Tom "the turtle" Herman [Lame Duck or greatest 5d chess player ever?]

[Surly Bevo 24698]

3 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Ha. He's 2-2, not 0-4 or 1-3. Get me a list of non-shit programs that fire their coach mid season. I'll wait. 

Bottom line, Veruca. He's not getting fired until the end of the season, regardless of how much you stomp your feet and want it now. 

I would caveat this.  He should be fired right now IF and only if you have Urban locked in and frankly you just announce that at the same time.  100% agree you don't fire him now just to do a coaching search while an interim flails about.  But if you could pull off Urban (big if) then you absolutely get it out there post haste, eliminate all uncertainty on future direction yada yada yada.

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

Just now, mdmost said:

Or Ewers decommits the second you fire Herman mid-season. Firing Herman isn't going to improve recruiting until his replacement is announced and is calling players.

The sooner you get his replacement the better. Not waiting until January to get that replacement. Especially when the obvious replacement isn’t coaching anywhere currently. 

[Herpa Derpa 6115]

2 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Ha. He's 2-2, not 0-4 or 1-3. Get me a list of non-shit programs that fire their coach mid season. I'll wait. 

Bottom line, Veruca. He's not getting fired until the end of the season, regardless of how much you stomp your feet and want it now. 

This ain't 1995 anymore.  Early signing day is December 16, 2020.  Not firing a lame duck Coach prior to that day is poor management.  Keep Tom until after the season and then fire him, and you're likely going to obliterate both the 2021 and 2022 classes.  You do it as soon as you decide it's going to need to be done.  Anything else is what shit programs do.

[Bodacious Bevo 3576]

1 minute ago, mdmost said:

Ha. He's 2-2, not 0-4 or 1-3. Get me a list of non-shit programs that fire their coach mid season. I'll wait. 

Bottom line, Veruca. He's not getting fired until the end of the season, regardless of how much you stomp your feet and want it now. 

Off the top of my head, LSU, FSU, and Florida all fired their last coach mid-season 

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

Just now, Herpa Derpa said:

This ain't 1995 anymore.  Early signing day is December 16, 2020.  Not firing a lame duck Coach prior to that day is poor management.  Keep Tom until after the season and then fire him, and you're likely going to obliterate both the 2021 and 2022 classes.  You do it as soon as you decide it's going to need to be done.  Anything else is what shit programs do.

Yup!!!

[ztejas 43266]

5 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Ha. He's 2-2, not 0-4 or 1-3. Get me a list of non-shit programs that fire their coach mid season. I'll wait. 

Don't worry, you don't have to wait that long. LSU and USC off the top of my head. OU fired their DC mid season 2 years ago. I don't feel like spending a bunch of time finding more examples. 

[Red Five 40684]

Just now, Bodacious Bevo said:

Off the top of my head, LSU, FSU, and Florida all fired their last coach mid-season 

USC and Lane Kiffin. 

[Dbeasy 14975]

I don't think we need to break it down piece by piece like this is some hard decision and that we need to "move in a different direction".
He fucking sucks. I want him out. I dont care why he sucks at this point or what he could have done differently - he didn't do those things. Winning 8 games at Texas is so. fucking. easy. Or at least it should be. Top 10 recruiting classes come here almost by default. We fired Mack for winning 8 games. Fucking John Mackovic won a B12 title here. 

You have to do that, so that we can all understand how, after he’s fired, he goes on to even greater success at another program, like Mack Brown, Rick Barnes, Manny Diaz, etc.

[Bill Lumbergh 7171]

Off the top of my head, LSU, FSU, and Florida all fired their last coach mid-season 

LSU almost screwed themselves over by not firing Miles early enough.

[Texas7 3]

6 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Lol. QB battle? Have you seen this kid play? Maybe we RS him but he's starting from day one after that afaic. 

That is if he doesn't decommit.

To be honest I haven’t had a chance to see him play.. I know he’s the top recruit.. I don’t see him going anywhere though.. from what I’ve heard he’s like Sam bleeds burnt orange since he was a kid.

[Liquor and Poker 3659]

Just now, Red Five said:

USC and Lane Kiffin. 

Fuck I’d hire Kiffin right now if it meant no more Pee Wee. 

[6th Street 6357]

Man could you imagine the kind of garbage Herman would surround Ewers with? A bunch of 2 and 3 star OL, WR that can't get open, and zero running game. 

[Surly Bevo 24698]

1 minute ago, Dbeasy said:

You have to do that, so that we can all understand how, after he’s fired, he goes on to even greater success at another program, like Mack Brown, Rick Barnes, Manny Diaz, etc.

Let me know when Mack wins a National Championship at UNC and Rick Barnes makes the FF.  You may have something on Diaz

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

2 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

You have to do that, so that we can all understand how, after he’s fired, he goes on to even greater success at another program, like Mack Brown, Rick Barnes, Manny Diaz, etc.

I mean...I know we encourage hyperbole here, but come on...

[Bevo 13529]

11 minutes ago, ztejas said:

  15 minutes ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

There’s a zero chance Herman gets fired today. I can’t believe some of y’all are seriously thinking it will happen. 
 

If he gets fired it will be at seasons end.

You may be right, but that can't happen logistically. It will fuck up the career of whoever we hire next. Recruits are going to bail knowing that the staff is the walking dead and with COVID and early signing, there will be no way for the new coach to bring in the players we need to compete in 2021. Logistically, we need to get rid of Herman ASAP and promote someone in the current staff as interim head coach. For an easy transition, Urban would be ideal. He would keep the good staff, announce a splash OL coach, and let the media start a positive message of an upcoming new and improved UT football program. Meanwhile, the current staff consisting of the guys he would keep could continue to recruit and bring in the necessary talent to improve from our current suckage. 

[BevoSwag 272]

11 hours ago, MIkeHoncho said:

we would need 4 more wins in 6 games.  My best guess is below.  

KSU = L

OSU = L

KU = W

ISU = Tossup (leaning L)

WVU = Tossup (leaning W)

BU = Tossup 

Nah.  We'll pound Baylor but they will give all of us COVID19 and season ends

[Billy Pilgrim 1913]

14 minutes ago, Ghost of Stevie Ray said:

Here’s where I’m at on Monday morning:
 

Tom had to realize how big this game was for his future at Texas.  Even for all his arrogance, the drums of hot seat have been banging for a year.  AND you’re coming off two horrid games.

AND HE STILL COULDNT GET HIS TEAM PREPARED FOR AN EXTREMELY WINNABLE GAME.  
 

It’s over for Tom and I truly hope CDC doesn’t elongate the inevitable.  

I think Herman realized how big this game was for his future. I’ve never seen him so demonstrative in the sidelines after a player mistake.

[Bill Lumbergh 7171]

I think Herman realized how big this game was for his future. I’ve never seen him so demonstrative in the sidelines after a player mistake.

I think he did, too, and seeing how obviously unprepared we were tells me that he can't do this job. He knew the importance of this one, and we had nothing.

[Captain Ron 12812]

10 hours ago, 927 E. 41st said:

Why would that be all they would get? As a donor you can put any conditions on it that you wish. They are free to turn it down.

IMHO, the BMDs are lucky to get a say in the coaching process, after Herman being here shows how much they can screw this up.

We pay CDC and others to run the athletic department. Either they do that or they turn over that job to the BMDs in return for the big checks. And if the BMDs are going to put so many strings on their checks, then yes, CDC should be telling them "Thanks, but no thanks."

Our team stinks, if the BMDs want to fix that they get to turn over a check that says "Fire Tom Herman" on the memo line, anything beyond that is a bridge too far.

[Blotto 23434]

Maybe the recruits bail, maybe they stay...lot of unknowns in how that will turn out. But we've been trying the good recruits/shitty coach routine for about 10 years in both football and basketball, and the results speak for themselves. Fix the coaching problem correctly and the recruits will come back. If we take a hit for a year, what's the downside? Another mediocre season? 

 

[Red Five 40684]

I'd like to hear the argument for why we don't fire him today. Other than "we don't do that here". 

Imagine what our recruits will be hearing from Riley, Jimbo, etc. over the next two months. 

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

23 minutes ago, Nueces River Rat said:

Maybe a few weeks before seasons end if the rest of October is a carbon copy of last Saturday.      Especially if Okie State dog stomps us or if we lose to WVU at Home.   And saying that may it be "Rout 66" style in either one.  This  will without any doubt move the needle quickly.

That’s the thing, all of our games are the same. Super close nail biter with a OMFG WTF moment. This team could be 4-0 just as easily as 1-3. If you take the Tech crazy comeback away we are 1-3 and if you take away the goal line fumble we are 3-1 and that is what you will get with Herman moving forward every game no matter who we play. So I highly doubt we will get a Route 66 like a Charlie strong would get. 
 

we probably go .500 down the stretch and cdc gives him another year. I want urban and I’m hoping I’m wrong.

[mdmost 42869]

2 minutes ago, Red Five said:

I'd like to hear the argument for why we don't fire him today. Other than "we don't do that here". 

Imagine what our recruits will be hearing from Riley, Jimbo, etc. over the next two months. 

21 million dollars that we don't have unless donors want to pay the buyout. The same reason Shaka is still at Texas. 

Look, I'll be very happy to be wrong on all counts. I don't see him pulling this out. He had his chance with new coordinators and it's more of the same. 

Edited October 12, 2020 by mdmost

[6th Street 6357]

We are 6-6 against the Big 12 dating back to the beginning of 2019

[Red Five 40684]

1 minute ago, mdmost said:

21 million dollars that we don't have unless donors want to pay the buyout. The same reason Shaka is still at Texas. 

I meant now as opposed to two months from now, if the decision has already been made. 

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

1 minute ago, Red Five said:

I'd like to hear the argument for why we don't fire him today. Other than "we don't do that here". 

Imagine what our recruits will be hearing from Riley, Jimbo, etc. over the next two months. 

It doesn’t matter what our argument is. I don’t think anyone disagrees I’m saying like others is that’s not CDC style. Mid season firing in college football is very rare. USC did it? I mean maybe I’m missing all the mid season firings that happen every year?

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

2 minutes ago, mdmost said:

21 million dollars that we don't have unless donors want to pay the buyout. The same reason Shaka is still at Texas. 

Look, I'll be very happy to be wrong on all counts. I don't see him pulling this out. He had his chance with new coordinators and it's more of the same. 

Does aggy ever have any money for the dumb shit they do? No, but they find a way to get it done. 

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

1 minute ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

It doesn’t matter what our argument is. I don’t think anyone disagrees I’m saying like others is that’s not CDC style. Mid season firing in college football is very rare. USC did it? I mean maybe I’m missing all the mid season firings that happen every year?

Dude it’s been pointed out to you multiple programs on our level of program has done it. And as the poster said earlier this isnt 1995 anymore. Early signing period has changed the game and we need to adjust or we will fall behind in two recruiting cycles, not just one. 

[Beantown Express 2.0 6555]

1 minute ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

It doesn’t matter what our argument is. I don’t think anyone disagrees I’m saying like others is that’s not CDC style. Mid season firing in college football is very rare. USC did it? I mean maybe I’m missing all the mid season firings that happen every year?

It is rare but coaches like Urban Meyer sitting out there is also rare, no?   Has CDC come out and given Herman the dreaded “vote of confidence” yet?  If he hasn’t, why not done!

[Herpa Derpa 6115]

4 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

It won’t happen now. It could happen if he truly has lost the team and we suffering more embarrassing defeats. I think we rally somewhat, finish like 6-4, and he’s fired before a bowl game. 

I note your tone - like that of Texas bloggers - has evolved from “he’s not being fired before the 2021 season” to “he’s not being fired mid-season ‘20.”

This team is checking out of the season.  OU post-game sprint to the locker room tells you that.  Texas players leaving the field at the Cotton Bowl smiling and laughing tells you that.  A slaughter in Stillwater on Halloween awaits.  We are hoping and praying that Texas can beat Baylor because otherwise you're staring at a 2-4 team.  Lose to Baylor and Texas will likely only be favored in one remaining game (Kansas) and that's a road game.  Every team gives Texas a Super Bowl effort.  All the remaining teams, sans Kansas, have the weapons to beat Texas.  Do you honestly think THIS team could rally in Stillwater or Manhattan?  They are poorly coached and they know it.  They are poorly developed and they know it.  They are watching their former 4 and 5 star colleagues around the country line up for the draft while watching Cosmi slip into the middle rounds.  Texas coddles their players.  Those type of kids don't rally.  Remember when they did it for Charlie?  Lasted all of one game/half.  They're not asked to sacrifice and dig down deep to see the field.  That's the ingredients you need to "rally".

It's over, Johnny.  

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

Team walking off the field abandoning the starting QB and staff says exactly that, they’re done for the season. 
 

nothing in this coaches or players history here says they are going to recover. 

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

some Of you guys are taking “it won’t happen today” as “we don’t think he should be fired today”.

i want him gone more than anyone but that doesn’t change the way our AD does business. Like it or not he’s here through the year.

I don’t think the buyout is that big of a deal but I think cdc has the covid-19 and social justice stuff locked and loaded as a excuse to keep him one more year. Hope I’m wrong.

[South Austin 52162]

1 minute ago, Herpa Derpa said:

Do you honestly think THIS team could rally in Stillwater or Manhattan? 

Sure we could.  But then we'd lose in overtime or turn the ball over in the final minute of regulation.

[Surly Bevo 24698]

Jim McElwain Florida...fired midseason

Lester Miles LSU....fired midseason

Lane Kiffin USC....fired midseason

Randy Edsall Maryland....fired midseason

Fat Charlie Weiss Kansas....fired midseason

Mike Stoops Arizona....fired midseason

Tyrone Whittingham Notre Dame....fired midseason

Tommy Bowden Clemson....fired midseason

And there are tons more...it happens ALL the fucking time

Edited October 12, 2020 by Surly Bevo

[utexas8 1433]

I'd like to hear the argument for why we don't fire him today. Other than "we don't do that here". 
Imagine what our recruits will be hearing from Riley, Jimbo, etc. over the next two months. 

They’re not going to fire him now. I wish they would but it doesn’t do anything. Unless they hired Meyer right away and he could start recruiting. But who coaches the games now? I’m not sure who the assistant is so I’m sure they would. Kind of weird someone else coaching but Meyer recruiting. I mean, in the end it helps Texas more because Meyer can recruit earlier but that’s if they were to hire him right now. If they wait till the season is close to being over, the recruits will be hearing the same thing they would right now.

Screwed either way with recruits UNLESS they hired Meyer now, which they won’t. Thankfully the recruiting class isn’t too good anyway. Looks like a transition class.


Our only hope he gets fired right now is if he keeps losing and gets blown out. He’s never been the one to get blown out.

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

Just now, Surly Bevo said:

Jim McElwain Florida...fired midseason

Lester Miles LSU....fired midseason

Lane Kiffin USC....fired midseason

Randy Edsall Maryland....fired midseason

Fat Charlie Weiss Kansas....fired midseason

Mike Stoops Arizona....fired midseason

Tyrone Whittingham Notre Dame....fired midseason

And there are tons more...it happens ALL the fucking time

Cool well let’s hope you’re right. I’d be beyond excited to see Herman gone today.  

[maninblack 7974]

7 minutes ago, mdmost said:

The same reason Shaka is still at Texas. 

Shaka was gone if Covid doesn't happen

[Texas7 3]

1 minute ago, South Austin said:

Sure we could.  But then we'd lose in overtime or turn the ball over in the final minute of regulation.

Or an Ok St player would talk about a UT players momma and get a stupid personal foul in a critical moment of the game.

[BurntOrange&White 39690]

If he isn’t fired now then the next best opportunity to salvage anything we have left of a 2021 recruiting class will be after the West Virginia game. 
 

we are likely to go 0-3 at worst or 1-2 at best imo. 

[Herpa Derpa 6115]

25 minutes ago, BevoSwag said:

Nah.  We'll pound Baylor but they will give all of us COVID19 and season ends

A Tom Herman led Texas team has never pounded a conference opponent.  He saves that for the UTEPs and Rices of the world.

[Dbeasy 14975]

Let me know when Mack wins a National Championship at UNC and Rick Barnes makes the FF.  You may have something on Diaz

How about just a conference championship, given that we can’t even do that in either sport.

[Herpa Derpa 6115]

3 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

I’ve thought worse Texas teams were done. We have too much talent. Herman will find a way to make it respectable. It doesn’t change the fact that he needs to go and nothing can change that now. Nothing. 

You have way too much faith in a man that has done nothing to earn that faith.  The talent regresses and is misused.  As others pointed out, this was arguably the most crucial game of Herman's career at Texas and he had nothing new to bring to the table.  He needed another Sam miracle just to avoid a two touchdown loss.

Edited October 12, 2020 by Herpa Derpa

[closetohumping 17408]

4 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

How about just a conference championship, given that we can’t even do that in either sport.

Yes let me know when any of them win their conference

[Sheep Have Wool 1053]

44 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Lol. QB battle? Have you seen this kid play? Maybe we RS him but he's starting from day one after that afaic.

I've always thought you'd make an excellent aggy.

[GreenspointTexas 9568]

Tom only has 3 losses in his last 4 years by more than 9 points

 

the rest of the season will be meh, but hes done in january for sure. No fucking way hes back for 2021... especially if we go 6-4 and lose our bowl game

[Wally Pryor 5244]

31 minutes ago, BevoSwag said:

Nah.  We'll pound Baylor but they will give all of us COVID19 and season ends

Lulz.  This team doesn't pound anyone.   Outside of Ehlinger and Ossai it's soft as shit, full of entitlement and lacking discipline, direction and drive .  What would you expect?   Their coach is a fraud - full of gimmicks and cute shtick but short on pretty much anything meaningful when it comes to being a good coach.    

We do continue to climb the charts in the most-penalized rankings.   Wonder if this was brought up yesterday at another great Sunday practice?  

[Red Five 40684]

3 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Tom only has 3 losses in his last 4 years by more than 9 points

 

the rest of the season will be meh, but hes done in january for sure. No fucking way hes back for 2021... especially if we go 6-4 and lose our bowl game

Holding on to him until after the first signing day would be the stupidest fucking thing imaginable, outside of bringing him back next year.

So yeah, maybe. 

[HillaryFan420 121]

13 hours ago, Schulz2.0 said:

Force the players to stay out for The Eyes. 

lmao.  This sounds like 9.95 fan fiction (Is this Nahlin? The eyes thing has made him short circuit.) but who knows maybe it's true.

Edited October 12, 2020 by HillaryFan420

[Treefidy 1463]

1 hour ago, Bevo VIII said:

The bye week is the best time to fire him. No point in keeping a lame duck coach to the end of the season. Especially with early signing period in recruiting now. 
 

you’re probably right though. 
 

it’s best to move on and begin the search/hiring process to salvage the 2021 class and start working their 2022 class 

The only way he gets fired mid-season is Urban says yes, otherwise it’s end of season because coaches aren’t available yet.

if Urban declines and UNC keeps winning, everyone should get a little nervous.  But seriously, I would welcome Mack back for 2021 before I would welcome Mensa back, and that’s saying a lot.   Going 11-1 and losing to OU every year is better than going 7-5 and losing to OU every year.  

[Vertigo 20267]

9 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Tom only has 3 losses in his last 4 years by more than 9 points

 

the rest of the season will be meh, but hes done in january for sure. No fucking way hes back for 2021... especially if we go 6-4 and lose our bowl game

So have we officially entered the aggy realm of competitive losses?