Need a will

[BillyMadison 7]

Should he pretty straightforward-wife and I need wills. Nothing crazy-we’ve own a house, couple of 401ks, etc.

Any reccs? Is legalzoom legit, or should we go through an attorney?

We’re in Dallas if that matters. Gracias for any help

[UTPhil2006 3,922]

@hornian to the white courtesy phone 

[Okie State 3,888]

I'm also needing to do this. Not sure if a will or living trust is the better option.

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

31 minutes ago, Okie State said:

I'm also needing to do this. Not sure if a will or living trust is the better option.

Only if you are super-afraid of probate for some reason should you do a living trust.  A living trust means you put everything you own in a trust (or everything signficant) and control inheritance by trust terms/powers of appointment.  It can have a few odd tax consequences here and there, but is effective at avoiding probate.

[Okie State 3,888]

18 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Only if you are super-afraid of probate for some reason should you do a living trust.  A living trust means you put everything you own in a trust (or everything signficant) and control inheritance by trust terms/powers of appointment.  It can have a few odd tax consequences here and there, but is effective at avoiding probate.

I had to deal with probate when my Mom passed. It took forever and lawyers charged fees for every little thing. I'd like to avoid that if possible, but am open to ideas. I have some friends who swear by wills and others by trusts.

I'll look into the tax implications. Thanks.

Edited Sunday at 03:36 AM by Okie State

[thunderlounge 8,367]

#TeamTrust

 

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

39 minutes ago, Okie State said:

I had to deal with probate when my Mom passed. It took forever and lawyers charged fees for every little thing. I'd like to avoid that if possible, but am open to ideas. I have some friends who swear by wills and others by trusts.

I'll look into the tax implications. Thanks.

In Texas?  

[Okie State 3,888]

12 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

In Texas?  

This was Oklahoma.

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

18 minutes ago, Okie State said:

This was Oklahoma.

Texas is pretty easy, probably cost about the same to do a living trust as a probate, depending on the complexity of things.

[pops 7,127]

Do a trust. Legal zoom is fine. Probate is public record and a pain in the ass compared to a trust. 

And you don't have to worry about putting everything in your trust. You still have a will but it will put everything in your trust upon death therefore there is no estate to probate.  Only thing that needs to actually be titled in the name of the trust now is any real estate. 

Also do a power of attorney upon incapacity and a living will or health directive. 

If you're sick or dead you don't need your loved ones worrying about all that shit and everything is in a nice little file that you or your wife can show a doctor or a bank or whomever else you need to deal with. 

Edited Sunday at 11:41 PM by pops

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

20 minutes ago, pops said:

Do a trust. Legal zoom is fine. Probate is public record and a pain in the ass compared to a trust. 

And you don't have to worry about putting everything in your trust. You still have a will but it will put everything in your trust upon death therefore there is no estate to probate.  Only thing that needs to actually be titled in the name of the trust now is any real estate. 

Also do a power of attorney upon incapacity and a living will or health directive. 

If you're sick or dead you don't need your loved ones worrying about all that shit and everything is in a nice little file that you or your wife can show a doctor or a bank or whomever else you need to deal with. 

A will without probate is nearly completely useless.  Anything you want conveyed by the trust, in accordance with your wishes, you have to put in the trust.

It's true that most people can get by as long as the real property is taken care of, by will, or trust, or some other device.  But if you really want to control the disposition of your assets, you either put it in the trust or live with whatever happens with beneficiary designations. etc.

[pops 7,127]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

A will without probate is nearly completely useless.  Anything you want conveyed by the trust, in accordance with your wishes, you have to put in the trust.

It's true that most people can get by as long as the real property is taken care of, by will, or trust, or some other device.  But if you really want to control the disposition of your assets, you either put it in the trust or live with whatever happens with beneficiary designations. etc.

I don't practice in Texas... And don't remember the specifics there.

 I'm saying you still put all your assets in your trust but where I'm at, the will can handle all of that at your death. You don't need to go through and list every chair or worry about changing names of bank accounts and all that shit. 

The only thing here that has to be titled in the trust before death to get it into the trust is real estate.  

[thunderlounge 8,367]

1 minute ago, pops said:

I don't practice in Texas... And don't remember the specifics there.

 I'm saying you still put all your assets in your trust but where I'm at, the will can handle all of that at your death. You don't need to go through and list every chair or worry about changing names of bank accounts and all that shit. 

The only thing here that has to be titled in the trust before death to get it into the trust is real estate.  

 

That’s pretty much how it works out here as well. Large, valuable assets get named specifically in trust to start. Land, stock, NFA toys, whatever. After that you can also add anything specific if you’d like. Timmy gets my double barrel 20ga since I taught him to hunt with it, or whatever. Or generalities, like my furniture and household possessions go to Jenny and her family, or whatever.

It’s really flexible. 

[Dbeasy 15,544]

Don’t the assets in a trust have to pay taxes when passed to descendants unless kept in a trust? Whereas assets outside the trust are stepped up in basis? 

[pops 7,127]

Just now, Dbeasy said:

Don’t the assets in a trust have to pay taxes when passed to descendants unless kept in a trust? Whereas assets outside the trust are stepped up in basis? 

Grantor trusts or living trusts don't really exist until death and still get the step up in basis. 

[HornOnTheBayou 9,059]

You should go with a will, so then you will also have a way. 

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

Well, I guess we should distinguish here between a "living," inter vivos trust, created by a living grantor, and various testamentary trusts created by a will.  

When I was speaking of trusts, I meant the former.  

I should state that I am a Texas lawyer, I don't practice in estates, but I went through this with my parents some time ago, so my knowledge may be somewhat outdated, but the general principles are the same:  With a "living trust," assets to be governed by testamentary intent are placed in a trust before death, for distribution according to the trust terms at death (or leaving them in the trust for the benefit of the beneficiaries).  The trustee of the trust is similar to an executor and the terms of the trust similar to a will.  

The only real advantage of the living trust is avoiding probate.  But it has its own hassles.

[Reagan1k 3,042]

Having been through it before in TX and helping a family member go through this process right now, my observation is that a living trust is only as useful as the attention paid to properly funding it (putting the assets in correctly) and that often isn't done correctly.

Seems that the fear of probate is often manufactured (mostly through Holiday Inn Express seminars and because Daddy always said....) rather than being founded in the truth.

Easy to say and looks great on paper, but when the newness wears off the trusts are often ignored or forgotten and never properly managed.  That can leave a bigger mess or more heartburn than had the average person just left well enough alone.

A living trust can be a great tool, but like any tool, it needs to be deployed properly and for the right reason.  Saying "to avoid probate" begs the follow up questions of why and at what alternative cost.  The answers to those questions usually determine the right direction to take.

[Tonesky 1,042]

20 hours ago, pops said:

Do a trust. Legal zoom is fine. Probate is public record and a pain in the ass compared to a trust. 

And you don't have to worry about putting everything in your trust. You still have a will but it will put everything in your trust upon death therefore there is no estate to probate.  Only thing that needs to actually be titled in the name of the trust now is any real estate.

Probate in Texas is neither expensive nor a pain in the ass.  And, with the advent of affidavits in lieu of inventory, the contents of a probated estate are no longer public record.  There are not many people in Texas who need revocable living trusts instead of traditional wills. 

A (pour-over) will that puts everything into your trust upon death can only do so by being probated.  But, the revocable living trust you do now (that basically doubles your aggregate estate planning and probate expense) gets you a pretty leatherette binder....

[UtBlaw 32]

I have written thousands of wills and trusts. Don’t listen to the trust advice on here. It’s uninformed and mostly wrong. The best way to get free wills and trusts drafted by an attorney is to sign up for LegalShield in Texas. Get the cheapest plan and cancel as soon as you receive them (also comes with free living will and powers of attorney).  It’s much cheaper than having a lawyer draft one. Trust me on this one I worked in estate planning for years.

[thunderlounge 8,367]

Thanks for using crappatalk and borking the page. 

[TwiceHorn 32,021]

23 hours ago, Reagan1k said:

Having been through it before in TX and helping a family member go through this process right now, my observation is that a living trust is only as useful as the attention paid to properly funding it (putting the assets in correctly) and that often isn't done correctly.

Seems that the fear of probate is often manufactured (mostly through Holiday Inn Express seminars and because Daddy always said....) rather than being founded in the truth.

Easy to say and looks great on paper, but when the newness wears off the trusts are often ignored or forgotten and never properly managed.  That can leave a bigger mess or more heartburn than had the average person just left well enough alone.

A living trust can be a great tool, but like any tool, it needs to be deployed properly and for the right reason.  Saying "to avoid probate" begs the follow up questions of why and at what alternative cost.  The answers to those questions usually determine the right direction to take.

Yes, when I said my parents went through this, that is exactly what happened.  When my Dad's employer went to 401k over defined-benefit pension, they started reorging their financial life.  One of the things they had going on was a conventional will without a marital deduction trust.  That was adequate for them at the time, but then all of a sudden it seemed, their estate was in excess of the estate tax deduction.  They were vaguely mad at our family lawyer for not warning them of this.  ETA:  Peter Lynch and Fidelity made them millionaires it seemed in the blink of an eye.

So, they started exploring all the options, including the living trust seminars and "second to die" insurance policies, which tended to be a feature of those.  Like whole life, I think they paid a nice commission to the seller.

Before they made a final decision on that, I had entered law school and had a better understanding of the legal aspects of this.  They ultimately went with a conventional will with a marital deduction trust.  By the time they actually passed, the estate tax deduction was high enough that they didn't really need it.

One thing that was an issue with a living trust was that you lost the homestead deduction on real property, which was a substantial asset of their estate and a meaningful issue.  I believe Texas law has changed to accommodate that, but there are a few niggling things like that that come up when assets are no longer owned by a "real person," even though the real person retains almost all control over the assets in question.

Edited Tuesday at 04:42 PM by TwiceHorn

[thunderlounge 8,367]

19 minutes ago, thunderlounge said:

Thanks for using crappatalk and borking the page. 

Gracias, mods. 

[4th and 5 4,998]

On 12/16/2024 at 1:53 PM, Tonesky said:

Probate in Texas is neither expensive nor a pain in the ass.  And, with the advent of affidavits in lieu of inventory, the contents of a probated estate are no longer public record.  There are not many people in Texas who need revocable living trusts instead of traditional wills. 

A (pour-over) will that puts everything into your trust upon death can only do so by being probated.  But, the revocable living trust you do now (that basically doubles your aggregate estate planning and probate expense) gets you a pretty leatherette binder....

This.

Went thru it with my own and my in-laws......with my own, despite a trust, still could not avoid probate (not much cost or trouble, I did the second to die myself), with the inlaws, terminated the trust due to step up in basis on a lot of land.

I've been executor 4 times and I have a bar card and I have a fucking will. No trusts.

Although our probate attorney and the corporate trustee were awesome help.