Caravan

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 minute ago, lemonlime said:

If anyone should have white guilt it's the people who run Auschwitz. I sure hope they have some.

I didn't know it was still operating.  

 

You should have some guilt for even trying to foist your BS attempt to link the events of then to today.

[wildcat09 29213]

1 hour ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Shut the hell up you ignorant troll.  Trying to make some bizarre connection to the atrocities of WWII and the Nazi regime to firing tear gas at people trying to break thru a border station is disgustingly insulting to the people who lived and died as a result of that horrendous period of time.  You obviously know jack fucking shit about it.  

The people working those crossing are people who have families, and shooting canisters of an eye irritant in the vicinity of people rushing  a closed border crossing is a pretty low level act given what could have occurred if actual physical contact between armed guards and people attacking them had taken place

The Auschwitz Memorial is a troll?

[Captainant 27403]

No idea why a historically notable prison camp for a marginalized social group would be making comparison to a modern prison camp for a marginalized social group where people have been getting sexually assaulted and beaten and forcibly separated from their parents and systemically moved to make it more difficult for those people to even know where they are. 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I didn't know it was still operating.  

 

You should have some guilt for even trying to foist your BS attempt to link the events of then to today.

The memorial itself made the link between then and today.  He just posted their tweet.  Why don't you go take it up with them?

[FondrenRoad 4378]

14 minutes ago, tjhooker said:

I'd say the person running their Twitter account is potentially trolling if they're trying to make any connection to the holocaust and tear gassing people trying to storm our border.  

They are saying that it didn't start with the holocaust, dumbass.  And it didn't.  There was a slow erosion of rights for a decade.  

Its stupid people like you who believe Nazis started exterminating people on day 1, and that all German voters signed up to do it directly.  People point out parallels between now and then because those parallels actually exist. 

Call people inhuman > Treat people as inhuman > Exclude those you feel are inhuman > Exterminate those you feel are inhuman.

It takes a long time to go down that road, even for the Nazis.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

23 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

The memorial itself made the link between then and today.  He just posted their tweet.  Why don't you go take it up with them?

Anyone comparing what's going on today with Nazi Germany is wrong, and it's an insult to the people who suffered through that tragedy. 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

3 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Anyone comparing what's going on today with Nazi Germany is wrong, and it's an insult to the people who suffered through that tragedy. 

How long do you believe Nazi Germany lasted?  Do you believe it was worse at the beginning of Nazi Germany or at the end of it?

[Captainant 27403]

10 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Anyone comparing what's going on today with Nazi Germany is wrong, and it's an insult to the people who suffered through that tragedy. 

I mean, trump has advocated for a method to revoke citizenship of Hispanic people because they "may be dangerous". That's straight out of the Nazi playbook. Dehumanize, disenfranchise, strip citizenship, cleanse.

There's been a mountain of people who actually suffered through the Holocaust yelling warning signs and your reaction is to ignore them. Take a look at the fucking mirror. Trump is using the fascists playbook

[hayden_horn 11360]

4 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Anyone comparing what's going on today with Nazi Germany is wrong, and it's an insult to the people who suffered through that tragedy. 

here's the thing. 

i don't think anyone here thinks that we are on our way to death camps like auschwitz. i've been to auschwitz. i've been to dachau. those are truly sobering places. that humankind found itself in a situation where people were being fucking gassed and cremated and having their ashes dumped into a pond that remains gray to this day is horrifying.

but they say the key to not repeating history is understanding it. how it happened. how did people turn into such villains? honestly, most nazis were not psychopaths. those at the top certainly were, and certain select ones found their niche in the death camps, but most of those germans were just germans who were led off the cliff by a pied piper.

now, let's start with the assumption that our endpoint won't be nazi death camps.

do you not think we shouldn't understand the baby steps that led to that atrocity? because death camps were not the only nazi atrocity, though they are the most remembered. 

that's the point of the auschwitz tweet. 

also, let's also not forget, auschwitz is in poland. the PiS in poland is a conservative, nationalistic party.

just because we believe in american exceptionalism doesn't mean every tweet in english is about us.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-poland-politics-election/polands-ruling-eurosceptics-score-modest-gains-in-local-vote-lose-warsaw-idUSKCN1MU0XA

Quote

WARSAW (Reuters) - Poland’s ruling eurosceptic Law and Justice (PiS) scored limited gains in regional government in Sunday’s election, but lost a high-profile race for Warsaw mayor, an exit poll showed, laying bare divisions in Poland over the party’s democracy record.

Since sweeping into power in 2015, PiS has remained broadly popular, benefiting from voter-pleasing welfare reforms, nationalist rhetoric and strong economic growth.

But critics at home and abroad have accused it of a tilt toward authoritarian rule after moves to increase government control over the judiciary and public media that have also fueled Poland’s isolation within the European Union.

though i will say the fact that some of yall are so sensitive about the comparisons concerns me that they are remotely accurate. 

[Captainant 27403]

6 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

though i will say the fact that some of yall are so sensitive about the comparisons concerns me that they are remotely accurate. 

A hit dog will holler. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

51 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

They are saying that it didn't start with the holocaust, dumbass.  And it didn't.  There was a slow erosion of rights for a decade.  

Its stupid people like you who believe Nazis started exterminating people on day 1, and that all German voters signed up to do it directly.  People point out parallels between now and then because those parallels actually exist. 

Call people inhuman > Treat people as inhuman > Exclude those you feel are inhuman > Exterminate those you feel are inhuman.

It takes a long time to go down that road, even for the Nazis.

And we're not going down the road of Nazi Germany. stop with the lame ass comparisons.  We will not become Nazi Germany.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

Just now, tjhooker said:

It is a fucking stupid correlation to bring up.  Did they tweet that out when Syrians were going through much much worse trying to actually escape a tyrant?  I'd guess not.  It is intellectually dishonest to infer this situation at all resembles anything in Nazi Germany.  Ilit is all political hyperbole. In fact, it was the opposite.  People were trying to flee and the Nazis were trying to keep them in.  I can't believe I am even to explain this to a bunch of loose border liberals.

Incorrect.  In the beginnings of Nazi Germany, the Nazis encouraged Jewish emigration.  Hitler took power in 1933.  They encouraged Jewish emigration for the first 8 years of their rule.

Again, the stupid people are those like you who believe Nazi Germany were always as bad as they could possibly be, and remained consistently terrible for the whole time.  Instead, they, like Trumpism, started bad and gradually became worse.  Do I think Trumpism gets to the death camp phase?  No.  But only because they have 0 control over information spread while the Nazis were able to lock down information.  They'd absolutely kill people at the border if they could keep it off the news though.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/german-jewish-refugees-1933-1939

"Until October 1941, German policy officially encouraged Jewish emigration. Gradually, however, the Nazis sought to deprive Jews fleeing Germany of their property by levying an increasingly heavy emigration tax and by restricting the amount of money that could be transferred abroad from German banks."

 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

16 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

here's the thing. 

i don't think anyone here thinks that we are on our way to death camps like auschwitz. i've been to auschwitz. i've been to dachau. those are truly sobering places. that humankind found itself in a situation where people were being fucking gassed and cremated and having their ashes dumped into a pond that remains gray to this day is horrifying.

but they say the key to not repeating history is understanding it. how it happened. how did people turn into such villains? honestly, most nazis were not psychopaths. those at the top certainly were, and certain select ones found their niche in the death camps, but most of those germans were just germans who were led off the cliff by a pied piper.

now, let's start with the assumption that our endpoint won't be nazi death camps.

do you not think we shouldn't understand the baby steps that led to that atrocity? because death camps were not the only nazi atrocity, though they are the most remembered. 

that's the point of the auschwitz tweet. 

also, let's also not forget, auschwitz is in poland. the PiS in poland is a conservative, nationalistic party.

just because we believe in american exceptionalism doesn't mean every tweet in english is about us.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-poland-politics-election/polands-ruling-eurosceptics-score-modest-gains-in-local-vote-lose-warsaw-idUSKCN1MU0XA

though i will say the fact that some of yall are so sensitive about the comparisons concerns me that they are remotely accurate. 

No, no they're not. And as I've already stated it's insulting to the memory of what those folks went thru to comparing it to a border gate attack, and the use of non lethal force, exactly as the Obama admin. did.  Anyone here call them Nazis  ?  I highly doubt it.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Incorrect.  In the beginnings of Nazi Germany, the Nazis encouraged Jewish emigration.  Hitler took power in 1933.  They encouraged Jewish emigration for the first 8 years of their rule.

Again, the stupid people are those like you who believe Nazi Germany were always as bad as they could possibly be, and remained consistently terrible for the whole time.  Instead, they, like Trumpism, started bad and gradually became worse.  Do I think Trumpism gets to the death camp phase?  No.  But only because they have 0 control over information spread while the Nazis were able to lock down information.  They'd absolutely kill people at the border if they could keep it off the news though.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/german-jewish-refugees-1933-1939

"Until October 1941, German policy officially encouraged Jewish emigration. Gradually, however, the Nazis sought to deprive Jews fleeing Germany of their property by levying an increasingly heavy emigration tax and by restricting the amount of money that could be transferred abroad from German banks."

 

More unrelated and non relevant words, but keep it up man.  Were you calling out the Obama admin for the same use of pepper spray and or tear gas ?

[FondrenRoad 4378]

3 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

And we're not going down the road of Nazi Germany. stop with the lame ass comparisons.  We will not become Nazi Germany.

We won't.  The press and the left are vigilant.  So even though you're a lazy old fuck who wouldn't give a shit either way, we're going to save this country for you.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

More unrelated and non relevant words, but keep it up man.  Were you calling out the Obama admin for the same use of pepper spray and or tear gas ?

Yes. And I'm calling you out for supporting the tactic in both cases.

[hayden_horn 11360]

15 minutes ago, tjhooker said:

It is a fucking stupid correlation to bring up.  Did they tweet that out when Syrians were going through much much worse trying to actually escape a tyrant?  I'd guess not.  It is intellectually dishonest to infer this situation at all resembles anything in Nazi Germany.  Ilit is all political hyperbole. In fact, it was the opposite.  People were trying to flee and the Nazis were trying to keep them in.  I can't believe I am even to explain this to a bunch of loose border liberals.

loose border liberals.

you've tipped your hand, mr both sides.

and it isn't hyperbole. there are parallels. they are never going to be exact. and we will very likely never end up at death camps. at least, i don't believe so. 

but this is sort of like being in a crowd that's on the edge of getting ugly. we've all been there. i remember the mardi gras riot here in austin in i think 2001. you got a sense of electricity going through the air. the cops were spoiling for a fight. they were clearly fucking sick and tired of policing mardi gras. they were looking for a reason to shut this thing down. 

and they did just that. the problem became when it became apparent to the gathered crowd the cops had an inherent hostility. then the crowd came in with a massive fuck you and we ended up with a situation that it's hard to believe ever happened in austin, texas. it was a full on riot. police waded into the crowd of mostly onlookers and just started wantonly beating people about the head and shoulders. they sprayed pepper spray indiscriminately. it really felt like we were under attack from the police. and most of us hadn't done anything to warrant such a reaction.

to this day, if i'm in a crowd, i keep an eye out for the warning signals i saw that night in austin. just because it is very unlikely to happen again doesn't mean i did not learn from what happened that night. this is kind of like that. if i even get a whiff of that vibe, i peace out, even if it is unlikely to blossom into the chaos of that night.

Edited November 27, 2018 by hayden_horn

[staboner 4956]

3 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Shut the hell up you ignorant troll.  Trying to make some bizarre connection to the atrocities of WWII and the Nazi regime to firing tear gas at people trying to break thru a border station is disgustingly insulting to the people who lived and died as a result of that horrendous period of time.  You obviously know jack fucking shit about it.  

The people working those crossing are people who have families, and shooting canisters of an eye irritant in the vicinity of people rushing  a closed border crossing is a pretty low level act given what could have occurred if actual physical contact between armed guards and people attacking them had taken place

nah man. its ok. it can be same same, and still different. 

i tend to agree that you never go full nazi

however the sentiment is of course spot on. trying speaking to that. thats the fucking point man. you are going full American here IMO. you can't connect the current current with the final outcomes others experienced at a different time. auschwitter is trying to help you get that. 

here is a good song from a great album

 

[wildcat09 29213]

22 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

And we're not going down the road of Nazi Germany. stop with the lame ass comparisons.  We will not become Nazi Germany.

If we don’t it will be because of the people like us pointing out the similarities and warning us off the path, not the people like you mirroring every step the Nazis took while pretending there’s no way it could ever ever happen.

[Nivek 16843]

Well, you see, the vast majority of conservatives are white Christians.  But they only give a shit about other white Christians, so they run around saying awful shit like what you just said.  So I mocked you a little bit.  Forgive me.

Vast majority of Christians are not very Christian. IME.

[hayden_horn 11360]

1 minute ago, tjhooker said:

Actually, I said that earlier.  Are we sure this is even about our border crisis?  Also, I am having a huge issue with all the coverage of this because it wasnt like this at all when in 2013 we were pepper spraying illegal migrants trying to mob force their way into the country.  Where was all this outrage then?

so the problem is with the rhetoric. i can't believe i have to even explain the difference. the situation in 2013 was unfortunate, but it was on us soil.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sdut-border-patrol-rock-throwing-san-ysidro-2013nov25-story,amp.html?__twitter_impression=true

Quote

The incident raises questions again about how Border Patrol responds in such situations and if it adheres to its use-of-force policies. The agency has not released its policies despite numerous requests to do so after several high profile deaths.

“Because of the growing instances in which Border Patrol has been involved in this sort of use-of-force that it’s important for the agency to be transparent,” Ramirez said. “To report to the public exactly what went on and to report what weapons were used.”

Advocates acknowledge the restraint agents used under the circumstances but they still have concerns given the agency’s recent decision to continue to use deadly force against rock throwers. This despite an outside review that recommended the agency rethink that approach.

and that part of the article looks an awful like criticism. 

but i return to the problem of the rhetoric deployed. donald trump has spent a significant amount of his presidency casting these asylum seekers (or migrants, i'll even grant that some of these folks might not be bona fide asylum seekers) as lawless criminals. it's the dangerous dog-whistling rhetoric that he uses that brings the comparisons that were not there during the obama administration. i want to take a moment and note that obama's immigration policy was crap. however, he never used words like "rapists." i'm not going to catalog every trump dog whistle about the migrant caravan. you know they are there. we all know.

when you couple that with his nationalistic attitude, his animosity toward the press, you start to see an emerging authoritarian pattern that is concerning.

if he wasn't such a cartoon character, it might even be seriously dangerous, which is why we need to talk about it before we get a real deal chavez or duterte, who can do some real fucking damage to our democracy.

and, again, i feel compelled to highlight how we've intentionally created this situation. people are forced to wait at the border to be processed, for long periods of time as we have intentionally slowed down the process. 

why do you think we have done that?

hint: it's the same reason that cops started that riot on sixth street. when you have all the power and a pre-determined outcome in mind, you can force the issue on mostly helpless people and drive them over the edge. then you can close the border, cancel mardi gras or whatever you want.

this is our concern, dude.

[lemonlime 5503]

4 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

 

but i return to the problem of the rhetoric deployed. donald trump has spent a significant amount of his presidency casting these asylum seekers (or migrants, i'll even grant that some of these folks might not be bona fide asylum seekers) as lawless criminals. it's the dangerous dog-whistling rhetoric that he uses that brings the comparisons that were not there during the obama administration. i want to take a moment and note that obama's immigration policy was crap. however, he never used words like "rapists." i'm not going to catalog every trump dog whistle about the migrant caravan. you know they are there. we all know.

when you couple that with his nationalistic attitude, his animosity toward the press, you start to see an emerging authoritarian pattern that is concerning.

 

A million times this. Trump's supporters find justification for each thing he does as though, each thing he says or does happens in a vacuum.  They then go through contortions to justify the single action, as though the rest of Trump's behavior doesn't exist.  It's not just sending tear gas over the border, however bad that is (and with whatever excuses trump supporters can dredge up).  it's doing that after years of dehumanizing people with brown skin. 

 

It's doing that after sending troops to the border in an election stunt.  It's doing that after calling Mexicans rapists.  It's doing that after saying that Judge Curiel can't fairly judge Trump based on the color of skin.  After calling hispanic immigrants "animals."  After the shithole country comments.  After hyping MS-13 as the biggest problem facing the country.  After separating thousands of young children from their parents.  After raping and abusing some (many?) of the people imprisoned by border patrol.  After throwing paper towels at brown Puerto Ricans and leaving them without power for months.   

[DixonHur 11154]

56 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Incorrect.  In the beginnings of Nazi Germany, the Nazis encouraged Jewish emigration.  Hitler took power in 1933.  They encouraged Jewish emigration for the first 8 years of their rule.

Again, the stupid people are those like you who believe Nazi Germany were always as bad as they could possibly be, and remained consistently terrible for the whole time.  Instead, they, like Trumpism, started bad and gradually became worse.  Do I think Trumpism gets to the death camp phase?  No.  But only because they have 0 control over information spread while the Nazis were able to lock down information.  They'd absolutely kill people at the border if they could keep it off the news though.

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/german-jewish-refugees-1933-1939

"Until October 1941, German policy officially encouraged Jewish emigration. Gradually, however, the Nazis sought to deprive Jews fleeing Germany of their property by levying an increasingly heavy emigration tax and by restricting the amount of money that could be transferred abroad from German banks."

 

I think we can draw a pretty distinct line between the forced emigration of citizens and stopping people from illegally entering the country.  But, hey, maybe that's just me.

[Smax 3800]

1 hour ago, Captainant said:

I mean, trump has advocated for a method to revoke citizenship of Hispanic people because they "may be dangerous". That's straight out of the Nazi playbook. Dehumanize, disenfranchise, strip citizenship, cleanse.

There's been a mountain of people who actually suffered through the Holocaust yelling warning signs and your reaction is to ignore them. Take a look at the fucking mirror. Trump is using the fascists playbook

 

 

this is hilariously sad

[Smax 3800]

1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

If we don’t it will be because of the people like us pointing out the similarities and warning us off the path, not the people like you mirroring every step the Nazis took while pretending there’s no way it could ever ever happen.

I'm literally rofl at you thinking this is remotely true, the left always needs a boogie man why not toss out the nazi hitler comparison like you did with bush

Edited November 27, 2018 by Smax

[Captainant 27403]

2 minutes ago, Smax said:

this is hilariously sad

Please, lay out for me where I'm not using facts and historical precedent to make my claims and predictions, and what is hilariously sad. Please explain it to me in detail and not low-effort shitposts.

[Smax 3800]

1 minute ago, Captainant said:

Please, lay out for me where I'm not using facts and historical precedent to make my claims and predictions, and what is hilariously sad. Please explain it to me in detail and not low-effort shitposts.

the entire premise that trump is  nazi and wants to take the US down that road

 

protect your border against an illegal invasion of people is nothing like rounding up your citizens and killing them in an attempt to exterminate an entire religion from the face of the earth

[wildcat09 29213]

2 minutes ago, Smax said:

I'm literally rofl at you thinking this is remotely true, the left always needs a boogie man why not toss out the nazi hitler comparison like you did with bush

The Bush administration based it's "enhanced interrogation" techniques on Nazi torture techniques, so this is probably not really the comparison you want to make.

[Smax 3800]

Just now, wildcat09 said:

The Bush administration based it's "enhanced interrogation" techniques on Nazi torture techniques, so this is probably not really the comparison you want to make.

yes it is as the US army used water boarding long before ol adolf came to power

[Captainant 27403]

Just now, Smax said:

the entire premise that trump is  nazi and wants to take the US down that road

protect your border against an illegal invasion of people is nothing like rounding up your citizens and killing them in an attempt to exterminate an entire religion from the face of the earth

That's not the premise. The premise is that Trump has authoritarian tendencies and has no moral or ethical compass to protect we the people from his hamfisted and spiteful policies. Part of the trouble is that trump is empowering those who DO want nazism and facism to return. He called nazis, that not even 24 hours prior killed someone, very fine people for fucks sake.

When you see similar patterns between one tyrannical leader and your leader, it's your fucking civic duty to call out those atrocities, not defend them and call people "loose border libs". 

I also take issue with your phrase of "invasion". 500 (give or take) people stormed the border over the weekend, and Mexico has been deporting the people who did it. This is not an invasion, which implies an armed force from an opposing power. You are echoing that rhetoric that purposely mis-states what they want and who they are, for the sake of using harsher methods of dealing with them.

How in the fuck is that not a problem?

[Brisketexan 104537]

Quote

Anyone comparing what's going on today with Nazi Germany is wrong, and it's an insult to the people who suffered through that tragedy. 

 

Hmmmm.....why are people concerned about a political movement that broadly dehumanizes and demonizes the other?

Because these:

 

Often start from these:

 

The time to put out the fire is in the second picture.  Arguing that "the first picture hasn't happened, why are you concerned about the lit matches being tossed into dry grass" is folly.

I live near a greenbelt.  If I see you tossing lit matches around, I"m going to put out the fire right away, and kick your ass.  I'm not going to wait until my house burns down to take steps.

The people who lived through one of the greatest forest fires ever are telling us over and over, "this is exactly how the fire started back then."  Only idiots would ignore them.  Or people who actually WANT that fire to burn.  Which are you?

Edited November 27, 2018 by Brisketexan

[Celery Man 20881]

the Nazis were just protecting their country against the Jewish invaders who sold out the smart and good German workers and veterans

[Kyle 207]

I hate to break up the national socialist emoting, but serious question ... why don't they accept Mexico's offer of asylum? That feels like a win-win?

[Smax 3800]

 

27 minutes ago, Captainant said:

That's not the premise. The premise is that Trump has authoritarian tendencies and has no moral or ethical compass to protect we the people from his hamfisted and spiteful policies. Part of the trouble is that trump is empowering those who DO want nazism and facism to return. He called nazis, that not even 24 hours prior killed someone, very fine people for fucks sake.

When you see similar patterns between one tyrannical leader and your leader, it's your fucking civic duty to call out those atrocities, not defend them and call people "loose border libs". 

I also take issue with your phrase of "invasion". 500 (give or take) people stormed the border over the weekend, and Mexico has been deporting the people who did it. This is not an invasion, which implies an armed force from an opposing power. You are echoing that rhetoric that purposely mis-states what they want and who they are, for the sake of using harsher methods of dealing with them.

How in the fuck is that not a problem?

 

I take issue with you only saying 500 or so people rushing the border when there are 8000 there right now and roughly 20+ million already in this county illegally.

I take issue with you, the left, the media trying to confuse and numb the American mind by switching around the term immigrant and illegal alien, talk about mis-stating rhetoric

Its not a fucking problem because unwelcome immigration is an invasion

 

21 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

 

Hmmmm.....why are people concerned about a political movement that broadly dehumanizes and demonizes the other?

Because these:

 

Often start from these:

 

The time to put out the fire is in the second picture.  Arguing that "the first picture hasn't happened, why are you concerned about the lit matches being tossed into dry grass" is folly.

I live near a greenbelt.  If I see you tossing lit matches around, I"m going to put out the fire right away, and kick your ass.  I'm not going to wait until my house burns down to take steps.

The people who lived through one of the greatest forest fires ever are telling us over and over, "this is exactly how the fire started back then."  Only idiots would ignore them.  Or people who actually WANT that fire to burn.  Which are you?

 

knee jerk over reaction by the left, also know as your typical Monday

[Smax 3800]

2 minutes ago, Kyle said:

I hate to break up the national socialist emoting, but serious question ... why don't they accept Mexico's offer of asylum? That feels like a win-win?

because asylum in mexico isn't what they are seeking, they want to be in america and they want it now!

[Captainant 27403]

8 minutes ago, Smax said:

I take issue with you only saying 500 or so people rushing the border when there are 8000 there right now and roughly 20+ million already in this county illegally.

I take issue with you, the left, the media trying to confuse and numb the American mind by switching around the term immigrant and illegal alien, talk about mis-stating rhetoric

Its not a fucking problem because unwelcome immigration is an invasion

Then you're ignoring the fucking facts. It was a relatively small group of people that charged the border over the weekend. I provided the evidence to back that claim. And you choose to go with your feels over reality. 

You're conflating every single possible facet of the illegal immigration issue and attempting to distill it down to a single extreme "all or nothing" position, where if you aren't throwing a fucking party about teargassing mothers and children across a sovereign border (because those MATTER right?) then you must want the country to have any borders at all.

Fuck your false dichotomy, fuck your ignorance of the facts when they're provided to you, and fuck your hate of people who look and live differently from you

[Smax 3800]

8 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Then you're ignoring the fucking facts. It was a relatively small group of people that charged the border over the weekend. I provided the evidence to back that claim. And you choose to go with your feels over reality. 

You're conflating every single possible facet of the illegal immigration issue and attempting to distill it down to a single extreme "all or nothing" position, where if you aren't throwing a fucking party about teargassing mothers and children across a sovereign border (because those MATTER right?) then you must want the country to have any borders at all.

Fuck your false dichotomy, fuck your ignorance of the facts when they're provided to you, and fuck your hate of people who look and live differently from you

 

Wrong, you're cherry picking in a vacuum in an attempt to make whatever point you think you have, while Im looking at the entire issue

No  false dichotomy

No  ignorance of the facts

and I don't hate people who look different them me

Good job on the leftist trifecta there bud 

[Captainant 27403]

Not a leftist my dude. Caring about facts, ethics, and morals doesn't make me a leftist. 

[lemonlime 5503]

Interesting how the Trump supporters' posts are always accusations against the so called border librrals.  I have yet to see someone actually defend lobbing tear gas across a sovereign border, or send troops on a political stunt.  instead it's deflections to what asylum seekers should have done, Obama, and Hillary.  I have yet to see someone actually defend Trump's actions (as opposed to deflecting to blame others).

[Celery Man 20881]

1) dicking around near the border over the holidays is good training

2) you can put tear gas on nachos, shut up

3) muh feelings

[gecko 1104]

[lemonlime 5503]

1 minute ago, gecko said:

 

So are you okay with the US sending tear gas across the border into Mexico such that it hit children?  Yes or no?    Today.  is this what we should be doing?  Without regard to what happened or didn't happen during the Obama administration.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

7 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Not a leftist my dude. Caring about facts, ethics, and morals doesn't make me a leftist. 

THAT is for damn sure.

[Captainant 27403]

A) Washington Times is a right-wing rag.

B) Tear gas usage under the Obama administration wasn't being used against mothers and children indiscriminately. The most favorite instance of tear gassing trumpsters invoke was when an individual attacked a border patrol agent, who used it in self defense.

Also, you beat huckabeef to the punch for invoking "but obama" rather than defending their actions. Well done, the right wing is really on top of their propaganda game today.

[hayden_horn 11360]

4 minutes ago, gecko said:

 

so you support this?

this arguing through implied false equivalence is such a tired tactic.

also, that article is light on actual details onto how or where the gas was deployed. was it on us soil? was it in mexico?

do we make a habit of lobbing gas canisters in violation of international agreement across sovereign borders?

should we?

i vote that we shouldn't. i vote that if we have done this with frequency, then we should revisit that policy. 

what do you think?

[Anastasis 23390]

Just now, hayden_horn said:

what do you think?

I don't think that we should gas immigrants. I think that we should have a sane immigration policy that makes room for workers and asylum seekers, and processes them in an orderly fashion so that they can contribute to American society and live on the grid.  I think that our inability to achieve these things is a failure of our politics, one aspect of which is a total lack of consistent perspective in favor of shifting political posturing.  This specific case is yet another example relevant to the immigration issue. 

Edited November 27, 2018 by Anastasis

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

4 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

so you support this?

this arguing through implied false equivalence is such a tired tactic.

also, that article is light on actual details onto how or where the gas was deployed. was it on us soil? was it in mexico?

do we make a habit of lobbing gas canisters in violation of international agreement across sovereign borders?

should we?

i vote that we shouldn't. i vote that if we have done this with frequency, then we should revisit that policy. 

what do you think?

Where do you stand on the OBL assassination in Pakistan ?  By your comments, he should be living there still, very much a-live.

 

If our border station is being attacked in an attempt to get thru then use it. It's non lethal, and is the safest way to prevent more serious violence from taking place against guards or the people storming the fence.

[hayden_horn 11360]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

Where do you stand on the OBL assassination in Pakistan ?  By your comments, he should be living there still, very much a-live.

 

If our border station is being attacked in an attempt to get thru then use it. It's non lethal, and is the safest way to prevent more serious violence from taking place against guards or the people storming the fence.

your first point about obl is dishonest. i wasn't a fan of killing him, but i understand why we did that. he was an avowed enemy of our country.

these people want to live here.

but you keep on with your own false equivalence. i know it's the only way to square away your support of the trump administration and its draconian immigration policies.

[David Dennison 18646]

21 minutes ago, gecko said:

 

But OBAMA!!!

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, hayden_horn said:

your first point about obl is dishonest. i wasn't a fan of killing him, but i understand why we did that. he was an avowed enemy of our country.

these people want to live here.

but you keep on with your own false equivalence. i know it's the only way to square away your support of the trump administration and its draconian immigration policies.

Oh I'm sorry, sovereign borders don't matter when someone is an enemy, got it.  

"These people want to live here". So when in an attempt to live here they break federal laws and storm a closed border crossing, yeah I want those folks as fellow law abiding citizens, except when they don't feel like being law abiding. 

Yeah nothing false about my equivalency, just your decision to make exception for your pet causes.