Mass shooting ar Cali bar

[Orange&White 5,522]

1 hour ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

You've obviously never seen 48 Hours.  There's a new sheriff in town, and his name is .......Reggie Hammond.

"I've never seen so many backward ass, Country-Fucks in my life."

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

Guns! Guns! Guns!

Everyone should carry. Maybe we can have duels instead of fights at a bar in the future. Let’s make the US the Wild West again, except with hundreds of millions more people.

What could go wrong?

[Lat22 4,010]

It’s a felony to carry inside of a business that gets at least 51% of its income from alcohol sales. Licensed to carry or not. 

[Newdoc 3,439]

6 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Do nightclubs in Texas let you carry now?

"For bars or a businesses that make 51 percent of their money from the sale of alcohol, all guns are banned – even if you have a concealed handgun license."

http://www.kut.org/post/gun-law-explainer-where-can-you-carry-texas

 

And I (with a CHL) agree with this as it is against the law to carry intoxicated. It's too easy to get a CHL here in Texas anyway.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Newdoc

[Gene Parmesan 4,004]

Arm the bartenders.

[landman 559]

2 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Large magazine weapons are not needed by any citizen of this country, ever, no matter how much fun they are too fire.

I don't disagree with you, but the thing about nutjobs/criminals is they don't follow laws.  If they did then we wouldn't need to do background checks and be talking about banning certain types of guns or magazines.  They'll still find them/use them.  It's never going to end, unfortunately.  We are way too far gone, be it a lack of parenting, a lack of religion (cue the haters), a lack of respect for people/life, whatever way you want to look at it.  There is no fix.  Ban the large magazines, they'll use multiple small ones or come up with another way. 

[jdhorn92 1,545]

30 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

My nephew is a Ventura County firefighter. He was called to the scene and had to tag the dead bodies. Fuck. Fuck this shit

 Surly is not part of my daily routine but certainly part of my weekly routine, I don’t know why l, but I thought about you Bruin.  I think you and I’ve traded info over the years I grew up out there in Southern California. Thoughts and prayers to your family member 

[Newdoc 3,439]

1 minute ago, landman said:

Ban the large magazines, they'll use multiple small ones or come up with another way. 

I think we can still look at some common sense ways to approach gun violence and we need to look at access to certain types of weapons and accessories for certain individuals. We've got some sick mofo's in our society.  Can we keep them from getting high capacity means to kill lots of people?  But my fear, and look to the Middle East, is that these people will find the next easiest way to kill lots of people (driving into crowds, IED's, poison, etc.).

[Sbbruin 21,833]

 Surly is not part of my daily routine but certainly part of my weekly routine, I don’t know why l, but I thought about you Bruin.  I think you and I’ve traded info over the years I grew up out there in Southern California. Thoughts and prayers to your family member 

Thanks, my sister and her whole family live in T.O., about a quarter mile from the scene. My niece and nephew went to TO high and nephew, per above, is a VC firefighter. Just so fucked.

[SameSame 1,704]

10 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Arm the bartenders.

[staboner 4,969]

RIP. very sorry to wake up to this news today.

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

25 minutes ago, landman said:

 Ban the large magazines, they'll use multiple small ones or come up with another way. 

Ok, LET THEM TRY.  Let's just make it a LITTLE bit harder, and see what happens. 

No one expects a murder-free world with gun control laws. We want LESS PEOPLE TO DIE. 

edit: Stannis gif. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by Hank Kingsley

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

23 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Arm the bartenders.

I actually wouldnt be totally against that. Wouldnt have changed anything in this case though.  The shooter probably didnt even get all the way to the bar.  Plus, the bartender has cover.  99 percent chance he ducks down, waits it out, and saves himself instead of engaging a mass shooter. The only thing you'd do by arming him is make him live with the guilt of not engaging. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by FondrenRoad

[DigglerontheHoof 21,183]

31 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Do nightclubs in Texas let you carry now?  Seems like they'd pat you down. Alcohol, people in their early 20s, and guns don't mix well. Even if the carrier has good intentions. 

I would bet the bouncer patted down everyone who entered this place in CA. The guy just came up, shot him, and entered. 

I'm an old, very rarely go into any 51% establishments.  When I do, I'll usually leave my pistol in my vehicle.  I have carried into a couple of biker bars because I didn't want to be the only unarmed person there.  

Oh and I've never been patted down at a bar in Texas in over 30 years of drinking. 

 

Edited November 8, 2018 by DigglerontheHoof

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

Just now, tjhooker said:

Good to see a Daily Texan thread go CR.

You seriously might be the dumbest motherfucker on this board, which is a huge feat. Congrats. 

Mass shootings are 100% a political issue at this point.  I guess you prefer a thread of nothing but "thoughts and prayers". Hard pass. 

 

[bernorange 8,359]

Quote

...

Witness John Hedge, of Moorpark, said he saw a suspect throwing smoke bombs into the front of the restaurant. He also said he saw a security guard get shot.

"I was at the front door and I was talking to my stepdad. I just started hearing these big pops. Pop, pop, pop. There was probably three or four, I hit the ground. I look up - the security guard is dead. Well, I don't want to say he was dead, but he was shot.

"He was down. The gunman was throwing smoke grenades all over the place. I saw him point to the back of the cash register...and he just kept firing. I ran out the front door," he said.

Hodge added that there may have been about 12 shots by the time he got out of the door.

He said the gunman had a beard, wore a hat, had a black jacket and may have had glasses.

"I thought it was a joke when the shots started firing. I know people there. I hope everybody's OK. I don't know how I didn't get shot," the man said.


Tim, Hodge's stepfather, who was in tears, said he was next to the entrance about to leave after playing pool when smoke came into the room.

"He fired the first shot. I knew it was live. I knew it was real. My son thought it was a joke so I pulled him down and got some cover. I looked up and he was moving to the right. He shot the front doorman, who was just a young man. Then he shot the cashier, just a young girl.

"Then he started moving to the right. He wasn't looking at us. Then he went into the office, where all the cash and stuff is. He didn't say anything at all. He just started shooting," he said.

https://abc7.com/mass-shooting-reported-at-nightclub-in-thousand-oaks/4644573/

Sounds like a very violent robbery attempt.

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

1 minute ago, FondrenRoad said:

I actually wouldnt be totally against that. Wouldnt have changed anything in this case though.  The shooter probably didnt even get all the way to the bar.  Plus, the bartender has cover.  99 percent chance he ducks down, waits it out, and saves himself instead of engaging a mass shooter. The only thing you'd do by arming him is make him live with the guilt of not engaging. 

Yes, because arming a server that deals with a rush of drunk people yelling their orders at them is a healthy environment to carry a firearm. 

Fuck it.  Let's arm waiters, cashiers, or anyone in the service industry. MORE GUNS. 

 

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

1 minute ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

I'm an old, very rarely go into any 51% establishments.  When I do, I'll usually leave my pistol in my vehicle.  I have carried into a couple of biker bars because I didn't want to be the only unarmed person there.  

Oh and I've never been patted down at a bar in Texas in over 30 years of drinking. 

 

I have never been patted down at slower bars either, old man bar or otherwise. Pretty much always get patted down at clubs though, and this place seems to fit that description. Dance Across Texas used to pat down on college night in the 90s. I cant imagine you can just walk into a country dancing club in Texas now unhindered. 

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Yes, because arming a server that deals with a rush of drunk people yelling their orders at them is a healthy environment to carry a firearm. 

Fuck it.  Let's arm waiters, cashiers, or anyone in the service industry. MORE GUNS. 

 

I was thinking more shotgun behind the bar. And I said I wasnt totally against it.  I didnt say it was the solution to all problems, and I even said it certainly wasn't the solution to this particular event. 

Most bouncers aren't armed and even if they were, they are standing there in the open as target number 1. The only real solution is to reduce access to guns. 

[RomaVicta 29,903]

Sickening. Truly sickening.

Again, what is going on in the minds of these non-political, motiveless killers?

Isolation, mental illness, social dysfunction, and whatever fuckeduppedness have always been with us. Now these potential suicides want to take people with them.

I have to think that first person shooter games and maybe movies make it easier for these people to visualize this action. Maybe there's something in the water. The gun culture isn't terribly healthy, but it's not new.

I can't help but feel that we don't have a real clue as to why Americans in particular do this.

[DigglerontheHoof 21,183]

9 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

I have never been patted down at slower bars either, old man bar or otherwise. Pretty much always get patted down at clubs though, and this place seems to fit that description. Dance Across Texas used to pat down on college night in the 90s. I cant imagine you can just walk into a country dancing club in Texas now unhindered. 

Tells you how long it's been since I've been to a night club/big scene joint. 

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

Just now, tjhooker said:

Oh, I forgot this should turn into a gun control debate thread because mass shootings are political.  WTF?   

I guess everything is political more or less then and is fair game to be completely CR on Daily Texan.  

You seem triggered soy boy.

There's no doubt in my mind you're less of a man than almost every person on this board. 

[bernorange 8,359]

6 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

I was thinking more shotgun behind the bar. ...

Most bouncers aren't armed ...

Not trying to make any particular point.  Your post just reminded me of this scene...

 

 

[pops 6,981]

This isn't preventable. This is the American suicide bomber. He goes in with a pistol and a few clips and it is church. 

 

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

33 minutes ago, landman said:

I don't disagree with you, but the thing about nutjobs/criminals is they don't follow laws.  If they did then we wouldn't need to do background checks and be talking about banning certain types of guns or magazines.  They'll still find them/use them.  It's never going to end, unfortunately.  We are way too far gone, be it a lack of parenting, a lack of religion (cue the haters), a lack of respect for people/life, whatever way you want to look at it.  There is no fix.  Ban the large magazines, they'll use multiple small ones or come up with another way. 

I totally agree, the genie is out of the bottle in many respects.  We have got to address this issue sooner rather than later.  How I have no idea, but going forward making semi auto long rifle weapons, and large magazines  harder to obtain now would be a start.  

[Hank Kingsley 20,910]

3 minutes ago, tjhooker said:

Oh, I forgot this should turn into a gun control debate thread because mass shootings are political.  WTF?   

So what are mass shootings to you? A mental health issue. 

Newsflash: For a difficult as it is to limit gun access to certain people, it's a million times harder to find any solutions through diagnosing or treating mental illness. 

 

[bernorange 8,359]

3 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

... Again, what is going on in the minds of these non-political, motiveless killers? ...

How did you determine that the Cali bar shooter had no motive?  According to the witness statements in the news report I posted earlier, it seems like the shooter was trying to rob the place.

[Trey3216 15,345]

2 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Sickening. Truly sickening.

Again, what is going on in the minds of these non-political, motiveless killers?

Isolation, mental illness, social dysfunction, and whatever fuckeduppedness have always been with us. Now these potential suicides want to take people with them.

I have to think that first person shooter games and maybe movies make it easier for these people to visualize this action. Maybe there's something in the water. The gun culture isn't terribly healthy, but it's not new.

I can't help but feel that we don't have a real clue as to why Americans in particular do this.

In the day of instant gratification and constant information, we've disabled our ability as a society to actually engage in social discourse.  Wide open alone-ness.  Communicative introvertedness.  Constant barrages of communication from all directions, none of it with any substance.  We are crippled in our on minds and paralyzed by our own thoughts, living in a big world where we've built insulated caves in our own minds.  

[Telegraph_it 3,357]

 

 

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

5 minutes ago, pops said:

This isn't preventable. This is the American suicide bomber. He goes in with a pistol and a few clips and it is church. 

 

imgur

[alincoln 2,371]

Nothing can or will be done about these shootings.  They are now part and parcel of the unique American experience.  If anything, they will only increase in frequency and severity as the number of young men living meaningless lives continues to expand.  

[Fuck Tim Beck 3,815]

Shooter was angry they played both kinds of music. Country and Western 

[RomaVicta 29,903]

11 minutes ago, bernorange said:

How did you determine that the Cali bar shooter had no motive?  According to the witness statements in the news report I posted earlier, it seems like the shooter was trying to rob the place.

I've been listening to LA NPR all morning and haven't heard a thing about robbery. He entered the place shooting according to one witness. Why not just go to wherever the money is? Plus, his getaway plan seems to have been suicide. I'm no criminologist, but that sounds a little out of the ordinary.

Even if they find a motive for this, I think my point still stands in general. Do you believe all of these mass shootings have motives like robbery? The only motive I see is derangement.

 

[RomaVicta 29,903]

9 minutes ago, alincoln said:

Nothing can or will be done about these shootings.  They are now part and parcel of the unique American experience.  If anything, they will only increase in frequency and severity as the number of young men living meaningless lives continues to expand.  

That's the concern. I don't see a solution, and I doubt gun laws will do much to stop it.

[Newdoc 3,439]

22 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

I can't help but feel that we don't have a real clue as to why Americans in particular do this.

I'm not sure the American people have the logic to demand/support getting to the root of the problem and (sorry CR trigger warning), I'm not sure our political class cares about getting to the root of the problem either.

[bernorange 8,359]

2 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

... He entered the place shooting according to one witness. Why not just go to wherever the money is? Plus, his getaway plan seems to have been suicide. ...

If your intention is to kill peeps and meet your maker in a blaze of "glory", why would you worry about the business' money?  That does not make sense.  Either the perp was after money or after his deranged idea of glory.  I really don't see both objectives as congruous.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

3 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

I'm not sure the American people have the logic to demand/support getting to the root of the problem and (sorry CR trigger warning), I'm not sure our political class cares about getting to the root of the problem either.

They're mostly scared of losing their cushy congressional seat.  

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

5 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

That's the concern. I don't see a solution, and I doubt gun laws will do much to stop it.

You're assuming that friendless nutjobs could find other ways to buy weapons if OTC weapons weren't available?

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

Just now, bernorange said:

If your intention is to kill peeps and meet your maker in a blaze of "glory", why would you worry about the business' money?  That does not make sense.  Either the perp was after money or after his deranged idea of glory.  I really don't see both objectives as congruous.

Yeah,vey doubtful this was a robbery, unless this guy was the dumbest MOFO in the history of dumb MOFO's.  

He had some break from sanity. Sane people don't go in blazing in a robbery. 

[NowThis 931]

6 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

I'm not sure the American people have the logic to demand/support getting to the root of the problem and (sorry CR trigger warning), I'm not sure our political class cares about getting to the root of the problem either.

metal detectors and 2-3 armed guards.  It's Beirut 1985. 

[Telegraph_it 3,357]

 

 

[Trey3216 15,345]

6 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

You're assuming that friendless nutjobs could find other ways to buy weapons if OTC weapons weren't available?

Of course they could

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

Just now, Trey3216 said:

Of course they could

Yeah, from where?

[Trey3216 15,345]

5 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Yeah,vey doubtful this was a robbery, unless this guy was the dumbest MOFO in the history of dumb MOFO's.  

He had some break from sanity. Sane people don't go in blazing in a robbery. 

sane people don't throw smoke bombs and outside and inside a club either.  This is some straight whack-job shit 

[Trey3216 15,345]

Just now, FondrenRoad said:

Yeah, from where?

Find your local drug dealer, buy one in mexico and cross through the desert, rob someone's home and steal it from them.  It would/will happen. 

[Brisketexan 105,086]

Need to get one of these:

Printed with:

1 - thoughts and prayers

2 - mental health!

3 - gun control!

4 - too soon to talk about gun control!

5 - if brown, muslim terrorist!

6 - if white, right wing terrorist!

 

I think that about covers it.  Let's just move on to the next shooting.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

1 minute ago, Trey3216 said:

sane people don't throw smoke bombs and outside and inside a club either.  This is some straight whack-job shit 

Yep, already reported he had issues, but CA. law didn't allow for his detention allegedly.

[Whitman 694]

21 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

That's the concern. I don't see a solution, and I doubt gun laws will do much to stop it.

You wrote something earlier mentioning the shooter video games these kids have grown up spending thousands of hours playing.  I 've seen a couple of them and I can't imagine how that isn't going to fuck up a small percentage of people's thinking and rationality.  Something else I've read, and don't really understand is the thought of being famous.  Some people want it and the attention so bad that they will do these kind of things to achieve this.  It's just like a 5 year old's tantrum x 1 billion in severity.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Whitman

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

Just now, Trey3216 said:

Find your local drug dealer, buy one in mexico and cross through the desert, rob someone's home and steal it from them.  It would/will happen. 

Only the 3rd option is a possibility for a friendless nutjob. It also may result in their arrest for robbery. The first two options result in them being robbery victims. Nobody is buying a gun from a drug dealer or in Mexico without connections. 

I assume you arent a friendless nutjob. Go see if even you are able to buy a gun from your local drug dealer right now. 

[Orange&White 5,522]

Do you honestly believe it would be difficult for, literally, anyone in this country to get a weapon if they wanted one, or are you just trying to set up an argument, or are you just being obtuse?