I put this here because it feels right. 
 

I go to church. I give back to the needy with my time and money yet I am not feeling it in church. We did Easter service yesterday because today would be packed but the whole time it felt like a Rolling Stones concert and it all felt so forced. I’ve never been one to raise hands and pray over people but I am one to actually help people. I just feel weird sometimes when almost everyone but me is singing and praising but I am just standing there. I wish I could get into it more but I just don’t feel ( that ).  I do give my church credit in that they do not get into politics so it isn’t that. I can say I’ve never felt closer to Christ than with a charity I do that helps special needs people run triathlons and half marathons. 

I just really wondered during the laser show yesterday am I the oddball or am I real ? Is this your 40’s??

It's harder to stay indoctrinated the older you are. 

Be a good person and treat people accordingly. 

Your congregation is either a part of it or it isn't. 

2 minutes ago, Clintonaldo said:

I put this here because it feels right. 
 

I go to church. I give back to the needy with my time and money yet I am not feeling it in church. We did Easter service yesterday because today would be packed but the whole time it felt like a Rolling Stones concert and it all felt so forced. I’ve never been one to raise hands and pray over people but I am one to actually help people. I just feel weird sometimes when almost everyone but me is singing and praising but I am just standing there. I wish I could get into it more but I just don’t feel ( that ).  I do give my church credit in that they do not get into politics so it isn’t that. I can say I’ve never felt closer to Christ than with a charity I do that helps special needs people run triathlons and half marathons. 

I just really wondered during the laser show yesterday am I the oddball or am I real ? Is this your 40’s??

They had a laser show? Good grief that would be a massive misuse of funds. Your church is in you. If it helps to worship with others like an AA meeting, then great. But if you just need to do good things, then I believe you’ll be judged by your acts more than your place of worship. But really, you’ll teach and reach more people by doing than telling. It’s far harder and more rebellious to be a decent person than a louse. Then anywhere can be your house of worship. 

I've never really been into doomsday cults to begin with, but considering how most of these people vote, and what they've done, I'm completely out of fucks to give when it comes to religion. It's fucking insanity. Santa Claus for people who are scared of dying.

1 minute ago, Red Five said:

I've never really been into doomsday cults to begin with, but considering how most of these people vote, and what they've done, I'm completely out of fucks to give when it comes to religion. It's fucking insanity. Santa Claus for people who are scared of dying.

Yeah it's hard to take seriously someone who votes for Trump and calls themselves a "Christian."  

1 minute ago, Red Five said:

I've never really been into doomsday cults to begin with, but considering how most of these people vote, and what they've done, I'm completely out of fucks to give when it comes to religion. It's fucking insanity. Santa Claus for people who are scared of dying.

7 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Be a good person and treat people accordingly. 

Your congregation is either a part of it or it isn't. 

That’s the whole thing that has me wondering. It’s a great congregation that does a lot of good. It’s more of me wondering why I just stand there when everyone else is all in their feels. The service itself never hits me but being out and volunteering with them does. 

First off, don't listen to @Red Five or any of the other shitheads.

Secondly, why post in the CR? Is this a Trump thing or something else? I'm just asking to see where you're coming from. If it's a crisis of faith, I have plenty of experience in that. If it's a crisis of "Holy shit! WTF America?", well then, we all have experience since 2016 if that's what you're looking for.

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by HornOnTheBayou

14 minutes ago, HornOnTheBayou said:

First off, don't listen to @Red Five or any of the other shitheads.

Secondly, why post in the CR? Is this a Trump thing or something else? I'm just asking to see where you're coming from. If it's a crisis of faith, I have plenty of experience in that. If it's a crisis of "Holy shit! WTF America?", well then, we all have experience since 2016 if that's what you're looking for.

When I posted this I expected the usual stuff so it doesn’t bother me. I honestly don’t know why I posted it here. I do think some of it is how can we call ourselves Christian and vote like we do but that is painting with a broad brush. I am just searching today  

 

13 minutes ago, Clintonaldo said:

That’s the whole thing that has me wondering. It’s a great congregation that does a lot of good. It’s more of me wondering why I just stand there when everyone else is all in their feels. The service itself never hits me but being out and volunteering with them does. 

Not everything has to be catered to you - you know? There may be aspects of your congregation that you like and aspects that you don't like. At the end of the day you're an adult and you can either leave or stay. 

Maybe appreciate that there are people around you down with the mission that choose to express it a bit differently. That in itself probably isn't worth throwing away your community and values. Maybe spend less time worrying about the service experience and more time doing what you can to enact positive change outside of that.

My view is that believing in a deity is fine, but that claiming to understand anything about it or how we are supposed to live is peak human hubris. So be good to people because it’s good to be good to people.  Believe in a higher power if you wish, be that a specific entity like god or just a nebulous idea.   But organized religion is just not a great idea, and that’s been proven throughout human history. 

11 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Not everything has to be catered to you - you know? There may be aspects of your congregation that you like and aspects that you don't like. At the end of the day you're an adult and you can either leave or stay. 

Maybe appreciate that there are people around you down with the mission that choose to express it a bit differently. That in itself probably isn't worth throwing away your community and values. Maybe spend less time worrying about the service experience and more time doing what you can to enact positive change outside of that.

That’s the beauty of it. I never once said it has or needed to be catered to me. It’s more of why am I not feeling it ?

2 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

My view is that believing in a deity is fine, but that claiming to understand anything about it or how we are supposed to live is peak human hubris. So be good to people because it’s good to be good to people.  Believe in a higher power if you wish, be that a specific entity like god or just a nebulous idea.   But organized religion is just not a great idea, and that’s been proven throughout human history. 

I don't think OP is struggling with his faith. 

1 minute ago, Clintonaldo said:

That’s the beauty of it. I never once said it has or needed to be catered to me. It’s more of why am I not feeling it ?

Because it's not catered to you. 

11 minutes ago, Clintonaldo said:

When I posted this I expected the usual stuff so it doesn’t bother me. I honestly don’t know why I posted it here. I do think some of it is how can we call ourselves Christian and vote like we do but that is painting with a broad brush. I am just searching today  

 

That makes complete sense. If it helps (and it's totally fine if it doesn't), I left the church in 2005-06 time frame. It was a combination of the war in Iraq, Hurricane Katrina (I grew up in South Louisiana), and personal matters. 

Just now, HornOnTheBayou said:

That makes complete sense. If it helps (and it's totally fine if it doesn't), I left the church in 2005-06 time frame. It was a combination of the war in Iraq, Hurricane Katrina (I grew up in South Louisiana), and personal matters. 

You ever consider going back? I’m genuinely asking. 

I'm going to give you props for posting this - it's a vulnerable thing to do, especially in this crowd. I'm also going to give you credit for, at least in the span of a 5 sentence post, appearing to be Christian as was intended from the jump, not the modern "use religion as an excuse for your behavior" Christian. 

I think (hope) you're bothered by what is being done in "the name of Christ" by our current ruling party and how that ties back with the Christianity you want to practice. If so, you more than any of us in this forum are the key to righting this ship. Most of us here have been on the left, will stay on the left, and won't shift any tides. We need people like you to enact change. 

Basically, we're all counting on you. Don't fuck it up.

 

Does your church have a smaller service?  One of the past ministers of my church declared the Easter Service a day for ladies to show off their pretty hats and advised the spiritually devout to stay at home.

Easter and Christmas Eve/Day services are somewhat outliers, but the "big" service, especially if it has tinges of "rock Jesus," is not necessarily for people who are spiritually engaged, it's an effort to engage people that they might otherwise become spiritually engaged.  And often, it's not much more than a social spectacle.  It sounds like you are engaged and are looking for something more meaningful.  Smaller services offer just that many times.

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by TwiceHorn

11 minutes ago, Clintonaldo said:

You ever consider going back? I’m genuinely asking. 

Honestly, no. But in my case, it's more about a loss of faith than politics. Although, politics definitely sped up my loss of faith.

44 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Santa Claus for people who are scared of dying.

It’s a little more than that. Group identity and a sense of purpose are also big draws to religion. 

But, yeah. It’s weird to me that grown adults think to themselves “I’ll make a difference in the world by joining that club for people who ask for favors from an imaginary sky friend.” 

Clintonaldo seems like the good, principled breed of Christian that is a rarity these days. It’s not for me, but I don’t begrudge anyone who reads the Bible and finds inspiration to be a kind, selfless, charitable person.

Everyone who goes to church falls into one of three categories: a) true believers; b) those who are unsure about the legitimacy of their religion but nevertheless participate, or c) pretenders who do it for social, political or other reasons. 

It sure seems like these days those in group c) are predominate. That makes it a whole lot less appealing to the a)’s and b)’s. 

10 minutes ago, dieucla98 said:

I'm going to give you props for posting this - it's a vulnerable thing to do, especially in this crowd. I'm also going to give you credit for, at least in the span of a 5 sentence post, appearing to be Christian as was intended from the jump, not the modern "use religion as an excuse for your behavior" Christian. 

I think (hope) you're bothered by what is being done in "the name of Christ" by our current ruling party and how that ties back with the Christianity you want to practice. If so, you more than any of us in this forum are the key to righting this ship. Most of us here have been on the left, will stay on the left, and won't shift any tides. We need people like you to enact change. 

Basically, we're all counting on you. Don't fuck it up.

 

Very kind thing to say and honestly it was weird yesterday during the service to think “ I wonder what Surly thinks”  but I value what people think here. 
 

I was very dejected after the election and was adamant among my peers we are hypocrites. I do live in the Bible Belt and have become somewhat disillusioned but it will never stop me from doing what I think is right. I am an extremely flawed person so if I am the key to change we are screwed. 

9 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Does your church have a smaller service?  One of the past ministers of my church declared the Easter Service a day for ladies to show off their pretty hats and advised the spiritually devout to stay at home.

Easter and Christmas Eve/Day services are somewhat outliers, but the "big" service, especially if it has tinges of "rock Jesus," is not necessarily for people who are spiritually engaged, it's an effort to engage people that they might otherwise become spiritually engaged.  It sounds like you are and are looking for something more meaningful.  Smaller services offer just that many times.

And that a good point. I think the showmanship yesterday really turned me off and it was almost high pressure sales by the end.  

3 minutes ago, BrickHorn said:

It’s a little more than that. Group identity and a sense of purpose are also big draws to religion. 

But, yeah. It’s weird to me that grown adults think to themselves “I’ll make a difference in the world by joining that club for people who ask for favors from an imaginary sky friend.” 

Clintonaldo seems like the good, principled breed of Christian that is a rarity these days. It’s not for me, but I don’t begrudge anyone who reads the Bible and finds inspiration to be a kind, selfless, charitable person.

Thanks man. I won’t ever lecture your for how you feel as I don’t know what you’ve been through. 

I grew up Baha'i, and I always thought it was great that there is no clergy or places of worship.  We would have Feasts, where a local Bahai'l family would offer to host at their house for potluck dinners in a relaxed atmosphere to read prayers and have discussions. Maybe 20-30 people max in attendance. 

Back in my 30's, I had a real crisis of faith along with some actual pre mid life crisis stuff like what I was going to do to as a career, how was I going to raise my son, would I ever find love after divorce, pretty standard stuff.

So I prayed for what I wanted and for wisdom to ask what to pray for.

What I heard back from god was "go make some dough", "meet as many woman as you can", "spend as much time as you can with your kids", and "stop wasting the time I gave you by going to church".

Stupidly, I actually doubled down on church, but the harder I tried the farther away I got, almost as if I was being pushed away, until I finally got it.

Take a break.  You might like it. God's a sport. She'll understand.

1 hour ago, Clintonaldo said:

That’s the whole thing that has me wondering. It’s a great congregation that does a lot of good. It’s more of me wondering why I just stand there when everyone else is all in their feels. The service itself never hits me but being out and volunteering with them does. 

More contemporary services are highly emotive and geared towards the "moment". We recently moved to a more traditional service that has much greater diversity of engagement during the service. Hymns, some liturgy, greet your neighbor, creed, prayer, choral performance, sermon, etc. My wife and I get so much more out of if than any modern-style service. Everyone of different in how they connect to the divine of course. I'm just mentioning it because I related to some of the thoughts you were expressing here. Every church needs folks like you who are extremely service oriented.

 

1 hour ago, Clintonaldo said:

I can say I’ve never felt closer to Christ than with a charity I do that helps special needs people run triathlons and half marathons. 

Sounds to me like you understood the assignment.  

10 minutes ago, KYHorn said:

More contemporary services are highly emotive and geared towards the "moment". We recently moved to a more traditional service that has much greater diversity of engagement during the service. Hymns, some liturgy, greet your neighbor, creed, prayer, choral performance, sermon, etc. My wife and I get so much more out of if than any modern-style service. Everyone of different in how they connect to the divine of course. I'm just mentioning it because I related to some of the thoughts you were expressing here. Every church needs folks like you who are extremely service oriented.

 

And, if you are inspired by liturgy, often the small services have it, but in a more intimate setting, with people you get to know or already know  and often a pastor/minister with whom you have a relationship, or build one.

It amazes me that modern Christianity can fuck up grace.

Grace, dude,

 

25 minutes ago, Clintonaldo said:

Very kind thing to say and honestly it was weird yesterday during the service to think “ I wonder what Surly thinks”  but I value what people think here. 
 

I was very dejected after the election and was adamant among my peers we are hypocrites. I do live in the Bible Belt and have become somewhat disillusioned but it will never stop me from doing what I think is right. I am an extremely flawed person so if I am the key to change we are screwed. 

I get it, man. As a guy who grew up Christian but quickly found my way out of religion as an adult, I don't know how much I can speak to your current struggles if you're wanting to remain connected to the church.

But a decade ago, I would have thought it very strange to share personal difficulties on here, but now I find it therapeutic. (Mostly) strangers who share at least some common background that brought them to this site are able to air greivances, but there is also a wide range of experience and beliefs (yes, even in CR).

There was a time, as a younger man working through depression, when I found speaking to a therapist incredibly helpful, moreso than any meds. This was a Christian dude who I didn't know personally, but he didn't pass any judgement and he listened and responded as a total outsider to my immediate experience. I am still grateful.

Obviously this is not a judgement-free zone, or a treatment center for depression, but sharing personal shit with people who aren't intimately involved, and who may have some understanding of your general background, while also offering differing opinions, can be a useful resource. 

I have recently shared family drama on here that is difficult to discuss even with my spouse and siblings, who are generally on my side. But getting the perspective of others who aren't entangled in it daily, or simply venting, has helped me work through a lot of my shit.

I am with you. I haven't connected with a church in some time.

It becomes much easier once you get over feeling guilty about it.  Trying to help someone who really needs it does wonders for me.

2 hours ago, Clintonaldo said:

I put this here because it feels right. 
 

I go to church. I give back to the needy with my time and money yet I am not feeling it in church. We did Easter service yesterday because today would be packed but the whole time it felt like a Rolling Stones concert and it all felt so forced. I’ve never been one to raise hands and pray over people but I am one to actually help people. I just feel weird sometimes when almost everyone but me is singing and praising but I am just standing there. I wish I could get into it more but I just don’t feel ( that ).  I do give my church credit in that they do not get into politics so it isn’t that. I can say I’ve never felt closer to Christ than with a charity I do that helps special needs people run triathlons and half marathons. 

I just really wondered during the laser show yesterday am I the oddball or am I real ? Is this your 40’s??

I understand you completely and how you feel. I had thought of spending Easter at a church here. Then I decided that God is everywhere so instead I went to the beach for a few hours, got in the water and swam and just enjoyed the morning and thanked God for another day. 
 

I have been in spiritual ruts before. Most of my own making. You’ll get past this feeling, but just remember that God is wherever you are. You don’t need to be in a fancy church building to feel God. Keep doing your charity work and stick to the basic tenets of being a Christian according to what Jesus said. Everyday you get the chance to make someone’s life better that may never be able to return the favor. Feel the joy in that and the rest will follow.

44 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I grew up Baha'i, and I always thought it was great that there is no clergy or places of worship.  We would have Feasts, where a local Bahai'l family would offer to host at their house for potluck dinners in a relaxed atmosphere to read prayers and have discussions. Maybe 20-30 people max in attendance. 

One of the nicest celebrities I ever met was that faith. Rainn Wilson was so cool to everyone. I didn’t go up to him. He came to me and said hello and shook my hand while I was working. I remember him saying God Bless you to everyone and thanking them for stopping by to say hi while he was having lunch outside on the patio. 

Not quite the same thing you are going through, but I’ve had similar thoughts lately with Judaism. I’ve never been the most scripturally religious person, but I’ve always felt connected to “the community.”

But over the last year and a half, I’ve seen many of the loudest voices in “the community” endorse some of the most abhorrent ideals, many of which directly contradict the teachings that I was raised on.

Just kinda feel spiritually homeless most of the time, these days.

Friendship ended with Christianity. 

Now Buddhism is my best friend. 

I like to think of myself as one does not practice his faith casually, and as such I still attend church regularly. In most things, I am an advocate of modernity, but the changes in worship, across denominational lines has been dispiriting. One would have difficulty discerning the difference in the music at St.Ann and that offered at Gateway or some such. From the sterile, uninspiring, windowless auditoriums that typify most modern churches, to the annoying, loud, often poorly performed band music, churches have made change the calling card without mapping to anything remotely transcendent. In my tradition (the black church) the fadishness has reached riduculous levels, to the extent that choosing a worship style that motivates and inspires is virtually impossible. While I am theologically and doctrinally in sync with my local congregation, (“Christ centered, Justice Driven, Kingdom Minded), I struggle with the pandering to Gen Z and Generation Alpha that masquerades as disciplining. 
 

I believe the church must change or die, but I’m not entirely comfortable with all that’s being done in the name of change 

Rant over.

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by Satchel

Not religious. I understand people who cling to church for a sense of community, but just about nothing else about it makes sense to me, up to and including how many religious people are monstrous pieces of shit, how many children get raped/molested by "churchly folk", and how many people turn a blind eye to it because of reasons I can't possibly fathom.

I know that religious organizations can do a lot of good, but it's hard for me to see how Abrahamic religion is a net positive in the world. To me, it's hard to look past these religions being firmly in the Mount Rushmore of sources of death and suffering in the world.

I remember when I was 6 and my grandfather took me to Easter church. I had so many questions.

“Jesus sounds like a really cool guy!”
“Jesus died for your sins”
“So I don’t have sin?”
“No, you still have”
“Then why did he die”
“Well, god resurrected him to show he was more powerful than death”
“Oh that’s cool! So he is still alive?”
“No, he went to heaven”
“So he was dead? But he went and told all the people who killed him they were wrong?”
“No, the cave were his body laid was empty, so Mary knew he had risen”
“Oh, his mother, the Virgin Mary?”
“No, this Mary was a prostitute”
“So the prostitute said he was alive, but many other people saw him I guess? It must have been the talk of Jerusalem that a dead guy was alive”
“No, not really, but the gospels in the Bible wrote about it 70 to 150 years later”
“So why did he die again?”
“God works in mysterious ways boy”

I’ve had similar struggles - and I can readily say that modern contemporary worship does absolutely nothing for me - it all feels performative and pandering.

When I was living in London in the 90s, I became a big fan of Evensong, the Anglican evening service - and tried to attend regularly. That led me down the path towards more ancient liturgical worship, most notably that in the Anglican/Episcopal tradition. I ended up in an ELCA (Lutheran) congregation as a marriage compromise, but it’s similarly liturgical - and both denominations generally have a progressive serve-others focus which I also connect with.

All that to say, you might try a smaller more traditional/liturgical service (as mentioned above) to see what you think. 

5 minutes ago, Satchel said:

I like to think of myself as one does not practice his faith casually, and as such I still attend church regularly. In most things, I am an advocate of modernity, but the changes in worship, across denominational lines has been dispiriting. One would have difficulty discerning the difference in the music at St.Ann and that offered at Gateway or some such. From the sterile, uninspiring, windowless auditoriums that typify most modern churches, to the annoying, loud, often poorly performed band music, churches have made change the calling card without mapping to anything remotely transcendent. In my tradition (the black church) the fadishness has reached riduculous levels, to the extent that choosing a worship style that motivates and inspires is virtually impossible. While I am theologically and doctrinally in sync with my local congregation, (“Christ centered, Justice Driven, Kingdom Minded), I struggle with the pandering to Gen Z and Generation Alpha that masquerades as disciplining. 
 

I believe the church must change or die, but I’m not entirely comfortable with all that’s being done in the name of change 

Rant over.

I get all of this too. I sang in the choir in a black church in The Bronx called Parkchester Baptist. It was a traditional Baptist church and I loved it. A woman was the minister and she was great at delivering a Good Word. That church reminded me of singing in the choir at a black church in Oak Cliff when I was younger. I prefer the older songs and love to sing them. 

6 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Not religious. I understand people who cling to church for a sense of community, but just about nothing else about it makes sense to me, up to and including how many religious people are monstrous pieces of shit, how many children get raped/molested by "churchly folk", and how many people turn a blind eye to it because of reasons I can't possibly fathom.

I know that religious organizations can do a lot of good, but it's hard for me to see how Abrahamic religion is a net positive in the world. To me, it's hard to look past these religions being firmly in the Mount Rushmore of sources of death and suffering in the world.

You have a very valid point which becomes stronger when you don’t acknowledge the difference in application of a faith practiced by William Barber, Jim Walls, and that of Franklin Graham or Paula White.

2 hours ago, Bookman said:

Yeah it's hard to take seriously someone who votes for Trump and calls themselves a "Christian."  

This needs the most rep possible. 

3 hours ago, Bookman said:

Yeah it's hard to take seriously someone who votes for Trump and calls themselves a "Christian."  

I was recently in Rome and like everyone else visited the Vatican and Colosseum.  The tours emphasized how incredibly poorly Christians were treated by the Romans.  The cruel treatment was startling and seemed inexplicably excessive, but at some point I started thinking maybe there was just a big group of asshole Christians just like today.  Maybe they were like, we are Christian, and we follow the word of Christ.  By that we mean we really support Maximusdickus, the rapist, pedophile, business cheat, who wants to dungeon all the brown people, and destroy our economy and we really want him to be emperor.  So they just pissed everyone off and everyone got sick of their hypocritical shit and the rest is history.

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by Horn Dog

1 hour ago, Satchel said:

You have a very valid point which becomes stronger when you don’t acknowledge the difference in application of a faith practiced by William Barber, Jim Walls, and that of Franklin Graham or Paula White.

Not gonna lie, I haven't got a single clue who any of those people are

I was recently in Rome and like everyone else visited the Vatican and Colosseum.  The tours emphasized how incredibly poorly Christians were treated by the Romans.  The cruel treatment was startling and seemed inexplicably excessive, but at some point I started thinking maybe there was just a big group of asshole Christians just like today.  Maybe they were like, we are Christian, and we follow the word of Christ.  By that we mean we really support Maximusdickus, the rapist, pedophile, business cheat, who wants to dungeon all the brown people, and destroy our economy and we really want him to be emperor.  So they just pissed everyone off and everyone got sick of their hypocritical shit and the rest is history.

This is actually more than likely what happened. There were thousands of religious groups in Rome at the time. For them to single out Christians (doubtful) they must have been real assholes (probably).

1 hour ago, Horn Dog said:

I was recently in Rome and like everyone else visited the Vatican and Colosseum.  The tours emphasized how incredibly poorly Christians were treated by the Romans.  The cruel treatment was startling and seemed inexplicably excessive, but at some point I started thinking maybe there was just a big group of asshole Christians just like today.  Maybe they were like, we are Christian, and we follow the word of Christ.  By that we mean we really support Maximusdickus, the rapist, pedophile, business cheat, who wants to dungeon all the brown people, and destroy our economy and we really want him to be emperor.  So they just pissed everyone off and everyone got sick of their hypocritical shit and the rest is history.

you are doing the romans a massive disservice by equating their villainy with the infantile tantrums of the anti-christ world speed record attempt to destroy civilization

I am not religious and have gone to church only once as an adult so maybe this is a dumb question but why not just look for a different church if this one isn't giving you what you want? I'm sure there are plenty out there without laser shows and other performative aspects.