Texas will never be good again until this happens

[In10se 175]

Said this when strong was here. Saying it again now. 

This program will continue to suck until they stop trying to fit these HS players who almost all grew up in various spread systems into these power running type of offenses. It will never work. 

For proof look no farther than the inbreds up north. Around the mid 2000s Stoops took a look around and saw that his big recruiting bases were all high schools running various spread systems. He then adapted and turned his program around to match and it's worked like a boss ever since and has continued with a spread guy in Riley. 

Look at what happened at Baylor in the late 2000s. They looked around and grabbed one of the early adopters/innovators of a form of spread offense. Within a few seasons Briles had them winning the conference and contending for a NC. At fucking Baylor. That's how powerful it is. 

Even in our own program take a look at 2016. In only 1 season where Strong, 2 years too late,  went out and got a spread guy to run that offense. With no QB worth a shit and a completely shit OL that offense put up 492 total yards per game and produced a 2000 yd rusher. With no QB and a shit line.

That team had a shit defense and just didn't have the talent on either side to make up for Strong's shit coaching, but they had finally matched the offensive system to what Texas HS QBs, OL, RBs,  and receivers have been doing since junior high and it showed. 

The talent level is getting better but won't matter and no 10+ win season will ever happen again until this program takes a cue from the dirt burglars and stops trying to establish gold mines while sitting on a mountain full of diamonds. 

[David Dennison 18659]

What kind of offense do you think Tom Herman is trying to run?

[wood 11160]

Well, yep. 

[Dark Horse 2263]

We’re doing click bait thread titles now? 

Fuck

 

[6th Street 6357]

Dumb thread. TCU and Ok State are doing fine. 

[Capn81 372]

We’re doing click bait thread titles now? 
Fuck
 

I expect to see this as a link on Yahoo.

[In10se 175]

4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

What kind of offense do you think Tom Herman is trying to run?

He calls it a "pro style spread" but it incorporates a lot more pro style power running zone blocking concepts that our Texas HS OL just don't usually run these days. It uses a lot of 11 personnel with the in-line TEs that allow defenses to stack the box more than we need with this line. 

[David Dennison 18659]

1 minute ago, BurntEyes said:

I don't have any fucking clue what type of offense he's trying to run and neither does he.

I'm pretty sure it's a run first spread, which is weird because that's not what it was on Saturday. 

But it's a spread.

[Bruh Man 3160]

I wish TXHSFB would just go back to its roots. The fall off started when the video game offenses took over our recruiting base. 

[El Diablo 4232]

Style of play doesn't matter nearly as much as consistency practicing the same thing for 5 years. You take the best football players you can sign and teach them your way for 5 years, it'll work. You just need to know what the fuck you want to do.

[In10se 175]

It also asks a lot more of the QB than these Texas HS QBs are used to and, to put it bluntly, asks more than a kind of dim witted kid like Ehlinger needs to be doing. 

[Fuck Tim Beck 3806]

2 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Sure, if you say so. Might want to tell corch.

He's busy reading Steinbeck. 

[David Dennison 18659]

2 minutes ago, In10se said:

He calls it a "pro style spread" but it incorporates a lot more pro style power running zone blocking concepts that our Texas HS OL just don't usually run these days. It uses a lot of 11 personnel with the in-line TEs that allow defenses to stack the box more than we need with this line. 

If our players can't pick it up because of their high school systems, then our coaches are terrible teachers and need to be fired.

[F250 28691]

11 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

What kind of offense do you think Tom Herman is trying to run?

Tom's running the finger your own butthole and sniff your finger offense.

 

[In10se 175]

1 minute ago, El Diablo said:

Style of play doesn't matter nearly as much as consistency practicing the same thing for 5 years. You take the best football players you can sign and teach them your way for 5 years, it'll work. You just need to know what the fuck you want to do.

Or,  you do like Stoops established a decade ago and run offense that these kids have already been training in for 4 to 7 years before you ever get them on campus. It's not rocket science. Let the HS coaches be your farm system. 

[El Diablo 4232]

1 minute ago, In10se said:

It also asks a lot more of the QB than these Texas HS QBs are used to and, to put it bluntly, asks more than a kind of dim witted kid like Ehlinger needs to be doing. 

Not every HS QB in Texas is in a spread offense. There's plenty of schools running drop back and pass, hand the ball off type offenses. You don't need 14 QB's, you just need to sign 2 or so each year. Nobody has the patience for that shit though, right OP?

[wood 11160]

8 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

I don't have any fucking clue what type of offense he's trying to run and neither does he.

Yeah I've seen little evidence in years of an offensive identity around here.

[ButtFumble 5158]

the flip side is you can always try and leverage a (what should be) a national brand into national recruiting

tom is actually trying to do that, but with games like yesterday who knows how well he can sell it or how long he will get (or deserve to get) to make it happen

lets look at OU that you mentioned this year for recruiting 17 so far 8 from Texas 9 from elsewhere....last year 8 from Texas 16 from elsewhere.....2017 9 from Texas 19 from elsewhere.......2016 4 from Texas 19 from elsewhere.....2015 12 from Texas 16 from elsewhere

lets look at Alabama this year so far 21 recruits ZERO from Texas......last year 21 recruits ONE from Texas....2017 29 recruits 3 from Texas.....2016 24 recruits 4 from Texas

lets look at LSU this year 19 so far 3 from Texas....2018 22 recruits 3 from Texas....2017 24 recruits 5 from Texas.....2016 26 with 3 from Texas

Auburn 15 this year so far NONE from Texas....2018 23 NONE from Texas.....2017 21 one from Texas.....2016 23 one from Texas

Clemson 23 this year NONE from Texas......2018 17 none from Texas......2017 14 NONE from Texas......2016 21 one from Texas

 

Texas high school coaches coddle their players and let them be entitled dickheads that get in a lot of trouble at college and play soft as fuck that is something that needs to change, but in the mean time Texas needs to recruit as a national brand not the brand in the state of Texas

[DaggerHorns 3058]

14 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

What kind of offense do you think Tom Herman is trying to run?

Single option yardage suppressor.

[El Diablo 4232]

2 minutes ago, F250 said:

Tom's running the finger your own butthole and sniff your finger offense.

 

That's the one that makes the monkey fall of the tree limb. 

[pacman 7330]

Texas will never be good again until this happens....

 

we stop letting head coaches hire friends over the best coach for the job

 

[David Dennison 18659]

1 minute ago, In10se said:

Or,  you do like Stoops established a decade ago and run offense that these kids have already been training in for 4 to 7 years before you ever get them on campus. It's not rocket science. Let the HS coaches be your farm system. 

So you want to run the Air Raid.

How many teams that run that offense have a national championship in the last 20 years?

[In10se 175]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

If our players can't pick it up because of their high school systems, then our coaches are terrible teachers and need to be fired.

Remember he's dealing with 18 to 21 yr old kids. Kids who are millennials with short attention spans and also have a lot of class time and other strains on their attention. 

In a lot of ways the offensive line problem is more than just learning. Most of these guys just weren't brought up to be power blocking mailers knowing complicated zone concepts. The upper Midwest and SEC states produce those guys like crazy but Texas just doesn't. That's why you see those guys getting drafted out of SEC schools and places like Wisconsin, ND,  and Ohio St

[wood 11160]

1 minute ago, pacman said:

Texas will never be good again until this happens....

 

we stop letting head coaches hire friends over the best coach for the job

 

Don't you even alignment, bro?

[Surly Bevo 24696]

We need our offensive and defensive linemen to be pipe hitting motherfuckers more than anything else.

Alabama does what they do for that very reason. It’s not RBs WRs or even QBs that consistently win championships in college football. It’s pipe hitting motherfuckers in the trenches.

[F250 28691]

3 minutes ago, wood said:

Yeah I've seen little evidence in years of an offensive identity around here.

No shit, the Texas offense has had an offensive identity crisis going back to GDGD. Mack Brown going schizophrenic towards the end didn't help matters either.

[F250 28691]

7 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

That's the one that makes the monkey fall of the tree limb. 

Yes, yes it is and its what happened last Saturday.

[In10se 175]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

So you want to run the Air Raid.

How many teams that run that offense have a national championship in the last 20 years?

You don't have to run air raid. OU doesn't run air raid. There's no reason to reinvent the wheel here. Look what OU does that has them plaYing in the playoffs. Look what Briles did that almost had Baylor of all tiny shitty schools playing in the playoffs. 

We did it for one year and it outperformed the horrible talent level we trotted out on offense. But then we stupidly said fuck this and hired a guy who wants to trot out 11 personnel and power zone block with lineman who can't do it. All because he was Mack's GA and the flavor of the month

[David Dennison 18659]

2 minutes ago, In10se said:

You don't have to run air raid. OU doesn't run air raid. There's no reason to reinvent the wheel here. Look what OU does that has them plaYing in the playoffs. Look what Briles did that almost had Baylor of all tiny shitty schools playing in the playoffs. 

We did it for one year and it outperformed the horrible talent level we trotted out on offense. But then we stupidly said fuck this and hired a guy who wants to trot out 11 personnel and power zone block with lineman who can't do it. All because he was Mack's GA and the flavor of the month

So how many national championships has the offense you want to run produced in the last 20 years?

[ButtFumble 5158]

9 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

Dumb thread. TCU and Ok State are doing fine. 

OkState 16 recruits this year 7 from Texas 9 from elsewhere......2018 24 total 13 from Texas 11 from somewhere else....2017 21 with 9 from Texas 12 from somewhere else......2016 20 with 7 from Texas.......stepping back a few years........2010 27 recruits with 20 from Texas.......2009 25 with 8 from Texas......2008 27 with 15 from Texas.....2007 23 with 15 from Texas......it is pretty clear that OkState has moved away from filling the majority of their team with Texas recruits and is looking to keep it to half or less and I would imagine it will trend more towards well less than half

 

TCU this year 18 so far with 14 from Texas....2018 23 with 14 from Texas.....2017 24 with 12 from Texas.....2016 22 with 12 from Texas.....2015 23 with 20 from Texas....2014 22 with 19 from Texas......2013 23 with 17 from Texas......so TCU is not scared at all and plenty willing and ABLE to fill over half their recruiting with players from outside of Texas and like Texas when Texas was successful under Mack Brown TCU has someone with a major focusnessess on DEFENSE and they change up their O and their OCs to match what they have and need and they lose OCs and run them off when they grow tired........this is somewhat like Mack and the churn of DCs (mainly from Auburn) and an offense that had a guy (that everyone hated) that would just make shit up to match the players available......this as opposed to a guy that just tried to cram shit on players that is not working and then does a shitty job calling that offense even when some parts of it show signs of life 

[In10se 175]

4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

So how many national championships has the offense you want to run produced in the last 20 years?

It's won a lot of conference titles and had teams playing for NCs. OU souls have had one last year if they weren't saddled with Mike Stoops' horrible defense. 

A place with the national pull of Texas has never committed to it. You pair offense that fits the linemen and QBs your recruiting grounds produce with the talent UT can put on defense and you start to have something. 

Edited September 4, 2018 by In10se

[Kyrie Eleison 9312]

He calls it a "pro style spread" but it incorporates a lot more pro style power running zone blocking concepts that our Texas HS OL just don't usually run these days. It uses a lot of 11 personnel with the in-line TEs that allow defenses to stack the box more than we need with this line. 

you mentioned Briles/Baylor as an example. fyi...Briles’ blocking schemes in his offense are based off Yoeman’s veer concepts (Briles played for UH under Yoeman) an offense that nary any UIL school runs nowadays.

iow, your premise is flawed from the outset.

Briles simply knew a real football player when he saw one, stars be damned. and if they could run, all the better.

[In10se 175]

1 minute ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

 

you mentioned Briles/Baylor as an example. fyi...Briles’ blocking schemes in his offense are based off Yoeman’s veer concepts (Briles played for UH under Yoeman) an offense that nary any UIL school runs nowadays.

iow, your premise is flawed from the outset.

Briles simply knew a real football player when he saw one, stars be damned. and if they could run, all the better.

 

Not a ton of HSs run the veer but the concepts fit what almost all big Texas HS programs do run: spread out defenses, allow your QBs simple reads against these defenses,  and not asking linemen to line up against heavy boxes and power block whether zone or man. 

It's not one set system. It's finding a system that incorporates the attributes the players you are bringing in are already trained to do.

It's not just me spouting this off. The proof is there. It's how OU switches out linemen,  QBs,  receivers,  etc and keeps running out 10+ win seasons and conf titles. They aren't trying to change every new recruiting class into something they aren't. 

[David Dennison 18659]

5 minutes ago, In10se said:

Not a ton of HSs run the veer but the concepts fit what almost all big Texas HS programs do run: spread out defenses, allow your QBs simple reads against these defenses,  and not asking linemen to line up against heavy boxes and power block whether zone or man. 

It's not one set system. It's finding a system that incorporates the attributes the players you are bringing in are already trained to do.

It's not just me spouting this off. The proof is there. It's how OU switches out linemen,  QBs,  receivers,  etc and keeps running out 10+ win seasons and conf titles. They aren't trying to change every new recruiting class into something they aren't. 

They do well against the Big XII for sure. 

They run into problems when they have to play the SEC.

[NoRagrets 1125]

37 minutes ago, Fuck Tim Beck said:

He's busy reading Steinbeck. 

Misreading Steinbeck and coverage

[Kyrie Eleison 9312]

Not a ton of HSs run the veer but the concepts fit what almost all big Texas HS programs do run: spread out defenses, allow your QBs simple reads against these defenses,  and not asking linemen to line up against heavy boxes and power block whether zone or man. 
It's not one set system. It's finding a system that incorporates the attributes the players you are bringing in are already trained to do.
It's not just me spouting this off. The proof is there. It's how OU switches out linemen,  QBs,  receivers,  etc and keeps running out 10+ win seasons and conf titles. They aren't trying to change every new recruiting class into something they aren't. 

most inside and outside veer schemes are in fact zone blocked. and in addition it requires a shit ton of man up, esp on the second level, so long as you leave the two primary DL reads (usually the 3 and the 5 or 7, depending on the front) completely unblocked, you can scheme it as you wish. nowadays, as mentioned above, it’s zone blocked.

Baylor under Briles was a zone team the majority of snaps, btw.

[In10se 175]

1 minute ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

 

most inside and outside veer schemes are in fact zone blocked. and in addition it requires a shit ton of man up, esp on the second level, so long as you leave the two primary DL reads (usually the 3 and the 5 or 7, depending on the front) completely unblocked, you can scheme it as you wish. nowadays, as mentioned above, it’s zone blocked.

Baylor under Briles was a zone team the majority of snaps, btw.
 

 

Difference is they didn't allow defenses to play 3 LBs and stack 7 to 8 in the box the way Herman's allowed Maryland to do. They forced you to go nickel and match up wide to each boundary allowing their line to play more to their strengths. It's the same thing Gilbert did in 2016 that allowed a 2000 us rusher with inferior talent on the line and at QB. It doesn't matter if you zone or man block if you're giving these linemen the looks and scheme they know and have been executing for years. 

I just brought up zone blocking because it's what Herman uses and it tends to be more complicated and require more athletic linemen. This current  offense would look just as shitty in a man blocking scheme.

[Dewey 3280]

Honestly, it's the shade of orange we're using these days. Its gay and leans to the left. I feel.like I should stop asking CDC for free shit on Twitter and really press him about the color we're usuing.

[kopp0e 1135]

1 hour ago, In10se said:

Look at what happened at Baylor in the late 2000s. They looked around and grabbed one of the early adopters/innovators of a form of spread offense. Within a few seasons Briles had them raping students on campus, while the conference did practically nothing. At fucking Baylor. That's how powerful it is. 

I volunteered to fix this for you...

[markstanco 12509]

Message board OP should coaches

[ButtFumble 5158]

lets compare and contrast the above recruiting numbers to two teams that perennially under perform

aggy this year 25 so far with 18 from Texas......2018 23 with 15 from Texas....2017 28 with 22 from Texas.....2016 20 with 15 from Texas.....2015 27 with 19 from Texas

Texas 15 so far 8 from Texas (tom has said he is going to go national I hope he follows through/can follow through)......2018 27 with 19 from Texas.....2017 17 with 13 from Texas......2016 28 with 23 from Texas......2015 27 with 19 from Texas

and lets be honest here you can say a lot of those were the "top recruits", but the reality is a lot of TOP RECRUITS went elsewhere and a lot of the ones that stayed in Texas were either soft as fuck, were problem children or they were soft as fuck problem children because both aggy and Texas have had PLENTY of soft as fuck problem children over the last few years while a lot of other programs got top Texas recruits and either made them earn something at a place where all their dumb ass friends did not "know who they were" from high school or did not give a fuck who they were in high school and probably mocked them endlessly when they tried to bring it up

as for Briles he actually had a lot of respect from Texas HS coaches, he knew how the system worked, he knew who the dick head full of shit HS coaches were that produced problem children and the truth of the matter is he was willing to take some of those problem children and let them wreck shop on the field and off the field and unfortunately a lot of Texas HS coaches are 1005 OK with that and love that attitude because they know they are producing a lot of near "regarded" worthless entitled football fucks with a lot of issues and problems they have tried to cover up for and I think a lot of TOP college coaches are aware of that and that is just another reason that TOP college programs are shying away from Texas talent and going elsewhere.....the upside and the problems are not worth the time and effort and it is easier to pick and choose and make Texas HS coaches beg for spots for their players on those college teams instead of feeling their dumb ass fuck nut players are entitled to them like they tried to tell Charlie

[Blotto 23434]

1 hour ago, Capn81 said:

 

I expect to see this as a link on Yahoo.

 

With a 15 image slideshow. Fuck those are great.

[HOOK'EMHOOAH 1606]

2 hours ago, David Dennison said:

I'm pretty sure it's a run first spread, which is weird because that's not what it was on Saturday. 

But it's a spread.

Im pretty sure it's actually a Hershey-squirts shit spread. Which is weird because the the usually when someone has the runs, they dont try and get a good push.

[Ramdiesel 109]

2 hours ago, In10se said:

Or,  you do like Stoops established a decade ago and run offense that these kids have already been training in for 4 to 7 years before you ever get them on campus. It's not rocket science. Let the HS coaches be your farm system. 

Or, he could do what Stoops did for the better part of his career and hire an  actual innovative/  good Offensive Coordinator....That doesnt seems like rocket science.  He could also bench players like Stoops would have when they suck, and possibly move players around like Stoops did to other positions when they might be better for the team at a different position.

[phdhorn 6224]

It's a spread because defenses run through it like melted butter.

[54_Strat 34]

We do run a spread offense. We don’t run it well, but we run a spread offense. 

Edited September 4, 2018 by 54_Strat

[52-80 19096]

7 hours ago, Dark Horse said:

We’re doing click bait thread titles now? 

Fuck

 

Coaches HATE him

[Coelenterate Fuccboi 13010]

1 hour ago, phdhorn said:

It's a spread because defenses run through it like melted butter.

It was actually refreshing to see a really good pocket for the QB on numerous occasions this weekend. Now, if we just had a QB who could consistently get the ball to receivers. Also, the run game would be far more effective if the QB kept the ball when he was the better option. See a pattern?

[EastTexan 662]

9 hours ago, Dark Horse said:

We’re doing click bait thread titles now? 

Fuck

 

Made me click. F it.

[BurntOrange&White 39661]

I’m just glad this isn’t a slideshow argument on why. Buzzfeed title af