Jacksonville Madden Shooting

[Bullneck 19231]

1 minute ago, slorch said:

Patrol the road more and make the fines as extreme as the crime necessitates, but we aren't taking people's cars away, right?

 

What I said in my original email was that the legal speed limit was too high.  So lower the legal speed limit so that you can drive the road safely with the law.  

 

 

1 minute ago, slorch said:

 

I am in support of extreme legislation towards CRIMES committed with guns.  That does not include simple possession.

By the time a crime has been committed someone has been killed.  

[SmokeyTheBear 5568]

I'm all for the good ol days of western shoot outs. Everyone carry a gun and let the bullets sort it all out. That's the only solution. 

[Lurch 5932]

Ok, I understand background checks, I understand mag caps. I still don’t understand the assault rifle thing. If it’s ammunition related, address the ammunition. But to me, an AR-15 with a 15 round mag and a glock with a 15 round mag are the same thing, if they’re shooting the same ammo.  Maybe assault rifles are easier to mod into full auto?  The pistol is the one that’s easy to conceal. 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4043345/ar-15-handgun-bullet-wounds-difference/

[MNLonghornFUKM 8823]

This is the ultimate rage quit.

[Pato del Muerto 52638]

1 hour ago, Lurch said:

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/4043345/ar-15-handgun-bullet-wounds-difference/

 

So yes, it’s the rounds and not the gun, per your link. So deal with the cartridges. High velocity hunting cartridges only load as 5 round mags or something. 

Someone wants to buy an AR-15 style gun that shoots 9mm, it should have the same freedoms and restrictions as a 9mm pistol. 

[Jkwellborn 6750]

More of the same gets you more of the same.
Let me ask you a question:  How many people would have to die before you say, you know, maybe Bullneck is right?  Eventually we'll hit your number.   

Driving nor speeding is in the bill of rights.

[Jkwellborn 6750]

So we should do nothing to stop mass shootings with assault rifles?  

Youre more likely to die from being beaten to death with a hammer. The news won’t cover it though. I get it. You’re afraid of an inanimate object. You buy into the sensationalized media.

[Lurch 5932]

I agree. Let’s get rid of all of them.

[Bash Riprock 1695]

 

[Pasken 1309]

What are the odds this kid turns up on some incel message board?

[Digdogger 1344]

How will I explain this to my children?

[Texas_Rocks 347]

How will I explain this to my children?

Get them pumped up on the Dallas Cowboys...and then let them watch several Cowboy games while teaching them to control the induced rage that will ensue.

[El Diablo 4232]

We have age limits for drinking, military service etc.. why not have age limits on gaming? You reach 24 and no more games, get a job.  

[South Austin 52637]

1 hour ago, Pasken said:

What are the odds this kid turns up on some incel message board?

It wouldn't surprise me.  And maybe his opponent started the "do you know how I know you're gay" smack talk.

[elfenix 34343]

2 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Driving nor speeding is in the bill of rights.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

 

[XYZ 2154]

Unconfirmed reports that shooter was on SSRIs.

[yoladu 4111]

5 hours ago, slorch said:

So if the perp had a legally purchased handgun, none of your suggestions affect anything except other people's liberty.

 

Great post.  We have to do SOMETHING, right?

That's probably while the death count was only 2.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, yoladu said:

That's probably while the death count was only 2.

Proof?  Or that’s your (biased) best guess?

 

 

Edited August 27, 2018 by slorch

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Digdogger said:

How will I explain this to my children?

“Nobody wants to hear how your video game went. Now pass me some gluten free muffins...”

[yoladu 4111]

Well i did say probably. I don't know if the guy's intent was to kill 2 people or to kill as many people as he could.

is it biased to believe that an AR-15 is a more effective killing weapon than a handgun when the goal is to kill as many as possible in the shortest amount of time?

[Trey3216 15379]

1 minute ago, yoladu said:

Well i did say probably. I don't know if the guy's intent was to kill 2 people or to kill as many people as he could.

is it biased to believe that an AR-15 is a more effective killing weapon than a handgun when the goal is to kill as many as possible in the shortest amount of time?

Walking up near folks who have headsets on and not paying a lick of attention to you, it doesn't quite matter.  The fact that he only killed 2 people is a blessing, regardless of the weapon of choice.  He could have just as easily hammered 2 people to death.  

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, yoladu said:

Well i did say probably. I don't know if the guy's intent was to kill 2 people or to kill as many people as he could.

is it biased to believe that an AR-15 is a more effective killing weapon than a handgun when the goal is to kill as many as possible in the shortest amount of time?

It might be biased to imply that the gunman was restricted by laws and regulations...

[yoladu 4111]

11 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

Walking up near folks who have headsets on and not paying a lick of attention to you, it doesn't quite matter.  The fact that he only killed 2 people is a blessing, regardless of the weapon of choice.  He could have just as easily hammered 2 people to death.  

yeah, it is so easy i am surprised we don't have tens of thousands of hammer deaths a year.  Hammers cost like what? 10 bucks.

Most people take the easiest and cheapest solution to most things. Why there aren't more hammer deaths is very perplexing.

Edited August 27, 2018 by yoladu

[burntorangebongos 10752]

This has something to do with young dudes that maybe don't properly channel their agrssion or learn to control it at a young age. This guy seems like he was in arrested development  as a man. That is why this happened. Since that is hard to fix as a society, they go for the gun laws. The answer might be to put young men in mandatory national service so they can get the camraderie and sense of real purpose that seems to be important to development. The prior generations received that because they kept being drafted into war. I'm not suggesting that but something like infrastructure building might work. I don't know, but something other than just gun laws needs to be done to truly address this.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, burntorangebongos said:

This has something to do with young dudes that maybe don't properly channel their agrssion or learn to control it at a young age. This guy seems like he was in arrested development  as a man. That is why this happened. Since that is hard to fix as a society, they go for the gun laws. The answer might be to put young men in mandatory national service so they can get the camraderie and sense of real purpose that seems to be important to development. The prior generations received that because they kept being drafted into war. I'm not suggesting that but something like infrastructure building might work. I don't know, but something other than just gun laws needs to be done to truly address this.

Disagree with mandatory MILITARY service, if thatis what you meant.  The people who don’t want to be there do not need to be in the way of those who do.  There are already problems of commitment with an all-volunteer force.

If you were suggesting some form of domestic service group or whatever, that is a different discussion.

Fix parents and the kids will turn out better.  How do we do that? IDFK... but there are a crapton of shitty parents.

[Jkwellborn 6750]

yeah, it is so easy i am surprised we don't have tens of thousands of hammer deaths a year.  Hammers cost like what? 10 bucks.
Most people take the easiest and cheapest solution to most things. Why there aren't more hammer deaths is very perplexing.

The fbi probably doesn’t agree with you.

[TornACL 7732]

4 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Youre more likely to die from being beaten to death with a hammer. The news won’t cover it though. I get it. You’re afraid of an inanimate object. You buy into the sensationalized media.

The next time someone kills 59 people at a concert with a hammer in 15 minutes, it'll be covered by the news. Of that I can assure you.

[BrickHorn 18292]

52 minutes ago, yoladu said:

yeah, it is so easy i am surprised we don't have tens of thousands of hammer deaths a year.  Hammers cost like what? 10 bucks.

Most people take the easiest and cheapest solution to most things. Why there aren't more hammer deaths is very perplexing.

Those stats are largely the result of a very successful PR campaign in the early 90s:

[Jkwellborn 6750]

It won’t change the fact that there’s a minuscule chance of anyone being involved in a mass shooting, particularly one involving an AR type weapon.

[burntorangebongos 10752]

55 minutes ago, slorch said:

Disagree with mandatory MILITARY service, if thatis what you meant.  The people who don’t want to be there do not need to be in the way of those who do.  There are already problems of commitment with an all-volunteer force.

If you were suggesting some form of domestic service group or whatever, that is a different discussion.

Fix parents and the kids will turn out better.  How do we do that? IDFK... but there are a crapton of shitty parents.

Nobody is ever going to be okay with being told how to raise their kids so while fixings parents is the best answer, that is the least likely thing the government can do. I'm not suggesting military service but some type of service to the country to provide purpose and bonding experiences. Some people don't get that in their lives from family and those are the most vulnerable and thus volitile males, it seems.

[Lurch 5932]

It won’t change the fact that there’s a minuscule chance of anyone being involved in a mass shooting, particularly one involving an AR type weapon.

 

I’ll keep that in mind as my kids practice active shooter drills, fuck you very much

 

[SpiralOut 1818]

6 hours ago, Bullneck said:

So we should do nothing to stop mass shootings with assault rifles?  

What rock have you been living under? 

The government has implemented a horde of gun laws, many specifically regarding "assault rifles."  Which, in the grand scheme of things, is rather pointless considering it doesn't stop people from shooting places up and focuses on the ultra minor number of attacks with rifles when there is an ocean of attacks with handguns.

You seem like a smart guy, Bull.  You even refer to yourself in the third person in your posts, a sure sign of a "stable genius."  So tell us, buddy, exactly what law or laws is going to stop mass shootings? 

[Jkwellborn 6750]

 
I’ll keep that in mind as my kids practice active shooter drills, fuck you very much
 

You don’t think your kids are the only doing that, right?

And it’s cute to throw those pictures out there. Not like the guy that shot them didn’t break a dozen laws before that.

[Helobious 9467]

5 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Youre more likely to die from being beaten to death with a hammer. The news won’t cover it though. I get it. You’re afraid of an inanimate object. You buy into the sensationalized media.

Without even looking at stats, I can guarantee you that more murders in this country are committed with guns than with hammers. By a wide margin. 

Just looked at the stats. The FBI counted about 500 murders by blunt object in 2014, and over 8,100 by firearm.

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/expanded-homicide-data/expanded_homicide_data_table_8_murder_victims_by_weapon_2010-2014.xls

Edited August 27, 2018 by Helobious

[Jkwellborn 6750]

I was referring to ar style rifles. That was what we had been talking about.

Not saying it was outdated info the last time I looked at it, so I could be wrong.

[CooterBrown 18034]

6 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Youre more likely to die from being beaten to death with a hammer. The news won’t cover it though. I get it. You’re afraid of an inanimate object. You buy into the sensationalized media.

2016 Deaths:

Firearms: 11,004

Blunt Objects including Hammers: 472

 

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-4.xls

[smuggs 9353]

This thread has me thinking about my trusty Estwing 20 oz. rip.

 

[Cheeseweasel 26438]

You'll take my hammer from my cold, calloused hand.

[Anastasis 23472]

5 hours ago, XYZ said:

Unconfirmed reports that shooter was on SSRIs.

One of the most consistent correlations with mass shootings in this country is psychotropic medication use. Now, we can all appreciate the obvious confounding by indication, but the relationship is still strong, and there are mechanisms that make a path for a causal relationship.  But nothing to see here. 

[Anastasis 23472]

3 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

I was referring to ar style rifles. That was what we had been talking about.

Not saying it was outdated info the last time I looked at it, so I could be wrong.

Total firearms:	8,897	8,454	8,312	9,778	11,004
Handguns	6,404	5,782	5,673	6,569	7,105
Rifles	298	285	258	258	374
Shotguns	310	308	264	272	262
Other guns	116	123	93	177	186
Firearms, type not stated	1,769	1,956	2,024	2,502	3,077

 

 

 

From Cooter's link. 

Edited August 27, 2018 by Anastasis

[Guest]

2 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

2016 Deaths:

Firearms: 11,004

Blunt Objects including Hammers: 472

 

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-4.xls

What if you back out Chi-town, St Louis and Nawlins?

 

oh and 40.000+ deaths from automobiles last year.  Put everyone on a golf cart.  It would make me feel so much more secure.

[Bullneck 19231]

4 hours ago, SpiralOut said:

What rock have you been living under? 

The government has implemented a horde of gun laws, many specifically regarding "assault rifles."  Which, in the grand scheme of things, is rather pointless considering it doesn't stop people from shooting places up and focuses on the ultra minor number of attacks with rifles when there is an ocean of attacks with handguns.

You seem like a smart guy, Bull.  You even refer to yourself in the third person in your posts, a sure sign of a "stable genius."  So tell us, buddy, exactly what law or laws is going to stop mass shootings? 

What l laws has any government implemented against assault rifles?  That you know of off the top of your head.  I'm not asking you for research.  Just a few (since there's a "horde.")

[Bullneck 19231]

38 minutes ago, slorch said:

What if you back out Chi-town, St Louis and Nawlins?

 

oh and 40.000+ deaths from automobiles last year.  Put everyone on a golf cart.  It would make me feel so much more secure.

Any reason you picked those particular cities?

If other people die from something else, is it OK to sit on your hands?

[Bullneck 19231]

9 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Driving nor speeding is in the bill of rights.

This is truly ignorant.  

[Brisketexan 105465]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

One of the most consistent correlations with mass shootings in this country is psychotropic medication use. Now, we can all appreciate the obvious confounding by indication, but the relationship is still strong, and there are mechanisms that make a path for a causal relationship.  But nothing to see here. 

The data on correlation seems clear.  But the causation piece is where I am a bit puzzled.

Is it that folks on psychotropics are CAUSED to become shooters by the psychotropics?

OR, is it that the kind of folks who have conditions that merit treatment by psychotropics are more likely to be shooters?

In short, is it the pre-existing crazy that causes the shooting, or is it the treatment for the crazy that causes the shooting?  I haven't ever seen any real explanation or analysis of that, just the correlation, which comes across as a pretty lazy piece of "correlation = causation" reasoning.  But, I confess that I haven't dug down to the earth's core on the issue.

[Helobious 9467]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

What if you back out Chi-town, St Louis and Nawlins?

 

oh and 40.000+ deaths from automobiles last year.  Put everyone on a golf cart.  It would make me feel so much more secure.

That tired old myth:

Quote

While Detroit, St. Louis and New Orleans are consistently among the top five American cities by homicide rate, the cities with most per-capita murders vary from year to year. Neither Washington, D.C., nor Chicago make the top five.

Chicago has a high number of homicides because of its population, but its homicide rate is middle of the road for large U.S. cities, according to Jay Corzine, a sociology professor at the University of Central Florida.

Specific reasons for the cities’ high murder rates largely remain a mystery for criminologists, but all are cities with "high poverty levels, inequality, significant segregation, and an entrenched drug trade," Corzine said.

Dropping them from the U.S. total has little substantive impact on the U.S. homicide rate or count.

The cities cited in the meme accounted for 1,568 of 17,250, or 9.1 percent, of all homicides reported to the FBI in 2016, Tom Kovandzic, a criminologist at the University of Texas, Dallas, calculated for us. And without those cities, the homicide rate (per capita) would only decline by 7.73 percent, or from 5.34 to 4.93.

When we applied those reductions to the UN data, the United States barely budged in its international standing. It moved down four spots in per capita murders and stayed the same in total murders. That’s inconsequential compared with the 186-spot jump the meme concocted.

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2018/mar/28/viral-image/united-states-third-murders-outlier-cities/

[Anastasis 23472]

11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

The data on correlation seems clear.  But the causation piece is where I am a bit puzzled.

Is it that folks on psychotropics are CAUSED to become shooters by the psychotropics?

 OR, is it that the kind of folks who have conditions that merit treatment by psychotropics are more likely to be shooters?

 In short, is it the pre-existing crazy that causes the shooting, or is it the treatment for the crazy that causes the shooting?  I haven't ever seen any real explanation or analysis of that, just the correlation, which comes across as a pretty lazy piece of "correlation = causation" reasoning.  But, I confess that I haven't dug down to the earth's core on the issue.

The pre-existing crazy is the confounding by indication issue that I mentioned. The mechanism for a causal pathway that I also mentioned is related to activation, disinhibition, and impulsivity associated with serotonergic agents. See also black box warnings on SSRIs. 

[4th and 5 4921]

On 8/26/2018 at 3:18 PM, Lurch said:

No confirmation, but this guy claims he knows
 

 

24 years without pussy will make a man lose his mind

[Continental Op 3934]

The only thing that can stop a bad guy with a hammer is a good guy with a hammer or, barring that, a guy who is really good with a set of needle nose pliers.  

[Pam Cummings 9686]

Once again the gun nuts make their awesome arguments about how people die all the time so we should just not make any effort to keep these things from happening.

Edited August 28, 2018 by Pam Cummings