Brett Kavanaugh Confirmation Thread

[David Dennison 18,828]

1 minute ago, AtticusFinch said:

He can't.   Any lawyer knows this.  There is no evidence to disprove her statements.   Regardless, you have made up your mind and wouldnt believe otherwise unless she recanted her story.  Same goes for all the idealogues out there

But there is a whole lot of evidence that he's lied to Congress.

[Celery Man 20,923]

9 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

I think you might be on to something here, though I think it's probably a bit more nuanced and subtle than your outlay here (as most things are versus what you post, no offense).

But if modern history tells us anything, don't count us white, cisgendered, patriarchal, judeo-christian heteronormative men out just yet  

the "white men" thing is I think fair in DC, in the country it's flyover white folk feeling maligned and disenfranchised.  They're wrong about being disenfranchised, but they're also in control over the shit they're maligned for.

[David Dennison 18,828]

Just now, AtticusFinch said:

Factually, it's the same thing

No, it isn't.

[seven 1,367]

What is oatmeals evidence that she's lying as part of a liberal democrat conspiracy to smear an honorable man who just happens to lie under oath a lot? 

[Johnny Sack 8,397]

18 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

So can we talk about recusals for a minute? What are the past precedents related to individual SCOTUS recusals, and what if any implications are there based on the political tirade that Kavanaugh dove into during his testimony last week?

You think Ruth should recuse on any issue involving Trump then?  Based on what she publicly said about him?

[RomaVicta 29,884]

13 minutes ago, AtticusFinch said:

White men are evil.  Kill the white man.

White men seem prone to hyperbole.

[David Dennison 18,828]

Just now, Johnny Sack said:

You think Ruth should recuse on any issue involving Trump then?  Based on what she publicly said about him?

Which is?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,367]

Grassley is mad.

[tantric superman 4,667]

Can I just say this -- I maybe said it before so apologize if I did.

Everyone is entitled to their own mental quirks, and the damage they may have suffered.  But the reason we are here is because Ford didn't bring this matter up early.  One can blame lots of things, but but for the delay, this would have been handled better on all fronts, and K. might not have been nominated.  No matter who you are pissed at or  blame for this deal, it comes down to the brutal march of time, and the idea that failure to act is its own type of injustice, whether intentional or not.

In that sense, Ford's delay was an injustice, forgivable perhaps, against all of us.

[David Dennison 18,828]

Just now, RomaVicta said:

White men seem prone to hyperbole.

And fear. Scared little rabbits. 

[AtticusFinch 155]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

But there is a whole lot of evidence that he's lied to Congress.

Let them bring perjury charges

[RomaVicta 29,884]

12 minutes ago, AtticusFinch said:

It's odd you dont see a problem with the fact she cant recall any key details about the event or her corroborating witnesses said it never happened

Negged for lying. The witnesses say they don't remember. One says that she believes Ford.

[David Dennison 18,828]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Grassley is mad.

They still don't have the votes.

LOL

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,367]

Just now, tantric superman said:

Can I just say this -- I maybe said it before so apologize if I did.

Everyone is entitled to their own mental quirks, and the damage they may have suffered.  But the reason we are here is because Ford didn't bring this matter up early.  One can blame lots of things, but but for the delay, this would have been handled better on all fronts, and K. might not have been nominated.  No matter who you are pissed at or  blame for this deal, it comes down to the brutal march of time, and the idea that failure to act is its own type of injustice, whether intentional or not.

In that sense, Ford's delay was an injustice, forgivable perhaps, against all of us.

She came forward before Kavanaugh was nominated 

[Anastasis 23,447]

Just now, Johnny Sack said:

You think Ruth should recuse on any issue involving Trump then?  Based on what she publicly said about him?

I asked what the precedent was, but if you are asking my opinion, I would suggest that a judge who has a conflict of interest, or has made public statements suggesting that they are incapable of being impartial wrt certain cases should recuse themselves.

[AtticusFinch 155]

Just now, tantric superman said:

Can I just say this -- I maybe said it before so apologize if I did.

Everyone is entitled to their own mental quirks, and the damage they may have suffered.  But the reason we are here is because Ford didn't bring this matter up early.  One can blame lots of things, but but for the delay, this would have been handled better on all fronts, and K. might not have been nominated.  No matter who you are pissed at or  blame for this deal, it comes down to the brutal march of time, and the idea that failure to act is its own type of injustice, whether intentional or not.

In that sense, Ford's delay was an injustice, forgivable perhaps, against all of us.

She actually did bring it up early.  Feinstein withheld it.  

[David Dennison 18,828]

Just now, AtticusFinch said:

Let them bring perjury charges

The Democrats can't.

Yet.

[David Dennison 18,828]

16 minutes ago, AtticusFinch said:

White men are evil.  Kill the white man.

Kill the straw man.

[Anastasis 23,447]

Just now, tantric superman said:

Can I just say this -- I maybe said it before so apologize if I did.

Everyone is entitled to their own mental quirks, and the damage they may have suffered.  But the reason we are here is because Ford didn't bring this matter up early.  One can blame lots of things, but but for the delay, this would have been handled better on all fronts, and K. might not have been nominated.  No matter who you are pissed at or  blame for this deal, it comes down to the brutal march of time, and the idea that failure to act is its own type of injustice, whether intentional or not.

In that sense, Ford's delay was an injustice, forgivable perhaps, against all of us.

I agree with this take regarding the timing turning it into a circus, but I wouldn't hang it around Ford's head, I would hang it around Feinstein's.  This entire circus could have been avoided if we had a functional senate committee and non-toxic political environment. 

Edited October 4, 2018 by Anastasis

[tantric superman 4,667]

1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

She came forward before Kavanaugh was nominated 

I'm my argument was about days or weeks, that would be relevant.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Ledge seems to be getting crowded these days.  But there's still room, pull up a chair.

And yes, you get it, that's the point. The entire system, and all of our institutions, are being irrevocably broken.  A trustworthy representative democracy, with the buy-in of the people, is an incredibly fragile thing. It always is.  But it still amazes me how many people don't realize that until a bumbling autocrat wannabe like DOTUS and his spineless minions gleefully smash it on the floor, and dance on the pieces.

This is EXACTLY how a representative republic dies.  Every single thing this regime is doing is following the playbook.  It's a playbook that's existed for centuries, and it's being followed to the letter.

Congress is a non-functional entity to protect the people.

The executive branch is actively conspiring against the people.

And the SCOTUS will be a broken body with limited credibility and a newly installed toadie to do the bidding of the admin and its minions, protecting them from all legal consequences.

 

There are only two ways for power to be exercised in any human society: the rule of law, or the rule of the fist/gun.  When the rule of law is neutered so as to become ineffective, society naturally transitions to other means of asserting its interests -- all factions, those in power, those out of power.  Our society is only as stable as people's belief in its functionality.  That's being killed.  By a large segment of our society.  With glee.

 

More scotch is needed.

Let’s take a look at recent history. I’m sure you lay blame at the feet of the GOP ENTIRELY. Who broke Senate norms during the Supreme Court nomination process. Could that be Ted Kennedy DEMOCRAT. Remember the “high tech” lynching of Clarence Thomas. Another DEMOCRAT plot. How about more recently. Arrogant Obama couldn’t advance his agenda legislatively and resorts to using executive orders more than any other President in history. You don’t think that now we are in power that we’re not going fight back and overturn Obama’s excesses. Stacking the SC with friendly justices will be a bulwark against the next Democratic President who doesn’t have the pull in Congress to rule by fiat. Remember it was progressives who politicized the courts in the first place. We’re doing everything to try to maintain what was intended. Brisket needs to play the violin. Shit has been far worse at other times in this country’s history.

[JimmyJames 12,271]

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Grassley is mad.

About what? 

[tantric superman 4,667]

3 minutes ago, AtticusFinch said:

She actually did bring it up early.  Feinstein withheld it.  

I'm talking sometime between when it happened and, oh, when he was first nominated as a judge. 

[AtticusFinch 155]

18 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I understand his response.  But it also should disqualify him. 

Why?  Anger is a healthy emotion as is expressing it.

[Caddox 952]

So not only will Kavanuagh get confirmed but the republican voter base has a 12 point increase in a voter enthusiasm poll conducted by NPR/amherst. Dems have played this horribly. 

[AtticusFinch 155]

Just now, tantric superman said:

I'm talking sometime between when it happened and, oh, when he was first nominated as a judge. 

That would make too much sense.  You are in the wrong thread

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,367]

2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I agree with this take regarding the timing turning it into a circus, but I wouldn't hang it around Ford's head, I would hang it around Feinstein's.  This entire circus could have been avoided if we had a functional senate committee and non-toxic political environment. 

If you’re going to blame Feinstein, you need to be able to explain what she should have done in her situation.

I’m not saying she’s innocent but she was in a no win situation too with regards to keeping Dr. Ford’s confidentiality.

[Chad Fuck 17,639]

Just now, AtticusFinch said:

Why?  Anger is a healthy emotion as is expressing it.

Anger negates the ability to reason.

The primary job requirement for the position is reason.

[David Dennison 18,828]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I agree with this take, but I wouldn't hang it around Ford's head, I would hang it around Feinstein's.  This entire circus could have been avoided if we had a functional senate committee and non-toxic political environment. 

 I'd blame Mitch McConnell for this whole mess.

[pyrohornIII 4,814]

42 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

But I don't believe in absolute democracy.  I believe in the representative republic, with three branches of institutional government, that we organized under the Constitution.  That's something that protects against governance by the whim of the people and/or tyranny of the majority.  That's a good principle to have no matter which "side" is in power as of a given moment.

This.  If we have anything close to a 50/50 nation and election, and govern only for the extremes, then we lurch from guardrail to guardrail, smashing into them with increasing force until we eventually break through and go over the edge.  I don't mind if we periodically drift into the right lane.  I don't mind if we periodically drift into the left lane. So long as we stay in a lane and on the road.  The government governs ALL the people.  Right now, we have created a mindset that there are two classes of citizens: the victorious and the subjugated.  That is anathema to our system, and is a recipe for destruction from within.  And the currently "victorious" are celebrating that with glee.  I don't want the subjugated to become the victors, and make the same play (although goddamn, it's really hard to fight that temptation a lot of times, and I do give in to it).  I want the governed to be the governed -- for the benefit of "we the people."

But, I ain't getting what I wished for.  The die has been cast.  Lurching from guardrail to guardrail is the only future we have in front of us....

I agree with this.  I would say though that the whole liberal vs conservative arguments are a smokescreen for what is really going on which is the making of money and the manipulation of the government to further that goal.  It's not our concepts (left/right) that are going to kill our nation, but the greed for power and/or money. 

I like your driving down the road analogy, but I'm pretty sure our destination has become muddled.    I think after WW2 we were able to use the Marshall Plan to build this image of Big Brother/Policeman to the rest of the world.   Battling the evil communist movement.  I know that arguments exist that we used that cloak of goodwill to basically rape smaller defenseless countries, but still at home a lot of Americans were hearing only the good things, the Red Cross, Unicef, poaching defense funds, the sally struthers adopt a kid thing.   And that largesse was in our own country.  Cal Farley's Boys Ranch was an annual check.  We felt good, because we had full plates, and we shared.   That is what made America great, not isolationism, not bullying your allies and cozying up to old nemeses.    But that is what Trump is saying, and people are buying into it.  Their plates aren't full anymore, though not many of them look to be starving. 

So yeah, I am not sure what road we are on anymore...where we are headed, or want to be headed.  Regardless though, through all the muddle someone who doesn't need anymore money is making money through all this.  Lots of money. 

Until we get serious campaign reform in place, we are destined to watch our representative republic die a slow death.

 

 

[seven 1,367]

Love when trump supporters call Obama arrogant

[AtticusFinch 155]

1 minute ago, Caddox said:

So not only will Kavanuagh get confirmed but the republican voter base has a 12 point increase in a voter enthusiasm poll conducted by NPR/amherst. Dems have played this horribly. 

It's a good thing when the left expresses themselves

[David Dennison 18,828]

3 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

Let’s take a look at recent history. I’m sure you lay blame at the feet of the GOP ENTIRELY. Who broke Senate norms during the Supreme Court nomination process. Could that be Ted Kennedy DEMOCRAT. Remember the “high tech” lynching of Clarence Thomas. Another DEMOCRAT plot. How about more recently. Arrogant Obama couldn’t advance his agenda legislatively and resorts to using executive orders more than any other President in history. You don’t think that now we are in power that we’re not going fight back and overturn Obama’s excesses. Stacking the SC with friendly justices will be a bulwark against the next Democratic President who doesn’t have the pull in Congress to rule by fiat. Remember it was progressives who politicized the courts in the first place. We’re doing everything to try to maintain what was intended. Brisket needs to play the violin. Shit has been far worse at other times in this country’s history.

You are just begging the next Democratic White House and Senate to pack the court.

[hayden_horn 11,362]

1 minute ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

Let’s take a look at recent history. I’m sure you lay blame at the feet of the GOP ENTIRELY. Who broke Senate norms during the Supreme Court nomination process. Could that be Ted Kennedy DEMOCRAT. Remember the “high tech” lynching of Clarence Thomas. Another DEMOCRAT plot. How about more recently. Arrogant Obama couldn’t advance his agenda legislatively and resorts to using executive orders more than any other President in history. You don’t think that now we are in power that we’re not going fight back and overturn Obama’s excesses. Stacking the SC with friendly justices will be a bulwark against the next Democratic President who doesn’t have the pull in Congress to rule by fiat. Remember it was progressives who politicized the courts in the first place. We’re doing everything to try to maintain what was intended. Brisket needs to play the violin. Shit has been far worse at other times in this country’s history.

lulz you can't even get your facts correct, you stooge. who had more executive orders, obama or george w bush? or bill clinton? or ronald fucking reagan? or jimmy carter? or richard millhouse nixon? or LBJ? or eisenhower? or truman, or roosevelt or hoover?

god, it hurts seeing someone be so willfully stupid.

[Johnny Sack 8,397]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If you’re going to blame Feinstein, you need to be able to explain what she should have done in her situation.

I’m not saying she’s innocent but she was in a no win situation too with regards to keeping Dr. Ford’s confidentiality.

The Senate Committee has a procedure for confidential investigations.  Were you asleep last Thursday?  It was only mentioned 100 times. 

[Pancho 44,665]

16 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

Lot of homophobic comments directed my way. I don’t think that it makes a very conducive place for discussion for our LGBT members 

Neither you nor the other Republicans/Conservatives give a shit about LGBT people here or in elsewhere. 

Just shut up. 

[Bateshorn 9,922]

This morning, for a moment, I thought all of this was some sort of McConnell master plan, whereby Kavanaugh would be defeated, there would be a fresh nomination, and we'd fight for the rest of the month and the GOP would be all fired up in November.  Now this thing looks like it's going to end with a 51-49 or 52-48 on Saturday, and Trump will spout off for a couple of days, then he'll do something stupid and in two weeks, we will be back to where we were. 

It's just......fucking weird.

[Anastasis 23,447]

Just now, David Dennison said:

 I'd blame Mitch McConnell for this whole mess.

I blame Scalia's ticker timing out in west texas. 

[Tom 2,959]

Just now, AtticusFinch said:

Factually, it's the same thing

No, it's really not.  There were two people in the room where it happened and they were the attackers.  One was not interviewed and the FBI was blocked from questioning either of them.

She didnt remember all of the details but she remembered many.  The right and Trump are exaggerating the amount of things she didnt know while mocking her.  I've been to parties in my adult life that I couldn't tell you now which house or street they were on, and I didnt even get raped there.  I've been to friend gatherings in the past few years where I probably couldn't name ever single person there.  

And quit being melodramatic by claiming people are trying to destroy his life.  He is not on any kind of criminal trial.  He's not going to lose his freedom or go to jail over this.  It's about deciding whether or not to consider him for one of the most important jobs in the country and nothing more.  Considering he's committed perjury half a dozen times in the process and has proven to be a hyper partisan party hack, the answer in a world where conservatives have any dignity whatsoever would be a resounding no, he is not qualified for the job.

[David Dennison 18,828]

2 minutes ago, Caddox said:

So not only will Kavanuagh get confirmed but the republican voter base has a 12 point increase in a voter enthusiasm poll conducted by NPR/amherst. Dems have played this horribly. 

Oh, sweetie. November is going to be a bloodbath for Republicans.

[Chad Fuck 17,639]

Just now, Bateshorn said:

This morning, for a moment, I thought all of this was some sort of McConnell master plan, whereby Kavanaugh would be defeated, there would be a fresh nomination, and we'd fight for the rest of the month and the GOP would be all fired up in November.  Now this thing looks like it's going to end with a 51-49 or 52-48 on Saturday, and Trump will spout off for a couple of days, then he'll do something stupid and in two weeks, we will be back to where we were. 

It's just......fucking weird.

Murcah 2018!

[AtticusFinch 155]

1 minute ago, Chad Fuck said:

Anger negates the ability to reason.

The primary job requirement for the position is reason.

Supreme court justices get in fights over cases all the time.  Should we disqualify them all?  

[JimmyJames 12,271]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

I blame Scalia's ticker timing out in west texas. 

I’m wondering where ted Cruz’s dad was on that day. Has that ever been confirmed? 

[RomaVicta 29,884]

4 minutes ago, AtticusFinch said:

She actually did bring it up early.  Feinstein withheld it.  

Ford wanted to get her story to the White House in a discreet manner. She went through her congresswoman and senator on the condition that the letter she wanted to submit be kept in confidence. Feinstein honored that request.

It seems very clear that Ford's ideal process would have been for the White House/FBI to get her story and make their decision not requiring Ford to go public. She wasn't out to get Kavanaugh because she felt the cost to her would be too great.

The efforts were all in good faith. The story broke from a source other than the letter in Feinstein's hands, so the cat was out of the bag.

Her story deserved to be heard by decision makers. It's clear she would have been glad to limit the audience to her story to those persons.

No conspiracy. No con job. No wicked intent.

Just GOP projection.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,367]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

The Senate Committee has a procedure for confidential investigations.  Were you asleep last Thursday?  It was only mentioned 100 times. 

Yeah, the procedure it to report to the ruling party.  Because the Republicans would have been so trustworthy with Dr Ford’s privacy 

[Johnny Sack 8,397]

2 minutes ago, Pancho Negro said:

Neither you nor the other Republicans/Conservatives give a shit about LGBT people here or in elsewhere. 

Just shut up. 

I was pro gay marriage long before Hillary and Obama.  

[MixtyMotions 102]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If you’re going to blame Feinstein, you need to be able to explain what she should have done in her situation.

I’m not saying she’s innocent but she was in a no win situation too with regards to keeping Dr. Ford’s confidentiality.

Easy.  Had Ford interviewed in confidence by the FBI.  In early August.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,498]

54 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

Ha.  I wonder if someone ran the math and that if every Dem senator wanted to read the report themselves,  McConnell wouldn’t be able to call for a vote for a few more days.   I thought the procedure was one senator at a time.  Sounds like they can’t even stick to their own rules.

[AtticusFinch 155]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

Oh, sweetie. November is going to be a bloodbath for Republicans.

Not in the Senate.   Probably in the House

[Incredulity 11,631]

4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If you’re going to blame Feinstein, you need to be able to explain what she should have done in her situation.

I’m not saying she’s innocent but she was in a no win situation too with regards to keeping Dr. Ford’s confidentiality.

She should have disclosed it to the comitee who could have investigated it privately.  That happens ALL THE TIME.