Jump to content

who would you rather have at his peak: kobe or kawhi?


Kobe or Kawhi  

29 members have voted

  1. 1. who would you want on your team



Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

i voted for kawhi. i actually think that he’s a better player than kobe when both are at their best. kobe has clearly had a better career, but he was also a paychopathic teammate and a streaky volume shooter, and as good as he was defensively, kawhi is better. all time it’s kobe >>> kawhi, but i think that the best version of kawhi > the best version of kobe.

Edited by Derka
  • Like 1
Posted

actually, having gone back and looked at it, i’ll concede it’s probably kobe. my biggest thing, as mentioned, was the difference in efficiency, but when comparing kawhi’s mvp runner-up season with kobe’s mvp season, kobe was actually more efficient than i realized. his 3p% in particular was way up that year from his career average- .361 vs .329. i still think that people might not be appreciating the gulf in efficiency between kobe and kawhi overall, but in his best season kobe was at his most efficient.

Posted (edited)

For a game? A series? A playoffs? A full season? 5 seasons? 

There are only a couple of those where I'd entertain the idea of Kawhi. 

Kawhi would never have won b2b in '09 and '10 and gone to 3 straight Finals the way Kobe did. At his best he was just as impactful as Kobe both ways, though. 

Kobe '08-'10 played 82, 82, 73 games, made the Finals every season, won an MVP, finished 2nd and 3rd in MVP voting the other 2 seasons, won 2 FMVPs and led the US redeem team to gold in the Olympics. 

Edited by ztejas
Posted (edited)

what started the conversation that led to this thread:

kawhi:

2p fg%- .540

3p fg%- .391

eFG- .553

•he’s actually a better defender than kobe, and physically more imposing

 

kobe:

2p fg%- .479

3p fg%- .329

eFG%- .482

•and again, as great as he was defensively, kawhi is better.

 

theres no doubt who’s had the better career, and while ive conceded that the answer is kobe, it still feels like kawhi isn’t getting enough respect. there’s actually a substantial portion of the game where he was more efficient if not out and out better than kobe. and he’s a two time finals mvp with two different teams. someone said that kawhi doesn’t go back to back with lal; probably not. but does kobe win with the raptors? i seriously doubt it. i think it’s closer than most of y’all do. 

Edited by Derka
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Derka said:

but does kobe win with the raptors? i seriously doubt it.

I don't doubt he could win that tile at all at the same age as Kawhi. That was a nice run from Kawhi but it wasn't some Herculean title. That Raptors team was deep as shit and GS injured themselves out of the Finals. 

That was the year Kobe put up 35.4 per game. Adjust that just using the league ppg average and that would be over 39 ppg in 2019. 

Yeah I think that dude could take Toronto all the way 🤷

Edited by ztejas
Posted

For me, it is really simple. 

If I was playing a game of 2-on-2 where the outcome had significant impact for me and my teammate, who would I choose as my teammate if I had the first choice?

It would be close, but it would be Kobe, MJ, then Bird.  Each of these folks wanted to destroy their competition.

If I chose Kobe (or MJ), I knew that he'd ignore me if the game was on the line.  Up 10, pass to boilerhorn and see what happens.  Close or down, f- boilerhorn, we need to win.  I do not give a shit about the stats.  If you want to win, you choose Kobe then MJ.  Kahwi is not in my top-10.

Posted
1 minute ago, boilerhorn said:

If I was playing a game of 2-on-2 where the outcome had significant impact for me and my teammate, who would I choose as my teammate if I had the first choice?

I don't think that's what he's asking. 

I get where Derka is coming from - peak Kawhi was a monster. I just don't think that the absolute best version of Kobe doesn't win the same playoff series that Kawhi did. And for every series Kawhi won Kobe won two (at least).

  • Like 1
Posted
25 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I don't think that's what he's asking. 

I get where Derka is coming from - peak Kawhi was a monster. I just don't think that the absolute best version of Kobe doesn't win the same playoff series that Kawhi did. And for every series Kawhi won Kobe won two (at least).

I'm not saying you do, but what I've noticed IRL/real life convos, a ton of people either have forgotton or not realized just how elite Kawhi's defense was in his peak too. He was a monster on offense and equally beastly on D. It really was fun to watch (I get that a lot of Spurs fans had a well earned bias and might not feel the same way).

  • Hook 'Em 3
Posted
3 minutes ago, Vegas64 said:

I'm not saying you do, but what I've noticed IRL/real life convos, a ton of people either have forgotton or not realized just how elite Kawhi's defense was in his peak too. He was a monster on offense and equally beastly on D. It really was fun to watch (I get that a lot of Spurs fans had a well earned bias and might not feel the same way).

I am extremely comfortable in my assessment of both of these players. 

You make a good contribution, though - it's a fun debate and like I have already said multiple times Kawhi was a beast.

(I'd take peak Durant over both of them)

Posted
8 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

Kobe's legacy was greatly enhanced by dying young.

Nah I don't think so. He had already been retired for a few years - and Kobe was such a magnanimous individual and a statesman of the game that him being alive and telling stories would have elevated his status just as much imo. 

It's not like he died in 2011.

Posted

before kobe died he was considered a top 10-ish player by most people. since his death all anyone says is “jordan, kobe, and lebron”. i’ve definitely seen his reputation enhanced by his death. 

  • Like 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, Derka said:

before kobe died he was considered a top 10-ish player by most people. since his death all anyone says is “jordan, kobe, and lebron”. i’ve definitely seen his reputation enhanced by his death. 

I think that's revisionist. There were always Kobe honks before he died claiming him top 5 and comparing him against LeBron. I haven't seen anyone credible move their position on Kobe because he died. 

If you claim him over Bron you're getting laughed out of the room just like you were before he died.

I'm a Spurs fan that owned multiple pairs of Kobes before he died. I fucked with the guy heavy. I didn't wait until he died to be like "well I know I'm a Spurs fan but because he died I'm going to appreciate him and buy his shoes now and take him over Kawhi in theoretical debates".

Kobe has always been a fringe top 10-12 guy for me. Before he died, after he died, whatever. 

Kawhi, meanwhile, I'd put behind Dwyane Wade and would be in the 30-35 range. 

Just my shitty opinion. 

Posted

I don’t think this question is that dumb. Peak Kawhi was arguably the best perimeter defender in NBA history, while also being 2nd in MVP voting and having a 27.6 PER.

Kobe was a great defender as well, but not nearly as good as Kawhi. His best PER was 28.0. Kobe had a 38% usage so of course his raw numbers looked better.

Kobe’s best BPM was 7.6. Kawhi’s was 9.4.

Kobe’s best WS/48 was 0.224. Kawhi’s was 0.277.

People forget how unreal good Kawhi was at his peak. His general bitch-assedness, injuries and fake injuries have tainted what should have been an all time great career.

Kobe had 100x more charisma though. I will give him that.

giphy.gif
Vs
giphy.gif

  • Like 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, HookEm said:

People forget how unreal good Kawhi was at his peak.

for me this is it. his peak was nowhere near as long as kobe’s,  it his peak is wildly more efficient than kobe’s, and as we’ve both said, kawhi is clearly the better defender. it’s closer than most people think, imo.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



×
×
  • Create New...