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Cruz vs Beto

Washpark

By Washpark
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Celery Man

Celery Man 20874

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, cactusflinthead said:

But, it's so very profitable. 

The work force is disgusted downs tools and walks
Innocence is injured experience just talks
Everyone seeks damages and everyone agrees
That these are 'classic symptoms of a monetary squeeze'
On ITV and BBC they talk about the curse
Philosophy is useless theology is worse
History boils over there's an economics freeze
Sociologists invent words that mean 'Industrial Disease'
Doctor Parkinson declared 'I'm not surprised to see you here
You've got smokers cough from smoking, brewer's droop from drinking beer
I don't know how you came to get the Betty Davis knees
But worst of all young man you've got Industrial Disease'

you know who pays taxes?  Folks who have daytime jobs - they're doing alright.

 

( :/ I tried)

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Hank Scorpio
Hank Scorpio

I'm sorry, look at all these old fucking goblins at this thing:  Let's go one by one:  Beatrice She has not missed a single city council meeting or church bingo in 35 years. S

Born to Run
Born to Run

I’ve heard this bullshit my entire life, hell I used to believe the myth that Republicans were all about “faith in the common man succeeding when unimpeded by the govt.” Left alone business and humani

austingirl
austingirl

I do volunteer work for Beto's campaign (surprise!). I get called a "libtard" on a regular basis and get a lot of responses that are just "#MAGA!" and the like, but I also hear a lot of "who is Beto?"

TDunk

TDunk 590

Posted
Posted
35 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

If we deny coverage for preexisting conditions, we should do the same for preexisting wars. I don't want to pay for other people's wars. It's a choice they made, not my problem. They should have to pay for it or go to jail, or just die. Right?

Sent from my SM-T237P using Tapatalk
 

Not to mention the first responders, cops, and firefighters during 9/11.  They ran towards the problem, so it's on them.  

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Eskimohorn

Eskimohorn 5610

Posted
Posted
All preexisting conditions aren’t created equally.  Plenty are self imposed.  And yet the rest of us get to pay.  I’d rather the people who made poor choices not to have insurance before their condition arose or whose own poor choices caused their condition bear the costs of such treatment. Instead of reaching into my pocket.  
For those who have conditions that don’t fall into either category, we should help.  That’s the minority though.  


Lot of words for you mad too many people getting too much healthcare.

If you want to spend less money on healthcare, then you need to move your sorry ass to another country because we spend more money on healthcare per person than any other country, both pre and post Obamacare - with brief stabilization under Obamacare, as the boring part of the legislation sought to improve outcomes and decrease costs to provide healthcare.
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104465

Posted
Posted
Sometimes when shaggy talks about healthcare and the challenges we face it looks a lot like a monkey fucking a football. 

Mostly because the conversation rarely starts from a universal acknowledgement of undeniable truths: our current system (and it really isn’t that different pre and post ACA) costs more than any other system, yet yields mediocre outcomes.

We’re spending a fortune on this - and that’s not just tax dollars, that’s all dollars - and it’s not even that good.

But we skip right past that in most conversations.
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workswithseed

workswithseed 2033

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Posted

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/07/canadians-may-pay-more-taxes-than-americans-but-theres-a-catch.html

Seems like Canadians live longer.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/physiciansfoundation/2018/04/09/u-s-health-outcomes-compared-to-other-countries-are-misleading/

We have a much quicker access and more new pharmaceuticals than all other countries.

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Captainant

Captainant 27311

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/07/canadians-may-pay-more-taxes-than-americans-but-theres-a-catch.html

Seems like Canadians live longer.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/physiciansfoundation/2018/04/09/u-s-health-outcomes-compared-to-other-countries-are-misleading/

We have a much quicker access and more new pharmaceuticals than all other countries.

Well, not even a majority of Americans have the ability to pay for new pharmaceuticals so what difference does access make? That's like saying that I have access to become president. 

Given a choice between the top tier of Americans getting faster medical advances and all Americans having access to healthcare, I'd say it's a no brainer. 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23375

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

Ok so what are you going to do about it?

Talk Is Cheap. Insurance comes out of my pocket and goes in your bank account. 

Well, what I would do about it is probably start with letting you know that asbestosis and aml are not what is driving the healthcare premiums coming out of your pocket in any way. Preventable heart disease and diabetes, along with a variety of other largely preventable chronic medical conditions such as copd are. And then after we come to grips with that maybe we can start to talk about designing a system that incentivizes and promotes healthy behaviors, back stops risk for catastrophic illness, aligns the interests of the various parties around specific and measurable health related outcomes, and provides a safety net for those in need. 

 

 

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Captainant

Captainant 27311

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

Well, what I would do about it is probably start with letting you know that asbestosis and aml are not what is driving the healthcare premiums coming out of your pocket in any way. Preventable heart disease and diabetes, along with a variety of other largely preventable chronic medical conditions such as copd are. And then after we come to grips with that maybe we can start to talk about designing a system that incentivizes and promotes healthy behaviors, back stops risk for catastrophic illness, aligns the interests of the various parties around specific and measurable health related outcomes, and provides a safety net for those in need. 

 

 

Or ya know, we could just have a single payer option. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18607

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Well, what I would do about it is probably start with letting you know that asbestosis and aml are not what is driving the healthcare premiums coming out of your pocket in any way. Preventable heart disease and diabetes, along with a variety of other largely preventable chronic medical conditions such as copd are. And then after we come to grips with that maybe we can start to talk about designing a system that incentivizes and promotes healthy behaviors, back stops risk for catastrophic illness, aligns the interests of the various parties around specific and measurable health related outcomes, and provides a safety net for those in need. 

 

 

Sounds like we need a single payer system.

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2033

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Posted
11 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Well, not even a majority of Americans have the ability to pay for new pharmaceuticals so what difference does access make? That's like saying that I have access to become president. 

Given a choice between the top tier of Americans getting faster medical advances and all Americans having access to healthcare, I'd say it's a no brainer. 

I'm giving two examples on the good and bad, its weird that in Canada they have to wait a month for CT scans.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23375

Posted
Posted (edited)

Show me a legislative proposal based on a single payer system that checks those boxes and I’ll support it. I have outlined an approach in the past that takes some of the best aspects of a single payer system blended with the best aspects of a market based system, engages consumers more fully in their medical decision making and applies market pressure to drive competition and outcomes, but I am not dogmatic about it versus other approaches.. Show me the proposal. 

Edited by Anastasis
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David Dennison

David Dennison 18607

Posted
Posted
Just now, Anastasis said:

Show me a legislative proposal based on a single payer system that checks this boxes and I’ll support it. I have outlined an approach in the past that takes some of the best aspects of a single payer system blended with the best aspects of a market based system, engages consumers more fully in their medical decision making and applies market pressure to drive competition and outcomes, but I am not dogmatic about it versus other approaches.. Show me the proposal. 

Remove the words "65 and older" from all Medicare legislation.

Done.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23375

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Remove the words "65 and older" from all Medicare legislation.

Done.

Ok. But that doesn’t get us anywhere near a single payer system that covers comprehensive healthcare. And it still leaves us with a complex web of private payers administering Rx benefits and Medicare advantage plans, which actually are preferred by most people relative to traditional ffs.

 

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cactusflinthead

cactusflinthead 27593

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Well, what I would do about it is probably start with letting you know that asbestosis and aml are not what is driving the healthcare premiums coming out of your pocket in any way. Preventable heart disease and diabetes, along with a variety of other largely preventable chronic medical conditions such as copd are. And then after we come to grips with that maybe we can start to talk about designing a system that incentivizes and promotes healthy behaviors, back stops risk for catastrophic illness, aligns the interests of the various parties around specific and measurable health related outcomes, and provides a safety net for those in need. 

 

 

Oh you mean making having a salad cheaper than a Big Mac? Or not making ketchup count as a vegetable on a school lunch? We're in accord on this. Copd. Hmm I wonder if the particulate matter down wind in Corsicana might be a contributing factor. Or the plant in Louisiana with a higher rate of cancer around them. Or Stinkadena. Yeah. On tobacco well, tell that to Mitch. I'm sure he's all ears. 

As I recall Michelle Obama's lunch program was summarily dismissed. Sid Miller brags on the fact he brought back cupcakes. 

Yep, lots of emphasis on prevention. It's great. 

How about the fact if I go buy the woman's hbp meds straight up from you it is 286. I get it on the sly from Canada and it's 50. 

Let's talk epipens next. 

2 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I'm giving two examples on the good and bad, its weird that in Canada they have to wait a month for CT scans.

Oh like my daughter having to get strep six times before they would take out her tonsils.

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25865

Posted
Posted

I voted by mail here in CA. 

I left many of the judicial ones blank.   I checked with the SD Dem party...they endorsed one judge.   I checked with the SD Bar Assn. No endorsements.  League of Women Voters, same.  As a last-ditch, I checked the local GOP, figuring I'd vote against any of their endorsements.  They had none.  I am disappoint. 

 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18607

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Ok. But that doesn’t get us anywhere near a single payer system that covers comprehensive healthcare. And it still leaves us with a complex web of private payers administering Rx benefits and Medicare advantage plans, which actually are preferred by most people relative to traditional ffs.

 

Sure it does. Medicare is a single payer system that covers comprehensive healthcare. It should be available to all citizens.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23375

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/jan/18/other-98/viral-image-about-democratic-senators-and-big-phar/

You ate it up with a spoon. At least do your homework first.

Ate what up? He takes money from Lilly. Booker takes money from nj pharma. They both voted against a measure that would promote importation from Canada, which is exactly what you brought up in your example. 

 

To to bring it back on topic I haven’t seen veto’s position on importation, but I do believe he has promoted giving Medicare the restrictive formulary stick to use in negotiating pricing with pharma. 

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Ate what up? He takes money from Lilly. Booker takes money from nj pharma. They both voted against a measure that would promote importation from Canada, which is exactly what you brought up in your example. 

 

To to bring it back on topic I haven’t seen veto’s position on importation, but I do believe he has promoted giving Medicare the restrictive formulary stick to use in negotiating pricing with pharma. 

Cuz we shouldnt need to import drugs from Canada. They should be sold here for the same, still profitable, price. Instead we get gouged. 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23375

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Cuz we shouldnt need to import drugs from Canada. They should be sold here for the same, still profitable, price. Instead we get gouged. 

I do not disagree. And without derailing this thread further with additional details, I would propose significant changes in the requirements and process for drug approval to address.

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cactusflinthead

cactusflinthead 27593

Posted
Posted

I'll save my rants for the proposed thread. 

I voted. There was a line. There were more today than yesterday. 600 or so, but no drop off as predicted. At lunch today a man walked in with a Beto sign. I asked them if he came in there regularly. Yes, he does. 

Here. Buy him a beer the next time he comes by. 

I have taken to asking people that I see during the day if they have voted. Not all of them. I am not likely to go volunteer down at the local HQ, but I get a charge from the reaction from it.

Do it. Vote Beto.

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Guest

Guest

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Posted

Talked to one of my circle C friends who is voting Beto and he said a lot of his peers are dealing with flooding still, the water thing is a pain in the butt and with it being early in the week with work and work travel, a large contingent of the more well to do Beto voters haven’t voted yet. So if you get a large amount of the young vote early, you get motivated the group who typically don’t vote to vote and get it out of the way (bonus points for getting them to see waiting in line as a humblebrag and victory status not unlike hour martyrs at work we all know), AND a huge part of the base or voters you’d expect to vote for Beto based off previous elections and registrations  hasn’t even voted yet!?!?!

It *might be* happening Ron Paul gif

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Tom

Tom 2959

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Well, what I would do about it is probably start with letting you know that asbestosis and aml are not what is driving the healthcare premiums coming out of your pocket in any way. Preventable heart disease and diabetes, along with a variety of other largely preventable chronic medical conditions such as copd are. And then after we come to grips with that maybe we can start to talk about designing a system that incentivizes and promotes healthy behaviors, back stops risk for catastrophic illness, aligns the interests of the various parties around specific and measurable health related outcomes, and provides a safety net for those in need. 

 

 

And how is this a unique problem to the United States?  There are plenty of obese people and smokers in Canada and the  UK.  They still pay significantly less across the board for universal access and better outcomes.

I don't disagree that we need a system that promotes healthy behaviors, but it doesn't explain why health care is so much more expensive here than anywhere else. 

 

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pyrohornIII

pyrohornIII 4801

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Tom said:

And how is this a unique problem to the United States?  There are plenty of obese people and smokers in Canada and the  UK.  They still pay significantly less across the board for universal access and better outcomes.

I don't disagree that we need a system that promotes healthy behaviors, but it doesn't explain why health care is so much more expensive here than anywhere else. 

 

unregulated greed.

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