Dallas officer kills man after mistaking apartment for her own, police say

[TwiceHorn 31433]

15 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

What kind of bullshit is this? If the victim had been a "hang cops who kill up by their toenails until the vultures have picked their eyes out" type, then jury would have went for life? WTF?

Yeah, that's no bueno.  I have no problem with considering the victim or their family, but the justice system serves society, not victims.  At least it was only two of them.

Society has interests that victims don't.  And, the ability of the justice system to serve victims is limited by nature.  The main thing society seems to have lost sight of in all of this is:  most of them get out; then what?

[TwiceHorn 31433]

23 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

What's worse,

a) overly punitive sentencing guidelines for thousands for possession of pot, and this white cop who jokes about killing people and MLK being dead gets a "fair" sentence of 10 yrs for killing a black man who was sitting on his couch, or....

b) overly punitive sentencing guidelines for thousands for possession of pot, and this white cop who jokes about killing people and MLK being dead gets gets an overly punitive sentence (30+ yrs) for killing a black man who was sitting on his couch?

 

I'm going with a) being worse because of the inherent racism and unfairness. TwiceHorn and his buddies seem to be choosing option b) as being worse because of some wishful thinking about how sentencing guidelines should be changed.

Yes, sentencing guidelines should be changed, but until they are, white girls get the same hammer as the black men. If it takes a few white girls spending their lives in prison for "making a mistake" then so be it.

 

 

 

 

We have to wrap our heads around the fact that it doesn't just affect "harmless stoners."  It affects people who have committed fairly serious crimes, too; not necessarily violent crimes, but even some of those.

There are sentencing guidelines at the federal level and some states.  Not Texas.  It's a seat of the pants deal that is mostly entirely in the hands of juries.  The only thing the lege can change is the RANGE of punishment; and, generally, I don't object to the ranges.

What you are basically arguing is that two wrongs make a right or that its ok to keep fucking up sentences as long as you get the indictment and conviction right.  That's a little too situational for me.

[hopkinsnhorns 533]

If the prosecutor had given some actual reasoning for their sentencing recommendation other than the age Bo would have turned at his birthday the previous weekend, the jury might have been inclined to agree.  As good as the state was throughout the rest of the trial, it felt like they were unprepared during their closing statement.

I hate the preferential treatment of cops as much as the next ACAB protester, but I don't see this sentence as being a cop out.  There were definitely mitigating circumstances in the eyes of the jury, even if they weren't mitigating to the point of "sudden passion", and they scaled their sentence accordingly.  I've said it before and I'll say it again - if you expected Guyger to be punished based on the crimes of other officers that were acquitted, then you set yourself up for disappointment.  Take the win and move on to the next battle and quit bitching because your team didn't run up the score.

 

Edited October 4, 2019 by hopkinsnhorns

[Surly Bevo 24908]

Nothing really to add at this point other than to comment it's amazing how much this thread now feels like the game thread for a 21-13 Texas win over say Arkansas State....

[hopkinsnhorns 533]

15 hours ago, Homesickhorn said:

What kind of ice cream stays frozen from the afternoon until 10-11pm? I’ll hang up and listen, but username definitely checks out.
 

No kind of ice cream.  The shooting took place around 9:50 at night and the responding officers were there about 3 minutes afterwards.  I don't know where you got the idea that this occurred in the afternoon.

[TwiceHorn 31433]

13 minutes ago, hopkinsnhorns said:

If the prosecutor had given some actual reasoning for their sentencing recommendation other than the age Bo would have turned at his birthday the previous weekend, the jury might have been inclined to agree.  As good as the state was throughout the rest of the trial, it felt like they were unprepared during their closing statement.

I hate the preferential treatment of cops as much as the next ACAB protester, but I don't see this sentence as being a cop out.  There were definitely mitigating circumstances in the eyes of the jury, even if they weren't mitigating to the point of "sudden passion", and they scaled their sentence accordingly.  I've said it before and I'll say it again - if you expected Guyger to be punished based on the crimes of other officers that were acquitted, then you set yourself up for disappointment.  Take the win and move on to the next battle and quit bitching because your team didn't run up the score.

 

It's incredibly hard to rationalize, and therefore argue for or against, a sentence.  The whole premise of the federal guidelines is an attempt to rationalize sentences with various little factors, mostly enhancements, based on this or that little aspect of wrongdoing.  And they are overly punitive to the point of draconian.  

Doing sentences "correctly" is going to take a massive mental effort and a recalibration of thinking on the issues.  It's non-trivial and a big reason I jump up and challenge people's thoughts on sentencing issues every time.  The default thinking is no good.

Also, I finally realized that my "argument style" on a lot of these issues, that seems to drive people like Huckleberry batshit on occasion is actually some probably poorly executed form of socratic dialog.  Yes, it includes "devil's advocacy," which can come close to trolling, but it's not intended that way.

Edited October 4, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[Homesickhorn 2202]

No kind of ice cream.  The shooting took place around 9:50 at night and the responding officers were there about 3 minutes afterwards.  I don't know where you got the idea that this occurred in the afternoon.

I didn’t get the idea that it happened in the afternoon. Read what I quoted in my response. It was a joke referencing Ice Man’s statement about the victim enjoying his ‘afternoon ice cream.

[hopkinsnhorns 533]

Yep, totally missed that.  My bad.

[Dahobbs 17521]

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

We have to wrap our heads around the fact that it doesn't just affect "harmless stoners."  It affects people who have committed fairly serious crimes, too; not necessarily violent crimes, but even some of those.

There are sentencing guidelines at the federal level and some states.  Not Texas.  It's a seat of the pants deal that is mostly entirely in the hands of juries.  The only thing the lege can change is the RANGE of punishment; and, generally, I don't object to the ranges.

What you are basically arguing is that two wrongs make a right or that its ok to keep fucking up sentences as long as you get the indictment and conviction right.  That's a little too situational for me.

Gee,  I thought he was arguing for equal protection and treatment under the law. Seems pretty important if we are going to keep calling it a "justice" system and not fucking horseshit. 

[Ellellelle 308]

Looks like the Jean's went on Dr. Phil. Clips are on YouTube.

[bigup2dahorns 3343]

[bigup2dahorns 3343]

[hookem17 485]

2 hours ago, bigup2dahorns said:

 

Good. Dumbass deserves it after going on tv. 

[SDG 3319]

I watched some of the case but didn’t see the DA. Was he part of it? And could that be used during the appeals process. 

[TwiceHorn 31433]

7 hours ago, Dahobbs said:

Gee,  I thought he was arguing for equal protection and treatment under the law. Seems pretty important if we are going to keep calling it a "justice" system and not fucking horseshit. 

There has yet to be "equality" in sentencing, and the grandest effort yet to promote it, the federal sentencing guidelines, are a fucking disaster.

[Dahobbs 17521]

10 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

There has yet to be "equality" in sentencing, and the grandest effort yet to promote it, the federal sentencing guidelines, are a fucking disaster.

I absolutely agree with that. I was just pointing out that how you frame his argument significantly changes the merit of his position. Practically, I agree with you. Philosophically, I am not sure that he was wrong. 

[NowThis 931]

good lawd!  Would a black male defendant get such cuddly treatment?

 

Edited October 5, 2019 by NowThis

[Cajun 11705]

20 hours ago, bigup2dahorns said:

 

Anytime a DA faces jail time it's a good thing.

[Cajun 11705]

4 hours ago, NowThis said:

good lawd!  Would a male defendant get such cuddly treatment?

 

fify

And the answer is, NOPE.

Courtrooms, at least in Texas, feel sorry for women no matter what kind of shit they've done.

I've witnessed it over and over again first hand.  Everyone wants to Rescue Ranger the poor little girly wirlys.

[TwiceHorn 31433]

6 hours ago, Dahobbs said:

I absolutely agree with that. I was just pointing out that how you frame his argument significantly changes the merit of his position. Practically, I agree with you. Philosophically, I am not sure that he was wrong. 

I didn't say or mean to imply that he was wrong.  There were a couple of things that deserved further discussion or elaboration, particularly since I was identified with a particular viewpoint.

Somewhere I saw that the average murder sentence in Texas is 40 years.  That puts things in perspective from both angles:  both that perhaps Guyger's is on the short end, and that sentences are outrageous.

Like most things in law, trying to make things "uniform" that vary wildly, like sentences for particular crimes, seems to be a fool's errand rife with unintended consequences.  It only works where having a rule is more important than what is the rule, e.g. the UCC.

Edited October 5, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 31433]

14 minutes ago, Cajun said:

Anytime a DA faces jail time it's a good thing.

Creuzot is one of the new crop of good ones, though.  I don't think much will come of the show cause/contempt thing.  A small amount of peepee whacking.

[Cajun 11705]

I guess I need to learn more about "good ones".  Never seen that before.

DAs I've watched in action are slimier than the criminals they go after, that is if they're criminals at all.

 

That said, here's to the "new crop".

 

Edited October 5, 2019 by Cajun

[NowThis 931]

23 minutes ago, Cajun said:

fify

And the answer is, NOPE.

Courtrooms, at least in Texas, feel sorry for women no matter what kind of shit they've done.

I've witnessed it over and over again first hand.  Everyone wants to Rescue Ranger the poor little girly wirlys.

i'd like to see some data on 4 quadrants

black vs. white vs. male vs. female -- for the same verdicts / sentences.  I'd bet white females get significantly less than black females.

[Cajun 11705]

Possible.  I didn't intend that there was no race component.  It's just my experience doesn't include that.

If race is equal, the wimmins always get the benefit of the doubt, and sometimes far beyond that.

It's nauseating.

[Vic Mackey 47006]

Supposedly Joshua Brown, who testified in the trial, was shot and killed last night in Dallas. I believe he was the neighbor of the victim. Looked like he played DB at South Florida from his Facebook page.

 

Police are investigating the killing of a man who was shot Friday evening at an apartment complex near Dallas' Medical District.

 

Officers were called about 10:30 p.m. to the 4600 block of Cedar Springs Road, where several witnesses flagged them down and directed them to the victim's location.

Police found a man on the ground with multiple gunshot wounds. He was taken to Parkland Memorial Hospital, where he died from his injuries.

Witnesses told police they heard several gunshots and saw a silver four-door sedan speeding out of the parking lot.

Neither the victim nor a suspect has been identified.

 

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crime/2019/10/05/man-fatally-shot-apartment-complex-near-dallas-medical-district-suspect-loose/?fbclid=IwAR3Zzf9w98A73LcLzc95dWTFoc_B5pvQfpCnJLNcXNZZaqcwHa8qOfjRyUE

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/joshua.brown.712?fref=search&__tn__=%2Cd%2CP-R&eid=ARBEBGmCI6Ux1KHjbfAE9uCMeYJ2mOXcjOp1VaR2cLilDdLyu24XxbLKVrJQpP2PTVsRj9T3uAsIKkks

Edited October 5, 2019 by Vic Mackey

[Vic Mackey 47006]

[LABEVO 928]

2 hours ago, Cajun said:

fify

And the answer is, NOPE.

Courtrooms, at least in Texas, feel sorry for women no matter what kind of shit they've done.

I've witnessed it over and over again first hand.  Everyone wants to Rescue Ranger the poor little girly wirlys.

Bitch could kill a man and get sympathy in court. Oh, wait.  Shit. 

[gsoda3 3245]

he wore that in court?

[Bama Chick 28596]

Yeah this is horrible.

[Neonmoon 38129]

Was it by the cops? 

I think it’s sad I believe it could be a real possibility 

[Deej 76750]

6 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Was it by the cops? 

I think it’s sad I believe it could be a real possibility 

Likely the only possibility. 

It's all good, though. The judge gave Amber a hug.

Edited October 5, 2019 by Deej

[futureman 22439]

19 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Was it by the cops? 

I think it’s sad I believe it could be a real possibility 

don’t be fatuous, jeffrey. 

[4th&Five 41506]

Holy shit!

[Junior Miller 1502]

1 hour ago, Neonmoon said:

Was it by the cops? 

I think it’s sad I believe it could be a real possibility 

No, of course not. He just recently testified against a cold blooded murderer cop and it's just a magnificent coincidence that he immediately gets gunned down on the street by unknown assailants in a white sedan. 

Of course the cops did this. We live in a police state. The facade of a democracy and freedoms is propped up by tons of pro America propaganda but it's all fake. 

This is a police state and if you aren't white or if you testify against the police you're in danger no matter where you are. 

It's over. We lost. America is no more. 

[Handcruser 2805]

Shot in the mouth.

Tell me that wasn’t a hit by DPD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Surly Bevo 24908]

23 minutes ago, Junior Miller said:

No, of course not. He just recently testified against a cold blooded murderer cop and it's just a magnificent coincidence that he immediately gets gunned down on the street by unknown assailants in a white sedan. 

Of course the cops did this. We live in a police state. The facade of a democracy and freedoms is propped up by tons of pro America propaganda but it's all fake. 

This is a police state and if you aren't white or if you testify against the police you're in danger no matter where you are. 

It's over. We lost. America is no more. 

Good luck with...with your bottom

[Constant 6723]

Y’all watch too much damn television. 

[Zepol87 9185]

7 minutes ago, Constant said:

Y’all watch too much damn television. 

Why? Because we don't trust the blue lines word? Yea it's TV's fault for sure 

[Vic Mackey 47006]

25 minutes ago, Constant said:

Y’all watch too much damn television. 

Is it only on tv that cops are dirty, too?

[Vic Mackey 47006]

Messages from the victim and his friend

[Zepol87 9185]

And fucking trust me that when shit goes down in the hood and people don't testify it's cause of shot like this. Maybe it had nothing to with the trial and a complete coincidence but most on here are really out of touch with reality and fear that happens. I was always taught never say shit and never see shit even if you did. Drive by and bullets went into our house and we didn't say shit. Rant over but fuck this you watch too much TV, you have no fucking idea what it is like I promise you.

 

[Kavinsky 417]

6 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Is it only on tv that cops are dirty, too?

Its not out of the realm of possibility that the cops killed the guy but I'd wait until the dust has settled a little but before signing it off as a DPD hit.

Either way, the feds need to investigate this one

[hopkinsnhorns 533]

Jesus Fuck. If this was a hit for testifying, Dallas deserves to burn.

[Constant 6723]

9 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Is it only on tv that cops are dirty, too?

 

On 9/7/2018 at 3:53 PM, Vic Mackey said:

On 9/7/2018 at 1:24 PM, conVINCEd said:

I used to live in a big complex.  I've tried to go in the wrong apartment a couple of times.  Even when hammered, if the key didn't work, my first reaction was to look at the apartment number and see if I''m at the right door.  

You mean you didn't bang on the door to get someone to open up and then murder them?

 

On 9/8/2018 at 2:25 PM, Vic Mackey said:

It was obvious this was not a mistake of wrong apartment. This was premeditated murder. She knew exactly what she was doing. They definitely had a history and knew each other. Hence a witness saying she was screaming "open up open up!".

Manslaughter is fucking bullshit if that's all this bitch gets.

No, I just think maybe, for once, you’d wait for a fact or two before spouting off and making yourself look like a moron. 

[Zepol87 9185]

Its not out of the realm of possibility that the cops killed the guy but I'd wait until the dust has settled a little but before signing it off as a DPD hit.
Either way, the feds need to investigate this one

Nah you watch too much TV. No such thing as dirty cops

[Vic Mackey 47006]

2 minutes ago, Kavinsky said:

Its not out of the realm of possibility that the cops killed the guy but I'd wait until the dust has settled a little but before signing it off as a DPD hit.

Either way, the feds need to investigate this one

Oh I am not saying they did the hit but like you said, it is not out of the realm out possibility and it is definitely not just a television thing where this happens.

I posted one of his last FB posts where it looked like he was beefing with some people and he said all they did was talk on the internet but not in person.

Also, I am wondering if this murderer will get a hug from the judge, too....Going to guess no.

[Zepol87 9185]

No, I just think maybe, for once, you’d wait for a fact or two before spouting off and making yourself look like a moron. 

Maybe we speak from experience and DPD has lost all fucking credibility. Did that cross your mind

[immortal13 4059]

Constant is a cop apologist 

[tokamak 6391]

Holy shit. Coincidence of the century.

[Bama Chick 28596]