Dallas Cowboys 2018 Regular Season Thread

[BradInATX 9208]

BradInATX*

Lol. Let's just hope another Texas team beats back the invaders in that stadium Saturday.

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[Vic Mackey 47027]

I might actually buy into this defense. They have flaws (every defense does) but they have a certain swagger to them we haven't seen in a very long time. And it starts with Vander Esch and Jaylon. I mean last night was the litmus test for them. Best offense in the league by most metrics. Defense never let them breathe last night. It was glorious.

I have no idea what it is about these games that Garrett and company win. Yet they can't do it consistently. 

Go Redskins on MNF. 

[kevwun 15777]

Yeah, they always seem to hold their own in big regular season games.  If only they could carry that over in to the playoffs.

[Vic Mackey 47027]

 

[Vic Mackey 47027]

I still can't figure out how this was called offsides...

 

[Deguello 54]

Tip of the ball is on the forward edge of the blue scrimmage line. Helmet is nearly all the way across the blue line and is past the ball. 

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

I didn't go back and inspect, but The Ticket mentioned that the blue line isn't accurate and the 50 is the LOS in which case it's offsides

[Deguello 54]

Even using the blue line just as reference, it shows his helmet past the ball. He’s aligned  a full head and some shoulder farther forward than Lawrence or anyone else. He was offsides. 

[Vic Mackey 47027]

Not buying it. I don't see him being offsides.

One of the more bizarre officiating errors in a night marked with several of them came when the folks in black and white wiped out a Drew Brees fumble, recovered by the Cowboys.

Referee Walt Anderson announced that Cowboys defensive end Randy Gregory had lined up in the neutral zone. But one small problem existed with this conclusion: Gregory wasn’t lined up in the neutral zone.

The neutral zone is, per the official rulebook, the “space between the forward and backward points of the ball (planes) and extends to the sidelines.” Look at the photo of the pre-snap alignment. Gregory’s hand simply doesn’t line up with or beyond the forward point of the ball.

“This is too technical for a foul to be called,” former NFL referee and current Sunday Night Football rules analyst Terry McAulay told PFT via text message. “Moreover, the [left tackle] appears to be lined up in the backfield, so it would be better to have simply warned both players in this situation.”

Even a warning arguably would have been excessive. Gregory simply wasn’t in the neutral zone, and the official that concluded otherwise flat out blew it.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/11/30/randy-gregory-wasnt-lined-up-in-the-neutral-zone/

Edited November 30, 2018 by Vic Mackey

[Bone3421 716]

Not sure about that go skins vic....we still play the eagles so i say go eagles mnf then we beat them next game and we are sitting pretty

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

Just now, Deguello said:

Even using the blue line just as reference, it shows his helmet past the ball. He’s aligned  a full head and some shoulder farther forward than Lawrence or anyone else. He was offsides. 

I agree.  Even with the blue line as your reference you should just be thinking it was a ticky tacky at worst.  I don't understand why anyone thinks it was a bogus call.  He's offsides

[kevwun 15777]

Yeah, you can just glance at that picture and see he's lined up way out in front of the rest of the line.

[Pato del Muerto 52490]

6 minutes ago, Deguello said:

Even using the blue line just as reference, it shows his helmet past the ball. He’s aligned  a full head and some shoulder farther forward than Lawrence or anyone else. He was offsides. 

By your definition, the center is offsides (and would be for all plays).  I don’t think that’s how offsides is defined for either side of the ball. 

[Deguello 54]

1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

By your definition, the center is offsides (and would be for all plays).  I don’t think that’s how offsides is defined for either side of the ball. 

No he isn't and no he wouldn't be.

His helmet isn't past the tip of the ball. Gregory's helmet was. Use the 50 yard line as reference for the leading edge of the ball and of Gregory's helmet. And of the center's helmet, if you like.

[Deguello 54]

7 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

By your definition, the center is offsides (and would be for all plays).  I don’t think that’s how offsides is defined for either side of the ball. 

Here's how offside is defined:

SECTION 20 - OFFSIDE

A player is Offside when any part of his body or his person is in the Neutral Zone...

ARTICLE 2. NEUTRAL ZONE

The Neutral Zone is the space between the forward and backward points of the ball (planes) and extends to the sidelines.

Item 2. Snapper. If he is the snapper, no part of his body may be beyond the Neutral Zone.

Edited November 30, 2018 by Deguello

[Pato del Muerto 52490]

2 minutes ago, Deguello said:

No he isn't and no he wouldn't be.

His helmet isn't past the tip of the ball. Gregory's helmet was. Use the 50 yard line as reference for the leading edge of the ball and of Gregory's helmet. And of the center's helmet, if you like.

The neutral zone is the ball. Players line up based on the ball. 

[Pato del Muerto 52490]

1 minute ago, Deguello said:

Here's how offside is defined:

SECTION 20 - OFFSIDE

A player is Offside when any part of his body or his person is in the Neutral Zone...

ARTICLE 2. NEUTRAL ZONE

The Neutral Zone is the space between the forward and backward points of the ball (planes) and extends to the sidelines.

Item 2. Snapper. If he is the snapper, no part of his body may be beyond the Neutral Zone.

Thanks for that. 

[Deguello 54]

Just now, Pato del Muerto said:

The neutral zone is the ball. Players line up based on the ball. 

And Gregory's helmet is past the tip of ball. Offsides.

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

His helmet hand and shoulders are completely over the 50 yard line (no other DLs is)

His helmet is over the blue line.

Whatever your reference he's offsides.  I get it if you think it's minor if the blue line is your reference, but you are crazy if you don't think he's offsides.

[Deguello 54]

16 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Not buying it. I don't see him being offsides.

...

The neutral zone is, per the official rulebook, the “space between the forward and backward points of the ball (planes) and extends to the sidelines.” Look at the photo of the pre-snap alignment. Gregory’s hand simply doesn’t line up with or beyond the forward point of the ball.

...

His hand isn't offside. His head is.

[Pato del Muerto 52490]

1 minute ago, Gene Parmesan said:

His helmet hand and shoulders are completely over the 50 yard line (no other DLs is)

His helmet is over the blue line.

Whatever your reference he's offsides.  I get it if you think it's minor if the blue line is your reference, but you are crazy if you don't think he's offsides.

The blue line doesn’t matter. The 50 yard line does not matter. The ball matters. And yes, based on the rule posted, he’s offside based on his helmet. 

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

28 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I didn't go back and inspect, but The Ticket mentioned that the blue line isn't accurate and the 50 is the LOS in which case it's offsides

This is correct.... he was offsides.  And furthermore.... an idiot.

Edited November 30, 2018 by Patrick Bateman

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

3 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

The blue line doesn’t matter. The 50 yard line does not matter. The ball matters. And yes, based on the rule posted, he’s offside based on his helmet. 

Well since it's difficult to extend an imaginary line from the ball to the sidelines you might as well use the ones drawn on the field. 

['stache 21808]

A Saints d-lineman lined up almost identical on Dallas' last drive.  You see it all the time where it's close like this and they never call offsides.  Sounds like they can warn if they are lining that close and its questionable?  I just don't see any clear basis to call that offsides.

[GRHorn 105]

3 hours ago, 'stache said:

I think Dak still has potential for greatness.  All of his flaws are fixable.  He sees the field well, makes pretty good decisions, and is accurate most of the time.  Most important (to me at least) is that he spreads the ball around to multiple receivers, which means he sees the entire field, reads defenses, and doesn't stare down receivers.  That alone is (in my opinion) the biggest thing that separates NFL quality QBs from the rest.

As I mentioned, his flaws are fixable.  When the pocket collapses he needs to make a quicker decision to run, throw it away, or tuck it in and take the sack.  He needs to feel the pressure better and tuck the ball in all circumstances.  He needs to be more consistent with his accuracy.  These are all things that can be learned with experience and coaching. 

I really wish Jerry would hire a real QB coach instead of letting Kellen Moore play coach because he's "a good kid."  There is no way a guy who is only a few years out of college and has proven unable to play the position at the NFL level is qualified to teach the position.  He needs to cut his teeth in college as a coach and then as a lower level assistant in the NFL before he's qualified to teach a young guy like Dak to realize his full potential.  Bring in a real QB coach to help fix the flaws and release the beast!

Accuracy is not a very fixable trait imo. By the time you get to NFL you either have it or don’t. You can get more consistent with footwork etc, but he misses too many gimmes that top QBs don’t. Like Gallup’s double move tonight.  Cooper the game before.

Also, I’ve heard it referenced before but he doesn’t throw well with anticipation. Needs to see guys open more.  That is hard to improve. I think it’s a big part of his tendency to hold the ball too long. 

Again, I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see him ever being top 10 QB in league. 

[Pato del Muerto 52490]

10 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Well since it's difficult to extend an imaginary line from the ball to the sidelines you might as well use the ones drawn on the field. 

Hope it’s not that difficult, as the vast majority of the field offers no such drawn line, while the refs and players have to figure it out every play. 

[Newy25 7668]

So that linebacker from Boise St, he seems pretty good. 

[Deguello 54]

1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Hope it’s not that difficult, as the vast majority of the field offers no such drawn line, while the refs and players have to figure it out every play. 

Well, they get to work in 3D and look straight down the line, so that doesn't hurt.

[immortal13 4059]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

I might actually buy into this defense. They have flaws (every defense does) but they have a certain swagger to them we haven't seen in a very long time. And it starts with Vander Esch and Jaylon. I mean last night was the litmus test for them. Best offense in the league by most metrics. Defense never let them breathe last night. It was glorious.

I have no idea what it is about these games that Garrett and company win. Yet they can't do it consistently. 

Go Redskins on MNF. 

I think we want an Eagles win, don't we? Eagles win over Washington increases our lead over the Skins and then we can lock up the division in our next game vs the Eagles.

[Underdog 28621]

30 minutes ago, Deguello said:

And Gregory's helmet is past the tip of ball. Offsides.

Just the tip?

[totallynotabuttpirate 5396]

Just now, 'stache said:

A Saints d-lineman lined up almost identical on Dallas' last drive.  You see it all the time where it's close like this and they never call offsides.  Sounds like they can warn if they are lining that close and its questionable?  I just don't see any clear basis to call that offsides.

This was the complaint by Aikman and Mike Pereira, they never make that call. Funny how many cowboys have a call that hasn't been made all year. 

[Gene Parmesan 4006]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

I think we want an Eagles win, don't we? Eagles win over Washington increases our lead over the Skins and then we can lock up the division in our next game vs the Eagles.

As much as it pains me to say Colt isn't leading the Redskins anywhere even though they are ahead of the Eagles right now.  The Eagles are the ones with a legit chance to get something going like Dallas did.

[immortal13 4059]

Just now, Gene Parmesan said:

As much as it pains me to say Colt isn't leading the Redskins anywhere even though they are ahead of the Eagles right now.  The Eagles are the ones with a legit chance to get something going like Dallas did.

Good point

[immortal13 4059]

4 minutes ago, Underdog said:

Just the tip?

Just for a second

[Deguello 54]

10 minutes ago, Underdog said:

Just the tip?

Whatever it takes to get the job done. 

[Post Oak 20213]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

 

BaldysBreakdowns are my favorite thing on Twitter.

 

Football Guy

['stache 21808]

18 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Accuracy is not a very fixable trait imo. By the time you get to NFL you either have it or don’t. You can get more consistent with footwork etc, but he misses too many gimmes that top QBs don’t. Like Gallup’s double move tonight.  Cooper the game before.

Also, I’ve heard it referenced before but he doesn’t throw well with anticipation. Needs to see guys open more.  That is hard to improve. I think it’s a big part of his tendency to hold the ball too long. 

Again, I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see him ever being top 10 QB in league. 

You're right on accuracy, but I think he's shown he has it as opposed to bad QB's who don't.  His problem is consistency.  He hit several dimes throughout the game.  A few inaccurate throws are the exception and can be fixed, as you say, with footwork and other coaching. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/NFLGameRecaps/videos/262305764454479/

[Vic Mackey 47027]

28 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

I think we want an Eagles win, don't we? Eagles win over Washington increases our lead over the Skins and then we can lock up the division in our next game vs the Eagles.

You might be right but I hate the fucking Eagles and wouldn't mind seeing Colt bury their season.

But I don't have a lot of faith that Colt can go win that game on the road. I think we might benefit from either result at this point. But win next week against the Eagles and we can put a strangle hold on this shit division. 

[kingkoopa6 8350]

How's yall day going gents?

Hopefully yall set up some office bets and collected with a fat smile!!

 

 

[immortal13 4059]

Just now, Vic Mackey said:

You might be right but I hate the fucking Eagles and wouldn't mind seeing Colt bury their season.

But I don't have a lot of faith that Colt can go win that game on the road. I think we might benefit from either result at this point. But win next week against the Eagles and we can put a strangle hold on this shit division. 

Yeah, I don't think I could root against Colt vs the Eagles either

[totallynotabuttpirate 5396]

2 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

You might be right but I hate the fucking Eagles and wouldn't mind seeing Colt bury their season.

But I don't have a lot of faith that Colt can go win that game on the road. I think we might benefit from either result at this point. But win next week against the Eagles and we can put a strangle hold on this shit division. 

Don't bite off more then you can chew.

[Vic Mackey 47027]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

Yeah, I don't think I could root against Colt vs the Eagles either

If we tied with the Skins and split the season series, what is the next tiebreaker for a division? Is it division record?

[Vic Mackey 47027]

Just now, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Don't bite off more then you can chew.

Meaning what? Next week's win against the Eagles would absolutely do that. That win would be bigger than this Saints win in terms of what it does for our division hopes. Dallas is in the driver's seat now. Which seems weird after the shitty Titans game but here we are. Now comes the challenge of if we will continue this momentum or falter late like so many Garrett led teams.

We also get some scheduling benefits here. We have extended rest going into next week's game. Eagles will be coming off a short week playing MNF. That is a huge advantage this late in the year where attrition starts to kick in to high gear.

[totallynotabuttpirate 5396]

2 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Meaning what? Next week's win against the Eagles would absolutely do that. That win would be bigger than this Saints win in terms of what it does for our division hopes. Dallas is in the driver's seat now. Which seems weird after the shitty Titans game but here we are. Now comes the challenge of if we will continue this momentum or falter late like so many Garrett led teams.

We also get some scheduling benefits here. We have extended rest going into next week's game. Eagles will be coming off a short week playing MNF. That is a huge advantage this late in the year where attrition starts to kick in to high gear.

It was yoke 

 

[ABSR 5310]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

Not buying it. I don't see him being offsides.

One of the more bizarre officiating errors in a night marked with several of them came when the folks in black and white wiped out a Drew Brees fumble, recovered by the Cowboys.

Referee Walt Anderson announced that Cowboys defensive end Randy Gregory had lined up in the neutral zone. But one small problem existed with this conclusion: Gregory wasn’t lined up in the neutral zone.

The neutral zone is, per the official rulebook, the “space between the forward and backward points of the ball (planes) and extends to the sidelines.” Look at the photo of the pre-snap alignment. Gregory’s hand simply doesn’t line up with or beyond the forward point of the ball.

“This is too technical for a foul to be called,” former NFL referee and current Sunday Night Football rules analyst Terry McAulay told PFT via text message. “Moreover, the [left tackle] appears to be lined up in the backfield, so it would be better to have simply warned both players in this situation.”

Even a warning arguably would have been excessive. Gregory simply wasn’t in the neutral zone, and the official that concluded otherwise flat out blew it.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/11/30/randy-gregory-wasnt-lined-up-in-the-neutral-zone/

The other thing that bothered me on this play is that the flag is not thrown immediately by the referee.  If someone is off sides and the line judge considers them off sides then it is easy to throw the flag immediately upon snap of the ball assuming the player does not move themselves back before the snap.  An immediate dropping of the flag is what I have always seen. 

If you watch the play the ball is snapped, the play progresses, and then Dallas sacks/strips the ball free and it gets knocked about 10 yards behind brees and both teams start to scramble for the ball.  Only at this point does the flag drop.  You can clearly see it is not on the ground, and only at this point does the flag get thrown and land of the fifty yard line. 

Seems odd.

[txbroadcaster 110]

1 minute ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

It was yoke 

 

Well eggcuse Mackey he misunderstood 

[immortal13 4059]

18 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

If we tied with the Skins and split the season series, what is the next tiebreaker for a division? Is it division record?

I believe so

[immortal13 4059]

12 minutes ago, ABSR said:

The other thing that bothered me on this play is that the flag is not thrown immediately by the referee.  If someone is off sides and the line judge considers them off sides then it is easy to throw the flag immediately upon snap of the ball assuming the player does not move themselves back before the snap.  An immediate dropping of the flag is what I have always seen. 

If you watch the play the ball is snapped, the play progresses, and then Dallas sacks/strips the ball free and it gets knocked about 10 yards behind brees and both teams start to scramble for the ball.  Only at this point does the flag drop.  You can clearly see it is not on the ground, and only at this point does the flag get thrown and land of the fifty yard line. 

Seems odd.

Very odd

[Vic Mackey 47027]

The other thing that bothered me on this play is that the flag is not thrown immediately by the referee.  If someone is off sides and the line judge considers them off sides then it is easy to throw the flag immediately upon snap of the ball assuming the player does not move themselves back before the snap.  An immediate dropping of the flag is what I have always seen. 
If you watch the play the ball is snapped, the play progresses, and then Dallas sacks/strips the ball free and it gets knocked about 10 yards behind brees and both teams start to scramble for the ball.  Only at this point does the flag drop.  You can clearly see it is not on the ground, and only at this point does the flag get thrown and land of the fifty yard line. 
Seems odd.

Yeah this is what I don't get. Shouldn't that flag be thrown the second the ball is snapped? Even Bob Sturm said there is no way you can throw that flag.

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

Accuracy is not a very fixable trait imo. By the time you get to NFL you either have it or don’t. You can get more consistent with footwork etc, but he misses too many gimmes that top QBs don’t. Like Gallup’s double move tonight.  Cooper the game before.

Also, I’ve heard it referenced before but he doesn’t throw well with anticipation. Needs to see guys open more.  That is hard to improve. I think it’s a big part of his tendency to hold the ball too long. 

Again, I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see him ever being top 10 QB in league. 

Dependent on what the issue is, accuracy can absolutely be fixed or improved.  Dak is completing almost 67% of passes so what the fuck are we talking about.  He led the league in tight space accuracy last season despite having a mediocre completion percentage.  He was 24-28 last night.  Dak's accuracy issues are specifically in relation to his footwork when in the pocket.  Like most QBs, he needs a manageable pocket to get his footwork correct and step into his throws.  When he has this pocket, he's extremely accurate.  When he's forced offschedule or to re-set his throwing base, this is when he can get wonky.  Accuracy isn't his issue.  Will he be elite?  Probably not without a scheme change, but he can certainly be good with proper protection.  Dak isn't good enough in making offschedule throws or changing his arm angle like a guy like Rodgers or even Ben.  

Now, anticipation is a tough trait to improve upon.  It can be improved with reps, experience and mastery of defenses and film work but if you don't have it, you may never be elite at it.  This is a Dak issue.  He often needs to see his guy flash.  He'll never have elite anticipation like Tony did.

Dak probably will never be an elite QB but because of his build and legs and competitiveness, he can be a good QB in his prime if he continues to improve.  A lot of folks hate the comparison because of the team, but he was often compared to Donovan McNabb coming out.  You can win big with a prime Donovan McNabb if the team around him is sound.  

Edited November 30, 2018 by Patrick Bateman