Tom "the turtle" Herman [Lame Duck or greatest 5d chess player ever?]

[bschoolprof 6,271]

cdt, god bless him, was actually quite anti-Herman when he was hired. But that was mainly because he was a charter member of the Strong mythological society. 

[Guest Lobo]

Averages 5 losses per season over his first 3 seasons at Texas.  Being paid nearly $700-$800k per victory at Texas.  By far and away the biggest financial fraud of the highest 7 paid coaches in the nation.  Maybe there's a reason no marquee coaches want to come to Texas. 

[El Squared 1,813]

On 11/18/2019 at 7:48 PM, Bevo said:

You can blame coaches all you want (Orlando, Meh, and a few others deserve it) but don't think for a minute that we have a bunch of early round NFL picks on the team.

They don’t have to be early round picks, they just have to not suck. Even average would be a step up. But we are below average in many areas.

[XYZ 2,154]

How many players are there in our team about whom you say “I’d rather have this guy than any other in the conference”? Maybe one on defense and two on offense, and Dicker?

[SilasCoade 2,622]

48 minutes ago, XYZ said:

How many players are there in our team about whom you say “I’d rather have this guy than any other in the conference”? Maybe one on defense and two on offense, and Dicker?

The only one I can say unequivocally is Collin Johnson.

[Burt Macklin 19,038]

1 hour ago, XYZ said:

How many players are there in our team about whom you say “I’d rather have this guy than any other in the conference”? Maybe one on defense and two on offense, and Dicker?

That’s a pretty high bar when you’re talking about the whole conference. Very few teams have more than 4 all conference guys and most all-conference players are upperclassmen. All of our upperclassmen are comprised of two underwhelming recruiting classes recruited primarily by Strong. 

16 minutes ago, Llogg said:

The only one I can say unequivocally is Collin Johnson.

Wut? He’s not even the best WR on our own team, and he’s nowhere near all-conference in the Big 12 this year.

[SilasCoade 2,622]

When healthy he's been dominant. He just can't stay healthy. But there's no one in the conference that matches his combo of size, speed, and body control. Duvernay's great and I wouldn't trade him, but CeeDee Lamb as an obvious comp would probably be a wash.

[tbone_ 14,147]

CJ reminds me of Lovell Pinkney

 

[nunna yo bizness 1,687]

1 hour ago, XYZ said:

How many players are there in our team about whom you say “I’d rather have this guy than any other in the conference”? Maybe one on defense and two on offense, and Dicker?

Why do people not understand that this is as much an indictment of player development by the coaches as it is the players themselves.  The recruiting rankings indicate there is plenty of talent potential here for us to win consistently and convincingly against all but the national top tier teams.  If they fail to do so because that talent potential is not being realized that is a lack of coaching.

Even 4 and 5 star players at Bama and OSU have to be coached and developed to achieve the level of success that their potential makes possible.  Do some top recruits still fail for other reasons?  Sure.  But the only reason a majority of top recruits would fail at a particular school is if they aren't coached.

[texashorn13 228]

59 minutes ago, Llogg said:

When healthy he's been dominant. He just can't stay healthy.

CJ in the NFL will carry on the brand of Texas players being soft.  He'll play 4 games a year and be "injured" often, much like here.

[jinx 2,635]

2 hours ago, texashorn13 said:

CJ in the NFL will carry on the brand of Texas players being soft.  He'll play 4 games a year and be "injured" often, much like here.

Yeah, I thought that identity had died with Strong, but I agree that it still holds for the most part. 

[Girdwood 118]

CJ9 has been a massive disappointment this season. 

[Treefidy 1,469]

23 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Forde-Yard Dash: Herman Still Has a Long Way to Go Before Texas Is Back

It’s been all about Baylor in the Lone Star State this season, as the Longhorns find themselves in the midst of another middling season.

PAT FORDE.   NOV 19, 2019

WE HAVE THIS UPDATE: TEXAS IS NOT BACK

Beware the fan base that reads too much into a non-playoff bowl victory. When Texas (31) handled a sulking Georgia team last year in the Sugar Bowl, a fan base exhausted by a decade-long malaise went ahead and proclaimed it: the Longhorns would be back as a national power in 2019. The Top 25 voters, addicted to brand names, bought in, ranked them in the top 10 entering the season despite significant losses on defense.

Everyone was, once again, wrong. Texas is not back, not close to back, and there is no reason to believe it will be back until proving it in games that actually matter.

After losing to Iowa State Saturday, the Longhorns are a pedestrian 6–4 and a pedestrian 4–3 in the Big 12. They are 23–14 overall under Tom Herman (32), and 16–10 in the league. While that is certainly an improvement over the Charlie Strong body of work (16–21, 12–15 Big 12), it is nearly identical to the last three seasons under Mack Brown (33), which were considered major disappointments. Brown was 25–14 overall, 16–11 in the league.

It also puts Herman pretty much in line with the other Big 12 coaches not named Lincoln Riley who have been in the conference since 2017. Oklahoma State’s Mike Gundy is 24–12, 13–12; TCU’s Gary Patterson is 23–14, 14–12; Iowa State’s Matt Campbell is 22–14, 15–10; and Baylor’s Matt Rhule is 17–18, 11–14.

With nearly a three-year body of work, there is no discernible difference between the Longhorns under Herman and the rest of the upper-middle class of the Big 12. Everyone is chasing Oklahoma in a muddled pack.

Thing is, there is supposed to be a difference between Texas and the rest of the upper-middle class. The recruiting rankings suggest that there should be. The tradition screams that there should be. The results aren’t there.

Even the game-by-game results reinforce the fact that Texas is not operating on a different level. Under Herman, 15 out of 26 conference games have been decided by one score or less. Average score of the Horns’ Big 12 games this season: Texas 32.9, opponents 32.4. Three of the past four have been decided by a field goal on the final play.

Currently, Baylor is the Lone Star State team putting together a special season. Texas has a chance to do damage to that Saturday in Waco, and to keep its own conference title hopes alive. But anything short of a surprise Big 12 title game appearance and upset of Oklahoma will be viewed as coming up short in 2019.

None of this means Texas will never be back under Herman. It does mean that the Longhorns have a long way yet to go. And it means that they should have to prove they’re back before saying they’re back.

Tl;dr  the best Herman can do this year by winning out is equal the win/loss total for the last 3 years of fupm that got him fired.  

Extension looking pretty dumb right about now.  

[alphahorn 1,637]

9 hours ago, XYZ said:

How many players are there in our team about whom you say “I’d rather have this guy than any other in the conference”? Maybe one on defense and two on offense, and Dicker?

i don't get these posts.  what's your point? our players suck? or although there were highly touted in high school they haven't been developed or put into a system that best utilizes their talent. just because a team doesn't have a lot of all conference players doesn't mean it's an indictment on the players, more times than not it't the coaches fault for elite programs.

[Jkwellborn 6,727]

Tl;dr  the best Herman can do this year by winning out is equal the win/loss total for the last 3 years of fupm that got him fired.  
Extension looking pretty dumb right about now.  

It was dumb anyway.

[XYZ 2,154]

33 minutes ago, alphahorn said:

i don't get these posts.  what's your point? our players suck? or although there were highly touted in high school they haven't been developed or put into a system that best utilizes their talent. just because a team doesn't have a lot of all conference players doesn't mean it's an indictment on the players, more times than not it't the coaches fault for elite programs.

Just a question.

[ada_flash 1]

If you want to beat Oklahoma, you would go get Leach and Venables.   You would win for the next 5 years.   But buying out Herman would not leave you the money to do that.  And I doubt Venables could be persuaded.  But Leach could.  For about 30 MM, you could pull this off.

[Dbeasy 15,085]

If you want to beat Oklahoma, you would go get Leach and Venables.   You would win for the next 5 years.   But buying out Herman would not leave you the money to do that.  And I doubt Venables could be persuaded.  But Leach could.  For about 30 MM, you could pull this off.

Leach has lost his mind, wasting hundreds of hours with his QB’s blabbing about random crap during what we’re supposed to be film sessions. Forget leach. Funny but no longer functional.

[PilotsError 2,318]

Leach is an amusing story from afar.  

[Girdwood 118]

2 hours ago, Treefidy said:

Tl;dr  the best Herman can do this year by winning out is equal the win/loss total for the last 3 years of fupm that got him fired.  

Extension looking pretty dumb right about now.  

Yup. That extension may ultimately end up costing CDC his dream job if we keep Herman for two more years. 

It was reactionary and frankly, unnecessary. No one was hiring Herman away from Texas.

[Dbeasy 15,085]

Highly recommend people go read Orgeron’s wiki page. It’s an interesting story of a coach that changed many times over his career to be a more effective coach.

Orgeron gets roasted on surly all the time as being an idiot, and he’s doesn’t seem like the sharpest tool in the shed, but some people recognize their weakness and take actions to address them. Props to Orgeron for figuring out how to change for the better.

He also has excellent career experience under many great coaches. Surly underrates that experience. Will he succeed long-term? Who knows.

Now Herman has the exact same opportunity that Orgeron has gone thru. We will figure out in the next twelve months whether this is a guy that can properly balance his own knowledge and beliefs with the need for change, and whether he can figure out the right type of change to make.

I’m not sure whether we need two new coordinators, or just changes to lower level staff, but cross your fingers that Herman can figure this out. I haven’t jumped off the Herman bus yet but I was late off the Strong bus too so maybe I’m too patient.

[Loch Ness Monster 3,533]

He won't. Herman needs to be at somewhere like Houston again.

[Nivek 16,982]

Highly recommend people go read Orgeron’s wiki page. It’s an interesting story of a coach that changed many times over his career to be a more effective coach.

Orgeron gets roasted on surly all the time as being an idiot, and he’s doesn’t seem like the sharpest tool in the shed, but some people recognize their weakness and take actions to address them. Props to Orgeron for figuring out how to change for the better.

He also has excellent career experience under many great coaches. Surly underrates that experience. Will he succeed long-term? Who knows.

Now Herman has the exact same opportunity that Orgeron has gone thru. We will figure out in the next twelve months whether this is a guy that can properly balance his own knowledge and beliefs with the need for change, and whether he can figure out the right type of change to make.

I’m not sure whether we need two new coordinators, or just changes to lower level staff, but cross your fingers that Herman can figure this out. I haven’t jumped off the Herman bus yet but I was late off the Strong bus too so maybe I’m too patient.

Charlie Strong seemed competent at one point. Mack Brown and Greg Davis were riding high at one point as well and took down a very talented team with a super bowl winning coach.

Lsu is good because of a new OC and a very good QB. Let’s see them in the playoffs before we start lining up to naked wrestle their coach.

[Brothahorn 10,087]

Highly recommend people go read Orgeron’s wiki page. It’s an interesting story of a coach that changed many times over his career to be a more effective coach.

Orgeron gets roasted on surly all the time as being an idiot, and he’s doesn’t seem like the sharpest tool in the shed, but some people recognize their weakness and take actions to address them. Props to Orgeron for figuring out how to change for the better.

He also has excellent career experience under many great coaches. Surly underrates that experience. Will he succeed long-term? Who knows.

Now Herman has the exact same opportunity that Orgeron has gone thru. We will figure out in the next twelve months whether this is a guy that can properly balance his own knowledge and beliefs with the need for change, and whether he can figure out the right type of change to make.

I’m not sure whether we need two new coordinators, or just changes to lower level staff, but cross your fingers that Herman can figure this out. I haven’t jumped off the Herman bus yet but I was late off the Strong bus too so maybe I’m too patient.

So by the time Herman is recycled to TCU/Baylor/Tech, he’ll have shit figured.

[tx 3 putt 77,358]

Prayers for the Surley servers today, it’s going to get ugly 

[hornhorn 100]

25 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

Prayers for the Surley servers today, it’s going to get ugly 

[Surly Bevo 25,141]

1 minute ago, hornhorn said:

Those servers are going to need real prayers.

[hornhorn 100]

2 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

Those servers are going to need real prayers.

All I could do was a fake Joel Osteen. 

[Nolacycling 893]

Not that Herman would give up OC duties, but I wonder if Ferentz jr would do a good job here. The family background is offensive line and they don't score a lot but since beating Minn. ,he's been doing well. Maybe it's time to turn the tables on B12 and give our D a rest while we grind it out.

I'd like to think he'd be working w/better athletes.

[DanTheHorn 4,961]

Tom says "Our season has been eerily  similar to Baylor" but worse. He says it like it is good thing. Texas football has been similar to Baylor, TCU and OKST for to long. I hope Tom gets trounced today so some of this stupid smug shit hopefully washes off him.

[Jkwellborn 6,727]

Not that Herman would give up OC duties, but I wonder if Ferentz jr would do a good job here. The family background is offensive line and they don't score a lot but since beating Minn. ,he's been doing well. Maybe it's time to turn the tables on B12 and give our D a rest while we grind it out.
I'd like to think he'd be working w/better athletes.

Well Tim Beck is the OC. He seems to have the background you are asking. That shit sucks. No one wants to watch old sec football or big 10 sleep fests.

[MrBig 5,431]

10 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

Tom says "Our season has been eerily  similar to Baylor" but worse. He says it like it is good thing. Texas football has been similar to Baylor, TCU and OKST for to long. I hope Tom gets trounced today so some of this stupid smug shit hopefully washes off him.

If you have to resort to comparing yourself to Baylor in any way, shape, or form, it’s time to GTFO.

[victory88 5,669]

Put us out of this misery CDC.  Fire this smug fraud.  You've got a 2 time national championship coach sitting that would win a championship here within 3 years.  Make the fucking move.

[alphahorn 1,637]

there better not be one returning assistant coach on the offensive side of the ball. A complete overhaul from beck all the way down.

[Thetexashammer 1,062]

1 minute ago, alphahorn said:

there better not be one returning assistant coach on the offensive side of the ball. A complete overhaul from beck all the way down.

Herb Hand can stay.

[alphahorn 1,637]

Just now, Thetexashammer said:

Herb Hand can stay.

yeah the oline looks all world, wtf

[alphahorn 1,637]

yeah herb hand has revolutionized our running game

[Vic Mackey 47,136]

Matt Rhule takes over Baylor after the Briles/rape scandal. Went 1-11 in 2017. And now has his team at 9-1. At fucking Baylor. Meanwhile we have never consistently gotten better besides an outlier year last season. We do nothing but spin our wheels.

[Funk Doctor Spock 12,501]

Just now, Vic Mackey said:

Matt Rhule takes over Baylor after the Briles/rape scandal. Went 1-11 in 2017. And now has his team at 9-1. At fucking Baylor. Meanwhile we have never consistently gotten better besides an outlier year last season. We do nothing but spin our wheels.

Backing into a Sugar Bowl and Sam doing the "we're baaaaaaaaaack" looks more and more cringe as every game passes. 

[MrBig 5,431]

Just saw Tom’s melon smashing into the helmet. What a try hard. This is the same shit as the baseball bat and the ring necklace and the grill shit he did at Houston. You don’t have to try really really hard like this when people genuinely like you.

[6th Street 6,493]

Fuck this guy for raping this football program and subjecting us to this garbage 

[Loch Ness Monster 3,533]

I'm depressed cause I know Herman will be back next year.

[crony 362]

There's nothing more we need to see from this fucking fraud. Move the fuck on NOW!!!

[bigcigar 1,164]

Fuck you Tom Herman

[mdmost 43,035]

This is Charlie all over again. We bring in this guy because he’s “an offensive genius” and proceed to only score 3 points on Baylor.

[naija 2,869]

the team clearly knows what they are at this point

[Capn81 373]

Herb Hand can stay.

Why? His line is fucking awful.

[6th Street 6,493]

Herman sucks at everything 

[Eastwood 4,394]

Hiring a G5 up and comer is no longer viable in modern college football. Matt Rhule is lightning in a bottle. Nothing at Temple indicated that he was going to be able to pull this season off. Poach a P5 winner or give up on the football program.

Edited November 23, 2019 by Eastwood

[The People’s Elbow 707]

The cake is baked. Turns out, it’s made out of literal shit.