Remembering What Mack Did Well

[PRONG HORN 3108]

 

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, FondrenRoad said:

But GG in the MNC is also Mack's fault.  The guy had almost 0 worthwhile snaps throughout the year.  You need to have a backup who is ready at all times.

Could we have won with Nordgren? Dude had more snaps than GG because VY was running up scores so early back in the day...Maybe we beat Bama on a dribble-scramble. 

[Wally Pryor 5244]

8 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

But GG in the MNC is also Mack's fault.  The guy had almost 0 worthwhile snaps throughout the year.  You need to have a backup who is ready at all times.

Yup. Spot on. 

[South Austin 52129]

Amazingly, GG got worse with more snaps, so maybe going in the MNC game cold was the best thing for us.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

And yet he is still a fringe NFL player.

 

https://www.chron.com/sports/texans/article/Texans-work-out-quarterback-Garrett-Gilbert-13206425.php

[FondrenRoad 4378]

14 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Could we have won with Nordgren? Dude had more snaps than GG because VY was running up scores so early back in the day...Maybe we beat Bama on a dribble-scramble. 

No, and Nordgren had even fewer meaningful 2005 snaps.  We ran up the score, but Nordgren just handed it off.  He only attempted 11 throws all season.  Even GG attempted 66 in 2009.  Neither were prepared to take over if the starter was injured.  That's 100% on Mack.

And we're lucky that Vince was superhuman and also gumby.  His foot turned almost backwards against KSU.  He was only out for a minute.  USC would have beat us by 30 if Nordgren was playing.

I always thought Sherrod Harris should have been given a shot in 2009.  At least he could have done things with his feet.

Edit:  GG's 66 included the bowl game.  40 were in that game.  So 22 attempts during the season.  Woefully underprepared.

Edited September 6, 2018 by FondrenRoad

[BabaYaga 15208]

4 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Could we have won with Nordgren? Dude had more snaps than GG because VY was running up scores so early back in the day...Maybe we beat Bama on a dribble-scramble. 

GG was awful.  Here.  At SMU.  Everywhere.  Dude was snakebit.  He was never going to be "the guy", no matter where he went.  Happens.  It's going all in on certain players, they don't pan out, and then not having anything else that killed us.  Can't hurt these guys feelings.  Run them off by recruiting multiples at each position.  Cant have that.  

I just can't fathom a school so devoid of serviceable QB talent as Texas.  It's maddening.  Colt was dumb, blind luck.  Then a series of misses after misses.  Even Swoops & Barrett.  We let, what three Heisman QB's out of our own backyard?  Ash was halfway decent, but made of glass.  Heard gave me hope.  Nope.  

[BabaYaga 15208]

3 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

And yet he is still a fringe NFL player.

 

https://www.chron.com/sports/texans/article/Texans-work-out-quarterback-Garrett-Gilbert-13206425.php

That's an indictment on the NFL, and how intangibles at the most important position is all of professional sports (arguably) are weighed so heavily.  Guy has a big arm.  He's a big guy.  But man, in games...he just cant' put it all together.  

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

That's an indictment on the NFL, and how intangibles at the most important position is all of professional sports (arguably) are weighed so heavily.  Guy has a big arm.  He's a big guy.  But man, in games...he just cant' put it all together.  

Yeah, agreed. When guys like him can stick around for years and years and dudes like VY and RGIII can't, it becomes apparent that the game sucks. 

[Tex Pete 20168]

1 hour ago, Extra Anejo said:

Yes ^^ this is a pretty good representation of the Mack Era. He needed to go but there's no mistake we haven't recovered from pushing him into the broadcast booth.

We weren't going to ever recover with him on the sideline. Remember that abortion that was Charlie's first season? Mack also would have had no talent. HIs last recruiting class was absolute shit.

He fucked us at QB with Garrett Gilbert, and we still have not recovered. He had no answer.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Yeah, agreed. When guys like him can stick around for years and years and dudes like VY and RGIII can't, it becomes apparent that the game sucks. 

Vince got fucked over in the NFL.  He showed progress every year with Tennessee.  Had a 98 QB rating in 2010.  His Philly stint was underwhelming, but nearly every other QB with his prior stats would have gotten another chance after that.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, FondrenRoad said:

Vince got fucked over in the NFL.  He showed progress every year with Tennessee.  Had a 98 QB rating in 2010.  His Philly stint was underwhelming, but nearly every other QB with his prior stats would have gotten another chance after that.

Agreed, but I still maintain that the game just sucks. Too many Fishers out there with set ideas about how it should be played, ruining careers like VY's along the way. All of it making for three yards and a cloud o' dust offenses and blizzards of short passes. 

[BabaYaga 15208]

5 minutes ago, Tex Pete said:

We weren't going to ever recover with him on the sideline. Remember that abortion that was Charlie's first season? Mack also would have had no talent. HIs last recruiting class was absolute shit.

He fucked us at QB with Garrett Gilbert, and we still have not recovered. He had no answer.

What really turns my stomach, how OU recognized, and capitalized on a regime change so fluidly.  God damn those fukers, but they did it right.  It pains me.  Riley may be smoke and mirrors, benefiting from Mayfield, but they also don't lose to MD.  Period.  And they have an offensive identity.  They know who they are.  And recruit to it accordingly.  

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

29 minutes ago, PRONG HORN said:

 

Nick Rose has not aged well

[Wally Pryor 5244]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

What really turns my stomach, how OU recognized, and capitalized on a regime change so fluidly.  God damn those fukers, but they did it right.  It pains me.  Riley may be smoke and mirrors, benefiting from Mayfield, but they also don't lose to MD.  Period.  And they have an offensive identity.  They know who they are.  And recruit to it accordingly.  

OU players wouldn't look like they were running in molasses.  They'd disembowel Maryland. 

Our game was on last night simultaneously with the OU, Alabama and Auburn games from this past weekend.    You'd flip channels and th speed disparity between the first game and the other three was just sickening.  Just a different zip code.

[Longboard Horn 40125]

What Mack did well: he embraced the past and met the challenges of bringing Texas back similar to the glory days of Royal. 

[BabaYaga 15208]

3 minutes ago, Wally Pryor said:

OU players wouldn't look like they were running in molasses.  They'd disembowel Maryland. 

Our game was on last night simultaneously with the OU, Alabama and Auburn games from this past weekend.    You'd flip channels and th speed disparity between the first game and the other three was just sickening.  Just a different zip code.

That's coaching.  Players are playing.  Not reacting.  Not over-thinking.  They know what to do and how to execute.  OU beats MD by three TD's minimum.  

[BabaYaga 15208]

4 minutes ago, Longboard Horn said:

What Mack did well: he embraced the past and met the challenges of bringing Texas back similar to the glory days of Royal. 

One of Mack's first "big" hires was from the Texas HS ranks.  Immediately ingratiated himself with the group.  Bruce Chambers out of Dallas Carter.  Great move on his part.  

[babysdaddy 2718]

48 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

And yet he is still a fringe NFL player.

 

https://www.chron.com/sports/texans/article/Texans-work-out-quarterback-Garrett-Gilbert-13206425.php

is GG going to have a longer career in the NFL than VY?

 

32 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

What really turns my stomach, how OU recognized, and capitalized on a regime change so fluidly.  God damn those fukers, but they did it right.  It pains me.  Riley may be smoke and mirrors, benefiting from Mayfield, but they also don't lose to MD.  Period.  And they have an offensive identity.  They know who they are.  And recruit to it accordingly.  

Well, they did get an example of how to do it exactly wrong by us. 

[Nivek 16852]

The 2008 team lost fair and square to Tech.  Yeah, we should have won, but we didn't, and we got fucked by the polls, but its not quite the same type of heartbreak as 2009.
And yeah, I think we beat Bama easily with a healthy Colt.  They didn't have an offense that could score with us.  I think Saban knew that too which is why he went Les Miles and faked a punt in his own territory on the first drive of the game.

Fair and square? Haha that was another ref screw job where our guy got held all game and even injured in a choke hold but phantom holding was called on Texas.

[Gut Wagon 8052]

16 hours ago, David Dennison said:

He was 158-48 at Texas.

Damn.

If Tom can hang on long enough, he'll beat that 48 in much less time.  

[faps 806]

Watching VY/Colt led teams on LHN replays is equal parts satisfying and depressing. It will most likely be a while before we have teams that good again. And for that I thank Mack I guess.

[EZ$ 2102]

8 hours ago, Wally Pryor said:

Recruited well, especially and, shockingly, in very timely fashion in Florida, in December 2013.  Right around December 10 to be specific. 

Brown was working so hard in doing so, give him credit, almost "killing himself" on the recruiting trail.  He was that hard at it. 

Ugh. 

 

 

Hey, that recruiting trip landed us a 2-time team captain!!!

[Mole 4320]

1 hour ago, BabaYaga said:

That's an indictment on the NFL, and how intangibles at the most important position is all of professional sports (arguably) are weighed so heavily.  Guy has a big arm.  He's a big guy.  But man, in games...he just cant' put it all together.  

3

Either I'm misunderstanding what you're saying (or maybe just how you're saying it) or you don't know what the word intangible means. 

[Bullneck 18987]

17 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

He was good at clapping, but I kind of think it worked in games like OSU 2005 to retain the appearance of calm on the sideline. Of course it looked like shit when blowU was beating us 91-3 in the second quarter, but...whattayagonnado, as the gangsters say. 

 

fughedaboudit

Edited September 6, 2018 by Bullneck

[ImissWallyPryor 9045]

3 hours ago, UTEX_ME said:

Well here's a quick and dirty list after skimming the drive chart of close games. These are score changes with less than a min on the clock, plus a couple defensive stops late:

1998

Oklahoma State: go ahead field goal w/ 0:03 remaining (Stockton). Win 37-34

aggy: go ahead field goal w/ 0:05 remaining (Stockton). Win 26-24

tech:  run by Tech w/ 0:25 remaining (Peters). Lost 42-35

1999

Iowa State: go ahead field goal w/ 0:00 remaining (Stockton). Win 44-41. 

2001 

Washington: 3 yard TD run w/ 0:38 remaining (Williams). Win 47-43. 

2002

KState: Block FG to keep lead w/ 0:00 remaining (Tubbs). Win 16-13.

Nebraska: Intercept ball on Texas 1 yard line to end game winning drive w/ 0:10 remaining. (Vasher) Win 27-24. 

2003

Tech: Go ahead touchdown w/ 0:46 remaining (Mock -> Johnson). Win 43-40.

2004

Kansas: Go ahead touchdown w/ 0:11 remaining (Young -> Jefferey). Win 27-23.

2005 

Michigan: Go ahead FG w/ 0:00 remaining (Mangum). Win 38-37.

2006

USC: Go ahead touchdown run w/ 0:19 remaining (Young). Win 41-38.

Nebraska: Go ahead FG w/ 0:23 remaining (Bailey). Win 22-20. 

2007

Oklahoma State: Go ahead FG w/ 0:00 remaining (Bailey). Win 38-35.

2008

Tech: Go ahead touchdown w/ 0:01 remaining (Harrell -> Crabtree). Lost 33-39.  

2009

Ohio State: Go ahead touchdown w/ 0:23 remaining (McCoy -> Cosby). Win 24-21

Nebraska: Go ahead FG w/ 0:00 remaining (Lawrence). Win 13-12. 

2011

aggy: Go ahead FG w/ 0:00 remaining (Tucker). Win 27-25.

2013

WVU: FG to tie game to send to OT w/ 0:13 remaining (Fera). Win in OT 47-40.

ISU: Go ahead TD run w/ 0:51 remaining (McCoy). Win 31-30.

Tl;dr His 16 seasons aged the fan base 50+ years. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That’s what I  remember. Thanks for the effort. 

Edited September 6, 2018 by ImissWallyPryor

[Deej 76543]

He rocked the butter teeth. 

Always had orange slices ready.

Woke to a bed full of shit regularly a certain Saturday morning in October.

[satyanash 14281]

Can you believe how good we once were? You never realize you're in the "good 'ol days" until they're long gone.

 

Edited September 6, 2018 by satyanash

[Tex Pete 20168]

7 hours ago, satyanash said:

Can you believe how good we once were? You never realize you're in the "good 'ol days" until they're long gone.

 

It was obvious they were gone when Iowa State kicked our asses at home in 2010. Some of you are pining for good ol’ days that weren’t really all that good.

The long run we had was great. Then it ended. 

[Bama Llama 1447]

The former M Creosote here, pleased to discover, after so many months of mourning its demise that Shaggdom  yet lives. If I can cipher out the combination on how to get my old name back I'll shed this temporary sobriquet.

I was at the double watershed 2009 UT/Bama game and I'll tell you one thing Mack or the Horns' special teams coach did well.  Bama had the national punt return leader, Javier Arenas, a points maker extraordinare, a field flipper.

On that night, fateful in so many other ways, ole Mack took Bama's return game "right off" like Ned Beatty's painties.  Arenas needed like only nine or eleven return yards to set some kind of record.  He did not get them, much less flip a field or take one back for a score.

Every kickoff was a sky kick, the first of which Bama booted, and every punt but a couple was long and out of bounds.  I've been watching Bama since 1956 and that was the most effective defensive kicking I've seen.

The Horns now remind me of Tuscaloosa before Saban.  Great fans yearning for a return to what was once called glory.  All we wanted was to sniff it again.  It clicked about halfway through his second year.  I hope it clicks for Texas this year as well.  Looking forward to an epic home and home.

[Doc Reeves 6434]

I remember in 1998 when he came onboard. He brought in energy and got all us students excited. He did those PR things like buying pizzas for all of us spending the night waiting in line for the A&M ticket draw, but they seemed genuine and sincere. People who didn’t give a shit about UT or Ricky Williams before the season suddenly did and that spread to the HS coaches and players. 

He made Football communal and fun again for me when i was in school and I’m really thankful for that experience 

Edited September 7, 2018 by Doc Reeves

[Slacks 6791]

he won games.  you know.. the only stat that actually matters.

Which would 'matter' more:
10-2 runner up.
9-3 champion.

Some wins 'matter' more than others.

But he did have us in the mix more than any other coach in the era of integrated football...

[BabaYaga 15208]

14 hours ago, Mole said:

Either I'm misunderstanding what you're saying (or maybe just how you're saying it) or you don't know what the word intangible means. 

Eh, typing too fast.  You're correct.  Tangibles.  His stats.  Size.  His arm.  His ability to make certain throws.  His intangibles are what's missing.  He's just never had "it".  

[Greg Davis Apologist 213]

Just now, tjhooker said:

He won a Big 12 title.

Two times!

Edited September 7, 2018 by Greg Davis Apologist

[BabaYaga 15208]

38 minutes ago, Greg Davis Apologist said:

Two times!

Fat Mack did have unfortunate timing.  When he was @ UNC, Bowden was still racking up conference titles.  Mack hit top 10 twice, but could never get past FSU.  Then @ Texas, Stoops comes into the picture.  

63-14 still haunts me.  We'd come back the year before 34-24 in fairly dramatic fashion.  It was bitterly cold.  Only time I've had more cocoa/coffee than beer at a game.  I was wearing a polo and jeans, something stupid like that.  Sleet, rain and wind.  Just a violation.  Then the men's BB team gets donkey-stomped later that evening.  Then a funeral for a friend that night.  Fun day...

 

[South Austin 52129]

I was at all five consecutive losses to OU in the early 00s, including the 2004 game in which Greg Robinson's defense held OU's prolific offense led by Jason White to 12 fucking points, only to watch the Greg Davis offense produce Texas' first shut out in a billion years. 

[Mossyhorn 143]

On ‎9‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 8:06 AM, South Austin said:

Charlie beat Oklahoma State in Stillwater in 2014.

I stand corrected!  

[kopp0e 1135]

17 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

GG was awful.  Here.  At SMU.  Everywhere.  Dude was snakebit.  He was never going to be "the guy", no matter where he went.  Happens.  It's going all in on certain players, they don't pan out, and then not having anything else that killed us.  Can't hurt these guys feelings.  Run them off by recruiting multiples at each position.  Cant have that.  

I just can't fathom a school so devoid of serviceable QB talent as Texas.  It's maddening.  Colt was dumb, blind luck.  Then a series of misses after misses.  Even Swoops & Barrett.  We let, what three Heisman QB's out of our own backyard?  Ash was halfway decent, but made of glass.  Heard gave me hope.  Nope.  

Could it be a combination of bad talent evaluation and placing the players mechanical throwing form out of whack by trying to fit the qb in a particular offensive set..?

[BabaYaga 15208]

5 minutes ago, kopp0e said:

Could it be a combination of bad talent evaluation and placing the players mechanical throwing form out of whack by trying to fit the qb in a particular offensive set..?

Can we not just admit that in a state with 1,200 HS's all running variations of the spread, that maybe it fucking makes sense to run that offense!  Just model what TCU and OU are doing and quit assing around.  Texas has never had a consistent offensive "identity" since I've been watching them.  Akers was too conservative, blah, blah.  So we get Mackovic and all his crap.  So we luck into Mack.  Who, to his credit adapted to fit his players.  Then Colt, but since then, who are we?  OU knows who they are.  So does TCU.  And Baylor with Briles.  Tech was the same way.  Plug and play. 

Texas is the vacillating, bi-polar, high-maintenance chick that takes two hours to get ready, gets your hopes up, makes you late to your reservation, orders the most expensive wine on the menu, then passes out when you get home.  Fuck all that....

[kopp0e 1135]

3 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Can we not just admit that in a state with 1,200 HS's all running variations of the spread, that maybe it fucking makes sense to run that offense!  Just model what TCU and OU are doing and quit assing around.  Texas has never had a consistent offensive "identity" since I've been watching them.  Akers was too conservative, blah, blah.  So we get Mackovic and all his crap.  So we luck into Mack.  Who, to his credit adapted to fit his players.  Then Colt, but since then, who are we?  OU knows who they are.  So does TCU.  And Baylor with Briles.  Tech was the same way.  Plug and play. 

Texas is the vacillating, bi-polar, high-maintenance chick that takes two hours to get ready, gets your hopes up, makes you late to your reservation, orders the most expensive wine on the menu, then passes out when you get home.  Fuck all that....

Agreed, that's how winners win, as you need the athletes to make a team, far more than the system to be rigid, best system to complement those skills...

[BabaYaga 15208]

1 minute ago, kopp0e said:

Agreed, that's how winners win, as you need the athletes to make a team, far more than the system to be rigid, best system to complement those skills...

We look slow YOY because the players keep having to learn or re-learn new systems.  They can't just "play".  They are thinking too much, and not simply reacting.  

Did Brandon Jones magically become faster?  Remember how tentative he first looked?  And now?  He's finally getting out of his own head.  Or why freshmen look so dynamic when they first play, then "slow down" as they are "coached up".  

Can please, for the love of all that is mighty, get an Art Biles offense.  Or a Cumbie offense.  Briles' style is a run-heavy spread.  And they facilitated it with mid-tier players.  

[kopp0e 1135]

2 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

We look slow YOY because the players keep having to learn or re-learn new systems.  They can't just "play".  They are thinking too much, and not simply reacting.  

Did Brandon Jones magically become faster?  Remember how tentative he first looked?  And now?  He's finally getting out of his own head.  Or why freshmen look so dynamic when they first play, then "slow down" as they are "coached up".  

Can please, for the love of all that is mighty, get an Art Biles offense.  Or a Cumbie offense.  Briles' style is a run-heavy spread.  And they facilitated it with mid-tier players.  

Who would be best to get as an offensive assistant, to coach an Art style system as well as he did, without the problem of using a former Baylor assistant..?

Would the offensive coordinator at Alabama make a latteral move..?

I think it might be best to start turning the tea leaves to see if there is a shot at the Hawaii coach as an offensive assistant...

[BabaYaga 15208]

3 minutes ago, kopp0e said:

Who would be best to get as an offensive assistant, to coach an Art style system as well as he did, without the problem of using a former Baylor assistant..?

Would the offensive coordinator at Alabama make a latteral move..?

I think it might be best to start turning the tea leaves to see if there is a shot at the Hawaii coach as an offensive assistant...

Herman was "that guy".  What he did at tOSU's MNC run was miraculous.  They come here, and crap the bed.  Maddening.  

Which, BTW, is why these guys make so much.  Top coaches at top programs are unicorns.  Beyond rare.  And when they "hit", the revenue they bring in and notoriety can be measured in the hundreds of millions.  

*See rationale behind Jimbo's contract (which I still think he's the 2010 version of Mack).  Either money-whip Carroll or go get Harsin.  

[Panama Red 63]

I was at all five consecutive losses to OU in the early 00s, including the 2004 game in which Greg Robinson's defense held OU's prolific offense led by Jason White to 12 fucking points, only to watch the Greg Davis offense produce Texas' first shut out in a billion years. 

I was at all of those too. Most miserable games of my life. Was sitting right behind the end zone when evil Roy Williams did his superfly leap over the line for the dagger in the heart. Dark times man, dark times...

[South Austin 52129]

11 minutes ago, Panama Red said:

I was at all of those too. Most miserable games of my life. Was sitting right behind the end zone when evil Roy Williams did his superfly leap over the line for the dagger in the heart. Dark times man, dark times...

Shit, I was also in that section.

[JBJ 3648]

5 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

Can we not just admit that in a state with 1,200 HS's all running variations of the spread, that maybe it fucking makes sense to run that offense!

We run a spread now. 

4 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

Either money-whip Carroll or go get Harsin.  

Run Multiple-Ace and Pro-style offenses, respectively.

Edited September 7, 2018 by JBJ

[Tex Pete 20168]

10 hours ago, Bama Llama said:

The Horns now remind me of Tuscaloosa before Saban.  Great fans yearning for a return to what was once called glory.  All we wanted was to sniff it again.  It clicked about halfway through his second year.  I hope it clicks for Texas this year as well.  Looking forward to an epic home and home.

Everything I have sniffed for the last near-decade has made me look at the bottom of my shoes to see what I just stepped in.

[kopp0e 1135]

4 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

Herman was "that guy".  What he did at tOSU's MNC run was miraculous.  They come here, and crap the bed.  Maddening.  

Which, BTW, is why these guys make so much.  Top coaches at top programs are unicorns.  Beyond rare.  And when they "hit", the revenue they bring in and notoriety can be measured in the hundreds of millions.  

*See rationale behind Jimbo's contract (which I still think he's the 2010 version of Mack).  Either money-whip Carroll or go get Harsin.  

At what point is there a "tipping point, of capping the next coach hire pay rate, as the school is unsure of if the new coach will be successful..?
Harbaugh out earns Saban, if I remember right, why, he has done less with more than even Texas, one could argue anyway...

[BabaYaga 15208]

1 minute ago, JBJ said:

We run a spread now. 

And yet we can't seem to make it work.  Texas out recruits every school in the conference with the exception of OU consistently YOY.  And I would trade offenses with almost all of them.  We can't shake this "do less with more" moniker over the last decade.  After Colt left, the only "consistent" offense we've had to any level of success was with Harsin.  

[GringoSalado 1651]

23 hours ago, Longboard Horn said:

What Mack did well: he embraced the past and met the challenges of bringing Texas back similar to the glory days of Royal. 

He got all the bbs back in the box.