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Is women's/female basketball the next UFC?


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Posted

Women's college ball has been the 3rd biggest revenue sport behind football and men's basketball for awhile now. In the NCAA.

The WNBA is starting to pick up serious traction - in large part because of Caitlin Clark - but she isn't going to be the last women's hoops superstar. I think she's just the beginning. 

UFC was a fringe product 20 or 25 years ago but has steadily grown to where it's a prime-time event now basically every weekend that it's in session. It kind of came out of nowhere. 

I think women's ball is about to do the same thing. The product is pretty damn good. It honestly reminds me of 90s NBA basketball the way they play. And they are also starting to lean into the sexualized marketing aspect of the thing. 

You pair quality play with some good-looking superstars or even role players and you are going to catch the average American male's interest. 

I think this thing as a whole is going to blow up and honestly I'm here for it. Give me some occasional eye-candy and some good basketball and I'm in. And that's exactly what the WNBA and D1 women's hoops is providing right now. 

Thoughts?

 

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Posted

I get your premise, and the quality of play in the womens game has improved, but the uphill battle for women's basketball that UFC didnt have to compete with is there is direct competition in the same sport. People who want to watch basketball have mens college and pro to choose from, multiple games every day, and the quality of play is superior to the women's version.

You could argue UFC had completion from boxing, but 1) those are different sports, and 2) boxing is not ubitiquous like basketball. The casual fan would watch 3 nights of fights per year, at most.

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Posted (edited)

I don't watch UFC either.  I did early on, but I lasted it about 18 months/ 2 years.  Haven't watched a fight in 2-3 years at the least and can't tell you any of the current lineup.  That's no indictment of UFC, it's just not for me.

I don't like the NBA, but watch the hell out of College basketball. I don't care for the WNBA and don't anticipate my interest increasing.  I watched zero games last season. 

I don't watch NASCAR either. I don't watch golf, and couldn't tell you the last tennis match I watched. There are many sports I don't watch, just like many other genres of TV entertainment.

Edited by Iceman
Posted

UFC is a pay per view model at this point isn't it?  

Well I did stop a guy switching from the women's game yesterday to Golf at Paul Martin's.  But it was a tight game with a few minutes left and I had a vested interest in watching any Longhorn team.  I would probably not watch much WNBA, because I don't watch much NBA except for Rockets and Spurs during this time of the year, before switching to Astros, Horn baseball. 

But where I do see the potential for growth in the WNBA, is the same reason I listed for watching all the above teams.  I have a personal connection via hometown, or where I went to school.   I think the the WNBA can build upon that model.  Think of Texas high school football small town loyalty and fervor, but on a national scale.  I think that the WNBA model is one of development fierce regional and smaller market loyalty, that bleeds over into TV watching.  It's a solid model, that should keep the WNBA growing.  And who knows what 20 years of steady growth might bring.  I think the key is the accessibility of the fans to the players in new leagues, and the WNBA seems to have that going fairly well.

Posted
8 hours ago, ztejas said:

You pair quality play with some good-looking superstars or even role players and you are going to catch the average American male's interest. 

 

 

No you won't.  Unless they are playing naked. 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Scraps said:

No you won't.  Unless they are playing naked. 

Plus, most dudes are just naturally predisposed to be a little freaked out by very tall women. I don't see enough mainstream support going for 6'2+ hot women for that to matter. 

The advantage women in the UFC had was their fights occur in the same event as the men. In the early days of women's MMA, most dudes watching would just use that time as a bathroom break or to run errands/get food. But over time people are going to naturally have to tune in waiting for the men's fights, and when Rousey came along it really caught people's attention. Then the next crop with Shevchenko, Nunes, etc. could actually really fight and it turned the tide. But not enough UFC fans would have seen it if they weren't forced to watch while waiting for the dudes to fight. 

Posted

I've been on board from the start.  I enjoy the W and womens college infinitely more than the mens college game.   I like that both are getting more exposure and yes it doesnt hurt that there are a lot more attractive feminine presenting women than there were previously.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

It's definitely skyrocketing in popularity.

Wild to have a regular season women's game on ABC Sunday afternoon.

2 of them. And the champ game will be on ABC again

Posted

Not even close. The prime time slots and games right now are more about political shoehorning than genuine interest. Clark was a flash in the pan thing, but now that she’s in the pros viewership has waned significantly. Go look in the comment section of any Instagram or Twitter post when women’s sports is posted on an ESPN or big sports account. It’s 75% “no one cares, why are you posting this”. 

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Helobious said:

Not even close. The prime time slots and games right now are more about political shoehorning than genuine interest. Clark was a flash in the pan thing, but now that she’s in the pros viewership has waned significantly. Go look in the comment section of any Instagram or Twitter post when women’s sports is posted on an ESPN or big sports account. It’s 75% “no one cares, why are you posting this”. 

So the NFL is going to fold by May and the WNBA will now become must-watch TV for Sundays in the fall.

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Posted

I hope not. I hate the UFC and their business model. They currently have a turnstile of nameless, faceless fighters and just use "UFC" to sell it. They would rather do that than build up equity in specific fighters like they did early on and use the names of those fighters to sell the product. This is because they aren't interested in sharing the money they make with their talent and enjoy paying them pennies on the dollar. I do not consume UFC because of this. Well, that, and the fact that they are a bunch of jacked up on testosterone wife beating assholes, Dana included.

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Posted
9 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

I hope not. I hate the UFC and their business model. They currently have a turnstile of nameless, faceless fighters and just use "UFC" to sell it. They would rather do that than build up equity in specific fighters like they did early on and use the names of those fighters to sell the product. This is because they aren't interested in sharing the money they make with their talent and enjoy paying them pennies on the dollar. I do not consume UFC because of this. Well, that, and the fact that they are a bunch of jacked up on testosterone wife beating assholes, Dana included.

Good points.   Basketball has always been a star driven sport so I cant really imagine them trying to marketing teams over the individual players though.   

Posted

The Texas LSU match was the first game I tried watching this year. Turned it on in the second quarter. We had 10 pts. I saw about 5 airballs and 12 missed layups between the two teams before I switched it off.  It just ain't for me. 

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Posted
1 hour ago, MotownHorn said:

It's definitely skyrocketing in popularity.

Wild to have a regular season women's game on ABC Sunday afternoon.

1)the sport actually isn’t skyrocketing in popularity 

2)the game(s) weren’t on abc because of demand, it’s there because espn/abc broadcasts the sport and has been pushing it very very hard for more than a decade now.

also, i watched the 1Q of that lsu/texas game and the quality of play was just unwatchable. i’ve worked middle school parochial girls basketball tournaments for 25 years and that’s basically what i saw yesterday- countless missed bunnies, girls dribbling the ball off their feet, just general mayhem in the paint, the entire game being played below the rim, every rebound being grabbed 3 feet below the basket, and just honestly a jarring lack of skill and athleticism. 4/5 players were just impossibly slow, unathletic, and unskilled. the product on the court was so, so bad. hard to believe these were two top five teams with a combined record of 50-3.

Posted

WNBA just now got back to viewership/attendance #'s from the 2000-2003 seasons.

It may sustain this a couple years until the Clark stuff wears off and then start declining once again.



Posted

It’s far more likely that Caitlin is the new Lance Armstrong.  A transcendent star who temporarily dramatically raises the profile of their sport.

The top-selling WNBA jerseys last season were Caitlin, Caitlin’s enemy, Ionescu and Caitlin’s college teammate.

The WNBA is one serious injury to Caitlin away from being completely ignored again

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Posted

it is somewhat amusing that some posters here say they can't watch a women's game because of how bad the play is yet don't have a problem watching our men's team. Going to women's games has been a hell of a lot more fun this year than the men's games - if you can get accept basic human biology and the fact that the game isn't played above the rim (which is never going to change) you might enjoy watching actual team basketball. It is a lot more prevalent with the girls, in particular with Schaefer's squad.

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Posted

I don't know why it has to be one or the other. I don't care if everyone else is watching when determining whether I want to watch something. I will continue to watch the Texas women and select games of potential competitors when the Texas women are championship caliber. The only reason popularity matters is that it needs to stay popular enough for me to be able to watch games. 

Skyrocketing popularity causes more problems than it solves for you from a fan perspective. Well I guess unless you're a TMZ type of fan rather than a fan of the actual competition. 

But to answer the question I don't see any way it ever becomes a mainstream viewer sport. 

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Posted
19 minutes ago, KingBobo81 said:

it is somewhat amusing that some posters here say they can't watch a women's game because of how bad the play is yet don't have a problem watching our men's team. Going to women's games has been a hell of a lot more fun this year than the men's games - if you can get accept basic human biology and the fact that the game isn't played above the rim (which is never going to change) you might enjoy watching actual team basketball. It is a lot more prevalent with the girls, in particular with Schaefer's squad.

Imagine the final score if the men’s team played the women’s team. I don’t know that the women could keep it within 60 points.

Posted (edited)

It's going to be more popular than ever going forward but will have a ceiling, which is fine, better is always better. I've been at my neighborhood brewery and more than once someone has come in and asked for the TV to be put on a women's game. Of course, like everything these fucking days, it's also already part of the CR culture wars. It can't just be if you like it watch, if you don't like it then don't watch. A bunch of raging assholes just have to use every outlet they have to not just not watch but to shit all over it and say how bad it is and us all the CR terminology about it being broadcast as if they can't just turn it to another channel (as mentioned by @Helobious above). With ESPN+ there's room for everything to be broadcast, i saw rock skipping and corgi races yesterday as part of ESPN's "the Ocho" marketing. If you don't like it, just don't fucking watch, I wish it was still that fucking simple.

Edited by 'stache
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Posted
Just now, 'stache said:

It can't just be if you like it watch, if you don't like it then don't watch

This.

I cannot count the number of times I've been to a bar and there's hockey or soccer or UCF (the sport, not the school) on the TV. 

I just don't watch it. 

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Posted
6 hours ago, Wiler77 said:

I get your premise, and the quality of play in the womens game has improved, but the uphill battle for women's basketball that UFC didnt have to compete with is there is direct competition in the same sport. People who want to watch basketball have mens college and pro to choose from, multiple games every day, and the quality of play is superior to the women's version.

Good point but boxing still sort of exists.

3 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

I hope not. I hate the UFC and their business model. They currently have a turnstile of nameless, faceless fighters and just use "UFC" to sell it. They would rather do that than build up equity in specific fighters like they did early on and use the names of those fighters to sell the product. This is because they aren't interested in sharing the money they make with their talent and enjoy paying them pennies on the dollar. I do not consume UFC because of this. Well, that, and the fact that they are a bunch of jacked up on testosterone wife beating assholes, Dana included.

Not comparing the product to UFC just that it kind of came out of nowhere and wound up becoming extremely popular. 

 

1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

But to answer the question I don't see any way it ever becomes a mainstream viewer sport. 

It kind of already is though. The Clark championship game and Final Four games were getting better ratings than the NBA Finals. 

And I would disagree that she is a one-and-done type star for the women's game. There will be more girls that get to her level or at least close to it. 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Helobious said:

Not even close. The prime time slots and games right now are more about political shoehorning than genuine interest. Clark was a flash in the pan thing, but now that she’s in the pros viewership has waned significantly.

Do you have any evidence whatsoever for your contention that "viewership has waned significantly?" Because all I see is evidence that it's continued to grow in the 2025 season. Over a million people watched the Texas vs. SC/LSU games. 

PS I can tell who you voted for from your post, but we'll leave that alone.

 

3 hours ago, Derka said:

1)the sport actually isn’t skyrocketing in popularity 

Yeah it's only up 350% in viewership. Math is hard. Herpa derpa derpa - https://ustvdb.com/networks/espn/shows/womens-college-basketball/#google_vignette

Edited by MotownHorn
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Posted
5 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

PS I can tell who you voted for from your post, but we'll leave that alone.

C'mon man we don't need that in here. 

And frankly anyone turning it into a political thing is an idiot. These girls can fucking play. Anyone acting like the men's product dwarfs it should be required to watch a full season of Charlotte Hornets basketball. They wouldn't make it through 30 games. 

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Posted

Texas this season has two absolutely bad bitches that have a ton of skill in Booker and Harmon. Both of them make multiple really legit basketball plays every quarter. 

Sure the game gets rough at times. Like someone upthread said - so does MEN'S college ball. If you sat through fucking Shaka and Charlie Strong you can sit through a college women's bball game. 

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Posted
5 minutes ago, MotownHorn said:

Do you have any evidence whatsoever for your contention that "viewership has waned significantly?" Because all I see is evidence that it's continued to grow. 

PS I can tell who you voted for from your post, but we'll leave that alone.

 

Yeah it's only up 350% in viewership. Math is hard. Herpa derpa derpa - https://ustvdb.com/networks/espn/shows/womens-college-basketball/#google_vignette

lol, that link does not show that women’s college basketball viewership is up 350%, it shows that the viewership on february 9th (when Texas played S Carolina and Tennessee played LSU) was up 350% from the viewership two weeks prior on january 26th when there was no such marquee matchup. the link you provided actually shows that people *aren’t* tuning in unless there’s a Texas vs S Carolina matchup on a sunday afternoon when everyone is sitting around waiting for the super bowl to start. you actually just refuted the point you were trying to make. 

Posted
3 hours ago, Blotto said:

The Texas LSU match was the first game I tried watching this year. Turned it on in the second quarter. We had 10 pts. I saw about 5 airballs and 12 missed layups between the two teams before I switched it off.  It just ain't for me. 

This is why flag football is actually going to be the next big thing. 

They've tried NFL lite and realized it doesn't work and the only things people care about are the big hits or the crazy plays. 

Flag football let's you have high paced crazy plays, is just different enough from regular football and has an easy gateway. 

Its why the NFL is gonna pump billions in and make it a thing, womens sports will never become popular until women start caring about sports more than they care about other shit. 

Posted
46 minutes ago, ztejas said:

 

And frankly anyone turning it into a political thing is an idiot. These girls can fucking play. 

I mean, not really. The games are brutal to watch. I watched the Iowa-LSU game last year. The whole game was Clark chucking up 3’s and LSU feeding their technically unsound big girls downlow. No one had any real skill at all, it’s a pretty unwatchable sport.

Posted
Just now, Helobious said:

I mean, not really. The games are brutal to watch. I watched the Iowa-LSU game last year. The whole game was Clark chucking up 3’s and LSU feeding their technically unsound big girls downlow. No one had any real skill at all, it’s a pretty unwatchable sport.

Then don't watch them. I don't give a fuck. 

Posted
1 hour ago, ztejas said:

Then don't watch them. I don't give a fuck. 

Not good enough, they have to tell you how much they suck, and most of the time they'll throw in some CR buzzwords about why it's being broadcast more these days. 

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Posted
47 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Better idea: stop doing this. Forever. It's probably too late to reverse the brain rot, but ya never know.

lol you don’t want to have the bots tell you what to think? You’re gonna, like, use your own brain and stuff?!?

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Posted
47 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Not good enough, they have to tell you how much they suck, and most of the time they'll throw in some CR buzzwords about why it's being broadcast more these days. 

you’re painting with a pretty broad brush here, and a lot of women’s hoops fans do this, which only turns people off even more. like anyone who doesn’t like the product on the floor is a misogynist at best, and quite possibly a far right wing neo nazi, all because they were critical of women’s hoops.

look i’m pretty fucking liberal/progressive, and i support UT athletes in anything they do, but i watched the 1Q of that game and it was terrible. it was simply, factually, a slow, unaathletic, uncoordinated, under-the-rim version of a sport that i love. it was just bad, bad basketball. and it was two top five teams who again were a combined 50-3 coming into the game. there’s nothing political about it, and calling a spade a spade doesn’t make one a misogynist or some far right trumper loon. so just be careful when throwing that around, because again, it happens a lot, and it only serves to turn people off of the sport even more. 

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Posted

for the record, i am, and always have been, a big fan of individual women’s players. there’s just not enough of the elite ones to make the product as a whole something that many people want to watch. that’s my opinion.

with that said, in my life i have admired and/or followed and been a fan of clarissa davis, cheryl miller, danielle viglione, edwina brown, jamie carey, nneka enemkpali, chamique holdsclaw, simone augustus, odyssey sims, ivory latta, cynthia cooper, tamika catchings, skylar diggins, and so, so, so many more. 

but again, the unfortunate truth, at least from my perspective, is that the wnba would have to go down to 4-6 teams in order for me to become interested in the product at this point. the best players are absolutely talented, athletic, engaging, and worth watching. but every time i tune in to an actual game there’s just such a drop off from the best couple of players to even the rest of the starters that i just can’t get into it. i do believe that given enough time that women’s basketball can become a popular sport, but for now there’s still to much of a disparity in talent between the great players and the average player for me to be interested.

Posted

This Notre Dame/Duke game has 2 of the best players in the country in Olivia Miles and Hannah Hildalgo.  They are coached by Jaden Ivey's (Pistons) mom who is quite MILFy.   Duke has a freshman that has some pretty crazy dunk clips named Toby Fournier.    She's gonna be really good too.   There is a group of "next gen" girls that are really upping the skill level.   The next few yrs will really be interesting to watch as they get to the W

Posted (edited)

there’s a girl in college this year who i believe is playing at a smaller school- i’ve only seen clips on social media- but she’s out here dropping pistol pete, white chocolate, dare i say magic johnson type dimes on a nightly basis. i tried to find videos of her but came up empty.

espn has done a lot to promote the sport, but they put too much effort into promoting a select few stars. like this year all the average sports fan knows about ncaa wcbb is that juju plays for usc. if espn decided to spend the entire season highlighting 10+ of ncaa wbb’s best/flashiest players then i feel that would go a long way with attracting new fans.

Edited by Derka
Posted
12 minutes ago, d2o said:

This Notre Dame/Duke game has 2 of the best players in the country in Olivia Miles and Hannah Hildalgo.  They are coached by Jaden Ivey's (Pistons) mom who is quite MILFy.   Duke has a freshman that has some pretty crazy dunk clips named Toby Fournier.    She's gonna be really good too.   There is a group of "next gen" girls that are really upping the skill level.   The next few yrs will really be interesting to watch as they get to the W

Texas needs Aaliyah Chavez. Another pure scorer who can put up an insane number every night. 

Posted
19 hours ago, ztejas said:

Women's college ball has been the 3rd biggest revenue sport behind football and men's basketball for awhile now. In the NCAA.

The WNBA is starting to pick up serious traction - in large part because of Caitlin Clark - but she isn't going to be the last women's hoops superstar. I think she's just the beginning. 

UFC was a fringe product 20 or 25 years ago but has steadily grown to where it's a prime-time event now basically every weekend that it's in session. It kind of came out of nowhere. 

I think women's ball is about to do the same thing. The product is pretty damn good. It honestly reminds me of 90s NBA basketball the way they play. And they are also starting to lean into the sexualized marketing aspect of the thing. 

You pair quality play with some good-looking superstars or even role players and you are going to catch the average American male's interest. 

I think this thing as a whole is going to blow up and honestly I'm here for it. Give me some occasional eye-candy and some good basketball and I'm in. And that's exactly what the WNBA and D1 women's hoops is providing right now. 

Thoughts?

John Candy No GIF by Laff

Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Texas needs Aaliyah Chavez. Another pure scorer who can put up an insane number every night. 

I’ll start watching our team only if she comes here. But everything I’ve read is that it’s between Tech and LSU. 
 

It’s funny I get painted as some radical misogynist but I’ve probably paid attention to women’s basketball longer than anyone else on here. There’s been great documentaries about it over the years (The Heart of The Game, the shoni schimmel one, No Look Pass). I remember Amber Ramirez bursting on to the SA basketball scene as a high school freshman, her hitting 7 three’s in the state title game, her playing at TCU. The problem is the sport is ONLY worth watching if there’s a compelling story. You can’t watch it just to enjoy it, because it’s not an enjoyable thing to watch. It’s not like other sports.

Edited by Helobious
Posted
1 hour ago, Derka said:

you’re painting with a pretty broad brush here, and a lot of women’s hoops fans do this, which only turns people off even more. like anyone who doesn’t like the product on the floor is a misogynist at best, and quite possibly a far right wing neo nazi, all because they were critical of women’s hoops.

look i’m pretty fucking liberal/progressive, and i support UT athletes in anything they do, but i watched the 1Q of that game and it was terrible. it was simply, factually, a slow, unaathletic, uncoordinated, under-the-rim version of a sport that i love. it was just bad, bad basketball. and it was two top five teams who again were a combined 50-3 coming into the game. there’s nothing political about it, and calling a spade a spade doesn’t make one a misogynist or some far right trumper loon. so just be careful when throwing that around, because again, it happens a lot, and it only serves to turn people off of the sport even more. 

The reference was specifically to social media comment sections where the vast majority of the criticism is CR misogyny and cries of "woke." That's specifically what I was responding to, but even your post, why? What's the point? Yeah, it's a different game than the mens, its less athletic, more airballs, etc. I just don't understand the compulsion some have to be so specifically critical of the women's game whether the motivation is CR or otherwise.  

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