Non-partisan "Fuck the Status Quo" Thread of Dominance

[Sawbonz 27,562]

3 minutes ago, immamac said:

So to get this thread back on track let's remove all the single issue mainstream issues from discussion? 

Do we just remove Republican and Democrat only policies and put forward ideas that are original for problems facing America not based in either platform?

Right now the reason this devolves into this type of thread is because everyone is starting from a position of who got elected on what platform. What if this was more of a thread of no platform but one that surly is putting forward? 

I can moderate to that. I can't moderate to the OPs idea. 

Is equal rights for women a single issue?

[Iceman 2,713]

5 minutes ago, immamac said:

They actually do, this is why you are wrong. 

In todays America you can lie cook your books and poof debt funding into existence or scam investors with no recourse. 

Jobs are literally poofed into existence all the time, most of them pay really well and have no real impact because corporations have unfathomably large budgets. 

Oh but when jobs are cut to make the company more productive... ohhh the humanity.  LOL.  How daree a team cut a shitty player.  they should all be Jerry Jones just hiring worthless shitbags and overpaying them.

 

A bunch of folks on here like to rail against corporate America, but they still have their 401k or other investments, as if that has ZERO influence on corporations. You're driving the result.

 

Edited November 7 by Iceman

[immamac 42,850]

Just now, Sawbonz said:

Is equal rights for women a single issue?

If you want to pontificate a basis for policy on equal rights without referencing candidates or party platforms that would be in the spirit of this thread. 

I think you can use real, cited examples of supporting information for the basis of your policy, but not portions of either platform. 

E.G. information about abortion rates in states with different laws impacting the topic or examples of positive and negative stories from 1st party citation. 

[immamac 42,850]

1 minute ago, Iceman said:

Oh but when jobs are cut to make the company more productive... ohhh the humanity.  LOL.

 

A bunch of folks on here like to rail against corporate America, but they still have their 401k or other investments, as if that has ZERO influence on corporations.

You do realize that you are making my point for me. Jobs are poofed in and out of existence not because they are or aren't needed. They do it at the whims of investor sentiment. 

If a company needs to show investment in an area they just poof jobs into existence and fill them with whoever and don't even really check on results. The investors like that company xyz is investing in the thing they think is hype or growth etc. 

Its all horseshit. 

[Iceman 2,713]

1 minute ago, immamac said:

You do realize that you are making my point for me. Jobs are poofed in and out of existence not because they are or aren't needed. They do it at the whims of investor sentiment. 

If a company needs to show investment in an area they just poof jobs into existence and fill them with whoever and don't even really check on results. The investors like that company xyz is investing in the thing they think is hype or growth etc. 

Its all horseshit. 

so end the companies and we can eat sawdust.

[Hank Kingsley 20,940]

I play golf almost on a weekly basis with my best friend's dad who is 30 years older than me. He grew up in Oklahoma, went to OU, huge Sooner fan, full blown Trumper. 

And I love him. 

He's a good father. He's an awesome grandfather who is attentive and always wanting to be with his 8 grandchildren.  I'm close with all his children and their kids, all wonderful people (none are Trumpers, FYI). He's stubborn, passionate, and loyal. We couldn't be more different in many ways. He is many generations American, I'm a child of two immigrants from two different countries and cultures. We have many Texas-OU discussions and arguments, but always respectful. I know if I ever needed support or help in my personal life, he would jump at the opportunity and vice versa. 

We purposely rarely talk about politics, as it's gotten heated. But I realize he's all bark and no bite with a lot of these issues. We once had a calm and civil conversation, and a lot of what he genuinely believes sounds like something from a Bernie Sanders platform. 

Life is complicated. No chance I abandon our friendship due to politics. 

[immamac 42,850]

1 minute ago, Iceman said:

so end the companies and we can eat sawdust.

Investors don't add any value or productivity to the economy. They are quite literally parasitic leaches on the economy and they have gamed the system to where reality is actually distorted by their horseshit valuations and lack of real liquidity. 

[Sawbonz 27,562]

17 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Oh, my sweet summer child.  "Outrage at our broken immigration system" is the key to decades of electoral dominance for the GQP.  Why on earth would they EVER make that issue go away?

No Republican since GWB has had ANY interest in actual sound immigration policy.  Their only interest, their ENTIRE interest, is in stoking the fires of xenophobic nationalism for political gain.  Which is understandable, because it has worked like a charm.  A GQP without "FIX OUR BORDERS!"  to run on doesn't grab nearly as much power as it has.  They will never, ever, ever let that issue get solved -- it would kill them.

You could stop illegal immigration tomorrow by making hiring an undocumented worker a felony punishable by 10 years in prison. I wonder why no one has done so?

[Iceman 2,713]

3 minutes ago, immamac said:

Investors don't add any value or productivity to the economy. They are quite literally parasitic leaches on the economy and they have gamed the system to where reality is actually distorted by their horseshit valuations and lack of real liquidity. 

Do you own a 401K?

Do you have a job that required capital investment by someone else in the entity for that to be available to you?  

Do you own your own small business?  You're still an investor.

Edited November 7 by Iceman

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

10 minutes ago, immamac said:

So to get this thread back on track let's remove all the single issue mainstream issues from discussion? 

Do we just remove Republican and Democrat only policies and put forward ideas that are original for problems facing America not based in either platform?

Right now the reason this devolves into this type of thread is because everyone is starting from a position of who got elected on what platform. What if this was more of a thread of no platform but one that surly is putting forward? 

I can moderate to that. I can't moderate to the OPs idea. 

I can put forth a ton of policies, but what's the point the politicians on either side will never for for it?

-Federal Voting Guidelines: States can run elections but there are certian rules on when/how absentee ballots are voted, so there is NO CONFUSION or gray area on "election theft"
-Ranked Choice Voting
-Districts are drawn with guidelines by computers to prevent partisan gerrymandering
-Supreme Courts not being a lifetime appointment
-Return Manufacturing to the US, even at a fucking loss, because of National Security Issues. We subsidize ariline failure, lets subsidize manufacturing
-Teachers and Police officers should be paid extremely high salaries, becuase educating and protecting is important, and right now intelligent and ethical people do other things becuase it's barely a living wage or a thankless profession that has become populated by bullies. Have to attract talent, EVEN AT AN ECONOMIC LOSS
-We need a new, fairer tax code. A fucking relatively simple one that isn't so easy for the wealthy to sidestep. 

That's my start. Ranked choice voting will eliminate the fucking fringe lunatics from each side who typically, currently, win their fucking primaries. FUCK PRIMARIES. You want to fix America, start fucking there. 

[Captainant 27,669]

1 minute ago, immamac said:

Investors don't add any value or productivity to the economy. They are quite literally parasitic leaches on the economy and they have gamed the system to where reality is actually distorted by their horseshit valuations and lack of real liquidity. 

And then, they can cash out tax-free on those distorted and inflated positions by taking MASSIVE loans that are secured by the illiquid but still valuable paper assets. 

Buy, borrow, die. Their estate will pay out any balances.

[immamac 42,850]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You could stop illegal immigration tomorrow by making hiring an undocumented worker a felony punishable by 10 years in prison. I wonder why no one has done so?

Wait you mean you are mandated to do that by federal law? 

Title 8 U.S.C. § 1324a(a)(1)(A) makes it unlawful for any person or other entity to hire, recruit, or refer for a fee, for employment in the United States an alien knowing the alien is an unauthorized alien, as defined in subsection 1324a(h)(3).

Subsection 1324a(2) makes it unlawful for any person or entity, after hiring an alien for employment, to continue to employ the alien in the United States knowing the alien is or has become an unauthorized alien with respect to such employment.

Subsection 1324a(f) provides that any person or entity that engages in a "pattern or practice" of violations of subsection (a)(1)(A) or (a)(2) shall be fined not more than $3000 for each unauthorized alien with respect to whom such a violation occurs, imprisoned for not more than six months for the entire pattern or practice, or both. The legislative history indicates that "a pattern or practice" of violations is to be given a commonsense rather than overly technical meaning, and must evidence regular, repeated and intentional activities, but does not include isolated, sporadic or accidental acts. H.R.Rep. No. 99-682, Part 3, 99th Cong., 2d Sess. (1986), p. 59. See 8 C.F.R. § 274a.1(k).A scheme for civil enforcement of the requirements of §  1324a through injunctions and monetary penalties is set forth in § 1324a(e) and § 1324a(f)(2).

In addition, 18 U.S.C. § 1546(b) makes it a felony offense to use a false identification document, or misuse a real one, for the purpose of satisfying the employment verification provisions in 8 U.S.C. §  1324a(b).

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

10 minutes ago, Iceman said:

Oh but when jobs are cut to make the company more productive... ohhh the humanity.  LOL.  How daree a team cut a shitty player.  they should all be Jerry Jones just hiring worthless shitbags and overpaying them.

 

A bunch of folks on here like to rail against corporate America, but they still have their 401k or other investments, as if that has ZERO influence on corporations. You're driving the result.

 

Lot of us just find it odd that regular workers get the axe while the big shots that drove the company into the ditch so they had to cut staff in the first place rarely suffer similar fates. 

[Incredulity 11,671]

3 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You could stop illegal immigration tomorrow by making hiring an undocumented worker a felony punishable by 10 years in prison. I wonder why no one has done so?

We’ve been over this eleventy billion times.

1.) R constituents need/want labor 

2.) D’s are certain they will become lifelong D voters 

3.)They pay a mountain of cash into entitlement programs that they likely won’t draw on

 

fin.

[Iceman 2,713]

4 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

Lot of us just find it odd that regular workers get the axe while the big shots that drove the company into the ditch so they had to cut staff in the first place rarely suffer similar fates. 

My employer has basically had 4 CEOs in my 30 years.  We don't do a lot of "touch and goes."

I don't necessarily disagree with you or where Imma is coming from, except that, as an employee, you have a choice of where to work... at least in Texas you do.

Edited November 7 by Iceman

[Hank Kingsley 20,940]

Just now, Incredulity said:

We’ve been over this eleventy billion times.

1.) R constituents need/want labor 

2.) D’s are certain they will become lifelong D voters 

3.)They pay a mountain of cash into entitlement programs that they likely won’t draw on

 

fin.

I don't know were #2 comes from. Feels invented by right wing media. 

 

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

Just now, Incredulity said:

We’ve been over this eleventy billion times.

1.) R constituents need/want labor 

2.) D’s are certain they will become lifelong D voters 

3.)They pay a mountain of cash into entitlement programs that they likely won’t draw on

 

fin.

First, it's illegal for illegal immigrants to vote in elections, so #2 makes zero sense.

But more to the point, even if you were right, if "everyone gets something they want" then why is there an outrage over illegal immigration?

[immamac 42,850]

2 minutes ago, Iceman said:

Do you own a 401K?

Do you have a job that required capital investment in the entity?  

Do you own your own small business?  You're still an investor.

Yes, I am in all treasuries backed by the US government. 

No I don't.

Yes, and I have multiple times said I'm going to stop investing in the community. 

You know I'm a real principled person who puts my money where my mouth is and is about instead of talks about it. You can try this with everyone else but you should know it won't work on me. I'm not here talking shit. 

[Hagbard Celine 10,864]

@immamac we need to establish whether or not anyone arguing the vc/pe/oligarchy question has any direct exposure to it, inside of it, and specifically any prior or current technology experience

in the quest for a truce, we have to understand their "reality tunnel", the lense through which they view the question

i would wager we are not having a conversation about apples and oranges

[capnamerca 571]

19 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

That's venting not discussing options in our actual reality. 

It's not productive. 

This is a fair point. 

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

I'll add another one. A company that performs massive layoffs shouldn't be allowed to perform stock buybacks. FUcking at all. What Google did was criminal this past year. If you lay off some massive percentage of your workforce you should be able to do stock buybacks for like 10 fucking years. 

[Hagbard Celine 10,864]

1 minute ago, Iceman said:

Enforce it

My employer has basically had 4 CEOs in my 30 years.  We don't do a lot of "touch and goes."

I don't necessarily disagree with you or where Imma is coming from, except that, as an employee, you have a choice of where to work... at least in Texas you do.

is your employer a technology company?

is your company funded by venture capital or private equity?

[Incredulity 11,671]

Just now, Hank Kingsley said:

I don't know were #2 comes from. Feels invented by right wing media. 

 

Have you never heard D’s and leftwing media spew about the certainty of Democratic victories as far as the eye can see because of “demographics”?

[immamac 42,850]

Just now, SydneyCarton said:

I'll add another one. A company that performs massive layoffs shouldn't be allowed to perform stock buybacks. FUcking at all. What Google did was criminal this past year. If you lay off some massive percentage of your workforce you should be able to do stock buybacks for like 10 fucking years. 

Weird a policy that no one on this board would think is bad that will never ever happen because those investors won't get their sweet sweet stock support and distortrd market reality by propping up their stock with cash. 

[Incredulity 11,671]

3 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

First, it's illegal for illegal immigrants to vote in elections, so #2 makes zero sense.

But more to the point, even if you were right, if "everyone gets something they want" then why is there an outrage over illegal immigration?

Pathway to citizenship, dreamers…..

[Iceman 2,713]

3 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

is your employer a technology company?

is your company funded by venture capital or private equity?

Not Tech.

Publicly traded for 59 years. Started by two separate entrepreneurs in the 30's.  The other significant portion was started 125 years ago or so.

Edited November 7 by Iceman

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Have you never heard D’s and leftwing media spew about the certainty of Democratic victories as far as the eye can see because of “demographics”?

Yeah. They meant young people and women and that got shot to shit on Tuesday. So did Latino vote. What else you got?

[Sawbonz 27,562]

4 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

We’ve been over this eleventy billion times.

1.) R constituents need/want labor 

2.) D’s are certain they will become lifelong D voters 

3.)They pay a mountain of cash into entitlement programs that they likely won’t draw on

 

fin.

I know. And yet the republicans cynically run on stopping it year after year. And the rubes lap it up. 
 

And now the guardrails are gone and true believers are in positions of power

About to be some painful finding out

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Pathway to citizenship, dreamers…..

A shockingly small percentage of people.

[Hagbard Celine 10,864]

1 minute ago, SydneyCarton said:

I'll add another one. A company that performs massive layoffs shouldn't be allowed to perform stock buybacks. FUcking at all. What Google did was criminal this past year. If you lay off some massive percentage of your workforce you should be able to do stock buybacks for like 10 fucking years. 

humans are disposable in the US

the cost of termination in the rest of the G7 is part of the human safety net we simply don't have

G7 companies function just fine and make healthy profits while protecting the careers of their employers

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

3 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Have you never heard D’s and leftwing media spew about the certainty of Democratic victories as far as the eye can see because of “demographics”?

Not so much after 2020. What happened then in Miami-Dade and the RGV shut down a lot of that talk. 

[Incredulity 11,671]

Just now, SydneyCarton said:

Yeah. They meant young people and women and that got shot to shit on Tuesday. So did Latino vote. What else you got?

I’m just telling you what they got out of not fixing immigration.  Yes Tuesday turned #2 on it’s head. 

[RDCanecutter 26,443]

I think we need to all get together and physically beat the shit out of each other, then, sure, I'll have a beer with you.

Sorta kinda like rugby, except chuck out the more complicated rules.

You can use a pistol as a club, but no shooting or stabbing.

[Helobious 9,454]

5 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

We’ve been over this eleventy billion times.

1.) R constituents need/want labor 

2.) D’s are certain they will become lifelong D voters 

3.)They pay a mountain of cash into entitlement programs that they likely won’t draw on

 

fin.

 

4 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I don't know were #2 comes from. Feels invented by right wing media. 

 

It is, because they don’t know or talk to any actual immigrants. My experience is only with Latin Americans, but I’ve been around them all my life. Legal and illegal. First off they have no interest in voting, 2nd not one I have ever met would I describe as liberal/progressive. Stats seem to bear this out pretty convincingly as well.

[Pato del Muerto 52,498]

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I'll add another one. A company that performs massive layoffs shouldn't be allowed to perform stock buybacks. FUcking at all. What Google did was criminal this past year. If you lay off some massive percentage of your workforce you should be able to do stock buybacks for like 10 fucking years. 

Courtesy of an m&a activity a year ago, I’m now in the employ of a large corporation that sees head count as a thing to be constantly right sized. They’ll lay off hundreds, then hire hundreds a year later.  Because to them the savings for that year outweigh the costs of losing institutional knowledge, new hire searches, and additional training. 
 

Not the greatest environment, but there’s no super safe jobs in the industry anyway. 

[Hank Kingsley 20,940]

5 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Have you never heard D’s and leftwing media spew about the certainty of Democratic victories as far as the eye can see because of “demographics”?

If we're talking about Latinos, they are definitely not a monolith. And from what I understand, the Democratic Party generally acknowledges their trouble with connecting with Latinos. 

 

[Incredulity 11,671]

Just now, Hank Kingsley said:

If we're talking about Latinos, they are definitely not a monolith. And from what I understand, the Democratic Party generally acknowledges their trouble with connecting with Latinos. 

 

I’m talking about the Democratic party thinking of the previous few decades.

[bolverk 29,672]

4 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

I think we need to all get together and physically beat the shit out of each other, then, sure, I'll have a beer with you.

Sorta kinda like rugby, except chuck out the more complicated rules.

You can use a pistol as a club, but no shooting or stabbing.

[Fudge Nuggets 19,190]

12 minutes ago, Iceman said:

My employer has basically had 4 CEOs in my 30 years.  We don't do a lot of "touch and goes."

I don't necessarily disagree with you or where Imma is coming from, except that, as an employee, you have a choice of where to work... at least in Texas you do.

How many rounds of layoffs have you had in those 30 years?

[gsoda3 3,261]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Naaah.....I know you very well.  I know a shitload of people just like you.

Faith is a shield you use against actual moral accountability.  Nothing you believe and support can be criticized, nor can the outcomes they lead to be criticized, because you are just "obeying Jesus."

"Obeying Jesus," as done in this society, results in pain, suffering, cruelty, and death.  When a woman in Texas experiences exactly what my wife experienced in a miscarriage (thankfully, hers was 20 years ago), she has a much higher chance of dying.  Which is just God's will (yet another approach that absolves you of all moral accountability).

You claim morality.  Oh, the irony.  The "morality" you claim is the very thing that absolves you from all accountability or actual moral practice.  You're just "obeying Jesus," and any bad outcomes are just "God's will."

Fuck that.  The bad outcomes are due to evil and cruelty.  Much of that evil cruelty is yours.

 

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

I don't care about what people think about me.  I care about the fact that it is pointless and a waste of time.  You can spend your lifetime building the Taj Mahal of decency.  The majority of Americans are doing everything possible to turn it to rubble in minutes.

It's a waste.  It's stupid to even try.  When the cruelty is the point and the entire point, decency is a wasted effort, a sisyphean task.

Stop trying to help people.  Most of them don't want it.  Most of them don't deserve it.  And even if they do, whatever good you spend a lifetime doing will be torn down in an instant, because that's the way we want it.  Don't be stupid.

If you have no intention of listening past your prejudices why are you here? This thread's not for that.  

1 hour ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Anyone that voted for the GOP voted to make me, and every woman in this country, a second class citizen. They do not care if we have bodily autonomy or not, and a growing portion of MAGA has openly talked about rescinding the 19th Amendment. 

So fuck your feelings. There will be no truce.  You don't deserve the consideration.

Same for you.  There's room for your unbridled ranting in every other thread in the CR. There are people attempting to have actual conversations in good faith here. It's fine if you don't but no one wants to hear about it.

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Psssst.  It's because all of the abortion bans aren't about reducing abortion at all.

They are about controlling women, and punishing them for being harlots, jezebels, and for the original sins of Eve, that bitch who tricked us out of a life in Eden.  That's it.  That's the entire story.  Because yes, if the goal was ACTUALLY to reduce abortions and protect women's health, there are literally thousands of other things we could do.  And the GQP is interested in NONE of those things.  That's not an eerie coincidence.  It's the tell that reveals the whole story

 

[Hank Kingsley 20,940]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

I’m talking about the Democratic party thinking of the previous few decades.

Even then, there was no confidence in getting support from the Latino community. 

[Brisketexan 105,139]

8 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Pathway to citizenship, dreamers…..

If y'all want to understand the dichotomy and why any hope of a "truce" is a pipedream, that's a perfect encapsulation of it.

A right winger cannot IMAGINE a reason for supporting a policy (that is, supporting a pathway to citizenship for immigrants who have been here for years, worked hard, and not committed any crimes, as well as a pathway for kids who were brought here at a young age so that they don't know any other home) OTHER than to increase your hold on power.

Because it's decent, human, and fairminded?  What the fuck are you talking about?  No, the ONLY reason to support any policy is self-interest: "how can this serve me and my goals?"  And they then project that onto the rest of us.  "Well, OBVIOUSLY, the ONLY reason that anyone on the left would support those things is to increase their hold on power [because that's what I would do]."

That's it.  That's why we can't get anywhere good, and never will.  One side views everything through the lens of "me me me mine mine mine," and automatically opposes and hates anything proposed by the other side because 1) they presume that EVERYONE'S sole motivation is "me me me mine mine mine," and 2) they view everything as a transactional zero-sum affair.  If someone on the left supports something, it MUST be because it will hurt the right.  Because that's how the right would do it.

This thread is a joke.

[G650 14,256]

10 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

I think we need to all get together and physically beat the shit out of each other, then, sure, I'll have a beer with you.

Sorta kinda like rugby, except chuck out the more complicated rules.

You can use a pistol as a club, but no shooting or stabbing.

How about a good game of calcio storico

[Incredulity 11,671]

Just now, Brisketexan said:

If y'all want to understand the dichotomy and why any hope of a "truce" is a pipedream, that's a perfect encapsulation of it.

A right winger cannot IMAGINE a reason for supporting a policy (that is, supporting a pathway to citizenship for immigrants who have been here for years, worked hard, and not committed any crimes, as well as a pathway for kids who were brought here at a young age so that they don't know any other home) OTHER than to increase your hold on power.

Because it's decent, human, and fairminded?  What the fuck are you talking about?  No, the ONLY reason to support any policy is self-interest: "how can this serve me and my goals?"  And they then project that onto the rest of us.  "Well, OBVIOUSLY, the ONLY reason that anyone on the left would support those things is to increase their hold on power [because that's what I would do]."

That's it.  That's why we can't get anywhere good, and never will.  One side views everything through the lens of "me me me mine mine mine," and automatically opposes and hates anything proposed by the other side because 1) they presume that EVERYONE'S sole motivation is "me me me mine mine mine," and 2) they view everything as a transactional zero-sum affair.  If someone on the left supports something, it MUST be because it will hurt the right.  Because that's how the right would do it.

This thread is a joke.

The fuck are you babbling about?  I said nothing disparaging about either program.  For fuck sake go elsewhere to rant and piss down your leg.

[Incredulity 11,671]

2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Even then, there was no confidence in getting support from the Latino community. 

Well you’re going to have to expand on that.  You’re saying Democrats didn’t have and didn’t think they would have in the future support from Latinos?

[Brisketexan 105,139]

Just now, Incredulity said:

The fuck are you babbling about?  I said nothing disparaging about either program.  For fuck sake go elsewhere to rant and piss down your leg.

Your post responded that the reason for people supporting dreamers and a pathway to citizenship was for electoral advantage (to get one side more future votes).  Did I misread your point?

[Brisketexan 105,139]

6 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

If you have no intention of listening past your prejudices why are you here?

Says the man who supports everything he does via rigid matters of faith that he would impose on everyone else.  That's rich.  Lectured on the evils of prejudices by a theocrat.

[RDCanecutter 26,443]

4 minutes ago, G650 said:

How about a good game of calcio storico

I don't speak no fancy French or nothin but if that means "Ass Whoopin" I'm in.

[SydneyCarton 48,106]

Can we ban brisket from this thread? He’s ruining whatever minuscule chance there is for talking. 
 

I’d like a R voter to speak on my policy points. 

[gsoda3 3,261]

1 hour ago, capnamerca said:

This isn't directed at you specifically, but your comment here is emblematic of the issue. Because in this country, we get one of two choices - Republican or Democrat - that shape the direction of this country. You can hold all the personal beliefs you want, you can donate to all the right organizations, you can volunteer your time at the shelter, and those are wonderful things which I sincerely keep happening. But enacting change comes from one of two places, and you sat it out. We saw who won, and thus ... you're part of the 

....

Sigh. I tried. But I guess this was directed at gsoda directly, at least a little bit.

I appreciate your thoughts.  I reject your premise that not choosing a side nullifies one's personal impact.  Government is not the only way to make a difference. In fact, it shouldn't be the primary way one makes a difference.  The hungry man doesn't care who you voted for when you feed him.  @immamac had a similar post on election night- don't rely on government to be the change.