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Federal Worker RTO and Buyout Offers


Anastasis

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MAGA believes that the federal government and the federal employees are the enemy and out to get MAGA. Every action and treatment from the Trump Admin will start with this in mind. Therefore there is no action or lie that is immoral when dealing with a hostile enemy.

Why try to figure out what 20%, or whatever, to cut when you can get them to volunteer to be fired by abandoning their job. Or perhaps Trump doesn’t care if they get paid severance or not, but he will leave that to Congress to fund. Spoiler alert, they won’t.

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This didn't have much thought put into it.  I imagine Elon gave them a 30 second pitch, said it worked at Twitter, got authorization to set up this system to collect email addresses for all federal employees, and sent an identical letter.  The "put 'Resign' in the subject field says enough about how well thought-through this who thing was.  It will yield some resignations though.  They don't care about legality or lawsuits.  That's par for the course for this lot.

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Interesting that this is the one broad issue with most support from voters.

1884364362233598366

61%-35% approve of downsizing Federal govt. Not sure if this is the way to make it happen.

Also, 48-41 approve of immigration policy. So, he would be wise to focus on these, but he won't. Scorched Earth is his way.

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There are always people resigning or retiring every day. For that small percentage, there would be little risk in taking this offer but their hr rep most likely won’t be able to provide guidance if there is an impact to retirement compensation. I imagine govt hr has no idea about this offer or what it means.

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Just now, The Original Greaser Bob said:

I'm curious why many of you think that the retiring feds would get screwed out of their payment?  Tiny price to pay to shrink the payroll -- most of the younger folks would find another job and be more likely to vote Republican next cycle.  Congress would gladly fund it.

Why do you believe that Trump and Elon would stick to their word? Past history says they don’t.

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1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Why do you believe that Trump and Elon would stick to their word? Past history says they don’t.

Do you have any evidence that either offered a severance package or an exit incentive and then didn't pay it?  Certainly that would be easy to find for Elon.

This is completely win-win for the Trump Administration.  

 

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4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

If you dump federal employees, who knows the consequences.

Sounds like we really should start the process for getting my son his passport.  We don't have immediate plans to travel internationally, but we may go to Mexico this summer.  The time to get a passport appointment in Dallas is already backed up.  Then possibly throw in tens of thousands of federal employees quitting en masse with no backfill? Things might screech to a halt.  As designed.

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34 minutes ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

I'm curious why many of you think that the retiring feds would get screwed out of their payment?  Tiny price to pay to shrink the payroll -- most of the younger folks would find another job and be more likely to vote Republican next cycle.  Congress would gladly fund it.

That offer came anonymously from an office that has no authority to offer it and in a way completely out of line with how the federal government handle any personnel action.  A better question is why anyone would think it is valid. 

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39 minutes ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

Do you have any evidence that either offered a severance package or an exit incentive and then didn't pay it?  Certainly that would be easy to find for Elon.

This is completely win-win for the Trump Administration.  

 

The win-win for Trump is if many take the offer and he fires them without paying them. 

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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6 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

That offer came anonymously from an office that has no authority to offer it and in a way completely out of line with how the federal government handle any personnel action.  A better question is why anyone would think it is valid. 

I guess I'm focused more on the actual idea of the buyout than the "validity" of any communication. 

If it purports to come from management, then any employee relying on it would likely have a case for detrimental reliance. 

I will agree that there is probably no limit to how much Trump can fuck someone over.  I'm more focused on all the things that we clearly have evidence that he's fucked someone over.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

The win-win for Trump is if many take the offer and he fires them without paying them. 

Okay, and then maybe he'll kill all the jews, too.

But that's not the debate I'm interested in.  That's more of a leopards eating faces kind of thing.  And I'll leave it to that thread in a couple of weeks.

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33 minutes ago, Jive Turkey said:

Sounds like we really should start the process for getting my son his passport.  We don't have immediate plans to travel internationally, but we may go to Mexico this summer.  The time to get a passport appointment in Dallas is already backed up.  Then possibly throw in tens of thousands of federal employees quitting en masse with no backfill? Things might screech to a halt.  As designed.

Same here. Yay???

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Last summer, a federal court dismissed claims against Musk alleging that X failed to pay $500M in severance pay.

Quote
According to the complaint, Twitter's severance plan called for employees who stayed on after the buyout to receive two or six months of pay, plus one week of pay for each year of employment, if they were laid off.
The plaintiffs Courtney McMillian, who oversaw Twitter's compensation and benefits, and Ronald Cooper, an operations manager, said Twitter instead offered fired employees just one month of pay as severance, with no benefits.

 Federal judge found that ERISA "did not cover the former employees' claims, and therefore she lacked jurisdiction." 

Quote
Thompson said ERISA did not apply to Twitter's post-buyout plan because there was no "ongoing administrative scheme" where the company reviewed claims case-by-case, or offered benefits such as continued health insurance and out placement services.
"There were only cash payments promised," she wrote.

Case is now on appeal to the Ninth Circuit.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/elon-musk-beats-500-million-severance-lawsuit-by-fired-twitter-workers-2024-07-10/

Musk may absolutely be legally correct in the X case. But it doesn't change the perception that Musk and OPM may try to screw over employees who accept this deal.

 

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8 minutes ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

I guess I'm focused more on the actual idea of the buyout than the "validity" of any communication. 

If it purports to come from management, then any employee relying on it would likely have a case for detrimental reliance. 

I will agree that there is probably no limit to how much Trump can fuck someone over.  I'm more focused on all the things that we clearly have evidence that he's fucked someone over.

I don't have any problem with the general idea of a buyout but I don't think the best method is for the top of the organization to offer buyouts to 100% of the workforce. Seems a bit manic to do so.

 

56 minutes ago, raw dog said:

Interesting that this is the one broad issue with most support from voters.

https://x.com/jamesoliphant/status/1884364362233598366

61%-35% approve of downsizing Federal govt. Not sure if this is the way to make it happen.

Also, 48-41 approve of immigration policy. So, he would be wise to focus on these, but he won't. Scorched Earth is his way.

I bet if I polled Americans if they wanted more daylight hours throughout the year, a majority of Americans would support it.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don't have any problem with the general idea of a buyout but I don't think the best method is for the top of the organization to offer buyouts to 100% of the workforce. Seems a bit manic to do so.

Not wanting to sidetrack too much, but it's kind of hard to limit the offer without it raising possible discrimination claims.

You want the people who most want out to leave.  You want the people who want to stay to stay.

I was a fed for eight years.  Some very fine people.  But some people that are mailing it in, just like any large organization.  

 

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3 minutes ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

Not wanting to sidetrack too much, but it's kind of hard to limit the offer without it raising possible discrimination claims.

You want the people who most want out to leave.  You want the people who want to stay to stay.

I was a fed for eight years.  Some very fine people.  But some people that are mailing it in, just like any large organization.  

 

Most likely the best workers would take the offer because they're confident they can find employment elsewhere. The worst of the worst are the ones who will stay. The people you mention who are mailing it in.

I've never heard of voluntary buyouts being a benefit from an efficiency standpoint. And as a citizen I only care about the efficiency. Personally I don't care about govt costs especially as I get older.

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie
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9 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don't have any problem with the general idea of a buyout but I don't think the best method is for the top of the organization to offer buyouts to 100% of the workforce. Seems a bit manic to do so.

And a bit fucking heartless to send a text message to people with years of service that basically says, "I want to break up.  If you agree, check this box."

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19 hours ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

It will certainly make drowning the government in the bathtub more manageable.

 

17 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

They don’t care if important personnel to leave. They don’t want them there. But getting them to leave voluntarily, they can replace them with loyalists and it reduces any lawsuits they’d face from wrongful termination of some sort. several people have said this is illegal. 
 

now if they don’t pay the severance, I don’t know what happens. 
 

 

 

This is the long term play, I think. People take the offer, oops, we need to rehire a bunch of people, those rehires are loyalists who will back ThE DOtArd when he becomes president for life. 

 

 

1 hour ago, dcbc said:

This didn't have much thought put into it.  I imagine Elon gave them a 30 second pitch, said it worked at Twitter, got authorization to set up this system to collect email addresses for all federal employees, and sent an identical letter.  The "put 'Resign' in the subject field says enough about how well thought-through this who thing was.  It will yield some resignations though.  They don't care about legality or lawsuits.  That's par for the course for this lot.

 

Anybody stupid enough to trust Elmo and DOAtarD  and take this "deal" gets no sympathy from me. I'm all out. 

 

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43 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Most likely the best workers would take the offer because they're confident they can find employment elsewhere. The worst of the worst are the ones who will stay. The people you mention who are mailing it in.

I've never heard of voluntary buyouts being a benefit from an efficiency standpoint. And as a citizen I only care about the efficiency. Personally I don't care about govt costs especially as I get older.

The benefit of the buyout is usually morale.

This administration is not concerned about efficiency - they might be if they end up deciding that the particular agency should sitll exist with a skeleton crew.

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2 hours ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

Do you have any evidence that either offered a severance package or an exit incentive and then didn't pay it?  Certainly that would be easy to find for Elon.

This is completely win-win for the Trump Administration.  

 

Elon offered 3-6 months of severances for those who were hit by the main Twitter layoff in 2023. Elon then gave them 1 month a few months later. Dared them to sue.

 

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2 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

Last summer, a federal court dismissed claims against Musk alleging that X failed to pay $500M in severance pay.

 Federal judge found that ERISA "did not cover the former employees' claims, and therefore she lacked jurisdiction." 

Case is now on appeal to the Ninth Circuit.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/elon-musk-beats-500-million-severance-lawsuit-by-fired-twitter-workers-2024-07-10/

Musk may absolutely be legally correct in the X case. But it doesn't change the perception that Musk and OPM may try to screw over employees who accept this deal.

 

That dismissal is dealing with a very specific issue. The plaintiffs in that case chose to bring their case as a claims under ERISA as opposed to a breach of contract action. There is a separate class action covering essentially the same conduct that is pending in Delaware, except those plaintiffs didn't pursue their case under ERISA. It isn't a holding that Musk did nothing wrong or that the Plaintiffs aren't owed anything. It just says that the case would not be governed or covered by ERISA. 

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5 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Elon offered 3-6 months of severances for those who were hit by the main Twitter layoff in 2023. Elon then gave them 1 month a few months later. Dared them to sue.

Not really.   He said he'd to honor Twitter's prior severance plan and then broke an oral promise to do so.  That case that attempted to say that the promise created an ERISA plan.

I'm not assuming that anything is offered until the employees are provided some written document that promises the specific pay.

Is Trump a liar and full of shit? Agree with you.

Am I going to automatically assume that any deal an employee takes is unenforceable?  No. 

Because I haven't seen the deal.

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7 minutes ago, The Original Greaser Bob said:

Not really.   He said he'd to honor Twitter's prior severance plan and then broke an oral promise to do so.  That case that attempted to say that the promise created an ERISA plan.

I'm not assuming that anything is offered until the employees are provided some written document that promises the specific pay.

Is Trump a liar and full of shit? Agree with you.

Am I going to automatically assume that any deal an employee takes is unenforceable?  No. 

Because I haven't seen the deal.

Says a lot that the worlds wealthiest man that he won’t honor a promise that he made to people as he fired them. Then wants to walk it back that his promise isnt enforceable. And Trump has a lifetime of broken contracts with small businesses who can’t afford to sue him.

if those two send an email promising 8 months severance if I reply with “Resign” and stop showing up/dialing into work, there is zero chance this promise will be met. 

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8 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

Sounds like we really should start the process for getting my son his passport.  We don't have immediate plans to travel internationally, but we may go to Mexico this summer.  The time to get a passport appointment in Dallas is already backed up.  Then possibly throw in tens of thousands of federal employees quitting en masse with no backfill? Things might screech to a halt.  As designed.

Use an expeditor you’ll get it in a few weeks. 

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The bureaucracy needs to be scaled down. Eggs will get broken along the way. Some shit will suck. Deal with it. People in the private sector go through this every  couple years on average. Promises made wrt pensions should be kept. Outside of that it’s a generous package and if you don’t think so you are probably operating in an alternate .gov universe. 

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11 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

if those two send an email promising 8 months severance if I reply with “Resign” and stop showing up/dialing into work, there is zero chance this promise will be met. 

If that happens, we can discuss.

Fork in the Road

Doesn't look like any promises made.

Edited by The Original Greaser Bob
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5 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

The bureaucracy needs to be scaled down. Eggs will get broken along the way. Some shit will suck. Deal with it. People in the private sector go through this every  couple years on average. Promises made wrt pensions should be kept. Outside of that it’s a generous package and if you don’t think so you are probably operating in an alternate .gov universe. 

Idiot. 

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I would put “Re-Sign” in the subject line, state my new pay, bonus structure, work conditions (remote) and see if any reaction. Throw a fit if wrongly included.

Its so clear nobody checked with lawyers (worth a damn) and compliance on this.

Edited by StassneyHorn
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How many private sector RIFs have you weathered?

My former company was as doing project for Microsoft. We had 50ish people working 17+ hours a day / 7 days a week to deliver an ambitious milestone. We delivered every bit of the contract and much more.

Because of some internal politics they ended up refusing to pay and cancel the project. There response for not paying the milestone was “sue us, lol”

50 people lost their jobs the next day

https://kotaku.com/how-a-small-game-studio-almost-made-it-big-1696997142
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On 1/28/2025 at 7:43 PM, 956 Worldwide said:

As you work through it…it’s not a buyout, they are keeping people on payrolls and in employed status, just not requiring work. 

Being paid to not work seems pretty inefficient.

Where is DOGE on this?

Edited by Superhero
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9 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

Sounds like we really should start the process for getting my son his passport.  We don't have immediate plans to travel internationally, but we may go to Mexico this summer.  The time to get a passport appointment in Dallas is already backed up.

My daughter needed a renewal just before Christmas.

We made an appointment for the UT office on Nueces as soon as we could -- which was the next morning.  Walked in with paperwork filled out.  No wait because we had an appointment.  Walked out 15 minutes later with an estimated delivery date of mid-February.

The new passport arrived Jan 10th.

Thanks Biden!

BTW they don't take credit cards ... bring your checkbook or a money order if you have to go in.  Most adults can renew online and pay via credit card, but not if you are in person.

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There is a circle K on Hayden Rd in Scottsdale AZ that has nothing but former Microsoft employees run the place while they develop their new “game changing” series . It’s at least 3 guys running this place who don’t need to work at all, but have a passion after being layed off. I loved them. You’d walk into this corner store and hear nothing but Halo stories/novels read over the speakers and you could talk to them for minutes on end and drink inside if you were bored.

 

layer not played edit

Edited by StassneyHorn
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1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

The bureaucracy needs to be scaled down. Eggs will get broken along the way. Some shit will suck. Deal with it. People in the private sector go through this every  couple years on average. Promises made wrt pensions should be kept. Outside of that it’s a generous package and if you don’t think so you are probably operating in an alternate .gov universe. 

And you trust anyone currently in charge to see this through in a way that ultimately proves efficient and beneficial? Dear lord.

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19 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

And you trust anyone currently in charge to see this through in a way that ultimately proves efficient and beneficial? Dear lord.

No one said anything about any of that shit. Shit's got to change. Establishment Ds and Rs had many chances over your lifetime to course correct. Now you get the clown that is just going to break things. And hopefully the world still revolves around it's axis. And if it doesn't hopefully something better comes along to replace it. 

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