Coming Soon: The Theranos Of Higher Education

[TwiceHorn 31554]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ryancraig/2018/09/20/coming-soon-the-theranos-of-higher-education/#2dd1f5123db5

Some interesting factoids in this about declining enrollment at "non-competitive" colleges and MBA programs, as well as fraud at both.

Quote

Business schools are under revenue pressure as never before. MBA programs have been shuttered at University of Iowa, Wake Forest, and Virginia Tech. Applications for 2018 were down 27.7% at Rice, 19.6% at UT-Austin, 18.3% at UNC Chapel Hill, and 16.2% at Georgetown. Business schools have been the font of much innovation in higher education: case studies, executive education, and online programs to name a few. As the value of the MBA bundle plummets relative to faster + cheaper alternatives, and as revenue pressure mounts, watch for other business schools to “innovate” like Temple.

 

Quote

Colleges under revenue pressure may feel desperate enough to engage in similar deception. Witness the eight colleges caught submitting false data to U.S. News for the 2017 rankings. The eight colleges – Austin Peay State, Dakota Wesleyan, Drury University, Hampton University, Oklahoma City, Randolph College, Saint Louis University, and Saint Martin’s University – are exactly the non-selective schools already under significant revenue pressure. Keep in mind, these are only the colleges that submitted false data that moved them up meaningfully in the rankings. And, of course, these are only the colleges that U.S. News caught. Perhaps the biggest scandal is that the punishment doesn’t come close to fitting the crime. Because U.S. News waited until the end of August to announce the fraud, these eight schools were listed as “unranked” for 14 whole days, then given a clean sheet in the newly posted 2018 rankings.

 

[Aqua Buddha 14624]

Part of it is that Gen Z is fairly pragmatic when it comes to money.  They saw the millenials get stuck that student loan millstones around their necks.  They're not going to middle tier expensive schools and majoring in nonsense.  They're going to get a job.

MBA's are also fairly diluted and this point and they don't really teach much.

[Parliament 14334]

Good call on Gen Z.  And have a read some employers are relaxing their requirements of having a college degree?  

[Johnny Chimpo 479]

I would say that technical / science masters are still worth the money if you’re STEM inclined. Pretty funny though when I went to my engineering MS graduation ceremony I was one of like five people out of 800 or so with a Caucasian background the rest were Indian or Asian (mostly Chinese). This was at USC Los Angeles. 

Edited September 21, 2018 by Johnny Chimpo

[Skipper 6207]

1 hour ago, Johnny Chimpo said:

I would say that technical / science masters are still worth the money if you’re STEM inclined. Pretty funny though when I went to my engineering MS graduation ceremony I was one of like five people out of 800 or so with a Caucasian background the rest were Indian or Asian (mostly Chinese). This was at USC Los Angeles. 

Asian girls everywhere.  Soso I've heard.

[BrickHorn 18290]

Nm

Edited September 21, 2018 by BrickHorn

[BrickHorn 18290]

Have these failing MBA programs considered refocusing on their core competencies in order to leverage paradigm-shifting synergies in the emerging information economy?

Edited September 21, 2018 by BrickHorn

[XYZ 2154]

1 hour ago, BrickHorn said:

Have these failing MBA programs considered refocusing on their core competencies in order to leverage paradigm-shifting synergies in the emerging information economy?

Funny.

[Helobious 9467]

3 hours ago, Parliament said:

Good call on Gen Z.  And have a read some employers are relaxing their requirements of having a college degree?  

Depends on the job. A lot of them go with what I call the "Mack Brown Depth Chart" for job requirements. College degree OR 5+ years experience in the field (how you get the experience without a degree I don't know). I work in finance and pretty much all the worthwhile jobs still require degrees. I imagine in the tech field or sales fields it's different. 

[Parliament 14334]

9 hours ago, BrickHorn said:

Have these failing MBA programs considered refocusing on their core competencies in order to leverage paradigm-shifting synergies in the emerging information economy?

Let me reach out to my counterparts with your ask, and circle back.  We need to think out of the box.

[Texas Jeff 1945]

11 hours ago, Johnny Chimpo said:

I would say that technical / science masters are still worth the money if you’re STEM inclined. Pretty funny though when I went to my engineering MS graduation ceremony I was one of like five people out of 800 or so with a Caucasian background the rest were Indian or Asian (mostly Chinese). This was at USC Los Angeles. 

As a hiring manager, I saw hundreds of Chinese and Indian resumes with an undergrad from some place I had never heard of in their home country, but a master's degree from a US university I had heard of.  This is a common path into the US.  Most of those with US BS degrees go get a job after undergrad ... but those outside the country have to come get an advanced degree, then start working the visa system to get a path to stay here.

I could open a requisition on a Friday and have 80 foreign born fresh MS applicants by Monday, no matter what the posted job qualifications required.

[52-80 19263]

12 hours ago, Johnny Chimpo said:

I would say that technical / science masters are still worth the money if you’re STEM inclined. Pretty funny though when I went to my engineering MS graduation ceremony I was one of like five people out of 800 or so with a Caucasian background the rest were Indian or Asian (mostly Chinese). This was at USC Los Angeles. 

ah - their new campus, USCLA

[GreenspointTexas 9683]

Sorry i didnt go to school to get my MBA

But I paid my dues and now my revenue is like the NBA

[J.R. Juniors Junior Jr. 1084]

Quote

id:

Have these failing MBA programs considered refocusing on their core competencies in order to leverage paradigm-shifting synergies in the emerging information economy?

 said:Have these failing MBA programs considered refocusing on their core competencies in order to leverage paradigm-shifting synergies in the emerging information economy?

Edited September 21, 2018 by J.R. Juniors Junior Jr.

[Incredulity 11683]

6 hours ago, Parliament said:

Let me reach out to my counterparts with your ask, and circle back.  We need to think out of the box.

Lets put a pin in that, step back and look at it from the 30,000ft perspective and develop a holistic approach to seamless, plug and play, integration.

[XYZ 2154]

Raise the bar...value proposition...KPI...powerpoint

[XYZ 2154]

So, hmm, anyway, what IS the theranos of higher education?

[XYZ 2154]

When I was half-way through engineering school, I decided that after graduating I wanted to get a masters degree in engineering. My parents tried to persuade me to get an MBA instead. I’m glad I didn’t listen to them.

[tbone_ 14181]

My expert analysis based on having an MBA is that the world will be better off with fewer MBAs in the future.

[BottleRocket 647]

You can’t swing a dead cat without hitting someone with a MBA.

[J.R. Juniors Junior Jr. 1084]

7 hours ago, XYZ said:

So, hmm, anyway, what IS the theranos of higher education?

The Theranos of higher ed would have to be the InfiniLaw chain of for-profit law schools that had low admissions standards, low bar passage rates, and unreal debt loads by many students.  Also, the ITT Tech-type schools that seemingly rely on the least savvy students just to stay in business.

[KaiserSoze 998]

University of Phoenix type stuff.

 

Also, it's no surprise enrollment/applications are dropping. It has nothing to do with the "theory" that gen z is more pragmatic about education spending, etc. The economy is doing well and there are plenty of job openings. Applications to MBA programs increase when the economy is in the shitter and people who have been laid off are looking to lay low for a couple of years, etc. and/or there aren't many job openings (these conditions often go hand-in-hand).

 

This isn't new.

 

 

[Lhorn 4968]

2 hours ago, KaiserSoze said:

University of Phoenix type stuff.

 

Also, it's no surprise enrollment/applications are dropping. It has nothing to do with the "theory" that gen z is more pragmatic about education spending, etc. 

 

Yeah that theory is giving today’s youth WAY too much credit 

[davidg 4038]

On 9/21/2018 at 1:42 PM, Incredulity said:

Lets put a pin in that, step back and look at it from the 30,000ft perspective and develop a holistic approach to seamless, plug and play, integration.

Can we circle back to this for a minute?

[Parliament 14334]

Can we circle back to this for a minute?

 

Sure. Ping me on IM when you reach a consensus on the synergies we can discover.

 

And don’t forget the cover sheet on your TPS report. (Did you get the memo?)

[Pescado_Rojo 19431]

On 9/21/2018 at 1:42 PM, Incredulity said:

Lets put a pin in that, step back and look at it from the 30,000ft perspective and develop a holistic approach to seamless, plug and play, integration.

Yea, let's not try to boil the ocean here...we need to stay in our swim lanes and fortify our core competencies. 

[Beau Vine 54466]

On ‎9‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 10:37 PM, KaiserSoze said:

University of Phoenix type stuff.

 

Also, it's no surprise enrollment/applications are dropping. It has nothing to do with the "theory" that gen z is more pragmatic about education spending, etc. The economy is doing well and there are plenty of job openings. Applications to MBA programs increase when the economy is in the shitter and people who have been laid off are looking to lay low for a couple of years, etc. and/or there aren't many job openings (these conditions often go hand-in-hand).

 

This isn't new.

 

 

The other thing that's happening is that more students are getting MS degrees in business fields instead of MBAs.  

More people already have BBAs; MBAs are redundant to these people.  

[pacman 7371]

14 hours ago, davidg said:

Can we circle back to this for a minute?

Let's schedule a daily 2 hour conference call to discuss...

[gecko 1104]

Gen Z is going to save this country. As a group, they have a very low tolerance for bullshit...

[Fudge Nuggets 19227]

Back on point, everyone.  Let’s put this in the parking lot and take it offline.

[tbone_ 14181]

But there’s so much still left to unpack

[luke duke 6414]

When I was half-way through engineering school, I decided that after graduating I wanted to get a masters degree in engineering. My parents tried to persuade me to get an MBA instead. I’m glad I didn’t listen to them.

You would probably be making more money now if you listened to them. Your job would probably be worthless, but you’d be better paid.

[Kyle 207]

10 hours ago, gecko said:

Gen Z is going to save this country. As a group, they have a very low tolerance for bullshit...

I hope your right. At my kids' athletic activities, I see the way many parent and worry.

[HornsOverIthaca 2335]

On 9/21/2018 at 2:34 PM, XYZ said:

So, hmm, anyway, what IS the theranos of higher education?

I keep reading it as “the Thanos of higher education” and I’m always disappointed.

[Johnny Chimpo 479]

On 9/25/2018 at 8:45 PM, luke duke said:

 

You would probably be making more money now if you listened to them. Your job would probably be worthless, but you’d be better paid.

 

In 2016 I was considering getting an mba to make a career change. Except I realized I already was making what the average Stanford grad does. Now in 2018 I’m making approximately double that. BS mech E MS petroleum E. 

[Kyle 207]

I think the issue likely extends beyond MBA programs. Like athletics, schools have been in an arms race drunk with never-ending tuition increases facilitated by Uncle Sam. The outrage over this plus the proliferation of online alternatives is make increasing competition.

[Guest]

On 9/25/2018 at 3:14 AM, gecko said:

Gen Z is going to save this country. As a group, they have a very low tolerance for bullshit... getting zeroes on shit they don't turn in.

FIFY.

[tx 3 putt 77535]

eng degree / mba combo is still very profitable 

[tbone_ 14181]

I agree. If I had it to do over again this is what I would do.