Dallas officer kills man after mistaking apartment for her own, police say

[pops 6973]

Followed this thread off and on but just heard part of the 911 call on the Hardline. Geezus. I have no idea how this will all play out but that was heartbreaking. 

[TwiceHorn 31265]

44 minutes ago, 4th and 5 said:

Also I posted this way back when this happened, but she may be able to use the defense of Mistake of Fact. I haven’t looked at Texas caselaw to see if it possible. Usually the specific controls the general, and the use of a Mistake of Fact defense may not be possible. For instance there is a fairly recent case from the CCA that says the D could not get a jury charge based on the defense of Necessity, because the defensive conduct he engaged in, while it may have been a necessity, was provided for specifically by the defense of Self Defense 

I thought the essence of the deal might be mistake of fact as to being in home, thus entitled to the self-defense provisions applying to being in one's home.

[TexasEd 8064]

On 4/29/2019 at 2:41 PM, HoustonHorn said:

The police want to stay away from this at all costs. If her hours were consistent with most officers and she in any way indicates it may have hindered her judgement, that will be the basis for attorneys to try and dismiss any case by any cop who worked similar hours. Might not be successful, but it would be a shit show for them. Not that I would mind the police having to deal with a shit show of their own creation.

In Austin it would be created by the Mayor who threatens to cut critical fire and police services so we can keep the budget for all the pet projects they can imagine.

[Beau Vine 53987]

6 hours ago, hayden_horn said:

of course they don't want that released.  i mean, it would have been out the next day if it painted anyone in a favorable light.

right?

right?

That tape paints her in a much more favorable light than anything else I've read about her/the incident.

[SDG 3319]

On 9/11/2018 at 6:20 PM, Aqua Buddha said:

(Reuters) - A former Minnesota police officer charged with murdering an unarmed Australian woman in July will argue that he acted in self-defense when he fired the fatal shot from his police car, a newspaper report on Wednesday said.

 

Mohamed Noor, 32, who has been charged with third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter in the fatal shooting of 40-year-old Justine Damond, will next appear in court on May 8, online court records showed. 

Minnesota’s Star Tribune newspaper reported it obtained a court filing in the case made on Wednesday that said Noor intends to claim he used “reasonable force” when he shot Damond, a spiritual healer from Sydney, should the case go to trial.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minnesota-police/ex-minnesota-policeman-to-argue-self-defense-in-australian-womans-shooting-death-newspaper-idUSKBN1HX07Y

Found guilty.

Quote

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) -- A Minneapolis police officer was convicted of third-degree murder Tuesday in the fatal shooting of an unarmed woman who approached his squad car minutes after calling 911 to report a possible rape, a rare guilty verdict for an officer asserting he faced a life-or-death situation.

Mohamed Noor was also found guilty of manslaughter in the July 2017 death of Justine Ruszczyk Damond , a 40-year-old dual citizen of the U.S. and Australia whose death bewildered and angered people in both countries.

Noor, a two-year veteran who testified that he shifted to policing from a career in business because he "always wanted to serve," was acquitted of the most serious charge of intentional second-degree murder.

Minnesota sentencing guidelines call for up to 15 years on the murder conviction and nearly five years on the manslaughter conviction, although judges aren't bound by the guidelines and can impose much lower sentences.

Noor was handcuffed and taken into custody immediately despite his attorney's request that he be free on bond pending sentencing June 7. He showed no visible emotion and did not look back at his family, but his wife was crying.

https://news.yahoo.com/deliberations-resume-case-officer-killed-woman-044702384.html

Edited May 1, 2019 by SDG

[hayden_horn 11360]

18 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

That tape paints her in a much more favorable light than anything else I've read about her/the incident.

Having now listened to it, i kind of agree.

There are some red flags in there for her, but overall, she sounds like someone who really fucked up and knew it. Red flags include "I'm fucked," "I'm going to lose my job," and "I'm so tired." But there was a ton of distressed human there. 

I still don't understand how we go 0-60 like that. Back out of the doorway, double check stuff. Do not just start blasting. 

[Deej 76546]

Yep. Her distress after the fact doesn't absolve her. She fucked up. She acted recklessly, but that seems to be par for the course for a lot of cops.

[Beau Vine 53987]

7 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Why?

Because it is a panicking female?

A female panicking about shooting someone puts a murderer in a favorable light for you?

Before you answer know, your reaction is exactly why females conviction rates are way lower in the US and sentences for crimes are lower than like for like crimes vs men.

It's sexist in favor of female and is very common in this country when it comes to convictions and sentences.

 

I thought it put her in more favorable light because it made her sound like a caring human being who realized  that she had made a terrible mistake, rather than just another cop who didn't care because she knew she'd never face any sort of trouble for shooting a black guy, but you apparently know what I'm thinking better than I do.  

[Matuka 1305]

Wouldn't be a bit surprised if cops tell each other to say "I'm tired" if they shoot someone they shouldn't have.

[tucker 238]

13 minutes ago, Matuka said:

Wouldn't be a bit surprised if cops tell each other to say "I'm tired" if they shoot someone they shouldn't have.

Shooting all those unarmed minorities tires you out!

[tokamak 6351]

It's interesting how people can listen to the same tape and come to completely different conclusions. I did not think it helps her case at all. Her primary concern seems to be keeping her job.

[Guest Lobo]

On the tape, she seemed to be shaken and emotional being in the same room as a dead body.  What an outstanding defense.  I haven't heard it used since Nuremberg, but here we are.  

 

[Beau Vine 53987]

20 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Doesn't matter. Your reaction of "Oh she's just a caring sweet girl not a cop murder" is opposite of your reaction to police shootings on every other thread on Surly. This comes on the heels of hearing her sad voice on the 911 call.

Tell me what about that statement I have implied or concocted.

Well, for the second time, you brought the sex of the shooter into it.  I said that she sounded like "a caring human being."

It is nice to know that someone is keeping a scorecard of my reactions to police shootings threads on Surly, just in case I ever need that to get out of jury duty.  

[Beau Vine 53987]

13 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

The point being, which you continue to avoid, is that your reaction is not unique. If it was a male cop, I would wager your reaction would not be the same.

 

So you do know what I'm thinking.

[Lhorn 4885]

Interesting call. I think she was legit freaking out. Maybe everyone’s already come to this conclusion but I don’t think she wanted to do this. (I only say this because a long time ago there were rumors that the two might have been at odds regarding how loud he played his music - I think suggesting she might have motivation to kill him.

I think you can do something so poorly or carelessly that you deserve to suffer consequences even if the outcome is an “accident.”  I don’t know if that makes sense but just my opinion. 

Continually repeating “hey bud.....hey bud” and “I thought it was my apartment” a million times was pretty annoying and not suggestive of someone who has the training and wherewithal to be entrusted to use a firearm to protect the public.

 

I agree that she seems concerned with him only to the extent that her killing him put her in a bind.  Doesn’t make her particularly sympathetic but I don’t think caring way more about yourself makes her any less or more guilty. 

In the end she fucked up royal and a man is dead.  I’d be happier if she ends up suffering some consequences  

 

[SquishMitten 10398]

9 minutes ago, Lhorn said:

In the end she fucked up royal and a man is dead.  I’d be happier if she ends up suffering some consequences  

 

Well she lost her job and has to live the rest of her life knowing she killed someone. How many more consequences does this poor woman need to endure? - Defense counsel, probably

[Lhorn 4885]

3 minutes ago, SquishMitten said:

Well she lost her job and has to live the rest of her life knowing she killed someone. How many more consequences does this poor woman need to endure? - Defense counsel, probably

I guess I should have been more clear.  She can certainly be acquitted but have lost her career and reputation and those would be consequences  I meant a conviction and whatever sentence comes along with being negligent in killing an innocent man 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2019 by Lhorn

[Lhorn 4885]

I do enjoy the “he’ll have to live with the fact that he mowed over 2 kids on bikes while drunk driving for the rest of his life” defense.  

Edited May 1, 2019 by Lhorn

[Huckleberry 32695]

That does not qualify as legal provocation under Texas caselaw.
In self defense cases you are trying to get the  presumption of reasonableness and the instruction of no duty to retreat in the jury charge.  These make it very difficult for the state to disprove beyond a reasonable doubt the justification of self-defense. 
 Her problem may be in the “not engaging in criminal activity other than a class C misdemeanor” element because if she entered (her whole body, not just some part, like her arm)  the apartment, (and the search warrant return for his apartment indicates shell casings were recovered seems to prove her presence inside the apartment) then her entry into the apartment was a  class A misdemeanor criminal trespass. And she will get neither the castle doctrine presumption nor the no duty to retreat instruction  
 

This was actually my first thought when reading through that. I knew criminal trespass was Class A due to some bullshit someone tried to pull once and thought I remembered that she had entered the apartment before the shooting.

I am not one who thinks the criminal justice system should be used for vengeance. That should not be one of its purposes. But in this particular case I do kind of want her convicted of whatever it takes to be ineligible to be a peace officer in this State ever again because she clearly shouldn't be one.

[Viper 12025]

On 9/11/2018 at 7:28 PM, Pato del Muerto said:

Anything ever happen to the cop in Minneapolis who shot and killed the Australian woman who was coming up to their cruiser...to explain why she called them?

 

On 9/11/2018 at 8:20 PM, Aqua Buddha said:

(Reuters) - A former Minnesota police officer charged with murdering an unarmed Australian woman in July will argue that he acted in self-defense when he fired the fatal shot from his police car, a newspaper report on Wednesday said.

 

Mohamed Noor, 32, who has been charged with third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter in the fatal shooting of 40-year-old Justine Damond, will next appear in court on May 8, online court records showed. 

Minnesota’s Star Tribune newspaper reported it obtained a court filing in the case made on Wednesday that said Noor intends to claim he used “reasonable force” when he shot Damond, a spiritual healer from Sydney, should the case go to trial.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minnesota-police/ex-minnesota-policeman-to-argue-self-defense-in-australian-womans-shooting-death-newspaper-idUSKBN1HX07Y

Found guilt of third degree murder and second degree manslaughter

 

[Pam Cummings 9568]

19 hours ago, 'stache said:

I'm still not buying her story, but even if it's true she needs to spend considerable time in jail, I don't care what they name the charge. It's reckless as fuck to be blasting people with your service pistol even if you think it's your own apartment. People go to jail for accidentally killing pedestrians with their car. This is ten times worse. I mean how fucking hard is it to not enter someone else's place by accident? 

I've literally never seen this before.

 

Home owner mistakes a neighbor for an intruder and shoots and kills them, sure.

 

But to mistake someone else's home for yours, barge in, and shoot the person who lives there? I've never heard of that.

 

Even if it was a legitimate mistake, which i just don't believe at all, the level of stupid required to do such a thing deserves the most severe charges, imo. Get this moron off the street.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13410]

I believe I would give anyone the benefit of the doubt that they are upset after shooting someone. Whether justified or not. I actually look down upon any cop (or homeowner) who immediately is calm and starts on the ol’ I was afraid for my life speech.

i don’t think it changes the facts in the case one bit, but I believe it can help her to get a lower sentence if it’s seems like she has always shown remorse for the situation.  Which is actually how it should work in any convicted crime.  

['stache 21765]

15 hours ago, 4th and 5 said:

That does not qualify as legal provocation under Texas caselaw.

In self defense cases you are trying to get the  presumption of reasonableness and the instruction of no duty to retreat in the jury charge.  These make it very difficult for the state to disprove beyond a reasonable doubt the justification of self-defense. 

 Her problem may be in the “not engaging in criminal activity other than a class C misdemeanor” element because if she entered (her whole body, not just some part, like her arm)  the apartment, (and the search warrant return for his apartment indicates shell casings were recovered seems to prove her presence inside the apartment) then her entry into the apartment was a  class A misdemeanor criminal trespass. And she will get neither the castle doctrine presumption nor the no duty to retreat instruction  

 

Those defenses fall apart on the reasonableness standard too. It's not reasonable to (a) "accidentally" enter the wrong apartment, and (b) start blasting your gun before you even see whose inside. 

Seriously, there's no legalese necessary to understand how badly she fucked up and why she deserves to spend time in jail. The facts are she shot a guy without any "reasonable" reason. Open and shut.

[TXSooner518 2432]

Also, the ability to not retreat before using deadly force in self-defense only applies if you have a right to be where you are. She didn't have a right to be in his apartment, thus must retreat rather than using deadly force if possible. It was possible.

[Brisketexan 104561]

10 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Also, the ability to not retreat before using deadly force in self-defense only applies if you have a right to be where you are. She didn't have a right to be in his apartment, thus must retreat rather than using deadly force if possible. It was possible.

This.  The prosecution counter-argument needs to be short and to the point: if you buy the argument of the defense, then you are finding that the standard is 1) you can walk into any residence claiming "whoops, I thought this was my house, it was dark, I was confused," and 2) kill anyone you see, because hey, an intruder in YOUR house should be shot, and 3) you just walk away free as a bird.  While an innocent man lies dead in his own home.  Killed by an unlawful intruder.  Nope.  You go into someone else's home and kill them, you go to prison.  That's the only outcome that makes any sense.

[Huckleberry 32695]

Any other result should scare the shit out of apartment complexes. Why in the hell would I rent an apartment when a tired person could easily confuse it for their own? Wrong building, wrong floor, etc.

Hell, hotels would immediately have a problem as well.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Huckleberry

[Continental Op 3934]

1. Cop walks.

2. Rioting ensues

3. Law and Order crowd dances in the end zone and calls for rioters to face harsher sentences than cop.

 

 

[Brisketexan 104561]

1 minute ago, Continental Op said:

1. Cop walks.

2. Rioting ensues

3. Law and Order crowd dances in the end zone and calls for rioters to face harsher sentences than cop.

 

 

This guy gets it.

[zork 629]

5 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

I've literally never seen this before.

 

Home owner mistakes a neighbor for an intruder and shoots and kills them, sure.

 

But to mistake someone else's home for yours, barge in, and shoot the person who lives there? I've never heard of that.

 

Even if it was a legitimate mistake, which i just don't believe at all, the level of stupid required to do such a thing deserves the most severe charges, imo. Get this moron off the street.

For a minimum of 5 years.  And more if she had been drinking between her shift being over and the time of the incident?  Can't have a defense of people going into another persons abode and shooting them being any of the bullshit being expressed above as legit.  She needs to go down.

[Gene Parmesan 3993]

37 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Any other result should scare the shit out of apartment complexes. Why in the hell would I rent an apartment when a tired person could easily confuse it for their own? Wrong building, wrong floor, etc.

Hell, hotels would immediately have a problem as well.

Why would you rent an apartment if you have other options?  I mean this isn't the first crime committed at an apartment complex.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Gene Parmesan

[HRSchenker 2259]

If she is acquitted of murder this city is going to burn to the ground.

[C-Man 27041]

5 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

I've literally never seen this before.

 

Home owner mistakes a neighbor for an intruder and shoots and kills them, sure.

 

But to mistake someone else's home for yours, barge in, and shoot the person who lives there? I've never heard of that.

 

Even if it was a legitimate mistake, which i just don't believe at all, the level of stupid required to do such a thing deserves the most severe charges, imo. Get this moron off the street.

What do you believe then? Occam's razor tells us the simpler solutions are usually correct. What do you think happened? From what we've seen, they didn't know each other. She entered some random dude's apartment, which happens to be directly above hers, and execute whoever it is she finds in there and then risk going to prison for a long time? That makes no fucking sense. What makes the most sense is that she was exhausted from her shift, or buzzed from the bar after her shift and mistakenly parked on the wrong floor at her complex and entered his apartment thinking it was hers. She's a cop so she naturally plays Billy Badass and starts blasting away only to realize her mistake once the lights come on. (I think that's apparent on the 911 call.)

NOTE: I reserve to change my thoughts if something comes out in trial showing they had a connection or the early allegations of noise complaints are back in play.

3 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

So because Jerry Sandusky was remorseful about his crimes you feel he should have gotten a lower sentence?

The Baylor players that felt bad about gang rape should get lower sentences?

Samuel Little should get a lesser sentence because he feels bad about all the women he killed?

I just want to make sure you mean what you said and weren't making an exception for some reason in this case.

This appears to have been an accident, a terrible accident. The Baylor and Sandusky situations were done willfully. That's a pretty big difference in my book.

['stache 21765]

19 minutes ago, C-Man said:

What do you believe then? Occam's razor tells us the simpler solutions are usually correct. What do you think happened? From what we've seen, they didn't know each other. She entered some random dude's apartment, which happens to be directly above hers, and execute whoever it is she finds in there and then risk going to prison for a long time? That makes no fucking sense. What makes the most sense is that she was exhausted from her shift, or buzzed from the bar after her shift and mistakenly parked on the wrong floor at her complex and entered his apartment thinking it was hers. She's a cop so she naturally plays Billy Badass and starts blasting away only to realize her mistake once the lights come on. (I think that's apparent on the 911 call.)

NOTE: I reserve to change my thoughts if something comes out in trial showing they had a connection or the early allegations of noise complaints are back in play.

This appears to have been an accident, a terrible accident. The Baylor and Sandusky situations were done willfully. That's a pretty big difference in my book.

Occam's razor tells me nobody is stupid enough to enter the wrong apartment. It's just not believable. We haven't seen any evidence of a prior relationship or altercation or any political motivation (my speculation was that it was a hit based on his family's political connections in his home country). Its looking more and more like it was truly random, but that in no way exonerates her. She is guilty of a crime even if the rosiest of circumstances are true. 

[Gene Parmesan 3993]

People are absolutely stupid enough to enter the wrong apartment.  That's not even top 1000 of the stupidest things people are capable of.

[TwiceHorn 31265]

1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

Any other result should scare the shit out of apartment complexes. Why in the hell would I rent an apartment when a tired person could easily confuse it for their own? Wrong building, wrong floor, etc.

Hell, hotels would immediately have a problem as well.

They either do or don't have a tort liability problem, don't really see how the outcome of this particular bizarre criminal case affects that?

[pops 6973]

Has anyone figured out how she got in?  Was his door open?  Do they have shitty keys there and hers actually opened his door through some computer glitch?  Was it possible his door was unlocked, she swiped her key and the door opened therefore she thought "my place"?

[Sandman 3402]

24 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Occam's razor tells me nobody is stupid enough to enter the wrong apartment. 

Man, people do dumb shit like this all the time. I can't be the only person ever to walk up to "my" car, wondering why the door won't open, and see my identical looking car, 3 rows away. Granted, this was before I had keyless entry but it still happens today at every shopping mall in the US. 

Now, I can definitely say that I've never gone a step further and driven off in someone else's car. I still can't figure out how that bitch got in his apartment.

[Gene Parmesan 3993]

To answer how she got in, her claim is that the door was ajar. 

[Gene Parmesan 3993]

I've gotten in the wrong car before.  It wasn't even the same make or color as my wife's car just the same general shape similar colors from a distance and in the same vicinity in the parking lot..  The other car's door was also unlocked so I opened it up and sat down.  I looked around for a few seconds until it hit me.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13410]

4 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

So because Jerry Sandusky was remorseful about his crimes you feel he should have gotten a lower sentence?

The Baylor players that felt bad about gang rape should get lower sentences?

Samuel Little should get a lesser sentence because he feels bad about all the women he killed?

I just want to make sure you mean what you said and weren't making an exception for some reason in this case.

Expressing remorse should always be taken into consideration during sentencing. A convict should be considered a candidate for rehabilitation even starting at the sentencing. It doesn't mean that a sentence should necessarily be reduced but I would hope that a judge would take all facts into account. This include how the convict is behaving and what they're saying. We should always strive to give  prisoners some hope that a behavioral change is worthwhile. Either through reduced time or with other rewards for those not getting out.

But you want me to play your little game. If Sandusky confessed and expressed remorse, I think it leads to a potential for less time in prison.  Instead of 60 years, give him 55.  He can get out when he's 125 years old instead of 130. Give him something to look forward to.

[Guest Lobo]

He does have something to look forward, cock raping small boys.  

Your sense of justice intrigues the hell outta me. 

The only thing less believable than her story is the notion that some of you think is true—-that a black man living in TexAs would be dumb enough to turn the TV up and smoke some weed with the door ajar in a building he knows to have fucking cops living in it!

there is no black person alive in the south that is that crazy.  

[Huckleberry 32695]

46 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

They either do or don't have a tort liability problem, don't really see how the outcome of this particular bizarre criminal case affects that?

I'm not talking about law, I'm talking about potential market effects of everyone suddenly realizing people can get away with murdering you just by using a simple excuse as long as you're in an apartment, hotel, or other structure where units look similar.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Huckleberry

[C-Man 27041]

51 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Every single point you made applies to DWI deaths of another driver except..

She was IN the man's home and she "Willfully" chose to pull her weapon and shoot the man TWICE.

So if you actually are on the side of defendants in DWI deaths AND support  a "willfull" choice to draw a weapon and shoot another person who is unarmed and in their home or ANYWHERE else anytime they felt threatened.

This means every DWI death and every cop shooting and every "self defense" shooting. No matter if that person/officer illegally entered the victims hom or not.

That is what you have just essentially said you support in this 'terrible accident'.

No worries though, she's going to walk because a lot of people think like you do and others think cops are heros. Yay!!

Where have I said I support her (or defendants in DWI death situations for that matter)? Not in the slightest. She fucked up and there's a price to pay, probably prison. What I'm saying is I don't believe she was on the 4th floor that night to shoot Botham Jean dead. It's far more likely she was there because she was drunk or tired and mistakenly got into his apartment -- we don't definitively know -- and killed an innocent man. That said, it doesn't excuse what she did. Should she have backed out and de-escalated before going to the gun? Absofuckinglutely. What I guess I'm saying is this wasn't a straight-up murder or execution. I think it was extremely poor decision making by a substandard cop and resulted in an innocent man's death.

[RPM 26215]

1 hour ago, HRSchenker said:

If she is acquitted of murder this city is going to burn to the ground.

Only south of I-30.

[irishtexan 11445]

7 hours ago, Viper said:

 

Found guilt of third degree murder and second degree manslaughter

 

Sure. But he was a black man cop and he killed a white woman. Soooooo........

[Nice Guy Eddie 13410]

18 minutes ago, Lobo said:

 

Your sense of justice intrigues the hell outta me. 

I'm talking in generalities not specifically about this case.  And I never said that apologizing or feeling bad about breaking the law, should remove culpability. 

[Beau Vine 53987]

5 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

So because Jerry Sandusky was remorseful about his crimes you feel he should have gotten a lower sentence?

The Baylor players that felt bad about gang rape should get lower sentences?

Samuel Little should get a lesser sentence because he feels bad about all the women he killed?

I just want to make sure you mean what you said and weren't making an exception for some reason in this case.

None of those people actually showed any sort of remorse.  Otherwise, yeah, you've made a great point. 

[Beau Vine 53987]

1 hour ago, Sandman said:

Occam's razor tells me nobody is stupid enough to enter the wrong apartment. 

I did it once in the dorms in college.  I was hammered.  The elevator stopped on the floor below mine.  I got off and walked four doors down like I always did, and opened the door.  I walked in, and there were three girls sitting on the floor watching TV.  They looked at me and squealed, and immediately began ripping my clothes off.  I spent the next six hours fulfilling the insatiable, repressed desires of passion that young nubile women have.  When I was done, I walked back to the elevator and realized that I was on the 4th floor, not the 5th. 

(*) Parts of this story have been embellished by the author.

[Beau Vine 53987]

49 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

I'm not talking about law, I'm talking about potential market effects of everyone suddenly realizing people can get away with murdering you just by using a simple excuse as long as you're in an apartment, hotel, or other structure where units look similar.

There's a market for that?

[Brisketexan 104561]

9 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

I did it once in the dorms in college.  I was hammered.  The elevator stopped on the floor below mine.  I got off and walked four doors down like I always did, and opened the door.  I walked in, and there were three girls sitting on the floor watching TV.  They looked at me and squealed, and immediately began ripping my clothes off.  I spent the next six hours fulfilling the insatiable, repressed desires of passion that young nubile women have.  When I was done, I walked back to the elevator and realized that I was on the 4th floor, not the 5th. 

(*) Parts of this story have been embellished by the author.

Wait....they WEREN'T watching TV?  What the hell, man?