All Things Brisket

[kevwun 15811]

140 is the minimum food safety temp.  For a short time, I wouldn't worry and would be more concerned about it being not warm enough to be at it's best.  I think the bbq places have their warmers set around 145 or 150.  If you don't have a roaster or something big enough that will hold a temp that low, I would throw it in your oven at it's lowest setting which is usually 170.

Edited August 5, 2018 by kevwun

[Mojo Hand 4580]

18 minutes ago, kevwun said:

140 is the minimum food safety temp.  For a short time, I wouldn't worry and would be more concerned about it being not warm enough to be at it's best.  I think the bbq places have their warmers set around 145 or 150.  If you don't have a roaster or something big enough that will hold a temp that low, I would throw it in your oven at it's lowest setting which is usually 170.

Thanks for the info.  Do you mean I should turn the oven on now to a low temp, or leave it off and turn it on when it gets closer to serving time? 

[kevwun 15811]

I would wait until it's actually down to 140 before putting it in the oven.  170 is a little bit hotter than ideal, so you don't want it in the oven any longer than necessary.

Edited August 5, 2018 by kevwun

[dcbc 14496]

Also consider that an oven set to 170 may be running above 200.  Toss a probe on top of the meat or in the meat and cycle on/off accordingly.

[kevwun 15811]

Yeah, that is a good idea if you are willing to baby your oven for awhile.  Won't have to worry about the brisket getting over done.  Next time we get a new oven I am doing some research to find one that does a good job of holding accurate temps.

Edited August 5, 2018 by kevwun

[dcbc 14496]

8 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Yeah, that is a good idea if you are willing to baby your oven for awhile.

I've got these temp controllers I use for holding chest freezers in about a 2 degree range for fermentation.  I have considered using one of them in the cooler hooked up to a heating pad.  A roaster probably is easier, but who knows how accurate the thermostats are on those things. 

I'm mostly overthinking it for the sake of overthinking it.

Edited August 5, 2018 by dcbc

[Mojo Hand 4580]

I was able set my oven to 150, and I still have the probe in, so I'm in good shape.  The brisket had actually dropped to 130, so this info was a big help. 

[BadgerHorn 147]

It's pouring in the DC area.

Mojo, any recommendations for picking up good brisket in NoVA? Very limited and unappealing selections at the places I frequent.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

[Mojo Hand 4580]

17 minutes ago, BadgerHorn said:

 

 

Mojo, any recommendations for picking up good brisket in NoVA? Very limited and unappealing selections at the places I frequent.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
 

 

Costco.   Consistent, good selection of Prime packers for $3.79/lb.   There were a dozen at Pentagon City just a few days ago.   Before I found them at Costco, I went to Union Meat Co. in Eastern Market and paid like $7/lb for Choice, and they kept them in the back so I couldn't even easily choose between what they had.  Another option would be Restaurant Depot; I've never been, but I understand they carry them and you can get free day passes there by joining the Kansas City Barbecue Society. 

But Costco is 100% the way to go. 

[kevwun 15811]

Cross post from the sous vide thread:

 

I need to reheat 2 briskets in a couple of weeks that I made yesterday.  I have an anova sous vide, but the tub I have is not big enough for 1 brisket let alone 2.  Is there a container I can buy that will hold 2 briskets and that my anova can keep at 165?

[GringoSalado 1651]

Igloo?

[kevwun 15811]

Yeah, that is what someone suggested on the other thread.  I have a 48qt that the anova will fit on the lip of.  I believe 165 is the temp I should use, but not sure how long to heat it up for.  2 or 3 hours after it hits the target temp?  I'm also guessing it will be a good idea to pull the briskets out the fridge in advance so they warm up a little bit.

Edited August 12, 2018 by kevwun

[Johnny Sack 8397]

3 hours ago, kevwun said:

Yeah, that is what someone suggested on the other thread.  I have a 48qt that the anova will fit on the lip of.  I believe 165 is the temp I should use, but not sure how long to heat it up for.  2 or 3 hours after it hits the target temp?  I'm also guessing it will be a good idea to pull the briskets out the fridge in advance so they warm up a little bit.

I have a sous vide.  I am wondering if it would even heat up that volume of water regardless of how much time I could let it warm up?

[Gil Bang 25984]

What if you started out at that temperature, using boiling water, etc. Will the device hold the temperature once it was already there?

[kevwun 15811]

I'm gonna put in hot water and probably get it up to temp before I put in the brisket.

[thunderlounge 7893]

[shnsajax 3591]

Anyone recs on a thermometer on Amazon. Have gift cards so was going to go that route and ThermoWorks doesn't appear to be on Amazon. 

[luke duke 6413]

Anyone recs on a thermometer on Amazon. Have gift cards so was going to go that route and ThermoWorks doesn't appear to be on Amazon. 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00UJWPTJ6/

[kevwun 15811]

Thermoworks has a warning at the top of their website not to buy any of their stuff listed on amazon.  They had a big problem with marked up and/or fake merchandise at some point in the past.

[Baboontyme 2815]

That's by far the best rectal thermometer I've ever used but last time I tried it on a brisket temps were off.

[Dr Fear 1268]

36 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Thermoworks has a warning at the top of their website not to buy any of their stuff listed on amazon.  They had a big problem with marked up and/or fake merchandise at some point in the past.

The last two instant reads I have gotten off amazon have been absolute garbage.

[BabaYaga 15302]

Buy once cry once.  Get a real one.  Don't look back

[TXLNGHRN10 341]

I'm pretty happy with this
Thermo Pro TP 20

 

[deft 6859]

Do you guys get “the stall” when using your rectal thermometer too?

[Anastasis 23480]

I use a thermapen and a couple dots. The dots are relatively cheap and I have a bunch of different interchangeable probes for monitoring smoker temp, meat temp, liquid, whatever is required. Except rectums. 

[luke duke 6413]

[shnsajax 3591]

Do you guys get “the stall” when using your rectal thermometer too?

Yes when you stick it between the flat and point.

[Baboontyme 2815]

3 hours ago, deft said:

Do you guys get “the stall” when using your rectal thermometer too?

I don't. But I suspect it might be because the penetration results in some expulsion. I mean that's probably warm, right. 

[Gil Bang 25984]

3 hours ago, deft said:

Do you guys get “the stall” when using your rectal thermometer too?

Is there a "Texas A&M Crutch" for dealing with the stall?

[utee94 15835]

8 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

Is there a "Texas A&M Crutch" for dealing with the stall?

Only when BBQing lamb.

[Horn_Spanker 524]

[VABuckeye 2472]

13 hours ago, luke duke said:

 

IWEI. 

[Dutch 4474]

¥4000 = $36. Can’t imagine it being better then the elite of Texas brisket, but I’d try it if I was ever in Nagoya. 

[luke duke 6413]

 

Did the smokestack fall off?

[Horn_Spanker 524]

59 minutes ago, luke duke said:

 

Did the smokestack fall off?

I was expecting you to say, nice cock.

[ChampKind 1314]

 
Did the smokestack fall off?

It goes up and down. Obviously deflated at the moment

[thunderlounge 7893]

Just now, ChampKind said:

 

It goes up and down. Obviously deflated at the moment

 

So it needs to get wood?

[C-Man 27239]

4 hours ago, Dutch said:

¥4000 = $36. Can’t imagine it being better then the elite of Texas brisket, but I’d try it if I was ever in Nagoya. 

I've had wagyu brisket when Pecan Lodge was still in the Farmer's Market shed. Definitely not worth the substantial price increase over PL's standard brisket IMO.

[Baboontyme 2815]

Question for you guys. I have become a hot and fast convert over the years. I turn out some pretty good brisket at hot temps. I believe Champ cooks regularly at 325 (right?). I think other experienced cooks on here like Luke cook at lower temps. I think I read that AF cooks at 275.

I recently read Vaughn's blog entry about cooking a brisket on the Kettle with his charcoal rings. He makes some assertions in there about how the fat breaks down at lower temps vs. higher temps. 

Do you guys buy this? Have you experimented with both? It's been a long time since I did a low and slow cook. And I know my brisket is good. But I also know that I had brisket at LA BBQ this spring and my shit wasn't nearly as good as that. 

[ChampKind 1314]

Daniel has eaten a lot of brisket so I think its safe to say he has a solid base of experience. And I’ll agree, there is a difference in how fat breaks down at low heat vs high heat. IMO, brisket cooked to the same doneness at lower heat will have a softer texture (vs one cooked to same doneness at high heat). And its simply not to my liking. I eat at Pinkerton’s a fair bit. Grant runs his pits low and slow. And while his brisket is cooked very, very well, I just prefer a little less spongeyness. Taste is so subjective and some folks like brisket one way over another. I prefer to blast them with heat and get a nice tight bark on them. The meat is still very tender and moist, but its not spongey at all.

I’ll be cooking a little closer to 300* when I pick up my new pit. Or at least that’s the plan. I may not have the patience for it though

[dcbc 14496]

1 hour ago, ChampKind said:

Daniel has eaten a lot of brisket so I think its safe to say he has a solid base of experience. And I’ll agree, there is a difference in how fat breaks down at low heat vs high heat. IMO, brisket cooked to the same doneness at lower heat will have a softer texture (vs one cooked to same doneness at high heat). And its simply not to my liking. I eat at Pinkerton’s a fair bit. Grant runs his pits low and slow. And while his brisket is cooked very, very well, I just prefer a little less spongeyness. Taste is so subjective and some folks like brisket one way over another. I prefer to blast them with heat and get a nice tight bark on them. The meat is still very tender and moist, but its not spongey at all.

I’ll be cooking a little closer to 300* when I pick up my new pit. Or at least that’s the plan. I may not have the patience for it though

Do you think low and slow with no wrap might give you the better fat break down without the spongy texture?  I feel like when I don't wrap, I really prefer the results when I keep the temps down and wait out the stall.  When I wrap, I'm more inclined to let the temps rise a little bit to push through.  I've had some good results with skipping the wrap lately, but will be wrapping this weekend just to remember what I've been missing. 

You're running a cabinet smoker, correct?

Edited August 31, 2018 by dcbc

[kevwun 15811]

If you cook a brisket for a really long time with no wrap, they tend to dry out too much.

[dcbc 14496]

53 minutes ago, kevwun said:

If you cook a brisket for a really long time with no wrap, they tend to dry out too much.

My anecdotal experience has been that my no-wrap briskets take about an hour longer to get done than the ones I wrap in butcher paper.  They haven't been dry, thankfully. 

This is my most recent no wrap.

[kevwun 15811]

I'm talking about ridiculously long cooks like 18-24 hours.  I have some friends who have gotten obsessed with cooking that long and I haven't been crazy about their results.

[dcbc 14496]

34 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I'm talking about ridiculously long cooks like 18-24 hours.  I have some friends who have gotten obsessed with cooking that long and I haven't been crazy about their results.

Longest I have gone is 17 hours, and that was wrapped.  Just a stubborn piece of meat.

Supposedly, the original Bodacious in Longview, TX, which pulled the #4 spot on the most recent TXM list smokes its briskets for 24 hours.  I'm close by, but still haven't made it over to try it. 

[Baboontyme 2815]

4 hours ago, ChampKind said:

Daniel has eaten a lot of brisket so I think its safe to say he has a solid base of experience. And I’ll agree, there is a difference in how fat breaks down at low heat vs high heat. IMO, brisket cooked to the same doneness at lower heat will have a softer texture (vs one cooked to same doneness at high heat). And its simply not to my liking. I eat at Pinkerton’s a fair bit. Grant runs his pits low and slow. And while his brisket is cooked very, very well, I just prefer a little less spongeyness. Taste is so subjective and some folks like brisket one way over another. I prefer to blast them with heat and get a nice tight bark on them. The meat is still very tender and moist, but its not spongey at all.

I’ll be cooking a little closer to 300* when I pick up my new pit. Or at least that’s the plan. I may not have the patience for it though

Interesting. He also said something in there about how when cooking high heat the brisket is done closer to 215 but lower it's usually around 205. Thought that was interesting as well. Maybe I'll give a low slow one a roll here soon.

What kind of pit you getting Champ?

[kevwun 15811]

I am starting to get over my obsession with temps.  I used to wrap religiously at 165, but now i go more by color.  Once it gets to 195, I stop paying attention to it's temp and just go for probe feel.  There's just too many variables involved to try to accurately predict what temp it will be done at.

[BabaYaga 15302]

37 minutes ago, dcbc said:

smokes its briskets for 24 hours

For too many, they seem to lob this out as some weird signal of quality.  One place smokes for 20 hours.  Well 'WE' cook for 24 hrs!  So it must be better, etc. 

That's fine, but it's still all about rendering, taste, and texture.  I agree I prefer a little more "pull" from a higher cook.  It's also easier from a time management perspective.  

[utee94 15835]

3 hours ago, kevwun said:

I'm talking about ridiculously long cooks like 18-24 hours.  I have some friends who have gotten obsessed with cooking that long and I haven't been crazy about their results.

I disagreed with you  at first, but with this extra information, yeah I'll tend to agree.

I rarely wrap, and typically cook at 225 although I'm doing 285-300 more often lately thanks to Champ's guidance.  But since I usually go at 225, and don't wrap, I also look for smaller briskets to keep overall cooking time down.  11 pounds is just about right for me.  I'll go up to 12 or 13 if I don't have an option.  Sometimes all you can find is 15# or more, those I cook up at 300 out of necessity.

Even on the smaller ones, I do tend to get less usable meat out of (just the tip) of the flat.  But some folks like those dry crunchy bits, and after the first 1.5 inches of (just the tip) of the flat, it's all good.

I like the texture either way, so that's not really a concern for me, though I do agree that there's at least a slight difference in the two methods.

To make a long answer even longer, for Baboon, I'd say try it out at 225 and see what you get?  It'll still eat.

 

 

[luke duke 6413]

Interesting. He also said something in there about how when cooking high heat the brisket is done closer to 215 but lower it's usually around 205.

This is true