Taking up arms

[Goredho 17388]

My FB feed is full of people I grew up with in West Texas predicting bloodshed if the dems "seize control" with the midterm results.  They seem resigned to some loss of GOP control, and are prodding each other into escalating levels of anger and rage over the loss of the 2nd amendment and the hordes of MS-13 members that will be streaming across the border to rape, murder and pillage.  Given that, lock her up, Charlottesville, the softball shooting and now mail bombs, It got me contemplating how close we might be to a real uprising and what it would personally take for me to get to the where I am willing to take up arms against other Americans.

I don't think we are close to some organized revolution, but I do think the context is in place for the ignition of a chain of violent events.  Most of these people preaching armed resistance are intardnet tough guys that won't act, but it takes only a small fraction to be worked up into enough of a frenzy to kick some crazy shit off.  We've already seen it happen with police shootings, corresponding riots and the cop killings in Dallas, LA, etc...

For me, I've got young kids, so shit would have to get personally bad for us for me to risk them growing up sans padre.  Our daily life would need to be impacted, or their future to become so dark that it would trump my responsibility to shepherd them into adulthood as decent human beings.  If our Democracy went full Brisketopia, and Trumpism became entrenched and endured beyond Trump's time in office for an extended period, I would start to become very uneasy about the future world they would live in.  Basically, it would probably boil down to whether our current context is an anomaly and our democracy stabilizes after a power-shift back towards the middle.

I'm curious what others think, either in terms of how close we are edging to a real revolution or what it would take for you personally to seriously consider violence and bloodshed as the best solution to America's internal problems.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

We're gonna find out in less than 2 weeks. Keep an eye on the Georgia Governor race. If Kemp wins, things will get ugly. 

Here in Texas, I don't expect any physical bloodshed based on the Beto/Cruz results. But there will be a lot of angry people, and it won't dissipate like it has in the past (at least for the anti-Cruz people). 

Assuming Trump doesn't get impeached, the 2020 election is when the real riots/violence will happen. I will not partake. Exploring options for exit strategy with my family if Trump wins the election. 

 

 

[Cody2422 270]

Good luck trending back to the middle. This shit is a pendulum. It will end up back on the left at some point but it will be further left than Obama and about as left or further left as trump is right.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mdmost 42996]

It'll be fine. The hordes of MS-13 just looking to rape, torture, and kill will take them all out. 

[Goredho 17388]

12 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

We're gonna find out in less than 2 weeks. Keep an eye on the Georgia Governor race. If Kemp wins, things will get ugly. 

Here in Texas, I don't expect any physical bloodshed based on the Beto/Cruz results. But there will be a lot of angry people, and it won't dissipate like it has in the past (at least for the anti-Cruz people). 

Assuming Trump doesn't get impeached, the 2020 election is when the real riots/violence will happen. I will not partake. Exploring options for exit strategy with my family if Trump wins the election. 

  

 

Yeah, its funny, though.  The people I know professing to be close to the edge aren't talking about Cruz/Beto at all or just what happens in the state.  Its about the national scene and whether the dems take control of one or both houses as well as the balance of governorships that has them worried.  If the GOP slips from having total control of the national government, they are predicting doomsday and say they are ready to die in resistance to all the negative consequences of the GOP not having total control.

Agree about 2020, that's when I think you might see people on the other end of the spectrum reaching a similar point.

11 minutes ago, Cody2422 said:

Good luck trending back to the middle. This shit is a pendulum. It will end up back on the left at some point but it will be further left than Obama and about as left or further left as trump is right.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I definitely think there will be an overcorrection at some point, but stuff has to pass the middle before it can swing as far left as it currently is right.

Edited October 25, 2018 by Goredho

[gsoda3 3243]

i think you guys are crazy.  there won't be an armed uprising no matter what happens next week.  and anyone cheering for one is just as bad as the person explicitly asking for one.

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Just now, Goredho said:

Yeah, its funny, though.  The people I know professing to be close to the edge aren't talking about Cruz/Beto at all or just what happens in the state.  Its about the national scene and whether the dems take control of one or both houses as well as the balance of governorships that has them worried.  If the GOP loses total control of the national government, they are predicting doomsday and say they are ready to die in resistance to all the negative consequences of the GOP not having total control.

 

Well that's a bummer. My thoughts of revolt were if Republicans somehow keep control of the Senate AND the House 2 weeks from now. The left and anti-Trumpers will not just accept this country being under full GOP control for another 2 years, let alone any longer.  If we're to expect bloodshed from the Right if Dems take control of the House while GOP keeps the Senate, then we are truly fucked. 

 

 

[jimmyjazz 45836]

24 minutes ago, Goredho said:

For me, I've got young kids, so shit would have to get personally bad for us for me to risk them growing up sans padre.

I take the opposite tack, although only in the context of an actual civil war.  Short of that, I'll be a "once was a peacenik but am now hyper-aware".

Maybe the difference is that my youngest is 14, and all of them are pretty much fully cooked on how to take care of themselves.  That said, I still see it as my duty to stand up to anyone who would bring what I've always known is "USA" down, and it's not at all hard for me to imagine or accept the idea of dying for the cause so my kids have a decent shot at a future like I enjoyed growing up.

I honestly never thought I'd have this perspective.  I guess that's what happens when you grow up in an era of nothing but vague, somewhat existential threats that never truly come to fruition. 

[lemonlime 5503]

We're a terror attack away from bloodshed (beyond the attack).  We already hate each other.  Imagine what we'll be like with the power grid or food supply fucked with.

[Mole 4328]

I don’t expect any major violence but wouldn’t be surprised if we saw something like the political violence of the 60s.

[Goredho 17388]

2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Well that's a bummer. My thoughts of revolt were if Republicans somehow keep control of the Senate AND the House 2 weeks from now. The left and anti-Trumpers will not just accept this country being under full GOP control for another 2 years, let alone any longer.  If we're to expect bloodshed from the Right if Dems take control of the House while GOP keeps the Senate, then we are truly fucked. 

  

 

Its what I'm seeing in one corner of social media.  It will probably amount to nothing, but the degree to which these 5-6 otherwise normal people think the world ends without total GOP control is pretty disturbing.

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

We're gonna find out in less than 2 weeks. Keep an eye on the Georgia Governor race. If Kemp wins, things will get ugly. 

Here in Texas, I don't expect any physical bloodshed based on the Beto/Cruz results. But there will be a lot of angry people, and it won't dissipate like it has in the past (at least for the anti-Cruz people). 

Assuming Trump doesn't get impeached, the 2020 election is when the real riots/violence will happen. I will not partake. Exploring options for exit strategy with my family if Trump wins the election. 

 

 

Why do you say this? 

I've been, for the last 10 days, in West Midtown, Buckhead, Sandy Springs, Roswell, Dunwoody, Duluth and Buford (Gwinnet) and have asked people how they feel about things. The only people I've heard love Abrams were the two uber drivers I had in Midtown and near State Farm Arena. Everyone else mentioned Kemp has hilarious ads that mimic Adult Swim which is a cult thing here and in a softshoe way they pretended to be waffling about who to vote for before comfortably tipping their hands. What I mean is, nobody I've seen or spoken to is full on POLITICAL VIOLENCE! mode and there is no passion I'm witnessing and definitely not seeing any "A Vote for Kemp is a vote for America!" white nationalism. It also feels like the voter suppression stuff is out of the news cycle out here and it's not a hot button thing.

Then again, these are all real life interactions which are more muted than the bullhorn of social media/surly hysterics.

Edited October 25, 2018 by Guest

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

Just now, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

Why do you say this? 

I've been, for the last 10 days, in West Midtown, Buckhead, Sandy Springs, Roswell, Dunwoody, Duluth and Buford (Gwinnet) and have asked people how they feel about things. The only people I've heard love Abrams were the two uber drivers I had in Midtown and near State Farm Arena. Everyone else mentioned Kemp has hilarious ads that mimic Adult Swim which is a cult thing here and in a softshoe way they pretended to be waffling about who to vote for before comfortably tipping their hands. What I mean is, nobody I've seen or spoken to is full on POLITICAL VIOLENCE! mode and there is no passion I'm witnessing and definitely not seeing any "A Vote for Kemp is a vote for America!" white nationalism.

Are you aware at all of the voter suppression tactics taking place?

 

[Guest]

Just now, Hank Kingsley said:

Are you aware at all of the voter suppression tactics taking place?

 

Sorry I edited too late. Yes, aware. Even asked about it. 

It also feels like the voter suppression stuff is out of the news cycle out here and it's not a hot button thing.

Then again, these are all real life interactions which are more muted than the bullhorn of social media/surly hysterics.

Edited October 25, 2018 by Guest

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

1 minute ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

Sorry I edited too late. Yes, aware. Even asked about it. 

It also feels like the voter suppression stuff is out of the news cycle out here and it's not a hot button thing.

Then again, these are all real life interactions which are more muted than the bullhorn of social media/surly hysterics.

Well, you mentioned that only 2 people you encountered like Abrams.  The actual race is neck and neck, so there are a ton of Abrams supporters you're not interacting with apparently. And the voter suppression by Kemp is ALL OVER THE NEWS.  If Kemp wins, the anger will be very real. 

 

[High Plains Drifter 11018]

Remember, it was the election of Lincoln that was the straw that led to S. Carolina seceding.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Well, you mentioned that only 2 people you encountered like Abrams.  The actual race is neck and neck, so there are a ton of Abrams supporters you're not interacting with apparently. And the voter suppression by Kemp is ALL OVER THE NEWS.  If Kemp wins, the anger will be very real. 

 

Which news, I guess. Every TV in every hotel and conference room I've seen is BOMBPALOOZA 2018 the last 48 hours and has definitely drowned out, but I did go to the Hawks season opener last night against the Mavs and I bet if I asked some people in that State Farm Arena I would hear some Abrams support-- because this city more than any other I've been to seems racially divided (and even geographically racially divided North and South, like Dallas).

Edited October 25, 2018 by Guest

[Hank Kingsley 20900]

The Georgia NAACP recently filed a complaint that during early voting that some machines are not properly registering votes for Abrams and instead check the box for Kemp. 

And the racial divide you mentioned is PRECISELY why things could get ugly. Kemp is predominantly suppressing the African-American vote.  When you fuck with people's right to vote, don't be surprised if they just won't sit there and take it. 

 

[formermav43 4606]

Nothing would make me take up arms.

[David Dennison 18826]

18 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

Remember, it was the election of Lincoln that was the straw that led to S. Carolina seceding.

As much as I would love to see a state attempt secession, I have no doubt that the United States military would nip it in the bud with a quickness that would shock most Americans.

[housious 468]

Everyone will settle down once the new season of the bachelorette starts.

[staboner 4969]

35 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

We're a terror attack away from bloodshed (beyond the attack).  We already hate each other.  Imagine what we'll be like with the power grid or food supply fucked with.

yep. 

or cyber attack by a country. or you name it. 

not only do we hate each other but we can't communicate at all. we broken. its pretty scary. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

1 hour ago, Goredho said:

My FB feed is full of people I grew up with in West Texas predicting bloodshed if the dems "seize control" with the midterm results.  They seem resigned to some loss of GOP control, and are prodding each other into escalating levels of anger and rage over the loss of the 2nd amendment and the hordes of MS-13 members that will be streaming across the border to rape, murder and pillage.  Given that, lock her up, Charlottesville, the softball shooting and now mail bombs, It got me contemplating how close we might be to a real uprising and what it would personally take for me to get to the where I am willing to take up arms against other Americans.

I don't think we are close to some organized revolution, but I do think the context is in place for the ignition of a chain of violent events.  Most of these people preaching armed resistance are intardnet tough guys that won't act, but it takes only a small fraction to be worked up into enough of a frenzy to kick some crazy shit off.  We've already seen it happen with police shootings, corresponding riots and the cop killings in Dallas, LA, etc...

For me, I've got young kids, so shit would have to get personally bad for us for me to risk them growing up sans padre.  Our daily life would need to be impacted, or their future to become so dark that it would trump my responsibility to shepherd them into adulthood as decent human beings.  If our Democracy went full Brisketopia, and Trumpism became entrenched and endured beyond Trump's time in office for an extended period, I would start to become very uneasy about the future world they would live in.  Basically, it would probably boil down to whether our current context is an anomaly and our democracy stabilizes after a power-shift back towards the middle.

I'm curious what others think, either in terms of how close we are edging to a real revolution or what it would take for you personally to seriously consider violence and bloodshed as the best solution to America's internal problems.

We’re not going to have an organized armed uprising because they’re all cowards and no one wants to lead anything like that.

However, due to the lack of leadership, we will have a shitload more shootings and bombings because of all the hate rhetoric floating around to vulnerable/extremist segments of the population on the internet and elsewhere. 

Ive kinda been saying this for a year.

It’s going to suck for the next 20 years regardless of what happens in an election. 

Personally I’d prefer a massive organized peaceful protest with clear objectives as opposed to violence. 

[F250 28757]

Eh, the MAGA crowd won't do shit. I'm sure there will still be crazies but those types (McVeigh) have always been with us.

 

[mdmost 42996]

Well and even before the MS-13 hordes come through raping, torturing, and controlling, the caravan of illegals will just mow down everything in their path. Think of them like a Central American version of The Nothing from The Neverending Story.

Edited October 25, 2018 by mdmost

[David Dennison 18826]

1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

We’re not going to have an organized armed uprising because they’re all cowards and no one wants to lead anything like that.

However, due to the lack of leadership, we will have a shitload more shootings and bombings because of all the hate rhetoric floating around to vulnerable/extremist segments of the population on the internet and elsewhere. 

Ive kinda been saying this for a year.

It’s going to suck for the next 20 years regardless of what happens in an election. 

Personally I’d prefer a massive organized peaceful protest with clear objectives as opposed to violence. 

It's sucked for a long time. Oklahoma City was 23 years ago. School shootings became routine 20 years ago. This country accepts mass gun violence as normal.

This country has been broken since the 60s.

[F250 28757]

Just now, mdmost said:

Well and even before the MS-13 hordes come through raping, torturing, and controlling, the caravan of illegals will just mow down everything in their path.

The Trans community gets mop up duty when people start seeking refuge in bathrooms.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

It's sucked for a long time. Oklahoma City was 23 years ago. School shootings became routine 20 years ago. This country accepts mass gun violence as normal.

This country has been broken since the 60s.

You have no idea how much worse it can get. 

[David Dennison 18826]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

You have no idea how much worse it can get. 

Of course I do. 

But I'm white. Odds are it won't be all that bad.

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

We’re not going to have an organized armed uprising because they’re all cowards and no one wants to lead anything like that.

However, due to the lack of leadership, we will have a shitload more shootings and bombings because of all the hate rhetoric floating around to vulnerable/extremist segments of the population on the internet and elsewhere. 

Ive kinda been saying this for a year.

It’s going to suck for the next 20 years regardless of what happens in an election. 

Personally I’d prefer a massive organized peaceful protest with clear objectives as opposed to violence. 

I agree with all of this except it’s not gonna take 20 years. We’ve got about 6-7 more years of this nonsense. Maybe less. 

[irishtexan 11479]

1 hour ago, Goredho said:

My FB feed is full of people I grew up with in West Texas predicting bloodshed if the dems "seize control" with the midterm results.  They seem resigned to some loss of GOP control, and are prodding each other into escalating levels of anger and rage over the loss of the 2nd amendment and the hordes of MS-13 members that will be streaming across the border to rape, murder and pillage.  Given that, lock her up, Charlottesville, the softball shooting and now mail bombs, It got me contemplating how close we might be to a real uprising and what it would personally take for me to get to the where I am willing to take up arms against other Americans.

I don't think we are close to some organized revolution, but I do think the context is in place for the ignition of a chain of violent events.  Most of these people preaching armed resistance are intardnet tough guys that won't act, but it takes only a small fraction to be worked up into enough of a frenzy to kick some crazy shit off.  We've already seen it happen with police shootings, corresponding riots and the cop killings in Dallas, LA, etc...

For me, I've got young kids, so shit would have to get personally bad for us for me to risk them growing up sans padre.  Our daily life would need to be impacted, or their future to become so dark that it would trump my responsibility to shepherd them into adulthood as decent human beings.  If our Democracy went full Brisketopia, and Trumpism became entrenched and endured beyond Trump's time in office for an extended period, I would start to become very uneasy about the future world they would live in.  Basically, it would probably boil down to whether our current context is an anomaly and our democracy stabilizes after a power-shift back towards the middle.

I'm curious what others think, either in terms of how close we are edging to a real revolution or what it would take for you personally to seriously consider violence and bloodshed as the best solution to America's internal problems.

While you, sir, seem like a thoughtful and reasonable man, the people you grew up with are enormous fucking pussies. 

[bad_teammate 13183]

lol calm down jeez

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Of course I do. 

But I'm white. Odds are it won't be all that bad.

The political battlefield is completely different than it was in the 60s.  We’re nowhere near 1968 bad but with the weapons freely available technologically, it could easily get worse.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

9 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

I agree with all of this except it’s not gonna take 20 years. We’ve got about 6-7 more years of this nonsense. Maybe less. 

6-7 years where it’s right in our face everyday but the consequences of the nihilism will echo on for a generation. 

[workswithseed 2077]

1 hour ago, gsoda3 said:

i think you guys are crazy.  there won't be an armed uprising no matter what happens next week.  and anyone cheering for one is just as bad as the person explicitly asking for one.

It isn't as exciting if there is no consequences.

[lemonlime 5503]

22 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

 

This country has been broken since the 60s.

Yeah, I guess if you're a white, straight, Christian man that's true.   I don't think many people who are black, or gay, or trans would want to go back.

[David Dennison 18826]

Just now, lemonlime said:

Yeah, I guess if you're a white, straight, Christian man that's true.   I don't think many people who are black, or gay, or trans would want to go back.

White people are the ruling ethnic group, so yeah.

[Sbbruin 21811]

1 hour ago, gsoda3 said:

i think you guys are crazy.  there won't be an armed uprising no matter what happens next week.  and anyone cheering for one is just as bad as the person explicitly asking for one.

This.  Maybe it's a Texas/South thing, but that armed uprisings are not part of the national discourse.

[Pancho 44658]

Cross posting this here too??

 

[RPM 26308]

This armed uprising by the "conservatives" is a frequent narrative when they see themselves losing power, so they have to fearmonger and schoolyard boast about how tough they are.

 

[BLKNSTY 289]

I don’t think there’s any doubt a civil war is on the horizon.

Everyone saying that the 60s were a crazier time, I don’t buy it. there’s one, fairly important, difference.

SOCIAL MEDIA.

There’s a reason why they take fbook, etc. offline prior to elections in third-world countries. People, as a whole, are fucking retarded and extremely susceptible to believing something just because it jives well with how they “think”.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

3 hours ago, Hank Kingsley said:

We're gonna find out in less than 2 weeks. Keep an eye on the Georgia Governor race. If Kemp wins, things will get ugly. 

Here in Texas, I don't expect any physical bloodshed based on the Beto/Cruz results. But there will be a lot of angry people, and it won't dissipate like it has in the past (at least for the anti-Cruz people). 

Assuming Trump doesn't get impeached, the 2020 election is when the real riots/violence will happen. I will not partake. Exploring options for exit strategy with my family if Trump wins the election. 

 

 

You should check out Haifa, Israel as a landing spot. Isn’t that where the Baha’i temple is? I’m sure you’re not a fan of Netanyahu though.

[Biff Tannen 45651]

I don’t think there’s any doubt a civil war is on the horizon.

Everyone saying that the 60s were a crazier time, I don’t buy it. there’s one, fairly important, difference.

SOCIAL MEDIA.

There’s a reason why they take fbook, etc. offline prior to elections in third-world countries. People, as a whole, are fucking retarded and extremely susceptible to believing something just because it jives well with how they “think”.

This. We've never had a force like social media that can not only reinforce false beliefs and completely make shit up to rile people, but also do it instantly and infinitely.

[Biff Tannen 45651]

Well and even before the MS-13 hordes come through raping, torturing, and controlling, the caravan of illegals will just mow down everything in their path. Think of them like a Central American version of The Nothing from The Neverending Story.

So would Soros be Gmork?

[lemonlime 5503]

3 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

 

This. We've never had a force like social media that can not only reinforce false beliefs and completely make shit up to rile people, but also do it instantly and infinitely.

 

There was also a lot more to be angry with each other about in the 60s--- Vietnam, segregation, etc.  Now, we're living in peace and prosperity, and the federal government, with some help from Putin,  is actively getting us to hate each other.

[David Dennison 18826]

Just now, lemonlime said:

There was also a lot more to be angry with each other about in the 60s--- Vietnam, segregation, etc.  Now, we're living in peace and prosperity, and the federal government, with some help from Putin,  is actively getting us to hate each other.

Peace and prosperity for some. That's important to remember.

[lemonlime 5503]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Peace and prosperity for some. That's important to remember.

True.  It will always be true.  But in relation to the 60s, which was my point of comparison, we're at full employment, there's no draft with tens of thousands of young men being sent to their deaths, at least purportedly institutional segregation is over (not saying it is in actuality).   And we're still collectively riled up.

[RDCanecutter 26376]

There'll be a civil war, but the tactics will change. Instead of explosions, entrenchments, wire bullet and grenade, it will be dispersed groups of immobile obese people thumb-insulting each other furiously on their devices. There will be deaths, many deaths, whether from stroking out due to poor health or words hurting just a tad too much. The storm... the storm is coming.

[Goredho 17388]

Just now, lemonlime said:

True.  It will always be true.  But in relation to the 60s, which was my point of comparison, we're at full employment, there's no draft with tens of thousands of young men being sent to their deaths, at least purportedly institutional segregation is over (not saying it is in actuality).   And we're still collectively riled up.

So you are saying "First world problems?"  Or maybe more accurately "Lone Superpower Problems?"

[RPM 26308]

We have social media now, but the 60's had the draft. You want a social motivator? Crank up the draft again. Attitudes will change.