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2017-18 Spurs Thread: Probably no buckets for Kawhi

Radical Larry

By Radical Larry
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PilotsError
PilotsError

Fuck Pops.   He came out as anti second amendment.  Hope he collapses on the court.

Radical Larry
Radical Larry

1 down, 15 to go.

Braff Zacklin
Braff Zacklin

That's a man. He's 40.

Mitch Cumsteen

Mitch Cumsteen 18,962

Posted
Posted

Swept by the Lakers for the first time since Tim Duncan's rookie season. And this is a shitshow of a Lakers team even before all of their injuries.

I've been saying this for months, but we should have been aiming for the lottery since Kawhi put himself back on the shelf in January. We fucking blew it.

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Gut Wagon

Gut Wagon 8,219

Posted
Posted (edited)

I know all good things come to an end, and we've had it amazingly good forever. But let's be semi-objective here. Had Tim and Manu not somehow held back the hands of the clock for a few years, had Boris not forced Charlotte to dump him and had Kawhi not evolved out of nowhere to become LBJ Lite, we'd have been toast long before now. Bullets can be dodged for only so long before you step the wrong way. 

Big question is, what's next? We won't start to know that answer until we learn more about Leonard. 

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dingleberryswitzer

dingleberryswitzer 2,724

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, Gut Wagon said:

I know all good things come to an end, and we've had it amazingly good forever. But let's be semi-objective here. Had Tim and Manu not somehow held back the hands of the clock for a few years, had Boris not forced Charlotte to dump him and had Kawhi not evolved out of nowhere to become LBJ Lite, we'd have been toast long before now. Bullets can be dodged for only so long before you step the wrong way. 

Big question is, what's next? We won't start to know that answer until we learn more about Leonard. 

I'd say tear it down and rebuild, but I'm not sure laMarcus would want to stick around for that.  

If spurs missed the playoffs id feel real bad for rudy.  Dude barely played in the playoffs like a decade ago, signs with SA most likely because he saw they were close, then this shit season happens.  

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MoJames

MoJames 8,258

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Posted
54 minutes ago, XYZ said:

Tony Parker and Danny Green combined 0-for-10. These guys used to be reliable shooters

Ya I start tuning in around this time of year and was very excited to watch LA. But man, have Danny Green and Parker been that reliable all season?  Just awful.

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Horn of Gabriel

Horn of Gabriel 1,886

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On 4/5/2018 at 12:13 PM, dingleberryswitzer said:

I'd say tear it down and rebuild, but I'm not sure laMarcus would want to stick around for that.  

If spurs missed the playoffs id feel real bad for rudy.  Dude barely played in the playoffs like a decade ago, signs with SA most likely because he saw they were close, then this shit season happens.  

If Leonard is not returning, I could see PATFO trading LMA and Gay and whatever other parts they can get rid of, making next year the tank year and Pop handing off to Messina. Problem is in today's NBA you need at least 2 all-stars and preferably 2+ HOFers to contend for a title, possibly more.  Leonard was one, Parker is way past his prime, Ginobili is probably done after this year, LMA has been doing a pretty damn good job considering, but he's a high-volume shooter who is all about the mid-block ISO game, which has basically wrecked any beautiful-game era passing and sharing we had. That's also my theory on why Danny has sucked so much ass since that shift.  We're one of the few half court grind-it-out teams left in an up-tempo era.  Our Defense is the only reason it kinda sorta works.  Our new point guard might be an all-star some day, but I see his ceiling as a step below Rajon Rondo - good but not a game changer.  So where are you going to find 2 more HOFers who will come down to SA?  In the draft?

I hate to say this, but I think we're on the slippery slope toward mediocrity.  PATFO is going to keep us good enough to not get a decent draft placement, and as a result we're not going to get the Duncan or Robinson we need.  It could be a many-years-in-the-wilderness situation we're looking at.  Hopefully that means the Horns are due to not suck.

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Gut Wagon

Gut Wagon 8,219

Posted
Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

If Leonard is not returning, I could see PATFO trading LMA and Gay and whatever other parts they can get rid of, making next year the tank year and Pop handing off to Messina. Problem is in today's NBA you need at least 2 all-stars and preferably 2+ HOFers to contend for a title, possibly more.  Leonard was one, Parker is way past his prime, Ginobili is probably done after this year, LMA has been doing a pretty damn good job considering, but he's a high-volume shooter who is all about the mid-block ISO game, which has basically wrecked any beautiful-game era passing and sharing we had. That's also my theory on why Danny has sucked so much ass since that shift.  We're one of the few half court grind-it-out teams left in an up-tempo era.  Our Defense is the only reason it kinda sorta works.  Our new point guard might be an all-star some day, but I see his ceiling as a step below Rajon Rondo - good but not a game changer.  So where are you going to find 2 more HOFers who will come down to SA?  In the draft?

I hate to say this, but I think we're on the slippery slope toward mediocrity.  PATFO is going to keep us good enough to not get a decent draft placement, and as a result we're not going to get the Duncan or Robinson we need.  It could be a many-years-in-the-wilderness situation we're looking at.  Hopefully that means the Horns are due to not suck.

Solid take. Even if Kawhi comes back to stay (please, please, please), your points about the other pieces still are valid. LMA needs the ball to run through him to be both productive and happy. It works OK as long as he's hitting and the other team never just decides to double him and make one of our non-scorers shoot. Then, as seen in LA, it's curtains for our offense. None of our guards can consistently get open and then make a shot. Although Rudy has been a huge asset this year, we can't count on him to morph into Kawhi every night. And Bertans is a fine heir apparent to Bonner, in that he can bomb like crazy one night, then stink it up for a week.

Murray's working his tail off, but I don't know that he'll become the PG it takes to win titles in today's association. You have to be able to make a lot of jumpers under duress to compete with your counterparts on the true contenders. Meanwhile, we're starting an SG who can't S. Our backup guards are midgets who can't create enough offense against decent guards to offset their defensive issues. We're currently so far behind on firepower that we have no chance against them without mucking up the game and holding the opponent under 100. 

In short, we're trying to hold it all together with an odd blend of a couple players who are still really good, a few who used to be really good and one or two who hopefully will  one day be halfway decent. Once we could count on at least beating the also-rans of the league through experience and coaching, but it still takes a reasonable amount of talent to do that.  Many  nights, we're just not better than the other team. Several have more firepower, fresher legs and roughly equal coaching. That's not a war we can hope to win too often any more.

I'm not saying we can't recover a fair bit of our punch and defense with a healthy Kawhi, because until proven otherwise, he's still a Top 5 guy. But as noted, his resurgence likely would come at the direct expense of LMA's points (and psyche). The only way we'll return to elite status any time soon is for the stars to align, giving us several young guys with talent other teams either don't see or appropriately value. I don't like the odds.  

    

Edited by Gut Wagon
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XYZ

XYZ 2,154

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Posted

LMA plays well when he’s the primary offensive weapon. When Kawhi comes back, I would keep LMA as the primary scorer and have Kawhi focus on defense (i.e. guard the best player) and be the #2 option on offense. Last season Kawhi was asked to do too much. He basically had to shut down the other team’s best shooter AND carry the offense, while LMA stood around, uninspired. Fortunately for everyone, I’m not the coach.

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NoRagrets

NoRagrets 1,138

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Posted
3 hours ago, XYZ said:

LMA plays well when he’s the primary offensive weapon. When Kawhi comes back, I would keep LMA as the primary scorer and have Kawhi focus on defense (i.e. guard the best player) and be the #2 option on offense. Last season Kawhi was asked to do too much. He basically had to shut down the other team’s best shooter AND carry the offense, while LMA stood around, uninspired. Fortunately for everyone, I’m not the coach.

I was thinking the same thing. LMA gets gassed, let Kawhi take over. They'll both be happily little all-stars.

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