Dallas Cowboys 2018 Regular Season Thread

['stache 21824]

I get the logic, but we're not a good enough team to expect the defense to hold, especially when a FG wins it for the opponent.  If your defense is good enough to hold them, they can do it from the 42.  And if you can't get 4th and 1 you don't deserve to win.  Dumb decision.

Edited October 8, 2018 by 'stache

[gsoda3 3263]

23 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

Brad sham agreed too

 

4 minutes ago, C-Man said:

As did Norm Hitzges -- I'm sensing a trend here.

Ten OT minutes goes by really, really fast. Anyway, I see the logic coming from those guys. It's 4th-and-1 on the other team's 42. A FG doesn't win the game at that point. Your defense has been playing pretty well for the most part and you have no idea what Deshaun's condition is going to be. In retrospect, I'd have gone for it and tried to get a damn GW TD there but I can see the logic Garrett used. It is playing not to lose logic but logic nonetheless. #takethelosspussy

i would have gone for it-  the hallmark of your team is your line and your running back.  it's what you've invested half of your cap and draft in over the past three seasons.  BUT i see the logic.  along with the reasons you listed, there's one more- if we miss the FG, houston has to get less than ten yards to get in to field goal range.  

 

that said-  none of that absolves jason garrett. 

Edited October 8, 2018 by gsoda3

['stache 21824]

Dak will likely never be great, but he can succeed with good surrounding players and coaching that is willing to play to his strengths and avoid his weaknesses.  This coaching staff just does what they want and hopes it works.  They aren't strategic.  They just do the same shit over and over and hope it works.  Fire the GM (lol).

[Trey3216 15349]

1 hour ago, Post Oak said:

Spagnola is a beating 

"Yeaahhhh" 

[Tired Horn 738]

7 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I get the logic, but we're not a good enough team to expect the defense to hold, especially when a FG wins it for the opponent.  If your defense is good enough to hold them, they can do it from the 42.  And if you can't get 4th and 1 you don't deserve to win.  Dumb decision.

It's not like the defense had been forcing a bunch of three and outs. We did great on the goal line, but we only had the chance to do that because the Texans kept reaching the red zone. Don't get me wrong -- holding them to 16 in regulation is a good performance. But nothing we saw in that game would have indicated the Texans were a poor bet to get into field goal range if we gave them the ball.

Not going for it was a gutless decision and a poor statistical bet.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

1 hour ago, mdmost said:

I watched The Deuce on HBO instead of the 2nd half of the game.

This is why I have two TVs in my living room.  I can watch a show on the bottom tv and have the game up on the top tv. 

[KeysPhoneWallet 807]

Time for garret to go

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

20 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Dak will likely never be great, but he can succeed with good surrounding players and coaching that is willing to play to his strengths and avoid his weaknesses.  This coaching staff just does what they want and hopes it works.  They aren't strategic.  They just do the same shit over and over and hope it works.  Fire the GM (lol).

Dak is basically Cam.  The problem is, this offense wants him to be a pocket passer.  He needs more designed runs and a simplified passing assignment. 

[totallynotabuttpirate 5400]

I hate to admit it, but the next coach should be Lincoln Riley with the existing defense staff. 

Of course that will never happen. 

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

1 minute ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

I hate to admit it, but the next coach should be Lincoln Riley with the existing defense staff. 

Of course that will never happen. 

I'd rather have Kris Richard with a capable OC than that "take the loss pussy" Riley. 

[C-Man 27235]

50 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

 

i would have gone for it-  the hallmark of your team is your line and your running back.  it's what you've invested half of your cap and draft in over the past three seasons.  BUT i see the logic.  along with the reasons you listed, there's one more- if we miss the FG, houston has to get less than ten yards to get in to field goal range.  

 

that said-  none of that absolves jason garrett. 

Yup. But our so-called "top 3" NFL RB and stud line led to a 20-54 day so let's not go ahead and say a first down was inevitable in that situation. It's hard to play the field position game in OT because it doesn't last very long.

[Vic Mackey 47089]

The play call on 3rd down was so bad. We lined up Cole fucking Beasley in the backfield? Lmao. What the fuck is he going to do? All that did was bring another defender in the box. The amount of slow developing zone runs up the middle all night was mind boggling. We had zero success running up the middle yet still tried it all game. Not one ounce of adjustment to try something else. Our playbook mirrors that of Tecmo Bowl in terms of simplistic, predictability.

Also, right before regulation ended, we had the ball with 10sec and a timeout. All we needed was about 10 yards for our kicker to have a legit shot. Now yes, it would have been close to 60 but isn't that supposed to be his strength? Let him try it. Nothing to really lose. Miss it, go to OT. So needing 10 yards, what do we call? A long developing pass play where WRs are running routes 15-18 yards down field where Dak has to sit behind a very shaky OL and wait. Where the fuck is the quick hitting routes to get something and call a timeout? This coaching staff is so fucking stupid.

I am not as high on Dak as before but he shows flashes when you actually call a game that fits his strengths. Thing is, we don't for any extended period of time. Only here and there. The rest is the same predictable, boring junk that everyone speaks on. Opposing players, coaches, former players, current players, media. I think Dak would look a lot better if the offense was actually designed around everything he does well. But it isn't. All offseason we heard how different this offense was going to be now that the personnel was "Dak friendly". Yeah, no.

[Vic Mackey 47089]

If you want to laugh and vomit at the same time, listen to this Garrett press conference and him telling us why the punt was the right decision. Even though the media clearly isn't buying it. I wish Jerry would interrupt the press conference and tell him to never show up to this facility again and someone will mail him his belongings.

[DougO 5251]

I don't have a big problem for not going on the 4th and 1 1/2. I have a much bigger problem with the shitty play call on 3rd and 2.

 

 

[immortal13 4059]

4 minutes ago, DougO said:

I don't have a big problem for not going on the 4th and 1 1/2. I have a much bigger problem with the shitty play call on 3rd and 2.

 

 

I had a big problem with both. 

 

One of Dak's real strengths is running with the ball, yet we don't take any advantage of that. Just roll him out with a pass option on a short yardage situation. Or just fucking run Zeke, but we do neither. 

[Vic Mackey 47089]

I don't have a big problem for not going on the 4th and 1 1/2. I have a much bigger problem with the shitty play call on 3rd and 2.
 
 

So you were ok with punting from their 43? Wow.

[DougO 5251]

3 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

12 minutes ago, DougO said:

I don't have a big problem for not going on the 4th and 1 1/2. I have a much bigger problem with the shitty play call on 3rd and 2.
 
 

So you were ok with punting from their 43? Wow.

 

Would the same genius be calling the play that conjured up the result on 3rd and 2?

[C-Man 27235]

1 hour ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Dak is basically Cam.

imgur

[Vic Mackey 47089]

 
Would the same genius be calling the play that conjured up the result on 3rd and 2?

But that's not the issue at hand. They didn't even give the team a chance to see what the play call would be.

Did anyone actually have confidence we were going to get the ball back to win? No doubt in my mind Houston would drive down and win. With no resistance. We had zero answer for their WRs. They had to have upwards of 450 to 500 yards of offense last night.

Punting there takes the win off the board and you are then lucky to leave with a tie.

[futureman 22496]

balls!

Edited October 8, 2018 by futureman

[DougO 5251]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

But that's not the issue at hand. They didn't even give the team a chance to see what the play call would be.
 

I'm not arguing either going or not going. Conventional football wisdom would likely say punting is mathematically logical way to go, probably at least 60/40. Someone more inclined to gamble would go for it and accept the consequences of losing. If Dallas goes for it and doesn't get it, it's 90% Houston's game. Punt deep and stop them with time left, you have a chance to win. Either way,the Cowboys probably screw the pooch, considering the history of the current regime.

The choice comes down to betting on Cowboys offense or the Cowboys defense. A review of the team's performance would strongly suggest that the defense was a much better bet, especially considering that Houston's QB appeared to be somewhat physically impaired. One could hope that Dak or Zeke would make a special play that would result in a big first down. But if that were the case, it should have happened on 3rd and 2. That's where the Cowboys should have felt the most extreme sense of urgency dictating a mindset of "this play HAS to work, call it good, and don't get fucking stupid." We know what happened there.

Regardless, we all know one thing with virtual certainty. Had Dallas gone for it and not made the first down, and Houston wins, the same people here screaming that Garrett was a moron for not going for it would be here screaming that Garrett was a moron for going for it.

 

Edited October 8, 2018 by DougO

[DougO 5251]

Houston's last drive started at 5:33. They kicked the winning field goal at 1:55. If they had missed the filed goal, there's STILL time to win the game.

They just need a better team with better execution with better coaches that make better decisions.

Some competent refs that don't cheat the Cowboys with shitty calls and keep the opponents drives alive after you've stopped them would be nice, too.

[Irish Wrist Watch 1392]

The third and two call was the killer. Although Dak had a linebacker shadowing him, there's no way that guy could've stopped him from a quick two yards, as long as he took off the second he faked the handoff to Zeke. Stupid fucking call. it's not like that was the first time we saw Zeke stopped for no gain or a loss last night. Also, the play appeared to take Zeke a yard or two to his left instead of straight up the middle.

Get a fucking blocking fullback in there - a bull, and give him the goddamn ball. It's just shit offensive play calling. Linehan has lost the magic. He's not seeing the Defenses any more. And of course, Red is clueless. Fuck

[txbroadcaster 110]

17 hours ago, Irish Wrist Watch said:

The third and two call was the killer. Although Dak had a linebacker shadowing him, there's no way that guy could've stopped him from a quick two yards, as long as he took off the second he faked the handoff to Zeke. Stupid fucking call. it's not like that was the first time we saw Zeke stopped for no gain or a loss last night. Also, the play appeared to take Zeke a yard or two to his left instead of straight up the middle.

Get a fucking blocking fullback in there - a bull, and give him the goddamn ball. It's just shit offensive play calling. Linehan has lost the magic. He's not seeing the Defenses any more. And of course, Red is clueless. Fuck

He never really has seen the Defense....Linehan is a coach that his scheme is built on his player beating your player with simple routes and simple runs. When he has the horses..ala 2014 and 2016 his play calling looks brilliant. 

What he has not shown is the ability to take a team and scheme the success...We all talk about Dak and throwing a WR open...well Linehan is terrible at scheming WRs open. We hardly ever see route combos that make sense or even simple route concepts that make the defense defend route A but give up Route B in return. 

[ztejas 43496]

22 hours ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Dak is basically Cam.

😂

[ztejas 43496]

Punting the ball to Deshaun Watson when the other team only needs a FG is never really what you want to be doing.

[Vic Mackey 47089]

1 hour ago, txbroadcaster said:

He never really has seen the Defense....Linehan is a coach that his scheme is built on his player beating your player with simple routes and simple runs. When he has the horses..ala 2014 and 2016 his play calling looks brilliant. 

What he has not shown is the ability to take a team and scheme the success...We all talk about Dak and throwing a WR open...well Linehan is terrible at scheming WRs open. We hardly ever see route combos that make sense or even simple route concepts that make the defense defend route A but give up Route B in return. 

Our routes are so simplistic. Deep outs/ins and comebacks. Watch other offenses and it's night and day compared to ours. It's pathetic.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

3 hours ago, ztejas said:

😂

Look at their stats during their first 3 years.  

http://www.nfl.com/player/camnewton/2495455/careerstats

http://www.nfl.com/player/dakprescott/2555260/careerstats

Very similar except for Cam running more, which I think Dak should be doing. Dak's yards per carry is about the same too.  

[Jameslaw121 4448]

put me in the camp that Garrett was either trying to tie or playing not to lose. That' s a bad idea if your team is great. It's a horrible idea if your team sucks

[Vic Mackey 47089]

put me in the camp that Garrett was either trying to tie or playing not to lose. That' s a bad idea if your team is great. It's a horrible idea if your team sucks

It's a bad idea either way. I'd rather lose when trying to win than tie by playing conservative. Did you see McVey go for 4th and short to end that Seattle game? And they were actually winning by 2 and at their own 40. He didn't punt.

Garrett's decision will end up losing this locker room. Every player wanted to go for that. Even former players agree and other media members. It was terrible.

[Sgt Hulk 13806]

I have 100% given up on this team,  i've watched all of 15 minutes this season of dallas play and I likely will not turn on another game of theirs until garrett is gone 

[ztejas 43496]

13 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Look at their stats during their first 3 years.  

http://www.nfl.com/player/camnewton/2495455/careerstats

http://www.nfl.com/player/dakprescott/2555260/careerstats

Very similar except for Cam running more, which I think Dak should be doing. Dak's yards per carry is about the same too.  

Okay bro. Tell me when Dak wins MVP and take Dallas to the SB.

Until then, put some respeck on Cam's name.

[DougO 5251]

Cam isn't the worst comparison. Cam is bigger. He runs more. Has a bigger arm. Both are stout, tough to bring down. Both have shown capabality to make remakable throws wiht gerat precision, as well as bouts of not being able to hit the broad side of a barn.

The difference is Cam pretty much hit his ceiling a couple of years ago. Dak, we don't know yet. If he doesn't progress more it's a pretty decently fair comparison.

The main difference I see now is that Cam is a meathead and a diva. Dak seems very intelligent and very much a team player. That's why I give Dak a chance of eventually proving to be a very good NFL starting QB. He has shown impressive ability when he's got a clean pocket and competent receivers.

[txbroadcaster 110]

 

[BigVegasHorn26 630]

Said it during the game and I'll say it again, if Dak isn't willing to tuck it and run, including fighting in those tough yardage situations, he's never going to be more than average.  His hesitancy to run borders on mind blowing with his skill set.  Nut the f up and tote the rock like a man.  

[dcar00 14305]

Dak isn't Cam because they actually run Newton.  If we aren't going to run him a lot more often then I'd rather move on(after we fire Garrett first).  His advantage is as a mobile QB that can take a bit of pounding.  use him like he should be used while he's cheap and if it doesn't work then don't give him the contract.

The OL with aging/hurt Smith, Williams(rookie playing new position from college) and no Frederick isn't anywhere near what it was 2 years ago.  you have to get more "mulitple" with backfield sets.  Dak gets big yards on the few times he does keep because the D doesn't worry about him.  we don't do it enough to make them hesitate.  they just say hey we'll deal with him getting a couple of 10 to 15 yard runs a game as long as we punish Zeke.

I know we didn't run Dak that much 2 years ago but there was no tape on him and our OL was light years better.  we need him to be accounted for in the run game by the defense.

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

 

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

What about Brice Butler?  He gonna show up ever? 

[Hammock 104]

I think Dak lacks something between the ears. The killer instinct, confidence, or whatever you want to call it.

He has little-to-no intimidation in his demeanor.

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

7 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

What about Brice Butler?  He gonna show up ever? 

I assume you mean figuratively as he's been active the last 2 weeks.  He's been there..... clapping away.  He's a JAG so him getting on the field wouldn't impact anything.

[ztejas 43496]

18 hours ago, DougO said:

The main difference I see now is that Cam is a meathead and a diva.

Yeah that and he's a better football player. 

Cam is a proven QB1. Dak is trying to prove that right now and might not be a QB1 for much longer.

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

Cam has been league MVP and taken a team to the Superbowl.  That's pretty much every QBs ceiling besides the few that win one on top of that.  I get it if you don't think he's a top 5 QB because there are some elite guys at the top, but everyone after top 5 aren't just lumped together as practically the same guy.  There are a whole lot of degrees in there. 

The comparison on point except that Cam is better at pretty much every metric.  Bigger, stronger, faster, more accurate, and better decision making.

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

Hurns is blowing up the Cowboys coaching staff and play calling.  The receivers have taken it very personally about criticism coming their way and it's understandable and nobody likes to be the punching bag.  

Here's the tough thing.  Statistically there is data out they don't win enough in single coverage, but as most issues, there isn't a silver bullet which explains all.  

Our play calling is poor and frankly, we're running an old system without a ton of creativity which is relying on less talented players to try and outplay more talented guys.  Hurns was the most vocal this week about how it's not one thing, but Beasley has chirped about it.  Feels like Garrett is starting to lose this locker room and when that happens, you can either get rid of all the players or get rid of coaches.  As Fisher admits....

Unfortunately, will this fix the organization and culture?  Absolutely not, it's a Jerrah problem.  However, Jason Garrett is the 2nd longest tenured coach in Cowboys history.  He has 1 playoff win.  

 

[Vic Mackey 47089]

Good shit. I hope these players continue to shit all over these fucking coaches. Dak and these WRs are not great by any means but they are not as bad as this. Look at Alex Smith. He went from a great situation in KC. Now look at him with Gruden and the Skins. Coaching and scheme matters. We don't scheme to get open. It's nothing but the same junk routes that the defense knows to sit on. Fuck Garrett and Linehan. How can Jerry sit on his hands and allow these idiots to stay? This is the first time the players are calling out these coaches. Coupled with that pussy decision to punt, Garrett is now losing the locker room like Wade. Please fire these clowns.

[gsoda3 3263]

you mean when the defense is playing man trailing you can't just tell your receivers to run until they get open?  who woulda thunk.

[C-Man 27235]

I don't get it. Linehan was a good enough OC to get a HC job. Once that led to his firing, he seemingly slid back into a role he used to be pretty good at. Why does he suck now? Has the game just passed him by in some way?

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

Is it even possible for both the players and coaches to suck?  What would such a thing even look like?

[Vic Mackey 47089]

1 minute ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Is it even possible for both the players and coaches to suck?  What would such a thing even look like?

The coaches are much more of a problem than the players.

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

1 hour ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Cam has been league MVP and taken a team to the Superbowl.  That's pretty much every QBs ceiling besides the few that win one on top of that.  I get it if you don't think he's a top 5 QB because there are some elite guys at the top, but everyone after top 5 aren't just lumped together as practically the same guy.  There are a whole lot of degrees in there. 

The comparison on point except that Cam is better at pretty much every metric.  Bigger, stronger, faster, more accurate, and better decision making.

Rex Grossman has taken a team to the super bowl.  Not sure that anoints Cam to legend status.  Especially because he got spanked in that game and didn't log a single TD.

Dak was rookie of the year, just like Cam.  Cam's obviously had more time in the league, but Dak has the ability to be just as good.  While Cam may be bigger stronger faster, Dak has a higher completion percentage so I'd argue he's more accurate. 

Cam regressed after his rookie season too.  They brought in a new offensive coaching staff to simplify the offense, complete with zone reads and uptempo.

https://www.catscratchreader.com/2013/6/13/4426096/carolina-panthers-cam-newton-hopeful-simplified-offense-leads-to-more-success

Where is the Dak friendly offense we were told about?

 

 

[Gene Parmesan 4008]

3 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Rex Grossman has taken a team to the super bowl.  Not sure that anoints Cam to legend status.  Especially because he got spanked in that game and didn't log a single TD.

Dak was rookie of the year, just like Cam.  Cam's obviously had more time in the league, but Dak has the ability to be just as good.  While Cam may be bigger stronger faster, Dak has a higher completion percentage so I'd argue he's more accurate. 

Cam regressed after his rookie season too.  They brought in a new offensive coaching staff to simplify the offense, complete with zone reads and uptempo.

https://www.catscratchreader.com/2013/6/13/4426096/carolina-panthers-cam-newton-hopeful-simplified-offense-leads-to-more-success

Where is the Dak friendly offense we were told about?

 

 

Did you skip over the first half of the first sentence?  Do you want to list me all the shitty players that have been MVP in an effort to claim that spares accomplish that as well.