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Perpetual Middle East Geopolitical Quagmire Megathread

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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ousuxndallas
ousuxndallas

Trump is the antithesis of that pussy Obama. The reasons why you guys hate Trump are the reasons we love him. He told Iran not to start shit, and when they did, he laid the wood. #MAGA

Brian Fantana
Brian Fantana

You've seriously got to be kidding me. In literally any other country in the world, Sanders and Warren would be considered centrists. The Overton window has shifted so far to the right in this fucked

Red Five
Red Five

You love him because he's a career criminal and conman and has no idea what he's doing and is historically corrupt and is incapable of telling the truth and is a truly terrible human being? That's wei

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RPM

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3 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Wait, I’m not a super genius but they say they don’t have evidence of foul play but their hands and waists were bound with duct tape???

 

Those statements seem fairly contradictory to me.

 

Obviously suicide. Sad.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23357

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6 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Wait, I’m not a super genius but they say they don’t have evidence of foul play but their hands and waists were bound with duct tape???

Those statements seem fairly contradictory to me.

I’ve seen this occurrence at least four times over the past three years:

1.  Once with a Russian in D.C. that was beaten to death in 2015

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/christopher-steele-fbi-mikhail-lesin-rt-russia-murdered-2018-3

 

2.  Peter Smith, the Mike Flynn Russian hacker connection.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-peter-smith-death-met-0713-20170713-story,amp.html

 

3.  A federal prosecutors in Hollywood beach, Florida that was shot to death.

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/broward/article166516317.html

 

4. And this case with the Saudi girls.

 

Whe they say “no foul play” when there probably was, it means it’s getting handle by the feds and they want the investigation not to have a media frenzy around it.  

Perhaps because it has national security and international relations implications.

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27-25

27-25 2040

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11 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Wait, I’m not a super genius but they say they don’t have evidence of foul play but their hands and waists were bound with duct tape???

 

Those statements seem fairly contradictory to me.

 

Someone needs to DO SOMETHING, like add a safety warning to duct tape about the accidental wrapping of oneself and a relative when near bodies of water.

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NowThis

NowThis 931

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On 10/22/2018 at 3:33 PM, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

just coming here to see if that was posted. this shit gets more amazing every day.

it's so well planned, finding a body double, i'm sorta amazed they got caught. So the weak link was his gf notifying the Turks right? 

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bernorange

bernorange 8348

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Not directly related to Khashoggi or the USA, but likely to ratchet up the pressure on the situation...

Quote

Saudi journalist and writer Turki Bin Abdul Aziz Al-Jasser has died after being tortured while in detention, the New Khaleej reported yesterday.

Reporting human rights sources, the news site said that Al-Jasser was arrested and tortured to death after Saudi authorities claimed he administered the Twitter account Kashkool, which disclosed rights violations committed by the Saudi authorities and royal family.

The sources said that the authorities identified Al-Jasser as the admin using spies in Twitter’s regional office located in Dubai. He was arrested in March.
...

More:  https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20181105-saudi-journalist-tortured-to-death-in-prison/

 

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bernorange

bernorange 8348

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Canadian intelligence has heard an audio recording of the killing of the Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has confirmed.

"Canada has been fully briefed up on what Turkey had to share," he said.

Mr Trudeau is the first Western leader to confirm his country has listened to the purported tape of the murder at the Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

Turkey's president said on Saturday that he had given copies to the US, UK, Germany, France and Saudi Arabia.
...

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-46183630

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bolverk

bolverk 29405

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WASHINGTON — Shortly after the journalist Jamal Khashoggi was assassinated last month, a member of the kill team instructed a superior over the phone to “tell your boss,” believed to be Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman of Saudi Arabia, that the operatives had carried out their mission, according to three people familiar with a recording of Mr. Khashoggi’s killing collected by Turkish intelligence.

The recording, shared last month with the C.I.A. director, Gina Haspel, is seen by intelligence officials as some of the strongest evidence linking Prince Mohammed to the killing of Mr. Khashoggi, a Virginia resident and Washington Post columnist whose death prompted an international outcry.

While the prince was not mentioned by name, American intelligence officials believe “your boss” was a reference to Prince Mohammed. Maher Abdulaziz Mutreb, one of 15 Saudis dispatched to Istanbul to confront Mr. Khashoggi at the Saudi Consulate there, made the phone call and spoke in Arabic, the people said.

Turkish intelligence officers have told American officials they believe that Mr. Mutreb, a security officer who frequently traveled with Prince Mohammed, was speaking to one of the prince’s aides. While translations of the Arabic may differ, the people briefed on the call said Mr. Mutreb also said to the aide words to the effect of “the deed was done.”

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/12/world/middleeast/jamal-khashoggi-killing-saudi-arabia.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28713

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40 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

I’m sure no one gives a shit anymore but
 

Things you knew were true before seeing the evidence. Like Joe Paterno knowing about the 1998 investigation of Sandusky, and Donald Trump knowing about the Trump Tower collusion meeting with the Russians before it happened. 

Edited by WhatTheBuck
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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28713

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6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Can we just go ahead and say fuck off to the kingdom already?

What would that entail? Stop selling them arms? Stop buying oil from them? Break off all diplomatic contact? Recommit to the Iran nuclear deal?

Do what we should've done in 1980 and invest heavily in research to find an alternative to oil as an energy source? Share it with the world and crater the profitability (and pollution) of the oil industry? Defund as a result the sponsors and defenders of the radical theology that led to 9/11 and which originated to protect Saudi oil wealth? Screw Russia in the process?

We all know who the forces are that have prevented any of that from ever happening.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

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13 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

What would that entail? Stop selling them arms? Stop buying oil from them? Break off all diplomatic contact? Recommit to the Iran nuclear deal?

Do what we should've done in 1980 and invest heavily in research to find an alternative to oil as an energy source? Share it with the world and crater the profitability (and pollution) of the oil industry? Defund as a result the sponsors and defenders of the radical theology that led to 9/11 and which originated to protect Saudi oil wealth? Screw Russia in the process?

We all know who the forces are that have prevented any of that from ever happening.

It entails waiting until 2020. We have never been great when it comes to SA, but we are practically their vassal state with our current administration. 

But yes, we do need to recommit to the Iran deal and refocus on alternative energy. Once we get to a point where we can maintain our current consumption via renewables backstopped only by US/Canadian fossil fuels, then we stop buying Saudi and ME shit completely.  This includes higher auto efficiency standards and better incentives for both the manufacture and purchase of electric vehicles, as well as gov't investment in national recharging and battery swap infrastructure.

But if we waste too much time, the world will be buying Chinese alternatives to fossil fuels rather than our alternatives. 

Edited by FondrenRoad
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bernorange

bernorange 8348

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... then we stop buying Saudi and ME shit completely.  ...


The petrodollars system depends upon the Saudis and ME selling their oil in dollars. It doesn't matter if they sell to us or someone else. The real issue is how to maintain the dollar and our economy when they stop selling in dollars.
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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

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2 minutes ago, bernorange said:


 

 


The petrodollars system depends upon the Saudis and ME selling their oil in dollars. It doesn't matter if they sell to us or someone else. The real issue is how to maintain the dollar and our economy when they stop selling in dollars.

 

That issue is going to arise anyway.  The renewable genie isn't going to go back into the lamp.  The Euro, Pound, and Yen seem to manage.  We'll be fine.

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28713

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5 hours ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

John Anderson was a visionary, eh?

Jimmy Carter was a visionary for putting solar panels on the White House. Ronald Reagan was a goddamn fool for tearing them down and blowing a shitload of money on a fantasy nuclear missile defense system, all while cozying up to the Saudis to replace Iran as our mid-east oil partner. All the money wasted on SDI (aka Star Wars) would've been better spent breaking our addiction to oil.

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Fozzz

Fozzz 152

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On 11/17/2018 at 3:48 PM, WhatTheBuck said:

Jimmy Carter was a visionary for putting solar panels on the White House. Ronald Reagan was a goddamn fool for tearing them down and blowing a shitload of money on a fantasy nuclear missile defense system, all while cozying up to the Saudis to replace Iran as our mid-east oil partner. All the money wasted on SDI (aka Star Wars) would've been better spent breaking our addiction to oil.

SDI wasn’t wasted, at least from the perspective of the policy makers, it was just never meant to act as a real defense system. It was simply a subsidy. 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89450

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19 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/palestinians/.premium-palestinians-seek-arab-league-session-on-israel-s-growing-ties-with-arab-world-1.6695112

So what do we make of this here?

Good people on both sides?

The Palestinians should be worried.  Nobody else wants them, or wants to deals with them.  

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13414

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WSJ reporting that MBS sent 11 messages to the lead of the hit squad in the hours before and after the murder of Khashoggi.  Content unknown.  While leaks are not normally good, I think its important that some in the CIA are not allowing the WH to keep this quiet.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/cia-intercepts-underpin-assessment-saudi-crown-prince-targeted-khashoggi-1543640460

and that MBS was captured saying the following in Aug 2017:

Quote

that if his efforts to persuade Mr. Khashoggi to return to Saudi Arabia weren’t successful, “we could possibly lure him outside Saudi Arabia and make arrangements,”

 Even if MBS didn't order or expect the murder, and that is difficult to believe, it at least speaks to how those around him interpret his wishes if not orders.   

 

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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11810

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This may not end well.  Qatar saying it will leave OPEC.

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DOHA (Reuters) - Qatar said on Monday it was quitting OPEC from January to focus on its gas ambitions, taking a swipe at the group’s de facto leader Saudi Arabia and marring efforts to show unity before this week’s meeting of exporters to tackle an oil price slide.

Doha, one of OPEC’s smallest oil producers but the world’s biggest liquefied natural gas (LNG) exporter, is embroiled in a protracted diplomatic row with Saudi Arabia and some other Arab states.

Qatar said its surprise decision was not driven by politics but in an apparent swipe at Riyadh, Minister of State for Energy Affairs Saad al-Kaabi said: “We are not saying we are going to get out of the oil business but it is controlled by an organization managed by a country.” He did not name the nation.

Al-Kaabi told a news conference that Doha’s decision “was communicated to OPEC” but said Qatar would attend the group’s meeting on Thursday and Friday in Vienna, and would abide by its commitments.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-qatar-opec/qatar-to-leave-opec-and-focus-on-gas-as-it-takes-swipe-at-riyadh-idUSKBN1O20DT

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

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On 11/16/2018 at 9:55 PM, WhatTheBuck said:

What would that entail? Stop selling them arms? Stop buying oil from them? Break off all diplomatic contact? Recommit to the Iran nuclear deal?

Do what we should've done in 1980 and invest heavily in research to find an alternative to oil as an energy source? Share it with the world and crater the profitability (and pollution) of the oil industry? Defund as a result the sponsors and defenders of the radical theology that led to 9/11 and which originated to protect Saudi oil wealth? Screw Russia in the process?

We all know who the forces are that have prevented any of that from ever happening.

We should have given 50 billion to Solyndra.  That would have solved it.  

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23357

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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

Graham will always bend the knee and kiss Trump’s wiring.  He’s not gonna stand up to him. 

If you haven’t, you should read the Bob Woodward book to better understand the Lindsey Graham/Trump relationship.

Trump likes Lindsey because he’s one of the few people that isn’t a yes-man behind the scenes. We’ve seen evidence of this a few times (shithole gate/DACA kids/North Korea).

Graham will run messaging for Trump in the media to curry favor and access but behind the scenes he probably has the most influence over certain aspects of Trump’s decision making, especially when it comes to foreign policy.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89450

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1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If you haven’t, you should read the Bob Woodward book to better understand the Lindsey Graham/Trump relationship.

Trump likes Lindsey because he’s one of the few people that isn’t a yes-man behind the scenes. We’ve seen evidence of this a few times (shithole gate/DACA kids/North Korea).

Graham will run messaging for Trump in the media to curry favor and access but behind the scenes he probably has the most influence over certain aspects of Trump’s decision making, especially when it comes to foreign policy.

Graham isn’t going to cross Trump and the defense contractors.  

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