Cruz vs Beto

[Texas73 420]

44 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

For those immobile demographics what is the underlying cause?  Are they lazy, don't care, scared or ignorant? 

I think it is scared or ignorant, especially ignorant. For the old white Trumpkins stuck in rural towns, when they graduated from high school not everyone was told they could go to college like they are today so they got jobs and married right after high school.

Moving to live in an urban area expands a person's perspective and working with and meeting diverse people increases the likelihood they will vote for Democrats.

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

 I feel like a good part of it is simple unfamiliarity. It’s hard to figure out even what  issues you’ll encounter, let alone how to navigate those issues, that come from moving from the country to the city if you don’t have any previous exposure.  That causes a lot of inertia against any sort of move. 

The same is also true in reverse. I think it would probably be very hard for a lot of people that have always lived in the city to move out to some town of 500 people. The difference is there is no driver to do so (like a jobs issue), so we don’t ever find out.   But if somehow a “changing economy”  required rural moves instead of the reverse, I bet a lot of cityfolk would resist it against their own interest. 

[Ghost of LL 15530]

1 hour ago, Message Board User said:

 

That's actually pretty funny.

[Larry T. Spider 1746]

45 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

 

I don't think it's a phenomenon at all unique to the folks we're thinking of here -- largely rural white folk.

It's also true of urban populations, including minorities.  I've related this before, but I remember a police procedural show many years ago where the focus of the episode was LA area hispanic gangs, with precisely defined turf.  The detective explained that some of these kids lived within 20 blocks of the ocean, but had never actually seen it.  I'm sure it was hyperbole, but the point was that many people tend to stick with what they know.

If you grew up in the projects, and all you saw was folks living and dying in the projects, the suggestion that you go to school, apply yourself, go to college, and end up getting a good job with GE in New York....you'd look at that person like an alien.  You have no frame of reference to even conceive of that possibility, much less really understand what it takes to make it reality.

Same goes for someone living in a poor agrarian area in Latin America, etc.  Limited perspective and frame of reference, which either leads to or combines with limited imagination, and you have generation after generation stuck in a rut.

This phenomenon is why mentorship, and just showing kids an example of another way, can go really far.  My dad grew up in a poor border town.  He had ONE teacher who really believed in these kids, and that they could go to college.  On weekends, on his own time, he'd take the school's bus and drive the kids to Austin, or College Station, to tour the campus, meet other kids there, and see a football game.  To get them to open their eyes to "hey, I could go here."  He was (alas) a big aggie.  Because of him, dozens upon dozens of kids from a dinky border town went to A&M and got college degrees.  I go to some of my dad's reunion events, and there are all of these reasonably successful, college-educated hispanic kids from the border -- because of ONE teacher.  Perspective is that important.

The challenge in rural areas is that folks don't want their small town to die because everyone goes away.  But the only way to move up in the world is to GTFO.  Hard to reconcile that.

So, frustrated with the catch-22 of a shitty life, they lash out.  And note, this applies to all of the demographics. 

A lot of educational research coming out that basically proves this story as the rule, not the exception, for poor kids that go on to college. Almost all can point to one caring adult that made the difference in some way. They say that without that person it would have been unlikely they would have gone on to college and built a successful life. Many of those kids never get that person because they are like hugging a porcupine. It hurts but you have to keep showing up for them.

[bolverk 29628]

30 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

 

I don't think it's a phenomenon at all unique to the folks we're thinking of here -- largely rural white folk.

It's also true of urban populations, including minorities.  I've related this before, but I remember a police procedural show many years ago where the focus of the episode was LA area hispanic gangs, with precisely defined turf.  The detective explained that some of these kids lived within 20 blocks of the ocean, but had never actually seen it.  I'm sure it was hyperbole, but the point was that many people tend to stick with what they know.

If you grew up in the projects, and all you saw was folks living and dying in the projects, the suggestion that you go to school, apply yourself, go to college, and end up getting a good job with GE in New York....you'd look at that person like an alien.  You have no frame of reference to even conceive of that possibility, much less really understand what it takes to make it reality.

Same goes for someone living in a poor agrarian area in Latin America, etc.  Limited perspective and frame of reference, which either leads to or combines with limited imagination, and you have generation after generation stuck in a rut.

This phenomenon is why mentorship, and just showing kids an example of another way, can go really far.  My dad grew up in a poor border town.  He had ONE teacher who really believed in these kids, and that they could go to college.  On weekends, on his own time, he'd take the school's bus and drive the kids to Austin, or College Station, to tour the campus, meet other kids there, and see a football game.  To get them to open their eyes to "hey, I could go here."  He was (alas) a big aggie.  Because of him, dozens upon dozens of kids from a dinky border town went to A&M and got college degrees.  I go to some of my dad's reunion events, and there are all of these reasonably successful, college-educated hispanic kids from the border -- because of ONE teacher.  Perspective is that important.

The challenge in rural areas is that folks don't want their small town to die because everyone goes away.  But the only way to move up in the world is to GTFO.  Hard to reconcile that.

So, frustrated with the catch-22 of a shitty life, they lash out.  And note, this applies to all of the demographics. 

4

All of this but especially the bolded. Having grown up in a small West Texas town (i.e., shithole), I had the twisted fortune of being adopted and always being cursed by curiosity about my roots. Being born at the time that I was, information about my bio parents was extremely limited, but one of the very few details my adoptive parents recalled from background information was that one of my bio parents had some French ancestry.

So, when high school rolled around, I took French unlike most of my friends and studied it diligently becoming about as proficient as you could get in a 4A West Texas high school with no native speakers. For whatever reason, the local Rotary Club was pretty active and hosted 3-4 foreign students a year, which gave me the inspiration to become an exchange student myself. And, that I did, going off to France and attended a high school in Chantilly about 25 miles north of the heart of Paris. This was, of course, a completely mind-blowing and eye-opening experience that resulted in giving me the social skills and confidence that I could probably land on my feet anywhere.

Now, to that bolded part. The best chance these small towns have is, like parents, let their children go off and experience the world but also allowing the opportunity to come back home bringing with them their experience and knowledge. From a company man, career perspective, that's not so easy. From an entrepreneurial one, I think opportunities are there.

Today, career-wise, I'm in the place-making business working with small towns across the state in economic development and downtown revitalization, and there's some really interesting stuff going on. Baby boomers are finally beginning to retire and cede leadership positions in many of these towns, and as places like Austin become increasingly expensive, Millennials and Gen-Xers are ready to put down their roots, start new businesses, and establish themselves and their families. More importantly, I do see that they ARE increasingly taking on leadership responsibilities and are contributing (slowly) to a cultural change in some of these places.

I'm beyond the age of feeling that I can single-handedly change the world, but in my position, I do feel like I can help places around Texas remain interconnected to the modern world and gain confidence in their ability to tap into new opportunities. If that be achieved, I think the urban/rural divide in our politics can be somewhat mitigated. But these towns have to be willing to try something new and allow fresh leadership and new blood into their communities.

This is what gives me some hope and motivates me to go to work every day.

While the challenge is that these towns are populated by place-dependent people, they need to embrace folks who are place-independent but who also want to find someplace to establish themselves. I think we all, at our core, want that, even among the most mobile of us.

[bolverk 29628]

This is a really excellent read about "How a New Generation Is Reviving Small-Town" from this month's issue of Texas Monthly.

[Message Board User 12394]

The Ted Cruz crowds...

vs the Beto crowds.

 

[Huckleberry 32830]

Saw my first yard sign here in northwest Houston suburbia. It was a Beto sign.

[bolverk 29628]

I've counted about a dozen Beto signs on the two streets that take me in/out of my neighborhood here in South Austin. I haven't yet seen a single Cruz sign anywhere in Austin, but that's really no surprise. I didn't see a single Trump yard sign during the entire presidential campaign.

[NoRagrets 1125]

I live in an upper middle class area with lots of retired military. Not a single Cruz sign and about 10 Beto signs.

[bernorange 8357]

I live in a very Republican area. Saw the first sign in my neighborhood yesterday.  Beto.

[Huckleberry 32830]

O'Rourke has the enthusiasm. Cruz has the historical voters who will show up and vote (R) or specifically for him without much enthusiasm. I think we're looking at a Cruz win by a margin of somewhere around 4 percent, honestly.

[Brisketexan 104924]

O'Rourke has the enthusiasm. Cruz has the historical voters who will show up and vote ® or specifically for him without much enthusiasm. I think we're looking at a Cruz win by a margin of somewhere around 4 percent, honestly.

I don’t think that’s off-target. Beto has to overachieve on most every level to get it to a 50/50 game. He can...but everything has to go right.

[Celery Man 20923]

More news from back home (very red suburb north of Houston) about some very politically connected people "coming out" as supporting Beto in this race, and the number of yard signs increasing.  I'm still skeptical he can pull it off, but I do think that this is a different thing than just a good democratic candidate.

[WhatTheBuck 28764]

10 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

I've got family in a shitty little town in Oregon.  There's jack shit there.  My cousin's boys (both in their 20's) work shitty, JiffyLube type no-future jobs.  I've tried to tell them that they need to move away to a place with more opportunities.  It falls on deaf ears.  

Where should they go? What should they do? Were you offering them a job? If the extent of your advice was just a general "you should go somewhere else and do better" then what were you really doing for them? That's practically as pointless as praying for them. 

It's easy to just say people should move to other places, find better jobs, and solve all their problems. Just saying it doesn't really help. 

Did you ever read The Grapes of Wrath?

[Js1 85223]

 

[bernorange 8357]

9 hours ago, Celery Man said:

... but I do think that this is a different thing than just a good democratic candidate.

I'm inclined to believe that folks wouldn't even be bothering to listen to Beto to find out what he's all about if Cruz hadn't repeatedly stabbed himself in the dick on national TV.

[Js1 85223]

Btw, the above is the San Antonio area ad.  The ad is mostly the same in Dallas and Houston, but with more local Beto footage thrown in.

[Art Vandelay 1712]

35 minutes ago, bernorange said:

I'm inclined to believe that folks wouldn't even be bothering to listen to Beto to find out what he's all about if Cruz hadn't repeatedly stabbed himself in the dick on national TV.

Well, it certainly helps that Cruz is such as unlikeable, slimy, spineless opportunist. 

[horncyclist 1387]

Will be interesting to see if Beto sticks to the 100% positive message. The conventional wisdom is that negative adds are effective and necessary, but If could see staying positive being particularly effective against Cruz and in the current climate. I know he's not taking PAC money but is he going to discourage PACs from running attack ads?

[Bozo_Casanova 26408]

Will be interesting to see if Beto sticks to the 100% positive message. The conventional wisdom is that negative adds are effective and necessary, but If could see staying positive being particularly effective against Cruz and in the current climate. I know he's not taking PAC money but is he going to discourage PACs from running attack ads?

Every Ted Cruz ad is a negative attack on Ted Cruz.

[thepop 4409]

That's pretty much the same as the youtube ad he released a few weeks ago. It'll do.

[M12BH 545]

Call bank #3 is in da books.  We had six people doing yeoman's work.  Also I got rid of my two extra t-shirts and my yard sign that MB12 and I double-ordered.  

You know, not that we need any more examples of their rank and stunning hypocrisy, but I wonder what the Republicans beshitting themselves over Beto's arrest record have to say about Paxton's. Because nothing says "Honest Conservative" quite like supporting a State Attorney General indicted for fucking securities fraud, apparently.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Inner loop Houston is nothing but Beto signs. I've seen a few for Culberson, but none for Cruz.  

[Js1 85223]

19 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Inner loop Houston is nothing but Beto signs. I've seen a few for Culberson, but none for Cruz.  

Actually saw one driving through West U last weekend. But it's the only one I've seen.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Doesn't surprise me that you saw a Cruz sign in West U.  I was driving on Dunstan yesterday in Southampton and must have seen 15 Beto signs within a few hundred yards of each other. 

 

[Gil Bang 25906]

Where should they go? What should they do? Were you offering them a job? If the extent of your advice was just a general "you should go somewhere else and do better" then what were you really doing for them? That's practically as pointless as praying for them. 
It's easy to just say people should move to other places, find better jobs, and solve all their problems. Just saying it doesn't really help. 
Did you ever read The Grapes of Wrath?

I’ve offered to let them stay with me for a while if they want to move down here. I’ve also pushed them to look for work in the bigger town 40 miles away and eventually move there.

[Gil Bang 25906]

Wtf? How did this discussion end up on this thread?

[DDD Dad 14312]

I've seen only two Cruz yard signs in the City of Dallas since I've been paying attention.  One is on my street about two blocks down from me in Lakewood.  That is a bit of a surprise but not as much as in the past since we've seen significant infiltration from Park Cities types/offspring lately.  The other was on Hillcrest north of Royal.  That didn't surprise me (Preston Hollow north and west of the traditionally Jewish area around Hillcrest High).  Plenty of Beto signs throughout Lakewood and everywhere other than the Park Cities.

[Message Board User 12394]

 

[ERhine 1894]

Inner loop Houston is nothing but Beto signs. I've seen a few for Culberson, but none for Cruz.  

I was in a gated subdivision out in Fulshear today for work. Only sign I saw was a Beto sign.

[RDCanecutter 26374]

4 hours ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Inner loop Houston is nothing but Beto signs. I've seen a few for Culberson, but none for Cruz.  

Pay attention to what plot of land they are on too. Front yard of private home means something. Nailed to a pine tree in an intersection, not as much.

[Bozo_Casanova 26408]

My wife is wearing a Beto shirt here in Riviera Maya. Got a thumbs up at the resort.

From Aggies.

[RDCanecutter 26374]

1 hour ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

My wife is wearing a Beto shirt here in Riviera Maya. Got a thumbs up at the resort.

From Aggies.

If they're on vacation in a furrin country, they are probably Thursday Night At Duddley's Draw type Aggies.

Dixie Chicken Aggy no go strange dangerous place.

[RDCanecutter 26374]

y reglas. 

[Message Board User 12394]

 

[RDCanecutter 26374]

From replies to above:

How come your appearances are in tiny venues while Beto has crowds of 2500 or more at his rallies? Are you scared to meet with Texans who aren’t converted GOPers who follow your friend DJT?

it's the Roy Moore strategery. Creep around small venues where nobody will challenge you, while your opponent hits the crowds. It's not as if it's decided by most votes.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

2 hours ago, RDCanecutter said:

Pay attention to what plot of land they are on too. Front yard of private home means something. Nailed to a pine tree in an intersection, not as much.

Yeah, they are all in front yards of private homes.  I was in Shady Acres/Heights this afternoon and saw more Beto signs, which isn't really a surprise in that neighborhood. 

I know where Cruz lives. Will try to drive by his house tomorrow and see if there are any signs on his street. 

 

 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Hank Kingsley

[RDCanecutter 26374]

21 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

 

I know where Cruz lives. Will try to drive by his house tomorrow and see if there are any signs on his street. 

 

 

I'll mail you a dollar if you stick a Canadian flag on his property and take a photo.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Tempting.

 

[tigol 2394]

26 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Tempting.

 

Would you entertain a counter offer?

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Haha, I'm not going to do shit. But I will drive by and check for Beto/Cruz signs in his neighborhood.

 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

13 hours ago, Js1 said:

 

Are we as Americans ready to be led by an extremist with a steering wheel on the right side of his car?

[horncyclist 1387]

Beto's going to have Obama like crowds in the cities before this is over

[pyrohornIII 4814]

On 8/14/2018 at 7:21 PM, Message Board User said:

The Ted Cruz crowds...

vs the Beto crowds.

 

I got told how dumb and naive I was to expect someone elected to serve Texas to serve ALL Texans.  You look at the pictures that are being posted by these two campaigns and discuss the diversity one candidate draws versus the other.    

 

[Larry T. Spider 1746]

23 minutes ago, horncyclist said:

Beto's going to have Obama like crowds in the cities before this is over

If Beto promoted the shit out of a big event in a large space in a city, I would love to see how many he could get. I would love it just to scare the shit out of republicans. The tide is turning and it’s not just the browns and Californians they bitch about all the time. Born and raised Texans are tired of your shit.

[cactusflinthead 27597]

Also from the Ted Cruz tweet 

And

 

[Born to Run 6569]

I hope Beto takes the higher ground. Don’t roll in the mud with this pig.

But respond with clever counter-messaging. “As a Texan, I’m not going to tell you to vote straight party. You know your community, you’re informed, and you’ll vote for the best candidate regardless of party”

The whole straight party voter philosophy should be against what Texans stand for.

[pyrohornIII 4814]

 

[troph 24763]

Fuck that nonsense. There ain’t nothing wrong with cross dressing. But stoking fears in others because we might be different in some small ways is becoming an unforgivable sin in my book.