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The $20,000 American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, and no touchscreen


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Posted

I'll also say that this is not a very inefficient design for an EV if they are only getting 240 miles from a 84.3 kWh battery pack for this little truck. 

Posted (edited)

I'm not 'bitching' about range. It's straight up impractical for where I live. A 2.5 day drive to Dallas doesn't sound like fun at all.
A spade's a spade. 

Edited by Iceman
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Posted
4 minutes ago, Goredho said:

I am for anything that might shake up the bloated engineering of modern cars for the US market.   I am like an Alzheimers patient in that I forget what button replaced the key ignition every. fucking. drive.  And Jesus, why do I have to pay extra for the privilege of getting goosed in the ass when my car's sensors confuse heavy snowfall with an imminent collision from the side?  WHAT WAS THAT LOUD SOUND AND FLASHING RED LIGHT?  No, motherfucker, I'm not about to fall asleep and need to pull over, I'm just old with droopy fucking eyelids.  NOW WHY ARE YOU SLOWING DOWN?  Im pressing the gas, and you are slowing down!  WTF?!  Oh, you detected an imminent collision with a car in front of me 1/2 mile down the road and corrected my driving?   Goddammit!  Get that shit out of my car.  I don't want it.  I never asked for it, and I am pissed I have to pay for it.  Give me a simple, reliable vehicle circa 1995 that just fucking works with no changes to an interface that was perfected a long time ago*

* But keep that little back up camera in there, that shit's gold for hooking up a trailer.

Hah! Get off my lawn!!!

I'm with you, and while they're adding all this bullshit the sizes are growing exponentially. Remember when a Suburban seemed like a fucking behemoth of a fucking vehicle in the 80s and early 90s? 

 

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Posted
Just now, BurntEyes said:

Hah! Get off my lawn!!!

I'm with you, and while they're adding all this bullshit the sizes are growing exponentially. Remember when a Suburban seemed like a fucking behemoth of a fucking vehicle in the 80s and early 90s? 

 

There is also the need to fit in mandated safety equipment. That stuff takes up space. Crumple zones need room to deform in order to do their job. Sensors everywhere. It’s tougher to make a really small vehicle now than it was in the 80s and 80s.  Bare bones isn’t all that bare. 

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Posted
18 minutes ago, Samson's Wig said:

No hate coming from me about the vehicle, I think it's a cool idea. I just don't think it's a viable product in this market.  I've driven similar vehicles in the past (small trucks), and I'm somewhat familiar with the market for small and midsize trucks, including those of the EV variety, as I currently drive one and pay attention to the market.   The positive use case for this type of vehicle serves a very narrow demographic, and that demographic has other factors, such as access to parking and charging, that make it even less plausible for this vehicle to sell well in the United States.  Range phobia has held back EV sales in all categories for years, but a basic truck with no paint and no other amenities is going to crack that code?   This looks more like a standard-issue private equity bullshit play than a viable product to me.  

I can agree with the bulk of your take, but I'm grateful for any and every option that focuses on affordability, function, and isn't part of the technology infusion size increasing space race to stupidity and cost.

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Iceman said:

I'm not 'bitching' about range. It's straight up impractical for where I live. A 2.5 day drive to Dallas doesn't sound like fun at all.
A spade's a spade. 

I wasn't calling you out or anything. I was just pointing out that they apparently intend to release a longer-ranged variant. Further, since these will be able to use DC chargers, I don't see how any drive in Texas would take 2.5 days, even when limited to the 150 mile variant. That said, I don't think folks driving long distances are the target for this sort of vehicle. 

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

There is also the need to fit in mandated safety equipment. That stuff takes up space. Crumple zones need room to deform in order to do their job. Sensors everywhere. It’s tougher to make a really small vehicle now than it was in the 80s and 80s.  Bare bones isn’t all that bare. 

Bruv, 3 WORDS.

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U

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Posted
8 hours ago, Hermanator said:

 

Only being a 2 seater makes this a problem for me and most people. 

 

Find a way to make it a reliable 5 person SUV or truck for $20k and I'd get one. But I'm in the probably very small minority that doesn't care about vehicles for anything but utility. 

 

From the article:

Quote

Need room for more than two passengers? Slate has an SUV upgrade kit that will bolt onto the back of the truck, adding extra rollover crash protection and rear seats with seat belts to match, all in a package that’s easy to install at home.

 

Posted
5 minutes ago, fuggled said:

 

From the article:

 

Well then it's not under $20k anymore. I'm better off just buying a used SUV with considerable depreciation. 

I don't get why these need to be made in America. If the tariff nonsense continues it will kill this anyway, but when they were planning this that wasn't an issue yet. Why not build in Mexico and make proper stripped down truck for under $20k retail?

Posted (edited)

Also wasn’t injection molded body panels the gimmick GM used with Saturn 35 years ago?

they also tried small and cheap around that time with Geo. 
 

how did those two badges do?

Edited by Pato del Muerto
Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

There is also the need to fit in mandated safety equipment. That stuff takes up space. Crumple zones need room to deform in order to do their job. Sensors everywhere. It’s tougher to make a really small vehicle now than it was in the 80s and 80s.  Bare bones isn’t all that bare. 

That's not really true in terms of size - you can get an incredibly safe (compared to 20 years ago) and small car today. Like I said earlier: the only reason trucks and SUVs have gotten so huge is to get the "light utility vehicle" exception for emissions standards so they don't have to be as fuel efficient.

Also, lulz at people bragging about needing to drive >100 miles a day for your commute. Congrats, I guess

Edited by Captainant
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Posted
8 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Also wasn’t injection molded body panels the gimmick GM used with Saturn 35 years ago?

they also tried small and cheap around that time with Geo. 
 

how did those two badges do?

Saturn did well when its vehicles were unique and quirky, when they basically just became cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other GM vehicles they started sinking and the 2008 recession did them in.

Geo were just cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other cars from the jump so it had no shot.

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Posted
1 minute ago, Brian Fantana said:

Saturn did well when its vehicles were unique and quirky, when they basically just became cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other GM vehicles they started sinking and the 2008 recession did them in.

Geo were just cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other cars from the jump so it had no shot.

Geos were horrible attempts at economy vehicles. 

I'm all for economy vehicles but not by using slap dick efforts with low engineering input resulting in POS vehicles that look like a Homer Simpson design.

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Posted
15 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Geos were horrible attempts at economy vehicles. 

I'm all for economy vehicles but not by using slap dick efforts with low engineering input resulting in POS vehicles that look like a Homer Simpson design.

The Homer looked WAY better than any Geo.

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Posted
52 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

I can agree with the bulk of your take, but I'm grateful for any and every option that focuses on affordability, function, and isn't part of the technology infusion size increasing space race to stupidity and cost.

That's where the profit is...

Posted
4 hours ago, Redneck Mutha said:

I'd assume it's competing with the Colorado and the Ranger. So plumbers, electricians, pool service, pest control, etc.

I see at least half a dozen of that type truck in the neighborhood every day. 

4 hours ago, Mother mopar said:

I like the minimalistic feel but 150 miles and that's on empty weight. Can't imagine what a lumber yard trip would do when she's got some weight. 

Don't really see this as a "heavy cargo hauler."

4 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I can see a significant market for these, especially if you can customize a covered bed panel-van style, for tradesmen, delivery, fleets, etc. Customers that want the service and warranty and who can’t one-off shop on the used market. 

This.  I think of the vehicles I see driving around dense urban areas -- think NYC or Chicago, or any number of cities overseas (London, Frankfurt, Berlin, Paris).  They need small, nimble light haulers and delivery vehicles.  Adapt it into a small panel van, and it's delivering bread, flowers, restaurant supplies, etc. all over town.  For cheap (electric, not gas), following local regs and not adding to emissions, and has plenty of range for the day's work (those vehicles drive 50 miles a day, not 150).

4 hours ago, Pescado_Rojo said:

I'd buy a 25 year old imported Kei truck for $8,000 before I'd buy one of these. 

honda_acty_1990_wallpapers_1.webp?v=1695

Definitely a similar function.  But you get the EV advantage (fuel savings) and the upside of a new, warrantied vehicle with a lot less stuff that can go wrong (EV maintenance is cheap and super-easy).  If I was running a restaurant supply delivery business in NY, or hell, even a pool cleaning business in Austin, I'd consider a bare-bones, low-maintenance, low-cost-to-operate vehicle like this.

But . . . that's a niche space.  Hard to see Joe Commuter buying one of these as his daily driver unless he also needs the utility of what that package offers.

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Posted
1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

Hah! Get off my lawn!!!

I'm with you, and while they're adding all this bullshit the sizes are growing exponentially. Remember when a Suburban seemed like a fucking behemoth of a fucking vehicle in the 80s and early 90s? 

 

Imagine having to pay $15, maybe even $20 to gas up! There's no way anyone would pay that much

Posted
4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

This.  I think of the vehicles I see driving around dense urban areas -- think NYC or Chicago, or any number of cities overseas (London, Frankfurt, Berlin, Paris).  They need small, nimble light haulers and delivery vehicles.  Adapt it into a small panel van, and it's delivering bread, flowers, restaurant supplies, etc. all over town.  For cheap (electric, not gas), following local regs and not adding to emissions, and has plenty of range for the day's work (those vehicles drive 50 miles a day, not 150).

Yeah. If you're trying to compare this to an F-150 or even basically any light truck in the US market you're thinking about it wrong. This is meant to be a practical city driver, pure and simple.

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Posted
1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

There’s a Russian vehicle that looks exactly like this, but with 80s era headlights. 

It's one of the Lada models, the Niva.  I actually saw them tooling around in Armenia, and I gotta tell ya.....kinda wanted one.

2020-lada-4x4-russian-spec-1.jpg

They are SUPER old-school, as in, "can be fixed with duct tape and baling wire," which is the kinda vehicle I grew up on.

Posted

I think some of ya’ll are overestimating the amount of miles pool guys, handymen, window cleaners, plumbers, etc drive per day especially in big metro areas and around suburbs, tooling down stop and go roads and cul-de-sacs. Its really hard to get to 150 or even 120 in between service calls, etc. If I drove l”my 12 mile commute right now that takes me 40 minutes, and if I’m a tradesman I don’t schedule 12 of those segments in a day.  5-6 miles between jobs is far more reasonable. Same if I am in a mid-site city, I don’t do 150 per day around town and if I drive 25 miles to a work site I will stay half the day and charge a service fee. 

 150 miles averaged across work days is 37k per year, and that’s a big number for anyone who doesn’t have a long commute. 
 

I agree that I’d rather own or drive a kei truck or a used Ranger.  But if wanted a car I can drop off for service without ordering parts from Japan or a junkyard and get on the road, and in warranty till I decide to off-load it, this looks very attractive.

I looked it up and the aging Nissan Leaf, which is more expensive, similar range, and less utility than this has gone up in sales by 187 percent compared to the same quarter in 2023. I see them wrapped all the time for maid services, delivery, etc. 

This doesn’t have to be the new Beetle. Just has to sell enough reliably to justify.  I look at it and see tons of places where its what is needed, especially if the conversion is as easy as they say.  

12 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

There’s a Russian vehicle that looks exactly like this, but with 80s era headlights. 

Lada Niva 4X4.

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Posted
5 hours ago, Redneck Mutha said:

Not sure if you can get the Maverick in EV? And I think the Maverick starting price is higher?

Obviously the price assumptions include EV credicks are still available, which I think may make all this discussion moo (sic).

Hybrid. 36K.

Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Don't really see this as a "heavy cargo hauler."

This.  I think of the vehicles I see driving around dense urban areas -- think NYC or Chicago, or any number of cities overseas (London, Frankfurt, Berlin, Paris).  They need small, nimble light haulers and delivery vehicles.  Adapt it into a small panel van, and it's delivering bread, flowers, restaurant supplies, etc. all over town.  For cheap (electric, not gas), following local regs and not adding to emissions, and has plenty of range for the day's work (those vehicles drive 50 miles a day, not 150).

Definitely a similar function.  But you get the EV advantage (fuel savings) and the upside of a new, warrantied vehicle with a lot less stuff that can go wrong (EV maintenance is cheap and super-easy).  If I was running a restaurant supply delivery business in NY, or hell, even a pool cleaning business in Austin, I'd consider a bare-bones, low-maintenance, low-cost-to-operate vehicle like this.

But . . . that's a niche space.  Hard to see Joe Commuter buying one of these as his daily driver unless he also needs the utility of what that package offers.

Well, sure there is rhe ID Buzz from VW that starts at $60k (didn't see anything under $75k on a quick glance)

VW ID Buzz

Volkswagen_ID._Buzz_1X7A6263.thumb.jpg.651200b5298242aa88851c890561ce23.jpg

There the Citroën Ami Cargo I guess:

citroen-ami-cargo-review.thumb.webp.1899f15409f204211fde9b17e3d1dee8.webp

There was the Canoo Lifestyle Delivery Vehicle from California, but "sadly" and shockingly it failed:

Walmart-purchases-Canoo-LDV.thumb.webp.3c8bbccaf14dac378c2ea0e35e7aec00.webp

Canoo Up the Creek with no Paddle

You've got FORD E Transit  (starting around ~$50K), and Mercedes E Sprinter (MSRP $62k to start) both of which are pretty large and have about a 150 mile range.

Sure there are options like the Nissan Townstar that do exactly what your suggesting, but guess where they are NOT shipping them. To fucking small, real men won't drive them in the good old US of A. 

Edited by BurntEyes
Posted
7 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Hybrid. 36K.

It's also available in 4 wheel drive. Having driven a family members Maverick Hybrid a goodly amount, I'd take that all day everyday over the one in OP due to diverse functionality in a Hybrid vs EV. 

...but I'm biased and live on a bunch of land in the middle of nowhere.

To be clear I'm not shitting on the truck, quiet the opposite, I applaud it, just not sure the niche is trying to fit is large enough for reality and success. A little too niche imo. 

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Posted
5 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

It's also available in 4 wheel drive. Having driven a family members Maverick Hybrid a goodly amount, I'd take that all day everyday over the one in OP due to diverse functionality in a Hybrid vs EV. 

...but I'm biased and live on a bunch of land in the middle of nowhere.

To be clear I'm not shitting on the truck, quiet the opposite, I applaud it, just not sure the niche is trying to fit is large enough for reality and success. A little too niche imo. 

That's really the question.  It really only works in an urban or dense suburban area (read: not long distances).  It has a real place in that environment, but in the US, is that enough to support an entire vehicle platform?  Because you won't sell a single one to anyone living in Elgin, or Marble Falls, etc.  And certainly not any place in the real hinterlands.  Shit, Houston might be too big for it.

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

That's really the question.  It really only works in an urban or dense suburban area (read: not long distances).  It has a real place in that environment, but in the US, is that enough to support an entire vehicle platform?  Because you won't sell a single one to anyone living in Elgin, or Marble Falls, etc.  And certainly not any place in the real hinterlands.  Shit, Houston might be too big for it.

Yeah, even if it met the needs of a true farmer, the options for UTVs and stuff like Mavericks are going to be their direction per my earlier post. There is a slow adoption of Hybrid in the sticks but they're still a LONG way from EV. The issues of poor inner city have already been addressed. So, maybe businesses in Chicago/NYC/LA if they have a centralized clientele. Otherwise, you're largely looking at EV minded folks that want a 3rd vehicle for errands. That's a small market, and well, why not a used EV SUV in that case? 

I think this would have done better as a panel van, personally. 

Edited by BurntEyes
Posted
1 minute ago, BurntEyes said:

There is a slow adoption of Hybrid in the sticks but they're still a LONG way from EV.

Agree.  Hell, I'm urban and a good example of that.  95% of my driving is commuting and/or other driving within a city.  But for that 5%....I have to go to court in far-flung counties, I go hunting and fishing in the sticks, etc.  In other words....driving where I am uncomfortable relying on an electric charge alone.  Being able to run on gasoline is necessary.  Maybe someday it won't be (when there is adequate charging network/infrastructure, even in West Possum Dick, Texas).

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Posted
6 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

The average person drives about 40 miles per day. 

The average person never needs a truck. Hell, a huge number of truck owners never use the bed. 

But by god Murica! And God Bless it!

Posted
4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Agree.  Hell, I'm urban and a good example of that.  95% of my driving is commuting and/or other driving within a city.  But for that 5%....I have to go to court in far-flung counties, I go hunting and fishing in the sticks, etc.  In other words....driving where I am uncomfortable relying on an electric charge alone.  Being able to run on gasoline is necessary.  Maybe someday it won't be (when there is adequate charging network/infrastructure, even in West Possum Dick, Texas).

Do they make adapters for camper power towers?  Could be an easy way for those places, which are usually pretty rural, to make some extra cash in unused stalls or even a few dedicated ones. 

Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Agree.  Hell, I'm urban and a good example of that.  95% of my driving is commuting and/or other driving within a city.  But for that 5%....I have to go to court in far-flung counties, I go hunting and fishing in the sticks, etc.  In other words....driving where I am uncomfortable relying on an electric charge alone.  Being able to run on gasoline is necessary.  Maybe someday it won't be (when there is adequate charging network/infrastructure, even in West Possum Dick, Texas).

Yeah, I think something like this, a very low cost low frills Hybrid has a MUCH larger market. Make a panel van option and I think it has a real US market at $20k. Hence my bring back the Toyota "Truck" or the Hilux.

Edited by BurntEyes
Posted
15 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Agree.  Hell, I'm urban and a good example of that.  95% of my driving is commuting and/or other driving within a city.  But for that 5%....I have to go to court in far-flung counties, I go hunting and fishing in the sticks, etc.  In other words....driving where I am uncomfortable relying on an electric charge alone.  Being able to run on gasoline is necessary.  Maybe someday it won't be (when there is adequate charging network/infrastructure, even in West Possum Dick, Texas).

My rental Mercedes E-SUV took 11 hours to charge in that desolate area known as...um...The Colony/ Frisco/ Plano. 
 

It's a time issue as much as the other logistics. 
 

 

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Posted
Just now, Iceman said:

in that desolate area known as...um...The Colony/ Frisco/ Plano. 

I know you wrote that ironically.  But it's not ironic.  Yech.

Also, what we REALLY need is a nationwide fleet of these BAMFs:

tiny-cars.jpg

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I know you wrote that ironically.  But it's not ironic.  Yech.

Also, what we REALLY need is a nationwide fleet of these BAMFs:

tiny-cars.jpg

The driving gloves make that pic!

Posted
14 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Yeah, I think something like this, a very low cost low frills Hybrid has a MUCH larger market. Make a panel van option and I think it has a real US market at $20k. Hence my bring back the Toyota "Truck" or the Hilux.

One thing I immediately thought is that this would be ideal for delivery/trades in European cities and getting congestion charge discounts. Tariffs throw a wrench in that and I wonder if the initial idea had that as part of a strategy. 

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Iceman said:

My rental Mercedes E-SUV took 11 hours to charge in that desolate area known as...um...The Colony/ Frisco/ Plano. 
 

It's a time issue as much as the other logistics. 
 

 

Where you are doesn't change how fast a battery charges. What you're describing sounds like charging at a level 2 charger (e.g., 220 outlet) either at home or maybe in the parking lot of business. That's not using a DC fast charger, which is what you'd use on a road trip. 

Posted
2 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

Geos were horrible attempts at economy vehicles. 

I'm all for economy vehicles but not by using slap dick efforts with low engineering input resulting in POS vehicles that look like a Homer Simpson design.

 

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Where you are doesn't change how fast a battery charges. What you're describing sounds like charging at a level 2 charger (e.g., 220 outlet) either at home or maybe in the parking lot of business. That's not using a DC fast charger, which is what you'd use on a road trip. 

I was just making fun of the shot at podunkville.
 

How much is a dc fast charger and how long would it take to add 130 miles to the Slate?

Edited by Iceman
Posted
46 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

It's also available in 4 wheel drive. Having driven a family members Maverick Hybrid a goodly amount, I'd take that all day everyday over the one in OP due to diverse functionality in a Hybrid vs EV. 

...but I'm biased and live on a bunch of land in the middle of nowhere.

To be clear I'm not shitting on the truck, quiet the opposite, I applaud it, just not sure the niche is trying to fit is large enough for reality and success. A little too niche imo. 

Yeah, I like the Maverick we have. Fun little truck.

But for me? I would rock the shit out of this EV.

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Posted
4 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Yeah, I like the Maverick we have. Fun little truck.

But for me? I would rock the shit out of this EV.

Looks like the base Maverick hybrid is under $30k?  That's not a bad deal at all.

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, Iceman said:

I was just making fun of the shot at podunkville.
 

How much is a dc fast charger and how long would it take to add 130 miles to the Slate?

Charging speed will vary a bit depending upon the particular charger and how busy it is.  According to the Ars Technica article I posted, this particular vehicle supports a peak DC charge of 120 KW and should charge from 0-80 percent in under 30 minutes (that claim seems unlikely to me if the peak charge is really 120 KW, but I'll take it face value for now). 

As a general note, EVs have to control the charging speeds to limit damage to the batteries. They can charge faster the more "empty" they are. Charging on a DC charger will go slower for an EV when the battery charge is above 60%. The particular charge curve will vary based on manufacturer and battery chemistry. A peak of 120 KW is fairly slow for a DC fast charger.  170 KW is pretty ubiquitous at this point. Some vehicles and chargers support much more, with 400 KW becoming more common. 

Edit: Sorry, I ignored the price question. Price depends on which state you're in, but generally speaking DC fast charging costs roughly the same as filling up at a gas station on a per mile basis. It can be a little bit more or little bit less just depending on current gas and electric prices. 

Edited by Dahobbs
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Posted
4 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

As a general note, EVs have to control the charging speeds to limit damage to the batteries. They can charge faster the more "empty" they are. Charging on a DC charger will go slower for an EV when the battery charge is above 60%. The particular charge curve will vary based on manufacturer and battery chemistry. A peak of 120 KW is fairly slow for a DC fast charger.  170 KW is pretty ubiquitous at this point. Some vehicles and chargers support much more, with 400 KW becoming more common. 

Sure, by my case study as to my wife's rechargeable vibrator....I mean, umm, phone....let's go with "phone"....is that it charges faster during the day than the overnight hours.

Posted
16 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Charging speed will vary a bit depending upon the particular charger and how busy it is.  According to the Ars Technica article I posted, this particular vehicle supports a peak DC charge of 120 KW and should charge from 0-80 percent in under 30 minutes (that claim seems unlikely to me if the peak charge is really 120 KW, but I'll take it face value for now). 

As a general note, EVs have to control the charging speeds to limit damage to the batteries. They can charge faster the more "empty" they are. Charging on a DC charger will go slower for an EV when the battery charge is above 60%. The particular charge curve will vary based on manufacturer and battery chemistry. A peak of 120 KW is fairly slow for a DC fast charger.  170 KW is pretty ubiquitous at this point. Some vehicles and chargers support much more, with 400 KW becoming more common. 

Edit: Sorry, I ignored the price question. Price depends on which state you're in, but generally speaking DC fast charging costs roughly the same as filling up at a gas station on a per mile basis. It can be a little bit more or little bit less just depending on current gas and electric prices. 

Yeah was gonna chime in with similar info.  It can take twice as long to charge from 80-100, as it did from 10-80.  So for some use cases it's more realistic to assume you're only charging to 80% each time.

If this thing could actually get to a true capacity of 150 miles I'd find it compelling for a variety of personal and fleet applications.  Even at 120 it'd be interesting.  If it's less than 100 then it gets quite a bit less interesting for most of those applications.

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Posted
3 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

Saturn did well when its vehicles were unique and quirky, when they basically just became cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other GM vehicles they started sinking and the 2008 recession did them in.

Geo were just cheap, rebranded, shittier versions of other cars from the jump so it had no shot.

Erroneous on the last bit. They are the same cars, not shittier.  Rolled off the same lines, same parts aside from minor stuff (Geo/Chevy actually had better radios). The Prizm and Corolla from those eras are the same car and the Prizm is a sweetheart deal even now if looking for a beater. The Storm is an Isuzu built in Japan on the same line as Isuzu’s sport coupe.  The Tracker and Suzuki Sidekick were the same car built in Ontario in the same factory with the same parts. 
 

They failed because they were too close in perception to the era of shit American small cars and also the bottom fell out of the small budget marker across the board.  You’ll notice Suzuki and Isuzu are also not here, Mitsubishi is a ghost, and the 3 Japanese giants shrank their budget lines and expanded their SUVs in both lineup and size. Even the Koreans began abandoning the econobox ship. 
 

A Geo of the era and a proper Pontiac or Chevy (Lumina, Grand Am, etc) are no comparison in quality. Geo is better in every way. Also remember the econoboxes were always meant to be bought cheap, flogged by new or poor drivers, then offloaded to some person with even less money for maintenance and care.  They got harder miles. But if you can find a Prizm in decent shape it’s a steal for a beater ride compared to the Toyota and it is the same car. 

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