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Southern CA Fires- Extreme Santa Ana Winds


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  On 1/14/2025 at 3:16 PM, austingirl said:

Watching this, I was most surprised at how slow-moving the fire was and how almost casual everyone seemed (I know they weren't actually casual) - I always imagine scenarios like this happening really quickly with everyone running around like crazy trying to evacuate. How horrible to see it come at you slowly and still not be able to stop it.

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Yeah that's what gives some people the impression that the firefighters aren't doing anything or are 'just watching it burn'. That's because in this situation they're simply trying to keep the fire from spreading, as best they can. In many cases that means 'deck-gunning' (spraying water from the turret-looking nozzle on top of the engine) the burning house from the street while spraying the surrounding exposures in an attempt to keep the fire from spreading to neighboring homes. Once that kind of operation is set up, there isn't much to do except monitor everything.

At a normal house fire, you're going to get 4-10 fire trucks to start with, all dedicated to fighting the fire in that one house (depending on severity, etc), with everyone jumping immediately into action in different roles as soon as they roll up. That cannot happen in this scenario.

Edited by wood
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  On 1/14/2025 at 3:31 PM, SquishMitten said:

I can’t imagine any residential water lines could support every homeowner opening up a high volume line for very long. How far have y’all gotten in scoping out the requirements? I’d be very interested in doing the same in my hood if it’s actually feasible.

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That's what I was thinking. It certainly wouldn't help the firefighters any when they did show up, but I suppose it might help delay or prevent the house from igniting. Another problem is that it's really only going to wet the roof of the house, and that won't keep it from burning.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 6:00 PM, SquishMitten said:

I'm not sure the math works out here. For most folks, those pumps would drain your pool in 1-2 hours max. So it's not like you can just set it and forget it. You'll have to hang around until the fire is literally right on you before you start spraying. At that point, you're going to have trouble breathing, it's going to be insanely hot, difficult to see, etc. Then, if anything goes wrong or you drain your pool and the fire hasn't passed yet, you've most likely lost the ability to evacuate. I think my wife and kids would rather have me around than the house. 

After a little more research, it looks like firefighting resources recommend having 500-1000 gallons per minute (typically by employing 2+ hydrants) to fight a residential fire. You aren't getting anything close to that out of your pool unless you've got multiple pumps. And then you're draining your pool with maybe one lap around your entire house. 

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Yeah I admire the desire to protect y'all's homes, and I get it. We've lived in our house for 23 years. It's the only house we've ever owned. We raised two boys in it and have improved it dramatically over the years ... but that's asking a lot from one untrained person with one 1.5" hose. At 100 psi, the hose & nozzle alone could kill you if it gets away from you. I concur with the idea of getting good insurance, doing your best to fireproof your home well in advance,  getting your most important stuff and gtfo when the shit comes down, and then hoping for the best.

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I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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Shake shingles have been banned in CA for a very long time.  Tile/slate and comp are all we have out here.

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Uh, yeah. Seriously impressive deployment of resources. And the fire still rolls along. Of course it's already been said, but many people out there need to understand that these conditions are historically extreme. This is a natural disaster. Like an earthquake or a hurricane, you're not stopping that. It stops when it stops. This fire will not be extinguished until conditions are favorable for it to be extinguished. We just need to be ready when the conditions favor us. Given the incredible resources being brought to bear, I believe we will be ready.

LAFD-1-13-25.jpg

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  On 1/14/2025 at 8:04 PM, wood said:

Related to that ... one of the best firefighters I ever worked with is a lesbian. She was also the best rookie I ever helped to train. Bad ass chick with a BMF belt buckle. Hiked the entire Appalachian Trail before she became a firefighter. Alone. 0% of the time did I ever have to worry about doing her job and having her shit together. No CR.

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Buddy of mine was AFD for years.  His firehouse was a pure dude-fest, just guys out-machoing each other all the time, it was kinda funny.  And yeah...the two obvious lesbians at his house gave as good as they got.  I'd have been damned happy to see either one of them bust through my door during a fire.  They were BMFs.

But, you know, none of this would have happened if LAFD was made up of entirely white dudes from the 1950s.  True fact, everyone from every conservative vantage point has told us so, so it must be true.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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We must read the same internet.  All this time, I thought screens on vents and chimneys were to prevent hot stuff from getting out, not from getting in.  Presuming of course that the internet is right.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 8:19 PM, shakahorn said:

We must read the same internet.  All this time, I thought screens on vents and chimneys were to prevent hot stuff from getting out, not from getting in.  Presuming of course that the internet is right.

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Attic vent screens aren’t metal.  Screens on a chimney would be.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 8:45 PM, Gatorubet said:

Can anyone verify that the Santa Ana wins today are blowing west rather than east? I’ll hang up and listen. Or fap.  Or both. 

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Weather Underground still shows wind from the west at 4 mph, but predicts them to be out of the north and increasing starting around 8 pm.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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I'm not sure what they do in California, but a prevalent design in Texas is to vent the attic with an air flow from soffit vents which travels up and exits on the roof ridge  vent.

An exterior wood soffit and wood roof trim would burn and then travel rapidly into the attic via the same path as the venting air. It is a pretty vulnerable design for fire.

In the case of these fires, I dont think it matters much.

My own house has a closed attic with a metal roof and I have been considering replacing the wood soffit with hardiboard and flashing the exposed wood.  The rest of the exterior structure is stucco, stone, and exposed concrete with aluminum clad wood windows, so with the improvements, we could probably fend off a wildfire considering there are no other structures close by and minimal trees. You never know though. Fire is like water.  It finds a way.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:54 PM, wood said:

many people out there need to understand that these conditions are historically extreme. 

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hmm, because twitter seems to imply that everybody knew this was coming and we deliberately ignored the signs and also deliberately sabotaged any infrastructure needed to fight these fires which were obviously coming at the time that everybody had marked on their calendar.

it's also weird because since i've lived here (~25 years), everybody always talks about earthquakes and what's going to happen when the "big one" comes. there are real, live, functioning humans that won't live out here "because of the earthquakes".

can't they just let us know when all the historic natural disasters are coming so we know who to vote for and make sure there are no minority groups involved? it's not that complicated.

i blame the weathermen. sorry, "meteorologists".

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  On 1/14/2025 at 9:46 PM, henrygandorf said:

hmm, because twitter seems to imply that everybody knew this was coming and we deliberately ignored the signs and also deliberately sabotaged any infrastructure needed to fight these fires which were obviously coming at the time that everybody had marked on their calendar.

it's also weird because since i've lived here (~25 years), everybody always talks about earthquakes and what's going to happen when the "big one" comes. there are real, live, functioning humans that won't live out here "because of the earthquakes".

can't they just let us know when all the historic natural disasters are coming so we know who to vote for and make sure there are no minority groups involved? it's not that complicated.

i blame the weathermen. sorry, "meteorologists".

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The fires were intentionally set so the UN One World Globalists could built 15 minute cities.  

Duh.

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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Despite having been read on the Internet, this is correct.  One of the first things you should do if there is a fire nearby is to turn off your HVAC system.  We live in pretty much the absolute worst spot in Austin for this type of fire to happen and have folks out to the neighborhood annually for fire prep and training. This is one of the number one things they bring up every time.  The other major one is to not have wooden fencing touching your house.  Fires spread on them like a little highway through the neighborhood.  If you have a wood fence near the structure, go knock it down before you get out of dodge. 

Edited by Samson's Wig
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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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I’ve read the same. You gotta nail some steel siding pieces over them or something 

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  On 1/14/2025 at 7:38 PM, Catpfish said:

I was reading (on the internet, so it has to be right) that many of the homes burned not from embers on the roof, but from embers being drawn into the attic through the airflow vents.  Once inside, there isn't much that could be done.  Does that sound right?  In looking at pictures of houses on fire, many seem to have fire resistant roofs like Spanish tile or composition shingles.  I know that fire resistant does not equal fire proof.

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This is correct. I saw several different videos where the fires started in the attics. 

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REMINDER: Do not give a penny to Red Cross.

 

1. Donate directly to the PP UMC. The funds will be used to help people who lost their homes cover immediate expenses and for the church’s eventual reconstruction. http://www.palisadesmethodist.org/giving

2. Donate to the Los Angeles Fire Recovery Fund through the UMC California Pac Conference. These funds will benefit all the Los Angeles communities suffering in the fires. https://www.calpacumc.org

3. Donate to UMCOR (United Methodist Committee on Relief) for its disaster relief for all the California fires. https://umcmission.org/advance-project/901670/

4. Send donations of e-gift cards (amazon, target, grubhub. etc.) to palisadesmethodist@gmail.com. These will be given to community members who lost their homes and belongings.

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  On 1/15/2025 at 2:41 PM, Beau Vine said:

REMINDER: Do not give a penny to Red Cross.

 

1. Donate directly to the PP UMC. The funds will be used to help people who lost their homes cover immediate expenses and for the church’s eventual reconstruction. http://www.palisadesmethodist.org/giving

2. Donate to the Los Angeles Fire Recovery Fund through the UMC California Pac Conference. These funds will benefit all the Los Angeles communities suffering in the fires. https://www.calpacumc.org

3. Donate to UMCOR (United Methodist Committee on Relief) for its disaster relief for all the California fires. https://umcmission.org/advance-project/901670/

4. Send donations of e-gift cards (amazon, target, grubhub. etc.) to palisadesmethodist@gmail.com. These will be given to community members who lost their homes and belongings.

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Tell me about Red Cross

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  On 1/15/2025 at 2:41 PM, Beau Vine said:

REMINDER: Do not give a penny to Red Cross.

 

1. Donate directly to the PP UMC. The funds will be used to help people who lost their homes cover immediate expenses and for the church’s eventual reconstruction. http://www.palisadesmethodist.org/giving

2. Donate to the Los Angeles Fire Recovery Fund through the UMC California Pac Conference. These funds will benefit all the Los Angeles communities suffering in the fires. https://www.calpacumc.org

3. Donate to UMCOR (United Methodist Committee on Relief) for its disaster relief for all the California fires. https://umcmission.org/advance-project/901670/

4. Send donations of e-gift cards (amazon, target, grubhub. etc.) to palisadesmethodist@gmail.com. These will be given to community members who lost their homes and belongings.

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Why the methodists? I mean, I don't have an issue with them, just wondering why them specifically. What about the Amish?

 

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  On 1/15/2025 at 3:23 PM, freyguy said:

Google their past records on previous disasters.  Very inefficient, corrupt, etc.

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The Red Cross is well known in the DC non-profit community for inefficiency, wasteful spending, and other shady practices.  World Central Kitchen is on the ground in LA if you are looking for a national non-profit with sterling ratings/reviews/reputation and don't have the time/energy to sort through local relief orgs. 

Edited by Bateshorn
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  On 1/15/2025 at 3:37 PM, InkaUtexas said:

I agree, the Red Cross ain't what it appears to be.

But why the Methodists? I saw lots of religious groups do some interesting shit after a disaster overseas.

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I can't speak to the Methodists but, again, based on experience with Harvey, despite what you may think of their beliefs, the LDS seemed to be doing great work on the ground helping people out after a disaster.

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  On 1/15/2025 at 3:32 PM, CHIEF said:

My granddad hated them. Said they had a monopoly on coffee and cigarettes during WWII, and charged out the ass for both. 
 

CHIEF

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Your grandpa and mine must have served in the same unit.  To his dying day, he hated the RC.  Told the story of being in the European theater, massive firefight had just ended.  He's still covered in dirt, smoke, and blood.  RC shows up, offering cigarettes -- yeah, I could really use one.  Then they told him the price, and he told them to fuck off.

  On 1/15/2025 at 3:39 PM, Bateshorn said:

The Red Cross is well known in the DC non-profit community for inefficiency, wasteful spending, and other shady practices.  World Central Kitchen is on the ground in LA if you are looking for a national non-profit with sterling ratings/reviews/reputation and don't have the time/energy to sort through local relief orgs. 

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Yep, we are huge WCK fans.  My wife already sent in our first donation to them.

We really are also looking to get guidance on LOCAL groups, which may well include local churches.  They are often plugged in to direct community needs and, having worked with our local churches for disaster relief and similar needs in Texas, we know personally that it's pretty much a 100 pennies on the dollar go to the cause sort of thing.  And they're generally pretty good at vetting the needs and making sure that people who really need help get the help.  Presbyterian Disaster Relief is a national org, but works directly with local churches.  And I have friends actively involved with both a Catholic and Methodist congregation in PP (the Catholic church burned, I know), so they will know of needs to fill.

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  On 1/15/2025 at 4:16 PM, Pig Bellmont said:

Exactly. Didn’t they have nothing to show for about half a billion of funds in Haiti?

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Hehehe, haiti.... Yeah, everyone else was great. UN, Clinton Foundation, Church Groups. Fucking spectacular.

I would say the international red cross is more effective than the American Red Cross. They are more community vs. national focused.

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