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Joel Osteen is a fraud meta thread

BurntOrange&White

By BurntOrange&White
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deadshank

deadshank 24654

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Nicole44 said:

“I have had a hell of a day. A real bad day. This is the cherry on top of shit days that I have had. And so…”

if they aren’t curious I feel like you might be in a room alone.

they will always be curious. Trust in the path I have set forth.

wow that’s fucker’s house?

1B4F9E5C-DB4F-4CB2-94CD-E6993676D2F2.jpeg

LOL.  Wrong house!

His house is still a biggun but that ain't it.

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Cajun

Cajun 11778

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, crash_davis said:

Only if someone confirms that he does in fact have a Ferrari? $100M in wealth, $10M house, and big ass private jet from peddling fake gospel, nope not a douche. Ferrari? Yes, then definitely a douche.

Um, have you looked at his hair?

This isn't that complicated.

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

Posted
Posted

He gets 17,000 in-person worshippers a week.  Assuming half of them tithe at an average income of $70,000, that's gotta be in the tens of millions of dollars per year.  I know he's got some serious G&A overhead.  But he still clears 8 digits from that.  Plus the TV rights to those services have to bring in another several million dollars per year.  Then the book sales.  But all of it based on fraud.

I know businessmen have been fleecing the American People for centuries, but it seems even more blatant now.  In an era where it's never been easier to verify who is full of shit and who is telling the truth...we seem to fall for more dumb shit than ever.  From megachurches based on personalities instead of Jesus' teachings, to entire political campaigns based more on merchandise than policy, to multi-level marketing companies in every industry.  

It was only just in the last year or so I finally saw behind the curtain and realized how truly desperate and easily fooled we are.

Go to a politically rally on Saturday, contribute a few hundred bucks, and be told you're better than the other side, you've been robbed of your country by other groups, and get filled up with peerlessness and hate.  Then on Sunday, go to megachurch, donate a few hundred bucks, and be told Jesus loves you the way you are, God has a special plan for you, and get filled up with salvation and altruism.  Go to the office Monday with a justified feeling of well-roundedness from your weekend, then head home early because the neighbors are coming over for a regional sales meeting for Rodan + Fields and you wanna be a Platinum Circle Producer this year!  

I know we all get fooled by clever marketing now and again.  Even the smartest people I know fall for something.  But two of the cornerstones of a person's self are their politics and their faith.  And we just making the dumbest fucking choices when it comes to that.  Spend an hour researching the ingredients in the your cereal? Okay.  Joel needs another $500 this month for his "Super Fantastic Faithful Outreach Ministry", no time to think honey---just the get the damn checkbook, ahhhh!

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Lobo said:

He gets 17,000 in-person worshippers a week.  Assuming half of them tithe at an average income of $70,000, that's gotta be in the tens of millions of dollars per year.  I know he's got some serious G&A overhead.  But he still clears 8 digits from that.  Plus the TV rights to those services have to bring in another several million dollars per year.  Then the book sales.  But all of it based on fraud.

I know businessmen have been fleecing the American People for centuries, but it seems even more blatant now.  In an era where it's never been easier to verify who is full of shit and who is telling the truth...we seem to fall for more dumb shit than ever.  From megachurches based on personalities instead of Jesus' teachings, to entire political campaigns based more on merchandise than policy, to multi-level marketing companies in every industry.  

It was only just in the last year or so I finally saw behind the curtain and realized how truly desperate and easily fooled we are.

Go to a politically rally on Saturday, contribute a few hundred bucks, and be told you're better than the other side, you've been robbed of your country by other groups, and get filled up with peerlessness and hate.  Then on Sunday, go to megachurch, donate a few hundred bucks, and be told Jesus loves you the way you are, God has a special plan for you, and get filled up with salvation and altruism.  Go to the office Monday with a justified feeling of well-roundedness from your weekend, then head home early because the neighbors are coming over for a regional sales meeting for Rodan + Fields and you wanna be a Platinum Circle Producer this year!  

I know we all get fooled by clever marketing now and again.  Even the smartest people I know fall for something.  But two of the cornerstones of a person's self are their politics and their faith.  And we just making the dumbest fucking choices when it comes to that.  Spend an hour researching the ingredients in the your cereal? Okay.  Joel needs another $500 this month for his "Super Fantastic Faithful Outreach Ministry", no time to think honey---just the get the damn checkbook, ahhhh!

I live nearby.  The demographic of the people I see walking into that building appears poor as shit.

I get why people justifiably do not like him.  But he has 14 best sellers and has sold 100s of millions of copies of his books.  From what I understand he takes no comp from the church.  His income is from publishing.  Unless I see evidence to the contrary, I see nothing to suggest his income is nefarious.  This is no different to me than politicians getting rich off their book deals.  I question why anyone would want to read his prosperity crap.  But that's those sucker's choice.

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Captainant

Captainant 28567

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

I am sure he pays taxes on his income.

if he never owns any of the extravagancies and they're the sole property of the church - that he's the primary beneficiary and agent of, it's not taxable income. (Stealing a well-written explainer from Quora)

Joel Osteen is in a clergy class. That means that any salary he earns is taxable, and since he does not receive a salary, he would not pay any income tax on it. He can, however, receive other benefits that can be quite lucrative that are not taxable as income, such as housing and travel allowances. Any expense incurred in the process of performing his duties as the pastor of Lakewood Church or the television ministry that comes from it are not “out of pocket” to Osteen. Some allowances, like housing, attract social security taxes even though they are exempt from income tax, but others are more like “business expenses”, and the line items are never passed through Osteen’s personal accounts, but paid directly by the ministry. His books sell well, and he receives royalties from that. All of that is taxable, and we are not privy to the mechanisms set up by his attorneys and accountants. No doubt it is legal to the letter.

2 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

I live nearby.  The demographic of the people I see walking into that building appears poor as shit.

I get why people justifiably do not like him.  But he has 14 best sellers and has sold 100s of millions of copies of his books.  From what I understand he takes no comp from the church.  His income is from publishing.  Unless I see evidence to the contrary, I see nothing to suggest his income is nefarious.  This is no different to me than politicians getting rich off their book deals.  I question why anyone would want to read his prosperity crap.  But that's those sucker's choice.

Osteen may be technically telling the truth in that he draws no salary, but like most things he says, its incredibly intellectually dishonest. What he's not being honest about is how much church money and tax havens enable and support his extravagant lifestyle.

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Osteen’s private jet, this Airbus 319...

 

A19C448A-E88A-4DC8-9DA3-556FBA25A8E5.jpeg

The livery on that thing suggests to me that Joel Osteen was watching Indiana Jones Last Crusade and thought, "That's the plane of a carpenter."  

Like the benevolent Osteen, I don't think the Pope technically draws a salary but I think he lives a decent lifestyle.  Probably has a nice book deal lined up, too.  

Edited by Lobo
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Nicole44

Nicole44 22322

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, deadshank said:

Airbus, $11 million dollar house, book deals, $325K sports car (allegedly). 
 

Ya, but he’s just not happy.  

I mean we all realize he’s gonna unzip that face? Just like in “V” (not Vendetta for you peeps who are just discovering the magic of the 80’s.) he can’t be happy. 

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tx 3 putt

tx 3 putt 78715

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Lobo said:

He gets 17,000 in-person worshippers a week.  Assuming half of them tithe at an average income of $70,000, that's gotta be in the tens of millions of dollars per year.  I know he's got some serious G&A overhead.  But he still clears 8 digits from that.  Plus the TV rights to those services have to bring in another several million dollars per year.  Then the book sales.  But all of it based on fraud.

I know businessmen have been fleecing the American People for centuries, but it seems even more blatant now.  In an era where it's never been easier to verify who is full of shit and who is telling the truth...we seem to fall for more dumb shit than ever.  From megachurches based on personalities instead of Jesus' teachings, to entire political campaigns based more on merchandise than policy, to multi-level marketing companies in every industry.  

It was only just in the last year or so I finally saw behind the curtain and realized how truly desperate and easily fooled we are.

Go to a politically rally on Saturday, contribute a few hundred bucks, and be told you're better than the other side, you've been robbed of your country by other groups, and get filled up with peerlessness and hate.  Then on Sunday, go to megachurch, donate a few hundred bucks, and be told Jesus loves you the way you are, God has a special plan for you, and get filled up with salvation and altruism.  Go to the office Monday with a justified feeling of well-roundedness from your weekend, then head home early because the neighbors are coming over for a regional sales meeting for Rodan + Fields and you wanna be a Platinum Circle Producer this year!  

I know we all get fooled by clever marketing now and again.  Even the smartest people I know fall for something.  But two of the cornerstones of a person's self are their politics and their faith.  And we just making the dumbest fucking choices when it comes to that.  Spend an hour researching the ingredients in the your cereal? Okay.  Joel needs another $500 this month for his "Super Fantastic Faithful Outreach Ministry", no time to think honey---just the get the damn checkbook, ahhhh!


Lakewood’s Spanish service is the biggest Spanish service in Houston 

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SHOOTER12

SHOOTER12 8886

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, crash_davis said:

so how does this work? 

yada yada yada, and so........wannna fuck? 

or does that last bit not need to be said?

are you expecting a dude to complete that thought or is the expectation for her to complete that sentence?

Yes inquiring minds and such, I didn't understand that.  So, you just walk up and day "and so" and they attack you?

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Bullneck

Bullneck 19543

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

b626f2742b42917967f4c8a245cc1fd7.gif

A lot to unpack here.  From left to right:

  • They guy sitting in stunned silence.
  • They guy unfazed by whatever is happening on the field.  Instead, he puts a full chip nacho in his mouth.
  • Scarf woman either has a sinus headache or is doing a quick prayer. 
  • Houndstooth hat guy seems to say, "They got to stop turnin' the bawl ovah."  Looks like child is sitting on his lap. His wife agrees.

Bama fans.  Is this the Cotton Bowl against OU?

 

Edited by Bullneck
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F250

F250 29202

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Captainant said:

if he never owns any of the extravagancies and they're the sole property of the church - that he's the primary beneficiary and agent of, it's not taxable income. (Stealing a well-written explainer from Quora)

Joel Osteen is in a clergy class. That means that any salary he earns is taxable, and since he does not receive a salary, he would not pay any income tax on it. He can, however, receive other benefits that can be quite lucrative that are not taxable as income, such as housing and travel allowances. Any expense incurred in the process of performing his duties as the pastor of Lakewood Church or the television ministry that comes from it are not “out of pocket” to Osteen. Some allowances, like housing, attract social security taxes even though they are exempt from income tax, but others are more like “business expenses”, and the line items are never passed through Osteen’s personal accounts, but paid directly by the ministry. His books sell well, and he receives royalties from that. All of that is taxable, and we are not privy to the mechanisms set up by his attorneys and accountants. No doubt it is legal to the letter.

Osteen may be technically telling the truth in that he draws no salary, but like most things he says, its incredibly intellectually dishonest. What he's not being honest about is how much church money and tax havens enable and support his extravagant lifestyle.

Este.

The scam is putting all the extravagances under ownership of the church but remaining the beneficiary.

A prosperity church in San Antonio got caught pulling this scam. The pastor and his family was taking trips to Fiji and the church elders were issuing Rolex watches and shit to each other when a church accountant blew the whistle. The local news ran a 3 part series on the scam in the religious section and it had some very juicy details.

The church sued and started purging people that started asking questions.

 

https://caselaw.findlaw.com/tx-court-of-appeals/1287828.html

 

 

 

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DanRydell

DanRydell 799

Posted
Posted
“I have had a hell of a day. A real bad day. This is the cherry on top of shit days that I have had. And so…”
if they aren’t curious I feel like you might be in a room alone.
they will always be curious. Trust in the path I have set forth.
wow that’s fucker’s house?
1B4F9E5C-DB4F-4CB2-94CD-E6993676D2F2.jpeg.ee245f9efa42a4826e777dc2b2a57783.jpeg

That’s Kim Kardashian and Kanye West’s house
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Bama Chick

Bama Chick 28596

Posted
Posted
A lot to unpack here.  From left to right:
  • They guy sitting in stunned silence.
  • They guy unfazed by whatever is happening on the field.  Instead, he puts a full chip nacho in his mouth.
  • Scarf woman either has a sinus headache or is doing a quick prayer. 
  • Houndstooth hat guy seems to say, "They got to stop turnin' the bawl ovah."  Looks like child is sitting on his lap. His wife agrees.
Bama fans.  Is this the Cotton Bowl against OU?
 

Don’t remember which game it was but the guy is saying “Let’s go ahead and run tha bawl!”.
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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, F250 said:

Este.

The scam is putting all the extravagances under ownership of the church but remaining the beneficiary.

A prosperity church in San Antonio got caught pulling this scam. The pastor and his family was taking trips to Fiji and the church elders were issuing Rolex watches and shit to each other when a church accountant blew the whistle. The local news ran a 3 part series on the scam in the religious section and it had some very juicy details.

The church sued and started purging people that started asking questions.

 

https://caselaw.findlaw.com/tx-court-of-appeals/1287828.html

 

 

 

Are there any facts suggesting Osteen does this?   Or is it just speculation?

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52-80

52-80 19377

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Are there any facts suggesting Osteen does this?   Or is it just speculation?

Pretty simple if somebody runs up his address on HCAD and the plane tail number to see if both are registered to church entities or to his private businesses or to himself. 

I'm curious about his church demographics? Is he dredging up the poors and grifting their 10%? Or suburbanites seeking community?  No sympathy towards the latter.

Don't mind if dudes makes money from books and TV rights.  But if what he enjoys is a product of tax loop skirting then he should be sent to Sodom

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deadshank

deadshank 24654

Posted
Posted
57 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Pretty simple if somebody runs up his address on HCAD and the plane tail number to see if both are registered to church entities or to his private businesses or to himself. 

I'm curious about his church demographics? Is he dredging up the poors and grifting their 10%? Or suburbanites seeking community?  No sympathy towards the latter.

Don't mind if dudes makes money from books and TV rights.  But if what he enjoys is a product of tax loop skirting then he should be sent to Sodom

HCAD search reveals “Current owner” as owner of property owner and a Houston PO Box as the mailing address.   
 

“Current owner” is a common name listing in wealthy neighborhoods.  

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'stache

'stache 22145

Posted
Posted (edited)

Isn't wealth and extravagance literally what he preaches? Serious question, kinda. Seems like someone whose dogma is "prosperity gospel" isn't really a fraud by living extravagantly. Seems he's pretty damn open about taking people's money and living well, and they just keep on giving it to him.

Edited by 'stache
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Jiggy-Z

Jiggy-Z 3509

Posted
Posted

Back in the day (1980's) my parents got real churchy, or I should say more churchy.  They were already pretty hard core catholics and my brother and I went to catholic school we made all the holy days and then some, prayed at home (rosary and all), had tons of Heavy ancient catholic reference books and lots of paperback books on theology, bios on 20th century catholics, and all the religious artifacts and nick knacks about.

They got into the more evangelical side of things and they brought my brother and me to all of their conventions, services, and seminars.  There was much good that came out of it and despite being very uncomfortable with it the whole things was pretty low key and the money side was more like passing of the plate after an AA meeting than what is going on in the mega church world, although there were plenty of t shirts, tapes and books to be had for the right price.

My brother who was much more cynical and kind of an asshole, used to remark that the people that showed up to these things were a bunch of losers and were generally fat to boot (he used much harsher language).  The point was is that these were people who were in need of a pick me up and it was ok to be poor, fat, unattractive, lazy, unsuccessful, submissive, and have a history of poor life choices because god still loved you and everything would be ok in the afterlife. It was a way of opting out and not taking responsibility in the worst of cases.

These were people in search of a fix, a quick fix if we are being honest.  It doesn't really matter whether we are talking about salvation, lowering your handicap, losing weight, stopping arthritis pain, taking hebal medicine, pyramid power, getting that can't miss fishing lure,  Amway, or hiring that up an coming college football coach.  There is always some con that gets you to believe that success will be yours if you just do buy these things or follow this little known formula.

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F250

F250 29202

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Jiggy-Z said:

hiring that up an coming college football coach.  There is always some con that gets you to believe that success will be yours if you just do buy these things or follow this little known formula.

 

Dont Make Me Cut You Orange Is The New Black GIF

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JohnnyRage

JohnnyRage 1617

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 7/20/2021 at 11:07 AM, Jiggy-Z said:

Back in the day (1980's) my parents got real churchy, or I should say more churchy.  They were already pretty hard core catholics and my brother and I went to catholic school we made all the holy days and then some, prayed at home (rosary and all), had tons of Heavy ancient catholic reference books and lots of paperback books on theology, bios on 20th century catholics, and all the religious artifacts and nick knacks about.

They got into the more evangelical side of things and they brought my brother and me to all of their conventions, services, and seminars.  There was much good that came out of it and despite being very uncomfortable with it the whole things was pretty low key and the money side was more like passing of the plate after an AA meeting than what is going on in the mega church world, although there were plenty of t shirts, tapes and books to be had for the right price.

My brother who was much more cynical and kind of an asshole, used to remark that the people that showed up to these things were a bunch of losers and were generally fat to boot (he used much harsher language).  The point was is that these were people who were in need of a pick me up and it was ok to be poor, fat, unattractive, lazy, unsuccessful, submissive, and have a history of poor life choices because god still loved you and everything would be ok in the afterlife. It was a way of opting out and not taking responsibility in the worst of cases.

These were people in search of a fix, a quick fix if we are being honest.  It doesn't really matter whether we are talking about salvation, lowering your handicap, losing weight, stopping arthritis pain, taking hebal medicine, pyramid power, getting that can't miss fishing lure,  Amway, or hiring that up an coming college football coach.  There is always some con that gets you to believe that success will be yours if you just do buy these things or follow this little known formula.

And how did your brother turn out?

Edited by JohnnyRage
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