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gsoda3

By gsoda3
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bad_teammate
bad_teammate

Immediate Situation: Welcome them with open arms. Invite them to participate productively in our society and economy. Register them to quickly become participatory, tax-paying citizens. Educate t

hpslugga
hpslugga

No. We have a situation where one person, i.e. you, is absolutely wrong about absolutely everything regarding this topic. What is the root of your wanting to build a wall? I imagine it's that of

GHOSTUSER
GHOSTUSER

Looks like President Trump’s deal with the Mexicans to limit the horde of migrants besieging our borders is working: “Its latest effort is a policy that admits only a few asylum seekers a day, if

Chrispy

Chrispy 132

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

And a convenient excuse for the intellectually barren to avoid addressing any of the post's content. 

You're a vapid fucking idiot don't @ me son.

What’s there to address? It’s the same talking points I’ve heard for over ten years. Everything he listed could be copy and pasted from MSNBC.

Visa overstays are the majority of illegals! We created this mess! Republicans hire them! The unfair drug war! 

It’s all the same recycled garbage. 

Edited by Chrispy
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David Dennison

David Dennison 18945

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, Chrispy said:

What’s there to address? It’s the same talking points I’ve heard for over ten years. Everything he listed could be copy and pasted from MSNBC.

Visa overstays are the majority of illegals! We created this mess! Republicans hire them! The unfair drug war! 

It’s all the same recycled garbage. 

It's almost like you don't realize open borders!, they took our jobs!, and they don't pay taxes! is also recycled garbage.

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Ted Lange

Ted Lange 16113

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Chrispy said:

What’s there to address? It’s the same talking points I’ve heard for over ten years. Everything he listed could be copy and pasted from MSNBC.

Visa overstays are the majority of illegals! We created this mess! Republicans hire them! The unfair drug war! 

It’s all the same recycled garbage. 

Honest question, is your IQ sub 80?

 

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4062

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Chrispy said:

What’s there to address? It’s the same talking points I’ve heard for over ten years. Everything he listed could be copy and pasted from MSNBC.

Visa overstays are the majority of illegals! We created this mess! Republicans hire them! The unfair drug war! 

It’s all the same recycled garbage. 

I don’t even watch MSNBC, but you knew that and you also knew the only reason you said that is to plant that idea into the minds of a very confused subset. You also know full well they hardly make any of those points, of which you straw manned them beyond recognition. I’ve yet to hear so much as one talking head from any of those cable networks refer to that ICJ case in 1986, and likely never will.

Anyways, it’s “garbage” to you because you don’t want it to be true and you’d rather live in a Make Believe and Pretend fantasy world that turns the victims into the victimizers and vice versa. You, just like icono, have been wrong about everything here and you’re seriously deluded enough to think you command the level of intellectual authority to dismiss very accurate statements with a broad stroke one liner that’s borne entirely out of wishful thinking. There’s no way you could possibly believe a word of what you say. All you’ve posted are delusions, logical fallacies and outright lies. This has to be a charade.

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Brian Fantana

Brian Fantana 6690

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Chrispy said:

What’s there to address? It’s the same talking points I’ve heard for over ten years. Everything he listed could be copy and pasted from MSNBC.

Visa overstays are the majority of illegals! We created this mess! Republicans hire them! The unfair drug war! 

It’s all the same recycled garbage. 

You're honestly fucking retarded. Those are not "talking points" they are verifiable facts mixed with a side helping of the literal fucking reality of the situation that you and others like you refuse to acknowledge.

At this point you're either trolling or you actually have an IQ of 65. Like what the actual fuck is wrong with you? 

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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, hpslugga said:

I don’t even watch MSNBC, but you knew that and you also knew the only reason you said that is to plant that idea into the minds of a very confused subset. You also know full well they hardly make any of those points, of which you straw manned them beyond recognition. I’ve yet to hear so much as one talking head from any of those cable networks refer to that ICJ case in 1986, and likely never will.

Anyways, it’s “garbage” to you because you don’t want it to be true and you’d rather live in a Make Believe and Pretend fantasy world that turns the victims into the victimizers and vice versa. You, just like icono, have been wrong about everything here and you’re seriously deluded enough to think you command the level of intellectual authority to dismiss very accurate statements with a broad stroke one liner that’s borne entirely out of wishful thinking. There’s no way you could possibly believe a word of what you say. All you’ve posted are delusions, logical fallacies and outright lies. This has to be a charade.

I’m not trying to be rude, but these points you’re raising have been beaten to death at this point and I’ve had this same discussion with other posters, it just grows tiresome. Maybe you mistook my brevity for an outright dismissal; I just find posts laced with insults lazy and it zaps the fun out of such a discussion. 

1.) Most are visa overstays: yes, so what? The guy that drunkenly kicked in my neighbor’s door in was not, as he had been deported 3 times. There’s still a lot of illegals that sneak across the border. 

2: Your second point is that we created this mess. I can get on board with a lot of what you said, but my claim was never that a wall would cure the entire problem. It’s a complex issue that’s going to require a multitude of solutions. Sending them billions of dollars obviously is not working, so we’re going to have to rethink that strategy. Letting them migrate here is not an option. 

3. I agreed on your 3rd point. I think the influx of so many low skilled workers is not a positive development. I personally know individuals that employ illegals, as I’ve discussed on this thread before ad naseum. When I’ve raised the topic with them, they simply state that they can pay them very little, for which I don’t have a worthwhile rebuttal. I’m not turning my friend into the police, especially when these illegals can sneak back over with ease. 

4. I’ve never said the wall will stop illegal drugs because most of the drugs pouring through are at our ports. I’ve suggested numerous times on this board to beef up our port security to stop the flow of fentanyl that is killing so many people. The drug war has been handled poorly thus far, but I find it a worthwhile endeavor. Other families that have lost a loved one to drugs feel the same.

Your 5th point is somewhat redundant, as my claim was never that it was a cure for all ills. It’s simply a tool that I feel we require, along with other solutions. 

The rest is platitudes about Trump being a failure and my brain not being able to reason, etc. excuse me if I don’t indulge those points, they’re just not very clever. 

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TornACL

TornACL 7722

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Chrispy said:

Santa’s Wonderland is off of highway 6, near College Station, not The Woodlands. Got the kids down late, so tomorrow is going to suck shit through a straw. Maybe he’ll strike me down then... 

I was dragged to that thing once. 

Hell on Earth. 

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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

You're honestly fucking retarded. Those are not "talking points" they are verifiable facts mixed with a side helping of the literal fucking reality of the situation that you and others like you refuse to acknowledge.

At this point you're either trolling or you actually have an IQ of 65. Like what the actual fuck is wrong with you? 

I’m not refusing to acknowledge them, I’ve been discussing them for years. You’re retarded garble low IQ garble fuck garble. Your posts are all the same my man, get new material. 

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TornACL

TornACL 7722

Posted
Posted

A lot of people prefer simple fixes to complex problems. 

If you don't feel bothered to give more than a cursory thought to immigration, a wall will fix everything.

Wall stop people. Keep people out. Hooray wall. 

My question, then, is... If one doesn't feel bothered to give more than a cursory thought to immigration, why is it such an urgent issue? 

On the other hand, someone who gives a great deal of thought to the matter and given all the variables still lands on the wall as the preferable solution... That person is either living in an alternate reality with distorted facts, or has some severe deficiencies in their approach. 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105274

Posted
Posted
Yawn, don’t care. Raising millions of dollars is incredibly impressive. 

“Judge finalizes $25 million Trump University settlement for students of 'sham university'”

Call me when the amount tops the amount that trump u had to pay back. Or when it tops the amount that Mueller has required Trump cronies to forfeit. Or when it tops the amount that the NY AG has forced the Trump Foundation to liquidate.
Shit, some of the biggest chunks of cash flow in the country are Trump and his buddies having to disgorge ill-gotten cash.
Now, THAT’S impressive.
Some gullible Fox News viewers sending their SS checks to a “fuck Mexicans!” fund? Not so much. Rather predictable and sad, but not impressive.
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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

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Posted
9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:


“Judge finalizes $25 million Trump University settlement for students of 'sham university'”

Call me when the amount tops the amount that trump u had to pay back. Or when it tops the amount that Mueller has required Trump cronies to forfeit. Or when it tops the amount that the NY AG has forced the Trump Foundation to liquidate.
Shit, some of the biggest chunks of cash flow in the country are Trump and his buddies having to disgorge ill-gotten cash.
Now, THAT’S impressive.
Some gullible Fox News viewers sending their SS checks to a “fuck Mexicans!” fund? Not so much. Rather predictable and sad, but not impressive.

You have Trump rot of the brain, stop letting him live rent free. 

A triple amputee raising millions for our government’s failings is admirable in my opinion. It’s strange that this could upset anyone, but this is the age of emotions I suppose. 

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4062

Posted
Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Chrispy said:

I’m not trying to be rude, but these points you’re raising have been beaten to death at this point and I’ve had this same discussion with other posters, it just grows tiresome.

I'm not interested in what you've discussed with other posters, and it's not my responsibility to take that into account. 

Quote

Maybe you mistook my brevity for an outright dismissal; I just find posts laced with insults lazy and it zaps the fun out of such a discussion. 

There isn't a single comment that I've made towards you that's an "insult." I can back everything I've said. You cannot, and that's the biggest difference between the two of us. You just asserted, baselessly to be sure, that what I told you was "garbage," and now you're pretending to be indignant about "insults?" That's hypocrisy of the highest order. 

Quote

1.) Most are visa overstays: yes, so what? The guy that drunkenly kicked in my neighbor’s door in was not, as he had been deported 3 times. There’s still a lot of illegals that sneak across the border. 

Immigration policy isn't made to avenge actions made by single individuals. And even with those illegal crossings, they're done in a variety of ways that could still circumvent a border wall. That's precisely what you and your ilk cannot understand. I mentioned before that drug runners use ramps and t-shirt canons to get around the fence. Do you know what they also use? Tunnels. And these things aren't done at border crossing towns like Laredo or Juarez, either. They're done in the relatively unpopulated areas where there's no one to stop them, and neither could a wall.

I really don't think you understand that this wall that Trump is proposing is purely symbolic and functionally would do zilch regarding immigration. Again, there's only one reason that he's acting like such a petulant child at this moment w/r/t funding the wall: because he knows that he's fucking done as far as re-election is concerned if he shows up in November 2020 without even a hint of a wall, which was the cornerstone of his shit-for-brains candidacy, and he will not get that wall if this issue isn't voted on before January because there's no way in hell the new Democratic House would even for a moment consider it. His wanting the wall has absolutely nothing to do with immigration. Hell, nothing that he's proposed about immigration is about immigration. That you don't understand this is absolutely shocking.

Quote

2: Your second point is that we created this mess. I can get on board with a lot of what you said, but my claim was never that a wall would cure the entire problem. It’s a complex issue that’s going to require a multitude of solutions. Sending them billions of dollars obviously is not working, so we’re going to have to rethink that strategy. Letting them migrate here is not an option. 

You're vastly overstating what we give them in aid. By the State Department's own admission, we transmitted $2.6 billion to Central America over a 4-year period.

That's a paltry amount. Here's how that translates: 

1) Their definition of "Central America" is very literal: El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, Belize, Panama, Costa Rica.

2) Those 7 countries have a combined population of just a little over 48 million people. 

3) 2.6 billion in 4 years=650 million per year

4) 650million/48million=$13.54 per person per year.

So to you, sending each person in Central America just enough for a loaf of bread, a dozen eggs, and a carton of milk per year is a "strategy?" 

The average American thinks that its government spends 26% of the total budget on foreign aid. Are you one of those people?

Quote

3. I agreed on your 3rd point. I think the influx of so many low skilled workers is not a positive development. I personally know individuals that employ illegals, as I’ve discussed on this thread before ad naseum. When I’ve raised the topic with them, they simply state that they can pay them very little, for which I don’t have a worthwhile rebuttal. I’m not turning my friend into the police, especially when these illegals can sneak back over with ease. 

That's...handy. You're admitting that it gives them an incentive, but by your own admission, you don't want anything to be done to the person that gives the incentive. Well if you don't do that, how is that incentive supposed to disappear?

Quote

4. I’ve never said the wall will stop illegal drugs because most of the drugs pouring through are at our ports. I’ve suggested numerous times on this board to beef up our port security to stop the flow of fentanyl that is killing so many people. The drug war has been handled poorly thus far, but I find it a worthwhile endeavor. Other families that have lost a loved one to drugs feel the same.

And they, like you, would be absolutely wrong if they were to make such a statement. 

Quote

Your 5th point is somewhat redundant, as my claim was never that it was a cure for all ills. It’s simply a tool that I feel we require, along with other solutions. 

And again, you'd be wrong. This, just like the Drug War, isn't about "feelings." This is about showing what you know to be concordant with reality. If you can't show it, you don't know it. You've not demonstrated a single, meaningful factual observance that would in any way bolster the case for such a wall. You say it's something we "require," and you've not demonstrated one actual reason why. All you've done is lie, misdirect, misunderstand, project and emote. If you don't give me a reason to believe you, then I have no reason to believe you. 

 

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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, hpslugga said:

I'm not interested in what you've discussed with other posters, and it's not my responsibility to take that into account. 

There isn't a single comment that I've made towards you that's an "insult." I can back everything I've said. You cannot, and that's the biggest difference between the two of us. You just asserted, baselessly to be sure, that what I told you was "garbage," and now you're pretending to be indignant about "insults?" That's hypocrisy of the highest order. 

Immigration policy isn't made to avenge actions made by single individuals. And even with those illegal crossings, they're done in a variety of ways that could still circumvent a border wall. That's precisely what you and your ilk cannot understand. I mentioned before that drug runners use ramps and t-shirt canons to get around the fence. Do you know what they also use? Tunnels. And these things aren't done at border crossing towns like Laredo or Juarez, either. They're done in the relatively unpopulated areas where there's no one to stop them, and neither could a wall.

I really don't think you understand that this wall that Trump is proposing is purely symbolic and functionally would do zilch regarding immigration. Again, there's only one reason that he's acting like such a petulant child at this moment w/r/t funding the wall: because he knows that he's fucking done as far as re-election is concerned if he shows up in November 2020 without even a hint of a wall, which was the cornerstone of his shit-for-brains candidacy, and he will not get that wall if this issue isn't voted on before January because there's no way in hell the new Democratic House would even for a moment consider it. His wanting the wall has absolutely nothing to do with immigration. Hell, nothing that he's proposed about immigration is about immigration. That you don't understand this is absolutely shocking.

You're vastly overstating what we give them in aid. By the State Department's own admission, we transmitted $2.6 billion to Central America over a 4-year period.

That's a paltry amount. Here's how that translates: 

1) Their definition of "Central America" is very literal: El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, Belize, Panama, Costa Rica.

2) Those 7 countries have a combined population of just a little over 48 million people. 

3) 2.6 billion in 4 years=650 million per year

4) 650million/48million=$13.54 per person per year.

So to you, sending each person in Central America just enough for a loaf of bread, a dozen eggs, and a carton of milk per year is a "strategy?" 

The average American thinks that its government spends 26% of the total budget on foreign aid. Are you one of those people?

That's...handy. You're admitting that it gives them an incentive, but by your own admission, you don't want anything to be done to the person that gives the incentive. Well if you don't do that, how is that incentive supposed to disappear?

And they, like you, would be absolutely wrong if they were to make such a statement. 

And again, you'd be wrong. This, just like the Drug War, isn't about "feelings." This is about showing what you know to be concordant with reality. If you can't show it, you don't know it. You've not demonstrated a single, meaningful factual observance that would in any way bolster the case for such a wall. You say it's something we "require," and you've not demonstrated one actual reason why. All you've done is lie, misdirect, misunderstand, project and emote. If you don't give me a reason to believe you, then I have no reason to believe you. 

 

I’m sorry, but saying one is deluded and living in a fantasy world is not something you can prove with facts, it’s just lazy writing. Jutstify it if you need to, but you can do better. 

Of course they could circumvent the wall, I’ve explained numerous times that it was merely a tool that could be utilized in coordination with other technological systems. It’s not a cure all, for the hundredth time. The anecdotal story was merely an example of how easy it is to cross our broken border. Illegal aliens laugh at our lack of border security.

I understand why Trump is concerned with the wall, but I just don’t care. He’s temporary and the chaos at the border will continue after his term or terms are over. 

2.6 billion is far too much money, especially since its become crystal clear they have no idea how to spend it. I wouldn’t send them another dime, as I believe it to be a waste of time and resources. 

I don’t think I’m wrong on the drug war, but that’s another discussion for another time. 

Here’s a link describing the broken border and why a constructing a wall has become more urgent. 

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2018/04/05/crossing-attempts-at-us-southwest-border-triple-in-march-from-year-ago.html

 

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Jesus what an idiot. Can we ignore this chump and go back to Onboard claiming Soros is paying for the caravan? At least that was interesting. 

Never did that, but you troll away.  Please show your work in explaining how they got (orchestrated) free rides on trains and buses, and had food, and shelter for most of the entire journey.  All this from thousands of people who live in abject poverty.  Coupons, sky mileage on their credit cards, promotional events ??

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4062

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Chrispy said:

I’m sorry, but the funding is specifically for the Northern Triangle. Here’s another link for you. 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/central-america-battles-corruption-violence-despite-billions-in-us-aid

From the article you posted:

"Over the past decade, U.S. taxpayers have provided $1.5 billion in aid to El Salvador, $1.4 billion to Guatemala and $1.1 billion to Honduras, according to the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID)." That's 1.5, 1.4, 1.1 in total over a ten-year period, not per year.

From what I posted earlier:

"By the State Department's own admission, we transmitted $2.6 billion to Central America over a 4-year period." The period, in question, was 2015-2018.

1.5 billion over 10 years=$150 million per year
1.4 billion over 10 years=$140 million per year
1.1 billion over 10 years=$110 million per year

Added up, that amounts to $400 million per year

2.6 billion over 4 years=$650 million per year. Why the disparity? I already told you. The State Dept. numbers include Nicaragua, Panama, Belize and Costa Rica.

So yeah, those numbers that the Fox article reported confirms pretty much exactly what I said. We give a paltry amount to those countries, and considering the volume of damage we've done to them (well not Costa Rica or Belize, but you get the idea), it isn't nearly enough to sustain them. Again, we attacked them over long periods, claimed a horrific number of lives, did untold amounts worth of property damage, absolutely wrecked their economies with the dictators/juntas we installed, and those societies have yet to recover. As long as they don't recover, there are going to be people who flee seeking political asylum. That's just how the game works regardless of how little you truly understand this.

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, SubliminalHorn said:

So you don’t want to say Soros funded it, but you totally think Soros funded it *wink wink*

No I haven't got any idea who funded it, but sure Soros wood do something like that. It;ps right in his wheelhouse. And again please explain how they obtained buses and trains. These are indigent people who haven't got any money. It was an orchestrated and funded event.

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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

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Posted
14 minutes ago, hpslugga said:

From the article you posted:

"Over the past decade, U.S. taxpayers have provided $1.5 billion in aid to El Salvador, $1.4 billion to Guatemala and $1.1 billion to Honduras, according to the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID)." That's 1.5, 1.4, 1.1 in total over a ten-year period, not per year.

From what I posted earlier:

"By the State Department's own admission, we transmitted $2.6 billion to Central America over a 4-year period." The period, in question, was 2015-2018.

1.5 billion over 10 years=$150 million per year
1.4 billion over 10 years=$140 million per year
1.1 billion over 10 years=$110 million per year

Added up, that amounts to $400 million per year

2.6 billion over 4 years=$650 million per year. Why the disparity? I already told you. The State Dept. numbers include Nicaragua, Panama, Belize and Costa Rica.

So yeah, those numbers that the Fox article reported confirms pretty much exactly what I said. We give a paltry amount to those countries, and considering the volume of damage we've done to them (well not Costa Rica or Belize, but you get the idea), it isn't nearly enough to sustain them. Again, we attacked them over long periods, claimed a horrific number of lives, did untold amounts worth of property damage, absolutely wrecked their economies with the dictators/juntas we installed, and those societies have yet to recover. As long as they don't recover, there are going to be people who flee seeking political asylum. That's just how the game works regardless of how little you truly understand this.

Exactly, this money has had little effect, so will billions more. They’re mired in corruption and more money will only serve to make matters worse. It’s better to completely cut off funding and solidify our border with a wall, etc. These economic migrants can apply for asylum if they like, but most will be denied and will stay in Mexico during their claim process thankfully. 

We need to get out of the nation building business and soon. 

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4062

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Chrispy said:

Exactly, this money has had little effect, so will billions more.

Little money will inevitably yield little effect.

Quote

They’re mired in corruption

Why do you think that is? They don’t have a government that speaks for them and when they try to pursue that endeavor, we crush them for it. 

Quote

and more money will only serve to make matters worse.

There’s no reason to believe that as there’s no evidence to support it. That’s just you and your little feelings at work again.

Quote

It’s better to completely cut off funding and solidify our border with a wall, etc.

See above. No reason at all to believe in this fairy tale.

Quote

We need to get out of the nation building business and soon. 

Reparations and nation building are totally separate concepts. 

Look, I’ve already told you exactly and precisely how to curb illegal immigration. It’s perfectly within our grasp, it’s 100% based in reality, but you refuse to divorce yourself from this Make Believe and Pretend universe in which you opt to live in lieu of reality. Failing that, you’re never going to understand this.

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Chrispy

Chrispy 132

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, hpslugga said:

Little money will inevitably yield little effect.

Why do you think that is? They don’t have a government that speaks for them and when they try to pursue that endeavor, we crush them for it. 

There’s no reason to believe that as there’s no evidence to support it. That’s just you and your little feelings at work again.

See above. No reason at all to believe in this fairy tale.

Reparations and nation building are totally separate concepts. 

Look, I’ve already told you exactly and precisely how to curb illegal immigration. It’s perfectly within our grasp, it’s 100% based in reality, but you refuse to divorce yourself from this Make Believe and Pretend universe in which you opt to live in lieu of reality. Failing that, you’re never going to understand this.

That’s why I suggested to stop aid and get out of their affairs, our meddling is making it worse.

There’s no way to completely stop illegal immigration, but the idea is to have the resources to deal with the problem appropriately, and currently we’re failing. I view the wall as an integral tool that would aid in such a solution, you do not, and I don’t suppose either of us will budge on the matter. 

My prediction is that we’ll continue lighting our money on fire and not build a wall, neither party gives a damn unfortunately. 

 

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SubliminalHorn

SubliminalHorn 6811

Posted
Posted
58 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

No I haven't got any idea who funded it, but sure Soros wood do something like that. It;ps right in his wheelhouse. And again please explain how they obtained buses and trains. These are indigent people who haven't got any money. It was an orchestrated and funded event.

It’s the Librul Cabal, bro. We donate $100 a month and it goes toward caravans and their posh coach buses. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18945

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Chrispy said:

Exactly, this money has had little effect, so will billions more. They’re mired in corruption and more money will only serve to make matters worse. It’s better to completely cut off funding and solidify our border with a wall, etc. These economic migrants can apply for asylum if they like, but most will be denied and will stay in Mexico during their claim process thankfully. 

We need to get out of the nation building business and soon. 

We don't built those nations. That's not what the money is for. That money is to project power and secure empire.

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