Trump’s America

[MissingInAction 25478]

1 minute ago, gmr548 said:

I mean it's basically just education polarization through another lens

Do you mean educating reality vs fantasy?

Does 2+2=5?

Edited November 15 by MissingInAction

[Evil Bill Obrien 3493]

3 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Misinformation/disinformation…works

 

So how far past the point of Idiocracy have we made it now?

[gmr548 16681]

20 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

was ‘african’ needed ?

 

Jesus fucking Christ.

I'd say this guy's professional career just ended but he'll actually get a raise in the right wing grifting sphere. Kyle Rittenhouse style.

[Evil Bill Obrien 3493]

49 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

here's a blast from the recent past that can really throw a grenade in everyone's plans

 

https://www.seatrade-maritime.com/ports-logistics/unions-walk-away-from-us-east-coast-ports-contract-negotiations

I was assured by MAGA folk the impending Trump Tariffs would fix everything and make the economy the biggest and bestest its ever been and eggs would be $1 cheaper and there would be no more brown people, how's that gonna happen if all the ports are shut down...

Edited November 15 by Evil Bill Obrien

[Macanudo 13252]

9 minutes ago, Evil Bill Obrien said:

So how far past the point of Idiocracy have we made it now?

We've gone plaid.

[Incredulity 11859]

10 minutes ago, Evil Bill Obrien said:

I was assured by MAGA folk the impending Trump Tariffs would fix everything and make the economy the biggest and bestest its ever been and eggs would be $1 cheaper and there would be no more brown people, how's that gonna happen if all the ports are shut down...

Well I’ve been assured repeatedly over the last week there will be no imports due to tariffs.  So 8d chess?

[bolverk 30228]

29 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Misinformation/disinformation…works

 

I won't question why you continue to patronize that disinformation hellscape and financially support the cocksucker who owns it, but I do ask that you copy/paste graphics and texts that aren't fully visible when you post them here so that the rest of us don't have to give it clicks to see what you're posting.

[Willfully Horn 8204]

A surly poster on some thread mentioned the Century Trilogy, by Ken Follett, so I read them. Certainly, the past still echoes today. What struck me most is the importance communist Russia placed on education. 
 

The intentional dumbing down of public education in the USA is infuriating. 

[Macanudo 13252]

1 hour ago, Incredulity said:

Well I’ve been assured repeatedly over the last week there will be no imports due to tariffs.  So 8d chess?

More like 8D cheese

[bolverk 30228]

This could also go in the Face-Eating Leopard thread.

https://itep.org/a-distributional-analysis-of-donald-trumps-tax-plan-2024/

 

[tx 3 putt 78461]

 

[Captainant 28380]

2 hours ago, Pancho said:

Misinformation/disinformation…works

literally just the attack ads played ad nauseum were believed, simply because they were repeated enough.

Trump using the Goebbels playbook to great effect

[Pancho 46046]

And. I hope Tyson knocks Jake the FUCK OUT

[Goofyboy 3428]

This could also go in the Face-Eating Leopard thread.
https://itep.org/a-distributional-analysis-of-donald-trumps-tax-plan-2024/


 

Thanks for the tax cut. We really didnt need it.

[ulukinatme 1768]

Ya'll have options this time around:

 

[tx 3 putt 78461]

[TwiceHorn 31983]

3 hours ago, Goofyboy said:

Thanks for the tax cut. We really didnt need it.

And some twats are worried about overtaxing people that make a million a year, to the tune of 36k.

[troph 25088]

37 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

And some twats are worried about overtaxing people that make a million a year, to the tune of 36k.

Is this what they mean when they say funding the transgender lifestyle and agenda with taxpayer dollars because all I gotta say to MAGA is thanks for the cash back rebate, I’d rather you go Argo fuck yourself but I’ll take the cash as a consolation prize. 
 

Edited November 16 by troph

[tx 3 putt 78461]

 

[Enemy07 340]

For the politically ignorant, what is the best source to track politicians policies, laws, and their promises, or word, in implementing these policies and laws?

[Enemy07 340]

I post in peace

 

[Horn Dog 10156]

2 hours ago, Enemy07 said:

For the politically ignorant, what is the best source to track politicians policies, laws, and their promises, or word, in implementing these policies and laws?

surlyhorns.com

[immamac 44197]

30 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

surlyhorns.com

He's not kidding. 

[PRONG HORN 3219]

34 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

surlyhorns.com

 

 

Correct!  It's great for policies, laws, and promises, but not so great for election predictions.  

 

[Goofyboy 3428]

 
 
Correct!  It's great for policies, laws, and promises, but not so great for election predictions.  
 

Might need to wear blublockers nexts time.

[scottsins 2039]

Well I’ve been assured repeatedly over the last week there will be no imports due to tariffs.  So 8d chess?

Who assured you of that? Anyone stating that is basically saying that the tariffs will work. That’s the point of them. People criticizing the tariffs do so based on the rationale that things will cost more.

[troph 25088]

4 hours ago, Enemy07 said:

For the politically ignorant, what is the best source to track politicians policies, laws, and their promises, or word, in implementing these policies and laws?

 

1 hour ago, Horn Dog said:

surlyhorns.com

I was going to say the same thing. 

1 hour ago, immamac said:

He's not kidding. 

He’s right you know.

4 hours ago, Enemy07 said:

I post in peace

 

Plus sometimes you get to look at pretty faces, present company (all of you assholes) excluded of course. 
 

all kidding aside - this board - and you can exclude commentary much like an op Ed from a newspaper source - acts almost like an aggregator. What’s missing is most far left and nearly all (well actually all) far right sources. So it does skew center left BUT you can get the deets and decide for yourself.
 

DT Ukraine thread is gold for that news. 

Edited November 16 by troph

[Bozo_Casanova 26773]

Did someone say imports?

 

[Goofyboy 3428]

Did someone say imports?
 

WTF? This timeline is so confusing.

[Biff Tannen 46060]

I just spent 2.5 days in Vegas and I can tell you now, I completely understand how this happened. We are very insulated in Austin by an intelligent, plugged in, and well-meaning population. This was…not that. 

[royiv 9676]

11 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I just spent 2.5 days in Vegas and I can tell you now, I completely understand how this happened. We are very insulated in Austin by an intelligent, plugged in, and well-meaning population. This was…not that. 

Let’s not start jerking each other off. Austin’s municipal government would say otherwise.

[Incredulity 11859]

13 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I just spent 2.5 days in Vegas and I can tell you now, I completely understand how this happened. We are very insulated in Austin by an intelligent, plugged in, and well-meaning population. This was…not that. 

Scratch SF and insert Austin and you’re on the way to self realization.

[Biff Tannen 46060]

Just now, Incredulity said:

Scratch SF and insert Austin and you’re on the way to self realization.

Well, you weren’t included in that. 

[Incredulity 11859]

Just now, Biff Tannen said:

Well, you weren’t included in that. 

It’s hilarious to watch you bump right up to reality, then reeeee right back to lemming status.  Keep on keeping on.

[RomaVicta 30497]

18 hours ago, Evil Bill Obrien said:

So how far past the point of Idiocracy have we made it now?

Yea. The only analysis I hear is on NPR when I'm driving. It's all old paradigm that's been quoted here. No exploration of powerful new factors:

• Christian Nationalism
• Xenophobia/Racial intolerance
• Character of candidate and what it says about electorate
• Lies being believed such as
  • The absurdity of children getting sex change operations at school. 
  • Haitians eating pets.
  • The poor shape of the economy.

 

The last one is probably the most profound issue. There is no good faith on one side. Analysts are content to discuss the perception of the electorate without getting into it being profoundly incorrect and why.

I just smirk and shake my head these days. I'm emotionally detached. 

[Bozo_Casanova 26773]

3 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

There is no good faith on one side. Analysts are content to discuss the perception of the electorate without getting into it being profoundly incorrect and why.

But they aren’t incorrect. Their perception isn’t wrong. They are correctly perceiving an economy that is unfair, inequitable and distorted. Unfortunately Democrats have lost the stomach for the politics of class, and Republicans filled the void, and the media doesn’t have the vocabulary or incentives to frame the issue that way.

[G650 14421]

25 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I just spent 2.5 days in Vegas and I can tell you now, I completely understand how this happened. We are very insulated in Austin by an intelligent, plugged in, and well-meaning population. This was…not that. 

I mean, I told everyone who was touting the whole not many Trump yard signs thing that in my neck of the woods it was twice as intense.

Just now, Bozo_Casanova said:

But they aren’t incorrect. Their perception isn’t wrong. They are correctly perceiving an economy that is unfair, inequitable and distorted. Unfortunately Democrats have lost the stomach for the politics of class, and Republicans filled the void, and the media doesn’t have the vocabulary or incentives to frame the issue that way.

Accurate

[TwiceHorn 31983]

12 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Yea. The only analysis I hear is on NPR when I'm driving. It's all old paradigm that's been quoted here. No exploration of powerful new factors:

• Christian Nationalism
• Xenophobia/Racial intolerance
• Character of candidate and what it says about electorate
• Lies being believed such as
  • The absurdity of children getting sex change operations at school. 
  • Haitians eating pets.
  • The poor shape of the economy.

 

The last one is probably the most profound issue. There is no good faith on one side. Analysts are content to discuss the perception of the electorate without getting into it being profoundly incorrect and why.

I just smirk and shake my head these days. I'm emotionally detached. 

That's really it.  We, the surly "liberal cabal" are informed, accurately.  Huge swaths of this nation are not.  They are informed by propaganda and their main analytical tool is their feelings.

For the liberal cabal to understand these election results is nigh unto impossible because it would require us to accept what is untrue.  I suppose we could make a better attempt, as a form of empathy, to understand the feelings that make the hoi polloi want to believe the untruths they are fed, but I don't think that is a positive form of empathy.

[RomaVicta 30497]

3 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

But they aren’t incorrect. Their perception isn’t wrong. They are correctly perceiving an economy that is unfair, inequitable and distorted. Unfortunately Democrats have lost the stomach for the politics of class, and Republicans filled the void, and the media doesn’t have the vocabulary or incentives to frame the issue that way.

The best thing I heard on NPR yesterday was Bernie Sanders making the same point you are. I think it's likely valid for accounting for some of the red shift to give Trump a majority.

Sanders' central point was that Trump, no matter how crazy and dishonest, does present a vision where the problem is illegals and how he will handle it. The Dems do not choose to pick a cause for what is wrong: the unfair economy and the tyranny (my word) of the billionaire class. It was a great 30 minutes. I'm not a Bernie Bro, but I'm impressed.

However, I don't see how you can quote me and suggest that the bullet list I make somehow represents correct perceptions. The embraced lies of Donald Trump are the whole of his success. They're also the hole we are sliding down with an electorate whose majority doesn't mind it.

[TexArcher 38816]

19 hours ago, gmr548 said:

Jesus fucking Christ.

I'd say this guy's professional career just ended but he'll actually get a raise in the right wing grifting sphere. Kyle Rittenhouse style.

Yeah, what used to end careers now makes them.  All of the societal checks that forced bad people into the shadows are gone.

I wonder how many people nodded along with the Jews Will Not Replace Us march a few years ago.  And I think we're about to find out.

And I expect we'll have the 3/5 Compromise back in place by about Christmas of 2026.  I'm only half kidding.  I don't think much is unthinkable anymore, and I think they'll also find ways to surprise us.

This is gonna be so, so bad.

Edited November 16 by TexArcher

[Goofyboy 3428]

But they aren’t incorrect. Their perception isn’t wrong. They are correctly perceiving an economy that is unfair, inequitable and distorted. Unfortunately Democrats have lost the stomach for the politics of class, and Republicans filled the void, and the media doesn’t have the vocabulary or incentives to frame the issue that way.

How do you properly have class politics when a massive group of poor people fight tooth and nail for billionaires and multi millionaires to hoard more and more wealth?

[TwiceHorn 31983]

5 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:

How do you properly have class politics when a massive group of poor people fight tooth and nail for billionaires and multi millionaires to hoard more and more wealth?

Yeah, good point.  The economy got this way by decades of at best flawed policy (and Democrats were nearly wholly complicit with that) and will take decades to undo with policy changes to which the great unwashed cannot relate (e.g. Liz Warren's ideas).

Seems like the only thing Democrats can do is deke the dummies with things that more directly invoke their feelings, e.g. handouts, while attempting larger scale policy changes to rein in big business.

[The Original Greaser Bob 2880]

13 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

Proof that the Feds really have it in for Oklahoma.  

[Incredulity 11859]

37 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Sanders' central point was that Trump, no matter how crazy and dishonest, does present a vision where the problem is illegals and how he will handle it. The Dems do not choose to pick a cause for what is wrong: the unfair economy and the tyranny (my word) of the billionaire class. It was a great 30 minutes. I'm not a Bernie Bro, but I'm impressed.

They did choose a cause.  The choice was, “everything is stupendous and the common folk are too stupid to understand how great they are doing”.

[Bozo_Casanova 26773]

18 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:

How do you properly have class politics when a massive group of poor people fight tooth and nail for billionaires and multi millionaires to hoard more and more wealth?

Well it doesn’t seem very mysterious that more poor and working class people stopped voting Democrat and started voting Republican around the same time that Democrats stopped talking to poor and working class people and Republicans started talking to them.

[Bozo_Casanova 26773]

12 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

The economy got this way by decades of at best flawed policy (and Democrats were nearly wholly complicit with that) and will take decades to undo with policy changes to which the great unwashed cannot relate (e.g. Liz Warren's ideas).

First, Liz Warren’s ideas are pretty naive. She’s got this lawyer’s notion that we can somehow use regulation to rid the economy of a bunch of widely used products and financial strategies and wind the clock back to how the economy worked in 1965.

Second more importantly however, is that it’s not that the unwashed can’t relate, it’s that they are being talked about rather than talked to. Trump and Bernie address their constituencies directly in words that are clear, immediate and certain, even if nonsensical in Trump’s case.
 

Democrats *refer* to those constituencies, as in “I’m going to create an opportunity economy (whatever the fuck that is) and help the middle class.”

[Bozo_Casanova 26773]

12 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

They did choose a cause.  The choice was, “everything is stupendous and the common folk are too stupid to understand how great they are doing”.

That’s true. One of my wife’s cousins is a big Dem donor. I was talking about some retired teachers saying they were better off financially when Trump was president, and he said “yeah but they are lying, the economy is in great shape. This is about race.”

Edited November 16 by Bozo_Casanova

[TwiceHorn 31983]

9 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

First, Liz Warren’s ideas are pretty naive. She’s got this lawyer’s notion that we can somehow use regulation to rid the economy of a bunch of widely used products and financial strategies and wind the clock back to how the economy worked in 1965.

Second more importantly however, is that it’s not that the unwashed can’t relate, it’s that they are being talked about rather than talked to. Trump and Bernie address their constituencies directly in words that are clear, immediate and certain, even if nonsensical in Trump’s case.
 

Democrats *refer* to those constituencies, as in “I’m going to create an opportunity economy (whatever the fuck that is) and help the middle class.”

Possibly so.  But she's the only politician making the effort of which I am aware.

Also I can't disagree about "talking about" versus "talking to."  What should they say?  Should it be true?  Should it be something they can deliver on?

The thing about right wing propaganda is that it appeals viscerally, not to the relatively benign self-interest that handouts might, but to the reliable negative emotions of fear, envy and hatred.

Should it be billionaires and billion-dollar businesses have been fucking you raw in the ass without a reach-around and we're going to start fucking them?

Edited November 16 by TwiceHorn

[G650 14421]

21 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

They did choose a cause.  The choice was, “everything is stupendous and the common folk are too stupid to understand how great they are doing”.

 

Well, they aren't wrong is the thing. Again though, I'll reiterate, I'm not a Dem politician trying to win votes, and if the Dem's have to blow smoke up their asses to get votes I'm all for it.

 

The uncomfortable truth that no one wants to admit is we are rapidly approaching the point where there are no more quality of life increases for the middle class. At this point we are down to nibbling at the edges in western society. The US needs universal healthcare and childcare, we are obviously the major outlier there. Other than that, UBI is necessary going forward. Continual incremental improvement in health outcomes and efficiency gains which are in the nice to have category. It's in out best interests to help raise the global living standard as it defuses a lot of conflict. But that's about it. And we are seeing the ennui and lashing out that comes from this with people with no internal sense of purpose.

 

11 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

First, Liz Warren’s ideas are pretty naive. She’s got this lawyer’s notion that we can somehow use regulation to rid the economy of a bunch of widely used products and financial strategies and wind the clock back to how the economy worked in 1965.

Second more importantly however, is that it’s not that the unwashed can’t relate, it’s that they are being talked about rather than talked to. Trump and Bernie address their constituencies directly in words that are clear, immediate and certain, even if nonsensical in Trump’s case.
 

Democrats *refer* to those constituencies, as in “I’m going to create an opportunity economy (whatever the fuck that is) and help the middle class.”

 

I mean, I've said for years that Liz Warren's entire being is defined by a deep psychosis over what happened to her father. It's so transparent. Ironically Steve Bannon is exactly the same. Sorry your dad was a dupe Steve.

[G650 14421]

17 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

I was talking about some retired teachers saying they were better off financially when Trump was president

I also find this sentiment insane. 2018 and more so 2019 were terrible years, 2022 and 2023 were miles better.