Tom "the turtle" Herman [Lame Duck or greatest 5d chess player ever?]

[Nicole44 22028]

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

While it is true that Herman's hiring was a completely impulsive move, that does not exclude it from being the best option at the time.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/athlonsports.com/college-football/grading-college-footballs-head-coach-hires-2017%3famp
 

the article speaks to your point. They called it the number one hire. Here are coaches also hired that same year:

PJ Fleck, Matt Rhule, Lincoln Riley, Ed O, Luke Fickell. I realize we couldn’t stoop to Rhule or Fleck or Fickell but all three look like better hires now. Jmo.

[mdmost 42876]

#

Edited October 4, 2020 by mdmost

[Brothahorn 10085]

 Shanahan doesn’t seem to much care/remember that he played here. Maybe he does but it doesn’t seem like it. I doubt he has some burning desire to return.

Plus he needs to work on finishing a big game.

[Huckleberry 32710]

10 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

While it is true that Herman's hiring was a completely impulsive move, that does not exclude it from being the best option at the time.

This is correct. Herman was rushed, but going back through who was available in late 2016 he was still the best option of an underwhelming pool given available information at that time.

[tejas60 3529]

4 hours ago, Xian said:

Lol. Some of y’all need to relax some 

Dude,

[TexMexBuddha 987]

1 hour ago, Domedriver said:

I really don’t want some big name retread like Urban, or Saban.  I want someone proven but young.  I would love for us to money whip Kyle Shanahan into coming home.  Or go crazy and get the Pirate and drive all the fat girl friends off the team!

This is my answer as well. I kinda wished he had won it already @ San Francisco (...washes my mouth with soap) so he'd have that out of his system. Sucks probability didn't land it that way for us and gave us Covid and Mensa perpetuation instead. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by TexMexBuddha

[Shaggy3.0 1695]

17 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

This is correct. Herman was rushed, but going back through who was available in late 2016 he was still the best option of an underwhelming pool given available information at that time.

True. But we rushed ourselves to hire a new coach in 2016 when we knew the best available candidates were underwhelming.  Charlie went full Charlie with the KU loss. He needed to go.  We didn't want a throw-away year by letting him hang around, so those in charge of hiring convinced themselves Herman needed to happen ASAP.  Now, we're totally cool with throw away seasons.  Our standards have fallen.

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Shaggy3.0

[pearlandhorn 3269]

Maybe herman will pull a herman and get beat by KU. We’d have all the data points we need to can his ass.

Edited October 4, 2020 by pearlandhorn

[Hagbard Celine 10772]

1 hour ago, Bevo VIII said:

Nah he was a coordinator at the time of hire so therefore according to Texas fans he would be ineligible to be hired here at the time of hire.

Eligible:

Clemson OC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Elliott_(American_football_coach)

After attending the United States Air Force Academy Preparatory School as a football recruit in 1997, Elliott played college football at Clemson University under head coach Tommy Bowden. He came to Clemson in the fall of 1999 as a walk-on. He was selected team captain in 2003, a rare accomplishment for a walk-on.[2] He finished his career at Clemson with 4 letters and 44 games with 4 starts.  Elliott graduated with a bachelor's degree in industrial engineering  in 2002 with a team-high 3.55 GPA. Upon graduation, he worked for Michelin North America for two years.

 

[dcar00 14044]

16 minutes ago, Shaggy3.0 said:

True. But we rushed ourselves to hire a new coach in 2016 when we knew the best available candidates were underwhelming.  Charlie went full Charlie with the KU loss. He needed to go.  We didn't want a throw-away year by letting him hang around, so those in charge of hiring convinced themselves Herman needed to happen ASAP.  Now, we're totally cool with throw away seasons.  Our standards have fallen.

 

we gave an extension for a sugar bowl win and a 4 loss record.  we are happy with that.  We are the new Texas.

[HillaryFan420 121]

Herman had an extremely thin resume when he was hired here.  Being an OC under Urban tells you pretty much nothing about what he can offer as a HC and his brief tenure at UH wasn't any more distinguished than Sumlin's.  Indeed, Sumlin's final team at UH was much better than either of Tom's.  He had a load of hype though.  

[Huckleberry 32710]

Just now, dcar00 said:

we gave an extension for a sugar bowl win and a 4 loss record.  we are happy with that.  We are the new Texas.

You have to give an extension every year so the coach can tell recruits he'll be there for their whole career. The issue is giving more buyout money. A 4 loss season with a Sugar Bowl win should be a one year extension and a reduction in buyout from the previous season.

For example, if the buyout before that season was 100% of owed salary for the remaining 4 years on the contract then the extension year should require only 50% of that year for a buyout. 

[6th Street 6358]

25 minutes ago, pearlandhorn said:

Maybe herman will pull a herman and get beat by KU. We’d have all the data points we need to can his ass.

Inshallah

[txbroadcaster 110]

 

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

People need to stop comparing Herman and DKR. Totally different eras.


Fuck Tom Herman. Fire that dumbass.

[BevoSwag 272]

6 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Jeff Traylor

Got the Roadrunners at 3-1 and gave conference power UAB a game in Birmingham yesterday. Traylor has been my guy since Charlie had to go but I've been told over and over again we just don't hire HS coaches....Even though his resume wasn't too incredibly different from DKR's back in 2016, save a short stint as HC at an irrelevant PAC school. 

Also I get a sense some of y'all think he's a little too bass boat and Oakley shades or something. Not a country club type like Mack or a hip young city slicker who can talk to da kidz about teh rap and such. 

What he is is a legend in our most fertile recruiting ground and he is now proving he can run a mid-major...But now just mentioning a mid-major is the kiss of death for most of y'all. 

Anyway, big game against a stout BYU squad this week. I bet UTSA covers. 

This is the real problem. Actually I'd blame their bosses, our BMDs. Or BMDs suck and appear to be torn into factions. I don't know much about that world but I doubt Bama has Mobile and Birmingham factions stabbing each other in the back, or the same with the Gooners and rival gangs from Tulsa and OKC. 

That's Auburn.  Maybe their backstabbers could meet our backstabbers in a duel

 

[dcar00 14044]

7 hours ago, GreenspointTexas said:

We miss on our next coach, and we legit drop from the blue bloods of college football. We are already a punchline.

 

The bigger issue is being irrelevant. Especially considering our money, prestige, location, city, and history. 
 

If herman loses 5 games this season, hes fucking toast... covid or not

we are going to lose 4 at least.  this D is unbelievably bad.

[BurntOrange&White 39717]

5 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Yeah, cause that's worked out so fucking well for us.

Jesus fucking christ.. there are two answers and two answers only.

Dabo and Urban.

That's the fucking list. All of it, in absolute entirety. 

Anything else is the same bullshit we've been running through here for a very, very long time and it doesn't fucking work. 1 NC since 1970 out front should have told you.

Stop with this dumb shit already.

I kind of like Luke Fickell. I was asking some Ohio St guys about him and they love the guy and said if it wasn’t for Ryan Day he’d probably be their head coach. 

[Beau Vine 54018]

Quote

Texas is 11-6 as a ranked team against unranked teams under Tom Herman (since 2017).

The latest loss was a 33-31 defeat at the hands of TCU on Saturday. Texas’ six losses as a ranked team against an unranked team are the most in the FBS since 2017, according to ESPN Stats & Info.

 

[westexhorn 2008]

3 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Man... Do you actually believe what you just typed? That Herman needs to lose to Kansas to have enough data to fire him? I mean, he did need a last second field goal last year just to win. But.. I'm nice so let me provide some data points I posted earlier in the thread.

He has done it consistently, as in 100% of the time, every year he has been a head coach.

In fact, he's not consistent at dropping a game he shouldn't every season as a head coach. Fucker is batting 1000. He is fucking perfect at it. It's impressive actually.

Let me spell this out in detail.

Head coaching losses for Tom Herman

2015 Houston, in his best season ever, he goes 15-1 with the only loss to 6-7 UConn.

2016 Houston (the year before we hired him) 

Losses to 

Navy, SMU, Memphis and San Diego State University

2017

Maryland, Okie State, TCU, Tech, USC and OU

2018

Maryland (yes again), okie state, west virginia, and Ousux in the championship game. We beat Tulsa by 7 points at home. TULSA. Kansas by 7 on the road. KANSAS.

2019 Ousux, ISU, TCU, Baylor, LSU.. we needed a last second field goal to beat mighty mighty Kansas. KANSAS!

2020 TCU......

It is perfectly clear who he is now.

[pch 1259]

3 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Man... Do you actually believe what you just typed? That Herman needs to lose to Kansas to have enough data to fire him? I mean, he did need a last second field goal last year just to win. But.. I'm nice so let me provide some data points I posted earlier in the thread.

He has done it consistently, as in 100% of the time, every year he has been a head coach.

In fact, he's not consistent at dropping a game he shouldn't every season as a head coach. Fucker is batting 1000. He is fucking perfect at it. It's impressive actually.

Let me spell this out in detail.

Head coaching losses for Tom Herman

2015 Houston, in his best season ever, he goes 15-1 with the only loss to 6-7 UConn.

2016 Houston (the year before we hired him) 

Losses to 

Navy, SMU, Memphis and San Diego State University

2017

Maryland, Okie State, TCU, Tech, USC and OU

2018

Maryland (yes again), okie state, west virginia, and Ousux in the championship game. We beat Tulsa by 7 points at home. TULSA. Kansas by 7 on the road. KANSAS.

2019 Ousux, ISU, TCU, Baylor, LSU.. we needed a last second field goal to beat mighty mighty Kansas. KANSAS!

2020 TCU......

Dayuuuum.  That be some very damning evidence for your argument.  Sign me up.

[Helobious 9494]

I don’t know if Mullen is a great coach, he seems to at least be better than Herman. But soundbites like this always come across as far more genuine to me than any faux competitiveness bullshit Herman tries or claims to be about. 
 

 

[BrazilHorn 6577]

This sham of a HC needs to go. He is not the person to get Texas respectable let alone "back".

He is a narcissistic ass clown who wants no one on his staff that could remotely threaten him or be perceived as an up and comer. Wants an army of JAGs around him.

[ShowMeALoss 143]

2 minutes ago, westexhorn said:

It is perfectly clear who he is now.

Then we forget when he wins the bowl game and hope that the next year is when he turns things around. Tom Herman can't avoid losing to inferior teams. That's who he is as a coach. He can't keep his team mentally grounded and hungry for every opponent.

[BurntOrange&White 39717]

8 minutes ago, Helobious said:

I don’t know if Mullen is a great coach, he seems to at least be better than Herman. But soundbites like this always come across as far more genuine to me than any faux competitiveness bullshit Herman tries or claims to be about. 
 

 

Correct me if I’m wrong but could we have hired him instead of Herman?

[ShowMeALoss 143]

When we needed a miracle to win at Tech, what was Tom's message to the team? Was it "I am proud of you for fighting and believing in each other" or "we were extremely lucky to get the win because we played like ass." Now do this for Saban.

[Knighthawk 284]

Well I’m going against the grain here.   Herman is going to run the table on the remaining games except @osu which will get us to the b12 championship.  He’s not going anywhere.  
 

I will check back in at that time and receive your complements.   
 

and by the way I told everyone a few months ago that Tarik black sucks ass and  was negged endlessly.  Neg away boys  on my Herman take   ... 

[Alien Octopus 506]

Either he wins the Big XII or GTFO. In light of his track record I am thinking he should GTFO. 
 

I would offer Bryan Harsin the job. I believe he has won a lot more games than Mensa and coaches a more appropriate offense for the Big XII. With his resume, he will likely be more aggressive w poaching top coaches. Maybe he can teach his rbs not to reach for the fucking end zone going in and for his gotdamned lines to stay in legal  mother fucking formations and have more explosive plays than penalties.

[Mason Ramsey 3373]

Correct me if I’m wrong but could we have hired him instead of Herman?

You’re very correct. They were hired in the same year.

[MonkeyDoughnut 10152]

I for one, really, really don't see him lasting

[Hank Chinaski 6310]

1 minute ago, Knighthawk said:

Herman is going to run the table on the remaining games except @osu which will get us to the b12 championship. 

[Not a cat 5622]

Burnt, I wholeheartedly agree with you a change needs to be made and we need to swing for a proven commodity.  

But where in the holy hell are you getting the idea dabo would come here?  He's got a pretty good gig right now and it's humming along quite nicely.  The only chance he leaves is for Bama and that's because he went there.  

The list of proven winners that we can get here this season starts and ends with Urban.  That's it.

 

[USNALonghorn 5024]

The absolute worst case scenario is that we stumblefuck our way through the conference schedule and somehow luck our way into 2nd place. Play the BCG opponent close and lose. Then beat down a hapless also-ran in the bowl game. Extensions for everyone. Rinse. Repeat. 

[Not a cat 5622]

3 minutes ago, USNALonghorn said:

The absolute worst case scenario is that we stumblefuck our way through the conference schedule and somehow luck our way into 2nd place. Play the BCG opponent close and lose. Then beat down a hapless also-ran in the bowl game. Extensions for everyone. Rinse. Repeat. 

No, the absolute worst case scenario is that, plus riley continues to trip on his dick, OU doesn't clutch their pearls about optics or winning the right way, and hires Urban.  He will do unspeakable things to Turtle Tom, both in the cotton bowl and on the recruiting trail.

[Goodman 3273]

48 minutes ago, ShowMeALoss said:

Then we forget when he wins the bowl game and hope that the next year is when he turns things around. Tom Herman can't avoid losing to inferior teams. That's who he is as a coach. He can't keep his team mentally grounded and hungry for every opponent.

It's always a moving target. I'm one of the ones Tom lost yesterday, apathy for him as our leader has set in. I'll root for the brand but Tom can fuck himself.

[USNALonghorn 5024]

2 minutes ago, Not a cat said:

No, the absolute worst case scenario is that, plus riley continues to trip on his dick, OU doesn't clutch their pearls about optics or winning the right way, and hires Urban.  He will do unspeakable things to Turtle Tom, both in the cotton bowl and on the recruiting trail.

Yes. That will be the consequence of what I said.

[Panama Red 63]

Yeah, cause that's worked out so fucking well for us.
Jesus fucking christ.. there are two answers and two answers only.
Dabo and Urban.
That's the fucking list. All of it, in absolute entirety. 
Anything else is the same bullshit we've been running through here for a very, very long time and it doesn't fucking work. 1 NC since 1970 out front should have told you.
Stop with this dumb shit already.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. Problem is I’m not sure we can get either to come here. Hope I’m wrong.

[Panama Red 63]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/athlonsports.com/college-football/grading-college-footballs-head-coach-hires-2017%3famp
 
the article speaks to your point. They called it the number one hire. Here are coaches also hired that same year:
PJ Fleck, Matt Rhule, Lincoln Riley, Ed O, Luke Fickell. I realize we couldn’t stoop to Rhule or Fleck or Fickell but all three look like better hires now. Jmo.

I wanted Fleck at the time. Oh well, wouldn’t want to stoop so low as to hire a proven winner...

[tx ind 7004]

^^^Dabo appears to be different, very humble and you’re wrong.

[mdmost 42876]

1 hour ago, Knighthawk said:

Well I’m going against the grain here.   Herman is going to run the table on the remaining games except @osu which will get us to the b12 championship.  He’s not going anywhere.  
 

I will check back in at that time and receive your complements.   
 

and by the way I told everyone a few months ago that Tarik black sucks ass and  was negged endlessly.  Neg away boys  on my Herman take   ... 

Well what if KSU only has a loss to Texas on their resume and we lose to oSu? Unless oSu also has 2 conference losses, we're out of the championship game with 2 losses and a head to head loss. What if the world implodes before December?

[troph 24593]

^^^Dabo appears to be different, very humble and you’re wrong.

That’s his brand. I’m sure he believes some of it but it’s how he relates to the outside football world. No way he’s an egoless Sunday school teacher. No one at the top is without ego. And don’t underestimate boredom.

[tejas60 3529]

1 minute ago, mdmost said:

What if the world implodes before December?

please Lord, let this happen.

[BurntOrange&White 39717]

Dabo has that Mack Brown charm in front of cameras. Behind them both are ruthless with Dabo being more ruthless. 

[troph 24593]

More ruthless so he needs to lead with more Jesus which he does.

[Not a cat 5622]

Saban didn't leave LSU for Bama, he left it for the NFL, got kicked in the nuts a couple of years and realized hey coaching with a decided talent advantage is a lot easier.  

I'm racking my brain trying to come up with someone that voluntarily left a program (i.e. not a foot in your ass on the way out like Jimbo) they won a national championship with in order to go to another college program.  It just doesn't happen.

[Dbeasy 14994]

Dabo is full of shit, buys players, and runs a steroids program.

[Js1 85152]

11 minutes ago, tejas60 said:

please Lord, let this happen.

Tom’s giant ego will finally collapse in on itself and suck us all in? 

[Goodman 3273]

10 minutes ago, Bevo VIII said:

Dabo has that Mack Brown charm in front of cameras. Behind them both are ruthless with Dabo being more ruthless. 

 

9 minutes ago, troph said:

More ruthless so he needs to lead with more Jesus which he does.

 

1 minute ago, Dbeasy said:

Dabo is full of shit, buys players, and runs a steroids program.

All of this. I can't believe this is news to anyone visiting this site.

[mdmost 42876]

It's going to come down to taking another flyer on a project head coach from a lower tier program, overpaying to get a guy that's sick of his existing situation (ala Jimbo to aggy) or we have to overpay to lure Urban out of TV. I don't think we can get a guy to leave good to great program that they've spent years establishing. We're too much of a project ourselves. We will yet again need another top down rebuild. Yeah, yeah, we're Texas, resources, fan support, blah blah blah. We have a 10 year record of mediocrity with very few bright spots. We have to now deal with better programs like Bama and LSU cherrypicking our top talent because they can promise the NFL to these players where you're a maybe if you come to Texas. I don't think our donors and administration have the stomach or desire to make a massively expensive change this year. We just have to suffer through another year and a half of this. 

Edited October 5, 2020 by mdmost

[BurntOrange&White 39717]

3 minutes ago, Goodman said:

 

 

All of this. I can't believe this is news to anyone visiting this site.

I had a handful of players I was friends with because of who I knew back around the MNC days and the stories I’ve heard about Mack not in front of cameras. 
 

they told me getting called into his office was the worst because he would rip you apart and etc. 

 

I know @Goo Punch knew some players on the team around them too and has shared/heard similar stuff. 

Edited October 5, 2020 by Bevo VIII