Wyoming forfeits Volleyball matchup with San Jose State

[aggie08 21491]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

She’s not even the best player on the team lol

Some of the teams who are forfeiting played against this same person LAST YEAR AND THE YEAR BEFORE AND WON.

If only we could pinpoint what's different about this year. Alas, we can never know.

[Brisketexan 105075]

3 minutes ago, C-Man said:

Yep. I'd like to get to a common sense agreement using certain parameters that allow transgender athletes the ability to play the sports fairly -- or as fairly as possible -- with their peers. How you define that, I don't really know. But this is an issue? In a country with 350 million people, how many examples are there of this? Less than 100?

This country has real fucking problems. News flash: This doesn't crack the top 1000.

Fucking....THIS.

Any issue/problem, even a small one, deserves a fair solution.

None of the dialogue about it is driven by that desire.  None.  Zero.  Sure, what athletic governing bodies are trying is driven by that goal, but none of the "ZOMG we HAFTA DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS IMPORTANT ISSUE!" crowd acknowledge or accept that.

And the amount of energy and attention this is getting, in relation to how big an issue it actually is?  Shit, it would make about as much sense to shut down the entire country to protect against bee stings (which actually KILL 50-100 people a year).  Wouldn't you agree that something that KILLS 50-100 people a year is more important than something that tilts perhaps a handful of amateur athletic competitions each year?  WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE BEE STINGS??????

Stupid. Pure manipulation of the rubes, who are so feverishly dancing the music played for them they can't see how foolish they look.

[bolverk 29655]

7 minutes ago, troph said:

I responded broadly, failure to respond to you directly isn’t the indictment you think it is. 

Did you accidentally not quote the person you're addressing with part of your post?

Quote

 

btw that Texas constitutional provision is per se unenforceable and unconstitutional. I’d be thrilled to have anti trans legislation on the books any law they want if it was settled law it’s unconstitutional.  

 

It's protected now, but like the right to transition, the abortion topic, or some other one, an asshole could always make an argument to SCOTUS that states should be able to decide whether nonbelievers can hold public office. As we've seen, precedent no longer matters with this court, and "settled law" is no longer a thing, so all our rights are at risk at any time. 

[Pam Cummings 9639]

4 minutes ago, Pancho said:

She’s not even the best player on the team lol

Some of the teams who are forfeiting played against this same person LAST YEAR AND THE YEAR BEFORE AND WON.

This is the main point that matters, and just proves these outrage artists to be completely full of absolute shit.

[Js1 85287]

7 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

I'm mostly here for the coed showers

Service guarantees citizenship 

[52-80 19147]

3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

[1] I've not been coy at all. I think allowing more people to compete is generally a good thing. But, like you, I don't believe the government should be involved in rule making for sports bodies. Especially not for an issue that will impact only a fraction of a percent of the population in any meaningful way. Unlike you, I recognize the push for those laws for what it is: a pretext for bigotry and hatred.

[2] No one in this thread has claimed sex is irrelevant in sports. I specifically addressed how important hormone differences are in determining physical attributes and you laughed it off as impossible to address because cycling has an issue with doping.

1. We're a closed circle here. We can talk up our individual beliefs without the red herring of the politicians and other hateful bigots. (If it's me/others you believe are bigots, say so. I've been called worse on this site).

2. Page #2 "there is an undercurrent in many of these discussions that men are by general rule inherently better than women. but the reality is that concept is actually the exception" , spawning lots of further anecdotes of exceptional woman, doing nothing to disprove the undeniable fact that men are clearly better at women in sports in aggregate.  And hence the foundation of the need for segregation in the first place.  If someone doesn't agree on that, it's really useless to go further downstream.

My laughing off was the unpracticality of measuring hormones to determine grouping for sports competition, as opposed to gender.

[Sawbonz 27542]

16 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

In which sport would the highest level be majority woman, or ever have a woman at its peak?

This, in the context of the post to which you responded, is a non sequitur

[Sawbonz 27542]

7 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Some of the teams who are forfeiting played against this same person LAST YEAR AND THE YEAR BEFORE AND WON.

But Slorch was just posting current events!!!

[52-80 19147]

29 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

So if at birth I declare my male child's gender as "girl" then that child plays girls' sports forever?

Gender does not equal sex. If you're going to try to use correct terminology then try to get the most basic one correct. 

Pedantry doesnt make a good substitute for an actual point.

I dont know which hospital you went to, but the doctors knew the gender before my child was born, there was no declaration needed after delivery.

[52-80 19147]

4 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

This, in the context of the post to which you responded, is a non sequitur

It's germane in that it proves the reason to use gender segregation -- otherwise there would be no female winners.

Now would you explain who is floating the idea of blocking young girls from playing sports? Are they in the room with us now?

[Huckleberry 32848]

6 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Pedantry doesnt make a good substitute for an actual point.

I dont know which hospital you went to, but the doctors knew the gender before my child was born, there was no declaration needed after delivery.

It's not pedantry. You are saying gender when you should be saying sex. People's gender not matching their birth sex is the entire reason this topic exists in case you haven't figured that out yet, and it seems like you may not have. 

The doctor can tell you a baby's apparent biological sex, they cannot tell you the child's gender. Words have meaning. 

Edited October 3 by Huckleberry

[52-80 19147]

24 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I can’t help you if you are stupid and or illiterate. I’m sorry

I'm impressed it took so long for the ad hominem. Did you improve your self-restraint, or just feel like you got cornered?

[Rex Kramer 1333]

15 minutes ago, G650 said:

How many trans athletes has she played against?

None. As I said, I’m unconcerned about this. I laugh at the Cruz commercials and wonder who they actually draw offsides. 

 

29 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Your comment was about being glad to be living in a state where the laws protects your daughters. I just pointed the utter hypocrisy of being glad about a law that will "protect" them from an issue as rare as being struck by lightning while in exchange exposing them to health risk that every woman faces. The fact that you don't see that both sets of laws for what they are--bigoted laws designed to control and minimize certain class of citizens--is completely on you.  

I like that Texas has taken a Lia Thomas situation off the table, limited as that may be to this state and location of competition in collegiate postseasons, and the sheer (lack of) volume of Lia Thomas type incidents. Period. 

I’m just not gonna opine on abortion. I’ll just say I’m pro choice. 

[Sawbonz 27542]

4 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

It's germane in that it proves the reason to use gender segregation -- otherwise there would be no female winners.

Now would you explain who is floating the idea of blocking young girls from playing sports? Are they in the room with us now?

Texas

Florida

 

Maybe you are trying to quibble about the qualifier of “young” but these rules affect jr high and freshmen which as a father of daughters I absolutely consider young.
 

Or perhaps you think they should all play boys sports. If so go fuck yourself
 

The mom in the Florida story lost her job for signing a form for her jr high daughter to play sports, and now the family is having to move  to check out the posts in the LGBTQ thread about it  absolutely sickening  

 

12 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Pedantry doesnt make a good substitute for an actual point.

I dont know which hospital you went to, but the doctors knew the gender before my child was born, there was no declaration needed after delivery.

They knew the sex. Are you just trolling at this point?

[aggie08 21491]

2 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

We're a closed circle here. We can talk up our individual beliefs without the red herring of the politicians and other hateful bigots.

It's not a red herring for the community that has to live through the unnecessary harassment of being made a political punching bag. The ONLY reason this thread exists is because of dipshit politicians stoking the fears of their easily-angered (and, yes, bigoted) base.

Yes, ostensibly, we all realize that we're just a bunch of assholes arguing pointlessly on the internet, and we can hold our own opinions that shouldn't be lumped into the extreme perspective. The problem is, on this issue, the extreme platform is the one creating the narrative and passing legislation, thus further endangering and isolating an already vulnerable community.

It's like gun control. Most are in favor of reasonable laws, but then many of those same people go out and vote for politicians proudly and openly advertising that they'll make zero attempt whatsoever to find a compromise. So it's hard to care what your nuanced internet opinion is anymore.

[Pancho 44712]

13 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Pedantry doesnt make a good substitute for an actual point.

I dont know which hospital you went to, but the doctors knew the gender before my child was born, there was no declaration needed after delivery.

 

Gender and sex are two different things. The doctor knew your child’s sex before you child was born.

[Sawbonz 27542]

8 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

I'm impressed it took so long for the ad hominem. Did you improve your self-restraint, or just feel like you got cornered?

Accurate description is not ad hominem. Just read your posts

Edited October 3 by Sawbonz

[hornbri 1396]

 

17 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

This is the main point that matters, and just proves these outrage artists to be completely full of absolute shit.

Ehhh, I think they are wrong but this is not the main point, arguing that she is not the best player so it should be allowed is dumb. 

If you are against her playing, you don’t care if she is the best player or worst player. You are against it all the time and would not wait for it to be a dominate player.

[Willfully Horn 8002]

2 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Now would you explain who is floating the idea of blocking young girls from playing sports?

I’d argue that people who want to ban trans athletes are doing just that.

You say your children’s gender was known prior to birth. Imagine that one child was identified as male, but, from the get go that child insisted they were a girl child. Consistently and insistently. The facts show that refusing to acknowledge the child’s gender identity will cause trauma and consign your kid into the most at risk population in human demographics. The facts also show that medical intervention for trans humans is, perhaps, the least regretted major life decision humans make. Other people refusing to acknowledge your child as female is likely the single most damaging facet to the outcome of medical intervention.

So, if sport is more important than life, keep on beating your drum.

[ChiTownDoc 21144]

Today I learned someone is happy because their daughters are safer in Texas.  Wow

On second thought, I’m positive parents in Jonestown thought their daughters were safer there than anywhere else on earth.  Also, Warren Jeffs clan was a-ok as well.  People are morons, shocking stuff.  

[C-Man 27194]

4 minutes ago, Pancho said:

 

Gender and sex are two different things. The doctor knew your child’s sex before you child was born.

And sometimes they're wrong about knowing the sex too

[Brian Fantana 6681]

41 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

In which sport would the highest level be majority woman, or ever have a woman at its peak?

Drawing weird message board incels and transphobes offsides, apparently.

[royiv 9262]

3 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

I like that Texas has taken a Lia Thomas situation off the table, limited as that may be to this state and location of competition in collegiate postseasons, and the sheer (lack of) volume of Lia Thomas type incidents. Period. 

So one athlete competing for a school in… checks notes… Pennsylvania warranted the full might of our state government, the one with a legislature that meets once every two years for 140 days, to spend the time and resources to pass a law banning trans athletes? And people bitch that our government doesn’t get anything done? 

[royiv 9262]

23 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Pedantry doesnt make a good substitute for an actual point.

I dont know which hospital you went to, but the doctors knew the gender before my child was born, there was no declaration needed after delivery.

Please explain the process the doctors followed to identify the gender of your child before it was born.

[immamac 42837]

https://sjsuspartans.com/watch

Tonight at 8PM. Watch and provide screenshot or you can no longer participate in thread. 

If you can't even be bothered to watch you can't possibly have a real opinion. If you don't have a real opinion you are trolling. 

[Pam Cummings 9639]

14 minutes ago, hornbri said:

 

Ehhh, I think they are wrong but this is not the main point, arguing that she is not the best player so it should be allowed is dumb. 

If you are against her playing, you don’t care if she is the best player or worst player. You are against it all the time and would not wait for it to be a dominate player.

The entire reason for this being a topic is that a bunch of disingenuous political people are presenting it as a big bad bearded man dressed as a woman dominating a bunch of helpless women.

[Sawbonz 27542]

7 minutes ago, royiv said:

Please explain the process the doctors followed to identify the gender of your child before it was born.

[troph 24781]

here's where this will go, i'm 99% certain. trans athlete bans will continue to occur in states that also block childhood transition. where it should go is kids with the help and guidance of medical and psychological should be allowed to transition making this all a moot point - even in college and pro ranks. Will that happen? not in my lifetime. Will the bans be lifted when kids are allowed to access medical care for gender dysphoria? they should, will they? I'm afraid probably not.

I hope the federal government stays out of it and let's the athletic governing bodies handle it and when the right course of action is adopted - broad allowance for kids to transition with medical and psychological guidance that those trans girls and women are treated no differently given the fact that they went through only one puberty.  While I think steadfastly an interim solution can be found while we wait for the tidal wave of hate to pass so trans health care can be routinized free from political hate, in the end, the answer is let trans kids receive the treatment they deserve and all of this becomes unnecessary. and I, an adult transitioner would gladly accept that's just life for those who transition later if early transition was accessible everywhere for those that needed. Because in the end that gives trans athletes an objective path and right to compete - do these things and you can compete in the class aligned with your gender, that's the only thing we really want and need is a clear path that we can control in order to participate. right now it's unsettled, unfair, and fraught with discrimination and fear of retaliation and causes athletes to give up, to hide, and more.

and with that, I really have said all I can say on the topic. so as Rooster Cogburn said when the trail ran cold, "Our engagement is terminated. I bow out."

 

Edited October 3 by troph

[Dahobbs 17526]

22 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

I like that Texas has taken a Lia Thomas situation off the table, limited as that may be to this state and location of competition in collegiate postseasons, and the sheer (lack of) volume of Lia Thomas type incidents. Period. 

I’m just not gonna opine on abortion. I’ll just say I’m pro choice. 

You should really ask yourself why you're glad about that. It was a non issue for you and pretty much every other Texan. It didn't need a law at all. You need to see this exactly for what it is. You're promoting hate whether you realize it or not. 

[DDD Dad 14326]

This whole thread is Slorch’d. 

[Pam Cummings 9639]

5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

You should really ask yourself why you're glad about that. It was a non issue for you and pretty much every other Texan. It didn't need a law at all. You need to see this exactly for what it is. You're promoting hate whether you realize it or not. 

Gotta love people who have been given every advantage in life, everything is great for them, yet they still have a need to constantly complain about everything.

[yoladu 4090]

54 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

I'm mostly here for the coed showers

Starship Troopers for the win.

[nbmishoid 949]

54 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Fucking....THIS.

Any issue/problem, even a small one, deserves a fair solution.

None of the dialogue about it is driven by that desire.  None.  Zero.  Sure, what athletic governing bodies are trying is driven by that goal, but none of the "ZOMG we HAFTA DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS IMPORTANT ISSUE!" crowd acknowledge or accept that.

And the amount of energy and attention this is getting, in relation to how big an issue it actually is?  Shit, it would make about as much sense to shut down the entire country to protect against bee stings (which actually KILL 50-100 people a year).  Wouldn't you agree that something that KILLS 50-100 people a year is more important than something that tilts perhaps a handful of amateur athletic competitions each year?  WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE BEE STINGS??????

Stupid. Pure manipulation of the rubes, who are so feverishly dancing the music played for them they can't see how foolish they look.

You are simply too reasonable.

[ChiTownDoc 21144]

22 minutes ago, immamac said:

https://sjsuspartans.com/watch

Tonight at 8PM. Watch and provide screenshot or you can no longer participate in thread. 

If you can't even be bothered to watch you can't possibly have a real opinion. If you don't have a real opinion you are trolling. 

Can someone photoshop this guy on a volleyball court with a bunch of wimmenz? Maybe he will calm down.  

[Goredho 17397]

13 hours ago, hayden_horn said:

i don't understand how or why this is the next political culture war.

If something does not change, Republicans are about to be destroyed at the ballot box by suburban moms.  You know, those women that turn into cocaine bear when someone looks crossly at their cubs.  This is about trying to distract their attention from Roe V Wade and their daughters right to personal health autonomy being taken away by Republicans.  Just like they want them focused on their pets being eaten by immigrants.

JD Vance said it at the debate, they will exaggerate and fabricate to get people talking about what they want.  Unsaid in that is an implication that they will exaggerate and fabricate to get people to stop talking about what they don’t want them to talk about.  This is all an attempt at distraction in the lead up to November 5th.

[aggie08 21491]

12 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

You should really ask yourself why you're glad about that. It was a non issue for you and pretty much every other Texan. It didn't need a law at all. You need to see this exactly for what it is. You're promoting hate whether you realize it or not. 

We all understand why these guys want to hold their positions in a vacuum. I don't even bemoan their desire to do so. 

...it's just completely unrealistic.

As troph has stated far more eloquently than I can: this isn't just about sports. Governments and school boards aren't suddenly taking an interest in this issue because of their unrelenting pursuit of fairness and protecting women. It's a culture war, and this is an attainable first step since, simplistically speaking, most do agree that born males generally shouldn't be competing in female sports. It's just getting their foot in the door though. These groups have made it plainly clear that removing these communities from polite society and keeping them as outcasts is their end goal. "There are only two genders!" "What is a female?"

Like others, I have seen firsthand how many people seem to suddenly, passionately care about transsexuals run amok in our schools and LGTBQ+ grooming because of what they hear on TV and podcasts. It's disturbing. And it's stoked and encouraged by an entire political party. Troph should be fearful of the future.

[Skipper 6128]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Stupid. Pure manipulation of the rubes, who are so feverishly dancing the music played for them they can't see how foolish they look.

I think it's as simple as being one of the few 'MAGA' positions where there is likely pretty clear majority support to the extent there was actually an issue.  If, in reality, you had biological males playing against biological females across all sports for 2 or 3 teams in every district with many of those biological males being really good players and dominating games, it would be an actual issue that would be unpopular as the majority (even non-MAGA) would take the position that seems inherently unfair.  Of course, that's not happening in the real world.   But trying to pretend it is an issue is a political winner and we live in the year 2024 where online outrage about shit like this gets people fired up. It is what it is.

[Brian Fantana 6681]

38 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

This whole thread is Slorch’d. 

[Brisketexan 105075]

31 minutes ago, nbmishoid said:

You are simply too reasonable.

Alex, I'll take "things my wife has never, ever said to me" for $1,000.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21875]

1 hour ago, Rex Kramer said:

I like that Texas has taken a Lia Thomas situation off the table, limited as that may be to this state and location of competition in collegiate postseasons, and the sheer (lack of) volume of Lia Thomas type incidents. Period. 

Guess again

[Huckleberry 32848]

16 minutes ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

Guess again

Birth sex only! 

Remember,  @52-80 approves of that result where the trans boy destroyed non-transitioning girls in competition because the doctor saw a vajayjay.

[Nivek 16923]

2 hours ago, Js1 said:

I would like to know more.

[Nivek 16923]

21 minutes ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

Guess again

Are you telling me Ted Cruz lies?

[52-80 19147]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

Texas

Florida

 

Maybe you are trying to quibble about the qualifier of “young” but these rules affect jr high and freshmen which as a father of daughters I absolutely consider young.
 

Its not a quibble to point out that none of us are legislators in the middle of writing laws.

You’re on this message board now, with us, arguing our positions. I stand by mine so if you’re gonna debate it I’d rather you stick to that, or those of other members, but not extraneous parties whose opinion I dont care to defend. 

 

[Sawbonz 27542]

12 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Birth sex only! 

Remember,  @52-80 approves of that result where the trans boy destroyed non-transitioning girls in competition because the doctor saw a vajayjay.

Non sequitur!!!

-52-80, probably 

[Sawbonz 27542]

2 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Its not a quibble to point out that none of us are legislators in the middle of writing laws.

You’re on this message board now, with us, arguing our positions. I stand by mine so if you’re gonna debate it I’d rather you stick to that, or those of other members, but not extraneous parties whose opinion I dont care to defend. 

 

So you want to pretend that laws directly pertaining to this discussion don’t exist for the purposes of argument on this board? 

[WhatTheBuck 28775]

2 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

In case anyone needed any more proof that the forfeits are nothing more than political theatrics. 

Like Mike Pence showing up at a Colts game just so he could storm out when athletes knelt during the national anthem. 

[WhatTheBuck 28775]

1 hour ago, hornbri said:

 

Ehhh, I think they are wrong but this is not the main point, arguing that she is not the best player so it should be allowed is dumb. 

If you are against her playing, you don’t care if she is the best player or worst player. You are against it all the time and would not wait for it to be a dominate player.

They’re not actually against her playing. They’re against her existing. In case you hadn’t figured that out yet. 

[aggie08 21491]

3 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

So you want to pretend that laws directly pertaining to this discussion don’t exist for the purposes of argument on this board? 

Seriously. If we were to follow the OP--as I'm sure was the intention (wink, wink)--the argument shouldn't be about transsexuals' place in sports, but rather if we think the Wyoming State government overstepped in pressuring the University to forfeit.

[Ghost of LL 15531]

23 hours ago, Rex Kramer said:

It is so ridiculous this is an issue. And I was told this wasn’t an issue. A fabricated deal. Glad that 25 (26 I thought) states have barred males from participating in women’s sports. Glad my daughters and I live in Texas. 

It's not an issue, as evidenced by the fact that the one time it occurs it causes national headlines and prompts a six-page (and counting) thread on the Surl.

If it were an issue, then it would be so commonplace that it wouldn't even earn your (or any other poster's) notice.  You'd be like "pfft--another one.  That's some bullshit."

Kind of like how Americans are about school shootings now.  That's an issue.  And Americans' callousness and non-recognition of when another one happens tells you just how big an issue it is.

This, however, is completely fabricated.