Houston Prop B - firefighter pay

[Hanrahan 1306]

2 hours ago, deech said:

They are butt-hurt because they cut benefits to the firefighters from their self-funded pension to sustain the other two pensions that were bankrupt because the City, the Cops, and the Municipal employees didn't fund them themselves properly.  It's called theft if its not done by a legislative act.

 

The referendum spinning by the City is a complete and total joke.  And like you I absolutely hate how the HFD operates.

Huh.  What spinning is the City doing?  I'd be interested in hearing.

[Lazarus Bocanegra 303]

On 9/24/2018 at 4:15 PM, Dewey said:

I've seen some bits and pieces in the news where some HFD stations are having issues with their trucks. One in Bellaire was driving around a loaner suburban til their truck could get fixed. Another station camped at a park til a mechanic could get to their truck, apparently the air brakes locked up, again, and they had to stay overnight watching the truck. That's piss poor for a City the size of Houston.

I spent a little time with a crew at a firehouse after Harvey, and they were quick to point out all the shit that is wrong/broken on their outdated equipment.  Trucks leaking, jerry-rigged, etc.  And how the entirety of HFD had, iirc, one boat for water rescues.  Mind bottling

 

[misslaw 8]

2 hours ago, Lazarus Bocanegra said:

I spent a little time with a crew at a firehouse after Harvey, and they were quick to point out all the shit that is wrong/broken on their outdated equipment.  Trucks leaking, jerry-rigged, etc.  And how the entirety of HFD had, iirc, one boat for water rescues.  Mind bottling

 

HFD is excellent at whining, bitching and moaning about everything. When they got new computer equipment for ambulance runs, they bitched about liking the old stuff better and not wanting to learn the new software. You can’t win with them. 

[misslaw 8]

7 hours ago, deech said:

They are butt-hurt because they cut benefits to the firefighters from their self-funded pension to sustain the other two pensions that were bankrupt because the City, the Cops, and the Municipal employees didn't fund them themselves properly.  It's called theft if its not done by a legislative act.

 

The referendum spinning by the City is a complete and total joke.  And like you I absolutely hate how the HFD operates.

Their pension is based on wonky numbers from an actuary that the City had to sue because their forecast was so off. Mario Gallegos, who started out with HFD, became a state senator and got them a sweet deal many years ago in Austin. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13411]

Now comes the layoffs to pay for the firefighter raises: https://www.foxnews.com/us/houston-plans-to-layoff-400-firefighters-to-fund-mandatory-pay-raises-for-fire-department

[Macanudo 12926]

Or Sylvester is trying to divert attention away from how corrupt HPD is.

[Dewey 3280]

The guy is a jackass, so bent out of shape by this prop b, definitely hurting him $ somehow, no other way to explain his level of anger towards it. No politician cares that much about the citizens and what they have to pay for. This is hurting him $$$ directly, somehow

[Macanudo 12926]

Maybe his friends own the land some of those fire stations are on and shrinking the force allows them to sell at a tidy profit.   

 

[Hanrahan 1306]

The guy is a jackass, so bent out of shape by this prop b, definitely hurting him $ somehow, no other way to explain his level of anger towards it. No politician cares that much about the citizens and what they have to pay for. This is hurting him $$$ directly, somehow

Uh, I think he’s just doing his job. Nobody hates firefighters but the HFD union has refused to negotiate in good faith for years and is being incredibly greedy. They knew the fiscal impact this would have on the City and knew firefighters were going to b the first laid off. Didn’t care, the well entrenched got more money in their pockets. You’re in clown school if you fall for this faux outrage now.

[deech 2251]

No one knows exactly what is going on with the negotiations, but Turner is coming across as a complete and total bitch hellbent on overturning the will of the voters with all this nonsense.  To only hit the firefighters with a mass layoff proposal after refusing to swear in their Academy class while giving police officers a 4% raise in the last six months and swearing in their new Academy class is laughable.

[Hanrahan 1306]

Lol wut? Should they fire police or other city employees to pay for the firefighters massive pay raise? The police have collectively bargained with the City for years. The firefighters used to do that but they went for the big payday. They got it and now they’re seeing the other side of the coin. If I was Turner I’d make them work regular shifts like the police - no more working three days a week and going to your other job with the four days off.

 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13411]

2 hours ago, deech said:

No one knows exactly what is going on with the negotiations, but Turner is coming across as a complete and total bitch hellbent on overturning the will of the voters with all this nonsense.  To only hit the firefighters with a mass layoff proposal after refusing to swear in their Academy class while giving police officers a 4% raise in the last six months and swearing in their new Academy class is laughable.

Turner was upfront that passing this proposition would lead to layoffs. Apparently the citizens voting for the pay raise were 100% on board with the lay offs.

[deech 2251]

2 hours ago, Hanrahan said:

Lol wut? Should they fire police or other city employees to pay for the firefighters massive pay raise? The police have collectively bargained with the City for years. The firefighters used to do that but they went for the big payday. They got it and now they’re seeing the other side of the coin. If I was Turner I’d make them work regular shifts like the police - no more working three days a week and going to your other job with the four days off.

 

They also collectively bargained their pension benefits, but that didn't stop the City from tying their pension benefits to that of the municipal workers and police officers via passing a bill in the last legislative session even though they were significantly better funded and nowhere near the desperation of the police officers and municipal workers.

[deech 2251]

3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Turner was upfront that passing this proposition would lead to layoffs. Apparently the citizens voting for the pay raise were 100% on board with the lay offs.

He's been nothing but a petulant bitch and it is going to cost him the next election IMHO.

[Scooter Monzingo 820]

On 9/28/2018 at 12:24 PM, deech said:

They are butt-hurt because they cut benefits to the firefighters from their self-funded pension to sustain the other two pensions that were bankrupt because the City, the Cops, and the Municipal employees didn't fund them themselves properly.  It's called theft if its not done by a legislative act.

 

The referendum spinning by the City is a complete and total joke.  And like you I absolutely hate how the HFD operates.

As I don’t know anything about their organization, I have to ask. Are their pension plans not governed by EBSA? 

EBSA oversight has been instrumental in the decision for most companies to no longer offer pension plans to their rank and file employees in many different lines of work. Simply because the company must provide annual proof that the plan is healthy. And most important not top heavy. it is expensive benifit to maintain.

[deech 2251]

8 minutes ago, Scooter Monzingo said:

As I don’t know anything about their organization, I have to ask. Are their pension plans not governed by EBSA? 

EBSA oversight has been instrumental in the decision for most companies to no longer offer pension plans to their rank and file employees in many different lines of work. Simply because the company must provide annual proof that the plan is healthy. And most important not top heavy. it is expensive benifit to maintain.

https://www.texasmonthly.com/politics/fire-fight/

Not sure but the fund for firefighters has been about 87% funded per this article which was considered healthy at the time per the article.

[mycox 582]

Turner did try to negotiate an annual raise for the next 5 years until they reach the 25% pay raise, but the firefighters turned that deal down. So the next step was layoffs to pay that 25% immediately. 

[relapse98 634]

delete

Edited March 11, 2019 by relapse98
already covered

[relapse98 634]

On 9/28/2018 at 4:09 PM, Lazarus Bocanegra said:

And how the entirety of HFD had, iirc, one boat for water rescues.  Mind bottling

They lied, you misremembered, or they have purchased a number after the hurricane. My guess is on the former.

HFD Units and Terms

Quote

8	Evacuation Boats - Placed into service during times of high-water, primarily used when there are a large number of people trapped in high waters.
5	Rescue Boats - The primary function of the rescue boat is to be used to effect rescue in high water situations, removal of a victim and/or stranded individual.
4	Fast Water Rescue Craft - Jet Bikes arrived 2007.

 

[misslaw 8]

On 3/9/2019 at 3:26 PM, Hanrahan said:

Lol wut? Should they fire police or other city employees to pay for the firefighters massive pay raise? The police have collectively bargained with the City for years. The firefighters used to do that but they went for the big payday. They got it and now they’re seeing the other side of the coin. If I was Turner I’d make them work regular shifts like the police - no more working three days a week and going to your other job with the four days off.

 

This is what needs to happen. 

[sullhorn 0]

On 3/9/2019 at 7:00 PM, deech said:

They also collectively bargained their pension benefits, but that didn't stop the City from tying their pension benefits to that of the municipal workers and police officers via passing a bill in the last legislative session even though they were significantly better funded and nowhere near the desperation of the police officers and municipal workers.

Exactly.  HFD gave up salary increases to juice their pensions.  Pensions then get crushed to pay for the other failing pensions and the Mayor gives a crappy raise and pretends everything is fine.  

[Nice Guy Eddie 13411]

It's only bad news that Houston fire fighters are experiencing lay offs, but they were told this was going to happen well in advance of the proposition that they championed last year: https://www.click2houston.com/news/houston-firefighters-gather-to-meet-with-fire-chief-about-layoffs . And other fire fighters are being demoted to fill the gaps of those being laid off. 

I guess they assumed that Turner was bluffing in that he had no choices other than to lay them and others off. 

[Captainant 27447]

Huh, a state judge ruled prop B to be unconstitutional and void

What an interesting dumpster fire

[Hank Scorpio 17723]

I can't wait for the mysterious fire that burns down the judge's house.