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Posted
4 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Karmelo's family put out a statement that the boys did not know one another.  

 

That wouldn't mean that he didn't know someone else from the school.  But my understanding is that he was just chilling under the wrong tent by himself, not chatting it up with friends.  Which would completely negate the argument that he was there to see friends.  If not there to see friends then Karmelo had no business being under that tent.  That means he only could have been under the tent because he had bad intentions.  I have a friend who is a track coach at one of the schools involved and was there and witnessed the events in question.

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Posted
43 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Again. Athletes know the other athletes from surrounding schools. My daughter's high school teammate showed up to our volleyball banquet with Jonah Williams on her arm who goes to Galveston Ball. We are in their district so they likely met at..... you guessed it.......a track meet. Both kids are not primarily track athletes. Again, these kids move around talking to one another. Half the girls on our volleyball team are dating kids from other schools. Part of me is wondering if you guys have high school athletes as you don't seem to be in touch with how things go.

I don't have current high school athletes so my observations are second hand from friends and colleagues who still do, specifically at these schools and in this area, but I'll defer to you since you are living it right now and these kids are always changing and confounding us olds.

Posted (edited)

To further put a point on my being out of touch @Thatguy, I have zero idea who Jonah Williams is and what hte Galveston Ball is. I'm assuming it's either a debutante ball thing or a kappa sea wall party or something in between.

ETA found it!

13006124.jpg?fit=crop&width=100&fit=crop

 

Jonah "Island Boi" Williams (his self-identifed sobriquet, not mine). Star Baseball player and hopefully one day star footballer as well!

Edited by Vegas64
Posted
6 hours ago, Helobious said:

Same county, 2015, two white 16 year olds were convicted of murdering a latino classmate at Wylie East because they didn’t like that he was dating a girl one of them liked. They had a whole detailed plan to ambush him in the woods, transport the body and bury it elsewhere. 
 

They were each sentenced to 30 years in prison, eligible for parole after 15. And they were even being charged as adults mind you. No big national story, no outrage, no End Wokeness retweets. But yeah let’s throw away this kid for life.

That sounds like some pussy woke ass nuance. Apparently we're just supposed to execute him this weekend. 

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Posted
31 minutes ago, Vegas64 said:

I have zero idea who Jonah Williams is and what hte Galveston Ball is. I'm assuming it's either a debutante ball thing or a kappa sea wall party or something in between.

It's a high school.  One that cranks out a lot of great athletes.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Helobious said:

Same county, 2015, two white 16 year olds were convicted of murdering a latino classmate at Wylie East because they didn’t like that he was dating a girl one of them liked. They had a whole detailed plan to ambush him in the woods, transport the body and bury it elsewhere. 
 

They were each sentenced to 30 years in prison, eligible for parole after 15. And they were even being charged as adults mind you. No big national story, no outrage, no End Wokeness retweets. But yeah let’s throw away this kid for life.

He didn’t seem to care about metcalf’s life.  Killed him

1 hour ago, 'stache said:

That sounds like some pussy woke ass nuance. Apparently we're just supposed to execute him this weekend. 

No no.  He’s misunderstood.    It was an accident I’m sure 

Edited by Im_smarter_then_you
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Posted
5 hours ago, Frank Drebin said:

Not sure how good a filet knife would be at stabbing someone in the chest.  

I was just curious if he was carrying a pocket knife or the Jackhawk 9000.

The police report/arrest affidavit said something about finding it folded.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Im_smarter_then_you said:

No no.  He’s misunderstood.    It was an accident I’m sure 

Criminal law is all about nuance. Degrees of a crime, intent, knowledge, etc. Its why there are multiple degrees of homicide and manslaughter. Discussing these issues isn't "woke" or CR. Its literally the practice of criminal law. 

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Posted
10 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

The police report/arrest affidavit said something about finding it folded.

No reason whatsoever a teenager should be carrying one, but EDC folding knives are practically a fashion statement these days versus any real need for practical use. Would run counter to the "he had a knife and was looking for an excuse to use it" angle if it was something he routinely carried. Probably a couple dozen men in the crowd with one in their pocket or beltline.

Posted
33 minutes ago, Helobious said:

But you’re ok with those other two kids getting off easy. Can’t imagine why

They can get life too.  Never said I was

16 minutes ago, Foosters said:

Criminal law is all about nuance. Degrees of a crime, intent, knowledge, etc. Its why there are multiple degrees of homicide and manslaughter. Discussing these issues isn't "woke" or CR. Its literally the practice of criminal law. 

Yes.  This will end up being self defense. 

Posted
46 minutes ago, Im_smarter_then_you said:

They can get life too.  Never said I was

Yes.  This will end up being self defense. 

I'd wager a plead down to manslaughter as far more likely at best.

Posted
1 hour ago, Foosters said:

Criminal law is all about nuance. Degrees of a crime, intent, knowledge, etc. Its why there are multiple degrees of homicide and manslaughter. Discussing these issues isn't "woke" or CR. Its literally the practice of criminal law. 

I was told semantics have no place in law

Posted
3 hours ago, Helobious said:

But you’re ok with those other two kids getting off easy. Can’t imagine why

I don’t think a 16 year old getting 30 years on a plea deal is easy. Not saying it’s draconian. But assuming first offense it’s a pretty reasonable plea deal for a 16 year old getting murder 1.  Sentencing range is 5 to 99 for first degree murder in Texas.  They took a deal to get lower range.  And Texas isn’t exactly parol friendly. Bet they do 75 percent of the sentence. 

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Posted
1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

I'd wager a plead down to manslaughter as far more likely at best.

In Texas, manslaughter and "sudden passion" murder are both second degree felonies, with a sentencing range of 2 to 20 years.

So, to an extent, six of one, half a dozen of the other.

Posted
2 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

I don’t think a 16 year old getting 30 years on a plea deal is easy. Not saying it’s draconian. But assuming first offense it’s a pretty reasonable plea deal for a 16 year old getting murder 1.  Sentencing range is 5 to 99 for first degree murder in Texas.  They took a deal to get lower range.  And Texas isn’t exactly parol friendly. Bet they do 75 percent of the sentence. 

I tend to think 30 years should represent the upper bound for all but the most heinous felonies.

One thing that seems pretty clear is that people start to "age out" of crime in middle age, and 30 years gets a teen or young adult pretty squarely there.

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Posted
We have friends of my child in Frisco HS that knew the deceased.   This is patently false.  
 
further, if you are being bullied to the point that you feel the need to bring a weapon to defend yourself, why are you stationed under the very tent of those you are so fearful of you feel that your life is being threatened by?   This idea of rain?   They are in the football field.  Every team brings tents.  Every one.   This is how the coaches coordinate their runners.  4x100 runners….meet at the tent at xyz time, etc.   This is also where their packs are.   Packs with cell phones, headphones, etc.  It’s not done.   Ever.  I’ve been to dozens of meets between both kids.  You never.   Ever.  See another schools kid under someone else’s tent unless they are friends and talking between events.  
I'm 5 days behind, so apologies if this is covered already, but you can tell the majority of the speculators here were the bullies and not the bullied. And probably don't even realize they were bullies.

I was bullied a lot in HS . Apparently it's frowned upon to get the best grades and wreck the curve. The last thing I would ever do is intentionally go where my bullies are unless I was planning a drastic Columbine-type retaliation. It wouldn't matter how bad the rain was. I'm not hanging around to give them a target.

Either this guy was never bullied by them, or went there specifically to tempt them so he could harm them with the knife.

And I wouldn't want a stranger in my team's tent where cell phones, jewelry, etc are sitting in bags.
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Posted
15 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

In Texas, manslaughter and "sudden passion" murder are both second degree felonies, with a sentencing range of 2 to 20 years.

So, to an extent, six of one, half a dozen of the other.

Yah... pretty much. It comes down, imo, as avoidance of a murder plead to manslaughter given the stronger social stigma assigned to murder.

To be clear it may well turn out facts present themselves that alter the ones I am currently aware of that alter the ultimate resolution. However, nothing I've seen to this point supports that direction. We will find out, mostly I think the race baiting aspects should at least end here. We're grown ass, mostly educated adults. Leave that bullshit for social media.

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Posted
19 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I tend to think 30 years should represent the upper bound for all but the most heinous felonies.

One thing that seems pretty clear is that people start to "age out" of crime in middle age, and 30 years gets a teen or young adult pretty squarely there.

This was a pretty heinous crime. 

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Posted
28 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I tend to think 30 years should represent the upper bound for all but the most heinous felonies.

One thing that seems pretty clear is that people start to "age out" of crime in middle age, and 30 years gets a teen or young adult pretty squarely there.

I tend to agree.  But if someone does another violent crime after a long stretch I’m pretty okay with locking them up and tossing the key.  I’d also reserve prisons for violent crimes in most cases.  I’d rather give those accused of property crimes an option of working and paying reasonable restitution 

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Posted
1 hour ago, ztejas said:

TIL 30 years in prison is "getting off easy".

They’ll be out in 15 years in all likelihood. They’ll be 31 years old. For taking a life, yeah that’s pretty easy. If the kid that did this stabbing got the same 30 year sentence I doubt you’d be saying that’s justice.

Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Helobious said:

They’ll be out in 15 years in all likelihood. They’ll be 31 years old. For taking a life, yeah that’s pretty easy. If the kid that did this stabbing got the same 30 year sentence I doubt you’d be saying that’s justice.

They may or may not be out in 15. I'd love to see you do 15 years in prison then come comment about any of this, btw.

I think 30 is plenty for the kid that did this stabbing (frankly I'd find it punitive) and I don't make shit like this about race despite you attempting to will it into existence. 

I get that you're either a troll or an accidental troll in wake of your stupidity but there are levels of ignorance that bother me if I don't say anything. 

Edited by ztejas
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Posted
13 hours ago, Helobious said:

Same county, 2015, two white 16 year olds were convicted of murdering a latino classmate at Wylie East because they didn’t like that he was dating a girl one of them liked. They had a whole detailed plan to ambush him in the woods, transport the body and bury it elsewhere. 
 

They were each sentenced to 30 years in prison, eligible for parole after 15. And they were even being charged as adults mind you. No big national story, no outrage, no End Wokeness retweets. But yeah let’s throw away this kid for life.

I don’t really care what happens to the kid. His life is over just as they two kids you cite are. It doesn’t matter if they’re released at age 31 or not. I am not opining on what his sentence ought to be. This wasn’t self defense or manslaughter, though. This was murder. 

Posted
1 hour ago, Frank Drebin said:

I tend to agree.  But if someone does another violent crime after a long stretch I’m pretty okay with locking them up and tossing the key.  I’d also reserve prisons for violent crimes in most cases.  I’d rather give those accused of property crimes an option of working and paying reasonable restitution 

Well I think there are signs of psychopathy that probably become fairly apparent in the criminal history of defendants. So you're not working off a single offense and sentence most of the time.

And yeah I think property crimes should be treated pretty differently from those against persons. 

Posted
16 minutes ago, ztejas said:

They may or may not be out in 15. I'd love to see you do 15 years in prison then come comment about any of this, btw.

I think 30 is plenty for the kid that did this stabbing (frankly I'd find it punitive) and I don't make shit like this about race despite you attempting to will it into existence. 

I get that you're either a troll or an accidental troll in wake of your stupidity but there are levels of ignorance that bother me if I don't say anything. 

I never said prison was easy. But 15 years for killing someone is comparatively a pretty light punishment. I don’t think any non-mass murdering killer under 18 should be given life. But if I was god of justice those two would be spending at least 20-25 years in prison, as would this stabber. 

Posted
7 hours ago, Vegas64 said:

I don't have current high school athletes so my observations are second hand from friends and colleagues who still do, specifically at these schools and in this area, but I'll defer to you since you are living it right now and these kids are always changing and confounding us olds.

I do. I had a HS Area meet today and an 8th grade district meet tomorrow. Kids most certainly do not hang out in each other’s tents. Ever. They may socialize outside the tents but not in the tents. I don’t give a fuck about ThatGuy’s humble brags about club volleyball (ooooh, I’ve got 2 athletes on 5 club teams) or his name dropping on comingling. Are there exceptions?  Sure, but it’s very rare, and to see a kid you don’t know sitting there is DEFINITELY abnormal behavior. I don’t know the point he and Jimmy and other posters are trying to make. His behavior was abnormal and aggressive, period. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

As someone who has spent a bit of time in jail, anything above a couple days is a long fucking time.  This opinion has no bearing on whatever sentence this kid gets, just saying.

My worst was my DUI where I sat in a cell with the lights on for 24 hours without any communication or knowing what the fuck was going on on the outside. (I'm sure other posters here have had similar experiences)

I have had guys say that county isn't always that bad. I think once you know what you're in for and when you're getting out you can kind of adapt.

That said - I think anything beyond 3-6 months in a decent situation is pretty dehumanizing and not something I'd ever like to experience. 

Edited by ztejas
Posted
26 minutes ago, ztejas said:

My worst was my DUI where I sat in a cell with the lights on for 24 hours without any communication or knowing what the fuck was going on on the outside. (I'm sure other posters here have had similar experiences)

I have had guys say that county isn't always that bad. I think once you know what you're in for and when you're getting out you can kind of adapt.

That said - I think anything beyond 3-6 months in a decent situation is pretty dehumanizing and not something I'd ever like to experience. 

image.gif.3326c6f7249bd884686298fbca82d400.gif

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Posted
8 hours ago, Rex Kramer said:

I do. I had a HS Area meet today and an 8th grade district meet tomorrow. Kids most certainly do not hang out in each other’s tents. Ever. They may socialize outside the tents but not in the tents. I don’t give a fuck about ThatGuy’s humble brags about club volleyball (ooooh, I’ve got 2 athletes on 5 club teams) or his name dropping on comingling. Are there exceptions?  Sure, but it’s very rare, and to see a kid you don’t know sitting there is DEFINITELY abnormal behavior. I don’t know the point he and Jimmy and other posters are trying to make. His behavior was abnormal and aggressive, period. 

Didn’t sound like Melo was hanging out talking to Metcalfs teammates etc.  

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Posted
10 hours ago, Helobious said:

I never said prison was easy. But 15 years for killing someone is comparatively a pretty light punishment. I don’t think any non-mass murdering killer under 18 should be given life. But if I was god of justice those two would be spending at least 20-25 years in prison, as would this stabber. 

It is extremely uncommon for murderers to get out the first time they are eligible for parole.  In Texas for murders, you have to serve half your sentence before becoming eligible for parole.  You are assuming they will get out when they become eligible for parole.  That would be unusual in this state for a murder conviction.

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Posted

I think they should let the surviving twin get one stab to the chest of the murderer and whatever happens happens after.

Seems like the most human solution here. 

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Posted
11 hours ago, Helobious said:

15 years for killing someone is comparatively a pretty light punishment

If this is true, it is only because you have been conditioned to accept unduly long sentences as "normal."

Posted
On 4/10/2025 at 8:17 AM, TwiceHorn said:

I feel naked without a pocketknife on me and have for a long time, going back to high school.  I don't think carrying even a small knife was looked upon particularly favorably in my day, but it mostly depended on whether you flashed it around or not.  This was before the days of metal detectors and at one of the whitest hs in the state.

I likely would have been one of those depositing a knife on the table, unless I thought it would be confiscated.

 

Back in my day, you see pick ups in the parking lots with rifles in the back window. Just in case you need to shoot a coyote on the way home I guess. 

 

Posted
23 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

If this is true, it is only because you have been conditioned to accept unduly long sentences as "normal."

Wait, you think more than 15 years for murder is unreasonable?

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Posted
4 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

Back in my day, you see pick ups in the parking lots with rifles in the back window. Just in case you need to shoot a coyote on the way home I guess. 

 

I spent my freshman and sophomore years in the Valley.  This was early 90s.  I always had my 20 gauge and a case of shells in my trunk during dove season.  Hunted every day back then when school let out.  I was not the only one.

1 minute ago, Hate said:

Wait, you think more than 15 years for murder is unreasonable?

30 years was the sentence.

Posted
13 hours ago, Frank Drebin said:

I don’t think a 16 year old getting 30 years on a plea deal is easy. Not saying it’s draconian. But assuming first offense it’s a pretty reasonable plea deal for a 16 year old getting murder 1.  Sentencing range is 5 to 99 for first degree murder in Texas.  They took a deal to get lower range.  And Texas isn’t exactly parol friendly. Bet they do 75 percent of the sentence. 

The fully grown man that brutally stabbed my cousin to death (his ex wife and mother of his child), and kept her body rotting in the garage surrounded by scented candles got 30 years. I'm not sure how I feel about that sentence to this day, and I'm not sure how I'd feel about a kid making a horrible mistake [possibly in self defense, I'm not saying it is because I don't know the full facts of the case, but still] getting the same sentence.

Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Hate said:

Wait, you think more than 15 years for murder is unreasonable?

It's probably adequate for a youthful offender without a history of offenses against persons.

It only appears short because we're conditioned to de facto life sentences.

I think we should ratchet back to about 20 years for all but the most heinous crimes.  And by heinous, I mean serial killers, rape killers, vulnerable victims, etc.

Edited by TwiceHorn
Posted
34 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

Back in my day, you see pick ups in the parking lots with rifles in the back window. Just in case you need to shoot a coyote on the way home I guess. 

 

For us it was shotguns preparing to head out to hunt doves Friday after school.  But your point is taken.  Different times.  

Posted
46 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

Back in my day, you see pick ups in the parking lots with rifles in the back window. Just in case you need to shoot a coyote on the way home I guess. 

My best friend kept a putter in his truck's gun rack.  That was considered odd, although he did play on his HS and college golf teams.

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