200 built and like 40 have crashed?

Is that a good safety record?

13 fatal accidents, killing some 500+ persons.  Many of those accidents were obvious pilot error and/or were in Nepal or other third-world countries.  Just spit balling here, but those planes have likely done 10,000,000 cycles by now.  Pretty good record, I'd say.

[dcbc 14471]

1 hour ago, DalTxHornFan said:

How can you not get the nose down and recover at that altitude?  Feathered prop, loss of control surfaces, weight and balance issues?  Horrible video of that plane going down.

Other area pilots reporting icing at altitude.

 

/edit to add, I read this second hand.  Obviously, a single engine failure could be possible, which would have made a spin like that hard to recover from.  But damn, to end up a flat spin an aircraft that size is a pretty uncommon situation to say the least.

Edited August 9 by dcbc

[bschoolprof 6252]

The ATRs have a pretty good safety record, except for when they get flown into ice.

That was gonna be my comment. They do not handle ice well.

[DaysOff 7947]

That was in 1994. Their boots have been modified for decades, and it's as food as any turboprop in icing.

[crash_davis 23107]

1 hour ago, shakahorn said:

Seems odd that when it crashes, it doesn't make a sound.

This version has the loud boom that you want to hear.

 

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

8 minutes ago, DaysOff said:

That was in 1994. Their boots have been modified for decades, and it's as food as any turboprop in icing.

Still several crashes blamed on icing since then.  Don't know if the accident planes got the mods.  But still a very solid plane.  Can't beat P&W turboprops.

[Pato del Muerto 52488]

4 minutes ago, DalTxHornFan said:

Can't beat P&W turboprops

Not what you mean, but I was just at the heritage flying museum in WA and they have a P&W dual radial engine bisected so you can see the internals (next to a R-R Merlin done the same) and it’s crazy cool engineering. 

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

We have a couple of vintage planes that fly around here.  I love hearing those rotary engines!

[Chad Fuck 17668]

We have a couple of vintage planes that fly around here.  I love hearing those rotary engines!

*radial

Could be rotary, but do you live by Old Rhinebeck in NY?

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

Thanks for the correction.  I misspoke - radial engines.  There are some vintage planes that fly around GTU regularly.

[bschoolprof 6252]

1 hour ago, DaysOff said:

That was in 1994. Their boots have been modified for decades, and it's as food as any turboprop in icing.

I remember reading that American and other carriers only fly them in the tropics, even after the boot mod.  But I don't know shit about piloting - all my info comes from here and youtube.

The video does certainly look like a classic stall spin.  Horrifying.  Is there any way ice can cause that?

[Deej 76758]

Not the way I want to spend the last minute or so of my life. 

[dcbc 14471]

1 hour ago, DalTxHornFan said:

We have a couple of vintage planes that fly around here.  I love hearing those rotary engines!

There used to be a Corsair that flew out of the old Andrau Airpark in Houston when I still was flying (student) in the early 90s before moving to W. Houston airpark.  I'm not sure if it was the original P&W rebuilt somehow, but that engine was loud AF and sounded like the voice of an angry god.  It's on the runway, quiet idle, then, all of a sudden:  FOGHORN!  Spec-tacular.

Edited August 9 by dcbc
radial, not rotary

[dcbc 14471]

20 minutes ago, Deej said:

Not the way I want to spend the last minute or so of my life. 

You want to go peacefully in your sleep?  Not screaming like your passengers?

 

/sorry. It couldn't be helped.  Gallows humor. 

[staboner 4969]

29 minutes ago, Deej said:

Not the way I want to spend the last minute or so of my life. 

yeah that looked fucking awful. poor people

[Celery Man 20934]

38 minutes ago, Deej said:

Not the way I want to spend the last minute or so of my life. 

have they gotten the cvr audio yet? pilot could have been getting a blowie

[ClubWhatever 12128]

Looks like it pancaked in someone's back yard.

[Deej 76758]

Probably more than one backyard

[ClubWhatever 12128]

[Ted Lange 16084]

 

[conVINCEd 21469]

I don’t like flying.  I really don’t like reading about planes falling out of the sky while planning a trip that’s going to require me to get on some questionable airplanes

[Macanudo 12976]

4 hours ago, DalTxHornFan said:

Similar ATR 72 crash in Nepal last year due to improperly feathered engines, but they lost control at a much lower altitude.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeti_Airlines_Flight_691

I don't know about ya'll but I'd be hard pressed to get on a plane that Yeti Airlines is flying.   That sounds like the Aggie of airlines.

[Pato del Muerto 52488]

How low can you fly in Nepal? Aren’t their giant mountains all over?

[conVINCEd 21469]

22 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

How low can you fly in Nepal? Aren’t their giant mountains all over?

It’s tricky.

[HenryJames 66041]

6 hours ago, DalTxHornFan said:

Similar ATR 72 crash in Nepal last year due to improperly feathered engines, but they lost control at a much lower altitude.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeti_Airlines_Flight_691

 

[Chad Fuck 17668]

How low can you fly in Nepal? Aren’t their giant mountains all over?

I was just there in May. There are mountains to the north. The south is plains.

But you can fly just as low there as you can anywhere else. The ground is still the ground.

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

1 hour ago, Chad Fuck said:

I was just there in May. There are mountains to the north. The south is plains.

But you can fly just as low there as you can anywhere else. The ground is still the ground.

Flight level Zero.  That's why altimeters are adjustable.

[cattail 112]

Is this the type of plane that Sky King flew?

[DalTxHornFan 3101]

4 minutes ago, cattail said:

Is this the type of plane that Sky King flew?

She was talented. They mostly showed as flying Cessna T-50s and Cessna-310s

[cattail 112]

Sky King was that Seattle plane mechanic who stole a plane and took it on a suicidal joyride

[Royalfan5 2354]

9 hours ago, ClubWhatever said:

Looks like it pancaked in someone's back yard.

As someone who lives in an Airport flight path, I’m fairly convinced that I’ll go out by having a plane fall on me while I’m taking a shit and posting here.

[Deej 76758]

1 hour ago, Royalfan5 said:

As someone who lives in an Airport flight path, I’m fairly convinced that I’ll go out by having a plane fall on me while I’m taking a shit and posting here.

Legend

[InkaUtexas 25890]

2 hours ago, Royalfan5 said:

As someone who lives in an Airport flight path, I’m fairly convinced that I’ll go out by having a plane fall on me while I’m taking a shit and posting here.

Make sure the post if memorable.

[sidis 9825]

2 hours ago, Royalfan5 said:

As someone who lives in an Airport flight path, I’m fairly convinced that I’ll go out by having a plane fall on me while I’m taking a shit and posting here.

Think of all the potential for being featured in the prologue of a Paul Thomas Anderson movie were that scenario come to pass. 

[SurlyGator 865]

3 hours ago, Royalfan5 said:

As someone who lives in an Airport flight path, I’m fairly convinced that I’ll go out by having a plane fall on me while I’m taking a shit and posting here.

Not the best humble brag I've ever seen, but...

[ABSR 5309]

17 hours ago, DalTxHornFan said:

13 fatal accidents, killing some 500+ persons.  Many of those accidents were obvious pilot error and/or were in Nepal or other third-world countries.  Just spit balling here, but those planes have likely done 10,000,000 cycles by now.  Pretty good record, I'd say.

Boeing approves this message/culpability analysis.