Mass shooting ar Cali bar

[hookemATL 11,907]

28 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

I have tears streaming down my face.  The sheer anguish he is going through is gut-wrenching.  Those of us who are parents can feel his emotion but can't begin to imagine dealing with it ourselves.  

There is no recovery from that loss. Grasp the pain you feel in your heart for him, then try and even come close to being in his shoes and how it feels to have your world shattered. Over fucking nothing. 

 

Inescapable, undeniable suffering and heartbreak. As a parent, I know that is a place I could never recover from. I hope he finds some type of peace with this, but I highly doubt it. 

 

Dusty as fuck in here. 

[Longhorn94 2,458]

5 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I forced myself to watch it, so I can give a bigger hug and kiss to my 16 month old boy when I get home from work. 

 

nope, nope, nope. i am already in favor of gun control legislation. no need to put myself through that. 

[TexArcher 38,073]

21 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Easy access to guns = mass shootings in America on almost a daily basis

Restricted access to guns = almost zero mass shootings in other countries

 

Stop talking about fucking father figures, video games, mental illness, etc. That is not an uniquely American issue. Guns are. 

 

This.  

I've said it before: Call of Duty sells millions of copies around the world.  Hip hop is popular in England and France, and heavy metal is popular in Sweden and Norway.  Mental illness happens in all of those countries.  And this shit hardly ever happens in those places.

Point out the handful of examples in those places if you want, but we all know there are scores of examples here for every one example in those countries.

The difference is access to guns.  Period.  The end.

Edited November 8, 2018 by TexArcher

[Dark Horse 2,291]

33 minutes ago, Fozzz said:

That video is soul crushing. 

Fucking this. God dammit. 

[C-Man 27,271]

3 minutes ago, TexArcher said:

This.  

I've said it before: Call of Duty sells millions of copies around the world.  Hip hop is popular in England and France, and heavy metal is popular in Sweden and Norway.  Mental illness happens in all of those countries.  And this shit hardly ever happens in those places.

Point out the handful of examples in those places if you want, but we all know there are scores of examples here for every one example in those countries.

The difference is access to guns.  Period.  The end.

The minute authorities left him in April, somebody should've stepped in and taken away his guns.

[pops 7,007]

1 hour ago, Sbbruin said:

If you can watch that video of that father, and can put yourself in his shoes, and STILL feel there should be no restrictions on guns, well, then you are different than me.

I like you, bruin, I think you're an asset to this board, so I'm not asking this dismissively... But with what we know about this cat so far, what restrictions stop this event? 

 

[immortal13 4,059]

1 hour ago, Sbbruin said:

If you can watch that video of that father, and can put yourself in his shoes, and STILL feel there should be no restrictions on guns, well, then you are different than me.

Who is saying there should be no restrictions on guns?

[Hank Kingsley 21,056]

5 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

Who is saying there should be no restrictions on guns?

The NRA and gun nuts feel there should be no additional restrictions. Stop parsing words. 

 

[austingirl 2,192]

I don't have words for this shit anymore. I'll just leave this.

[immortal13 4,059]

1 minute ago, Hank Kingsley said:

The NRA and gun nuts feel there should be no additional restrictions. Stop parsing words. 

 

It was a question for Bruin. Stop being an asshole

[Sbbruin 21,894]

7 minutes ago, pops said:

I like you, bruin, I think you're an asset to this board, so I'm not asking this dismissively... But with what we know about this cat so far, what restrictions stop this event? 

 

I'm not suggesting anything, in this case, would have stopped THIS event.  But doing nothing will not stop anything.  Doing SOMETHING may stop one event.  And that may be my child who lives instead of dies.  Again, all I'm saying is doing nothing isn't working.

[Trey3216 15,358]

3 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

The NRA and gun nuts feel there should be no additional restrictions. Stop parsing words. 

 

No one here says there isn’t some meaningful things that could happen.  But an outright ban is both unrealistic and unconstitutional.   

[Longhorn94 2,458]

Who the fuck is suggesting an outright ban of guns?

[Bama Chick 28,596]

That’s basically my point. Single mothers (or two mommies) can’t show by example how a man should behave. A father who consistently exhibits poor control may be worse than a single mom, but most fathers show control most of the time. A father who can almost always control himself offers something no single mother can offer. I will go out on a limb and say that often a good single dad (rare as they are) can do a better job with daughters because most fathers (not all) can control their daughters better than moms can control their sons once those sons realize that they are stronger than their mom.

This post made me so furious but this thread isn’t the place for me to rant right now.

And it never fails to astonish me how a certain type of mass murderer inspires conversations about mental illness and grasping theories about social media and family unit make up and video games and the internet and music and movies.

It’s about guns.

[Sbbruin 21,894]

15 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

Who is saying there should be no restrictions on guns?

Any suggestion of moving the ball forward when it comes to practical, AND MORE STRINGENT, gun laws- by way of example guns not sold freely at gun shows, mental health and more thorough background checks, elimination of large capacity magazines to name a few, at least shows a willingness to engage in the discussion.  Right now every suggestion is met with fierce resistance.

[Sbbruin 21,894]

8 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

No one here says there isn’t some meaningful things that could happen.  But an outright ban is both unrealistic and unconstitutional.   

Nobody made that suggestion.  

[Fondren & Main 6,742]

8 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

 

This post made me so furious but this thread isn’t the place for me to rant right now.

And it never fails to astonish me how a certain type of mass murderer inspires conversations about mental illness and grasping theories about social media and family unit make up and video games and the internet and music and movies.

It’s about guns.

 

It’s about societal decay actually.

[C-Man 27,271]

14 minutes ago, Longhorn94 said:

Who the fuck is suggesting an outright ban of guns?

Some far-right candidates were claiming their opponents this past Tuesday are suggesting just this. #nocloakroom

[South Austin 52,617]

3 hours ago, HenryJames said:

 

I’m not really a crier.  I cried.

[Trey3216 15,358]

23 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

Nobody made that suggestion.  

Not you.  Lots of those undertones from some folks even though not stated.   I merely made a statement, didn’t say anyone suggested.   There are lots of things that can and should happen

[Kyle 207]

I absolutely don't want to Cloak Room this thread, but there my sense is there is a reasonable alignment among those who hold these two POV:
1. The war on drugs isn't working, legalize / decriminalize 

2. Launch a war on guns

I am not mixing the two subjects, but if one believes a war on drugs failed, it makes little sense to believe a war on guns would succeed. That does not mean there should not restrictions on firearms, but like most the issue is significantly more complicated. I am neither passionately pro- or anti-gun, but access to guns is no different or possibly more difficult than 25 years ago; yet, mass shootings have increased.

What has changed?

[cactusflinthead 27,603]

Damn. I have been at work since the early morning. No chance for a look at the news. I know what to expect from Twitter, it will be good and bad. 

Canada has a lot of guns. They don't seem to have the same problem with mass shootings. It's harder to qualify for it, but it is certainly done. We've made it harder to cook speed to the point you have to sign for antihistamines. If you get a large amount of certain kinds of fertilizer you have to report it to Homeland Security. 

We can do a lot to curtail the access to both the bullets and firearms. It's a matter of having the will to do it. 

It shouldn't be harder to buy snot pills than bullets. 

[SDG 3,319]

7 minutes ago, Kyle said:

I absolutely don't want to Cloak Room this thread, but there my sense is there is a reasonable alignment among those who hold these two POV:
1. The war on drugs isn't working, legalize / decriminalize 

2. Launch a war on guns

I am not mixing the two subjects, but if one believes a war on drugs failed, it makes little sense to believe a war on guns would succeed. That does not mean there should not restrictions on firearms, but like most the issue is significantly more complicated. I am neither passionately pro- or anti-gun, but access to guns is no different or possibly more difficult than 25 years ago; yet, mass shootings have increased.

What has changed?

There was quite a bit of good discussion about the changes up thread.  

[Helobious 9,464]

Some of these theories in this thread about why this happened are hilarious. Yeah, I'm sure this former marine just never had any outlet for his aggression or need for physical activity. We don't yet know what this guy's home life or upbringing was like, how much time he even spent on social media, or what video games he played, or what movies he watched, or what his sex life was like, etc. All it comes down to is that he was a sick person with a gun. That's all it ever comes down to. 

[Tired of Lurking 637]

So ahead of his time.
 

 

[Buzzrock 14,944]

In the day of instant gratification and constant information, we've disabled our ability as a society to actually engage in social discourse.  Wide open alone-ness.  Communicative introvertedness.  Constant barrages of communication from all directions, none of it with any substance.  We are crippled in our on minds and paralyzed by our own thoughts, living in a big world where we've built insulated caves in our own minds.  

There’s something to this. My sister is 41 and has had terrible anxiety since high school. She absolutely LIVES on Facebook.

[Buzzrock 14,944]

These stories will eventually be at the level of a traffic fatality:  won't make the national news.    

Ironically that could help.

[Tired of Lurking 637]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tasneemnashrulla/thousand-oaks-shooting-victims

[Dilligas 666]

1 hour ago, Sbbruin said:

Any suggestion of moving the ball forward when it comes to practical, AND MORE STRINGENT, gun laws- by way of example guns not sold freely at gun shows, mental health and more thorough background checks, elimination of large capacity magazines to name a few, at least shows a willingness to engage in the discussion.  Right now every suggestion is met with fierce resistance.

I’ve bought several weapons the last couple years, (rifles, pistols, shotgun) and love the freedom to do it. But I’m all in favor of making it more difficult to do so. Check the hell out of people, I’m in favor of stricter laws. I don’t need extended clips or bump stocks, why does anyone need that?

[Buzzrock 14,944]

Easy access to guns = mass shootings in America on almost a daily basis
Restricted access to guns = almost zero mass shootings in other countries
 
Stop talking about fucking father figures, video games, mental illness, etc. That is not an uniquely American issue. Guns are. 
 

We’ve always had easy access to guns in this country. We haven’t always had frequent mass shootings.

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

1 hour ago, Buzzrock said:

 

There’s something to this. My sister is 41 and has had terrible anxiety since high school. She absolutely LIVES on Facebook.

 

Facebook and social media exacerbate those issues. Most people only post things that make their lives appear happy and great, and it skews perception. A mother may post a picture while taking her kids to the zoo. It appears happy, but the mother is stressed and may fight the urge to chase a bottle of sleeping pills with a bottle of vodka that night. Other mothers see her photos and think she is just grand so why aren't they.  Meanwhile, the first mother thinks the same thing about them when she sees them in pictures at junior's bday party and even smiling at their husbands who, in reality, spent the last week on the couch due to constant arguing. Throw a few actual loners into the mix who only know all these "friends" in passing, and the loners truly believe their life sucks while not realizing facebook has caused 90 percent of people to think everyone else has it better. 

[Buzzrock 14,944]

Facebook and social media exacerbate those issues. Most people only post things that make their lives appear happy and great, and it skews perception. A mother may post a picture while taking her kids to the zoo. It appears happy, but the mother is stressed and may fight the urge to chase a bottle of sleeping pills with a bottle of vodka that night. Other mothers see her photos and think she is just grand so why aren't they.  Meanwhile, the first mother thinks the same thing about them when she sees them in pictures at junior's bday party and even smiling at their husbands who, in reality, spent the last week on the couch due to constant arguing. Throw a few actual loners into the mix who only know all these "friends" in passing, and the loners truly believe their life sucks while not realizing facebook has caused 90 percent of people to think everyone else has it better. 

It also makes it easy for her to surround herself online with people who think exactly like she does on most any issue.

[Hank Kingsley 21,056]

38 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:

 

We’ve always had easy access to guns in this country. We haven’t always had frequent mass shootings.

 

Right. Population has increased and society has changed. If other countries can avoid continuous mass shootings, why can’t we? The answer is easy access to guns. Time to adapt.

[XYZ 2,154]

Same exact thread after every mass shooting. Why don’t y’all demand a constitutional convention and re-write the second amendment? It’s worded ambiguously. Fix it. Actually, never mind that, Americans never get together to demand anything.

[smuggs 9,353]

45 minutes ago, XYZ said:

Actually, never mind that, Americans never get together to demand anything.

The fuck we don’t, bitch.

 

 

 

[JohnnyRage 1,617]

Pride in the compensation for your work.

Getting laid, being loved.

A Spiritual path.

 

All separate from gun control. Start with the stigma for asking for help. It's a health issue.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

12 hours ago, alincoln said:

Nothing can or will be done about these shootings.  They are now part and parcel of the unique American experience.  If anything, they will only increase in frequency and severity as the number of young men living meaningless lives continues to expand.  

Men in this country are doing worse than women in this country when it comes to life expectancy, educational attainment and almost any meaningful metric. You will never hear a peep about it in the national discourse. There are millions of men struggling, discontent, not working or in shit paying jobs since good paying manufacturing jobs have gone away. You don’t hear a peep about it in the media.

[SquishMitten 10,439]

Some far-right candidates were claiming their opponents this past Tuesday are suggesting just this. #nocloakroom

Don’t be obtuse. Damn near every one of them also claimed their opponent was for “open borders” also. None of it is real

[Newdoc 3,453]

3 hours ago, Buzzrock said:

 

There’s something to this. My sister is 41 and has had terrible anxiety since high school. She absolutely LIVES on Facebook.

 

Yeah, nothing like anyone on Surly.

[hookemATL 11,907]

49 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

Men in this country are doing worse than women in this country when it comes to life expectancy, educational attainment and almost any meaningful metric. You will never hear a peep about it in the national discourse. There are millions of men struggling, discontent, not working or in shit paying jobs since good paying manufacturing jobs have gone away. You don’t hear a peep about it in the media.

Won’t someone please think of the poor, disenfranchised white men?!?  /helen lovejoy

this guy was a fucking loser lacking the skills or desire to be a contributing member of society. I’m glad he is dead, just wish he had not wreaked so much havoc getting to that point. 

Life is hard. Get through it day by day like everyone else or find some help to get some perspective.  If not, walk into the woods, wrap your mouth around your precious precious gun and become compost. Don’t force yourself into it by first murdering innocents that have zilch to do with your insecurities and issues. 

[Sbbruin 21,894]

So just spoke to my sister.  my nephew was with the first group of first responders to get there.  He got the officer who was shot onto a gurney, then was escorted in by officers as they weren’t sure the shooter was dead.  That was quickly determined.  He told my sister that the scene was more horrific than he could ever have imagined.  And he wa terrified he was going to know one or more of the victims.  He didn’t.  But he told her when he looked down at one young girl, she was riddled with bullet holes and covered in blood, and he lost it.  But he and 2 guys had to go about tagging each of the victims.  He’s goona be fucked for awhile.

 

oh and then a massive fire broke out nearby this afternoon and he was called to deal with that.  But probably a good thing to get his mind off of last night.

He’s a great kid.  Hope he gets some help to deal with this.  I know they’ll get it for him.

[Homesickhorn 2,208]

That video is soul crushing. 

I shouldn’t have watched it. I keep finding myself walking back into Little Homesick’s room to check on him. He’s been asleep since 8pm. I think I’ve gone in to check on him 20 times just to make sure he’s still there.

[Nivek 16,987]

I’m not really a crier.  I cried.

I teared up a little. I am just numb to this now.

[Brisketexan 105,369]

I shouldn’t have watched it. I keep finding myself walking back into Little Homesick’s room to check on him. He’s been asleep since 8pm. I think I’ve gone in to check on him 20 times just to make sure he’s still there.

It’s brutal. I just listened to the audio on the way home, and it was too damn much.

But it won’t matter. Nobody in this country is changing their mind about anything.

Might as well sticky a post about “another mass shooting” at the top of the page, and on and on it will go.

[Fozzz 152]

It has truly become a very sad ritual. 

[Born to Run 6,569]

The image of the Vegas guy just blasting away for hours broke me in some way. Or numbed me. I don’t know what it is, but it’s fucked up. This news event passed through my consciousness like another fender bender on my commute.

[Lhorn 4,966]

Terrible day.  I like to consider myself a normal person and as such can't understand how people can do shit like this to random innocent people, or anyone for that matter.  I try to remind myself that in a nation of 300+ million occurrences like this are going to happen but I look at the way people treat each other on social media, the intolerance people have regarding politics, etc and I'm left with the feeling that mental illness is not as uncommon as I'd like to believe it is.   

[Born to Run 6,569]

Men in this country are doing worse than women in this country when it comes to life expectancy, educational attainment and almost any meaningful metric. You will never hear a peep about it in the national discourse. There are millions of men struggling, discontent, not working or in shit paying jobs since good paying manufacturing jobs have gone away. You don’t hear a peep about it in the media.

-Maybe if Goosestepping Morons started reading books instead of burning them.

“Never hear a peep” that’s bullshit. All of those topics are discussed in media, academia- fuck even at “the middle school coffee with the principle” And the reasons behind those trends are pretty easy to understand.

[Helobious 9,464]

Details starting to emerge about the shooter (how many times have you heard that?). He was divorced, deployed to Afghanistan from 2010-2011, came home and attended local colleges to study athletic training, and had an interest in motorcycles. He also apparently had a circle of friends (including females) he would go out to the bar where the shooting happened with. Seemed to start having troubles with the law a couple years ago. He still may have been a loner, but he certainly isn't the totally isolated shut-in that many thought he was.

It kind of sounds like he was a somewhat normal guy. And to me that's the scariest part. 

[NorthLoop 14,248]

4 minutes ago, Helobious said:

Details starting to emerge about the shooter (how many times have you heard that?). He was divorced, deployed to Afghanistan from 2010-2011, came home and attended local colleges to study athletic training, and had an interest in motorcycles. He also apparently had a circle of friends (including females) he would go out to the bar where the shooting happened with. Seemed to start having troubles with the law a couple years ago. He still may have been a loner, but he certainly isn't the totally isolated shut-in that many thought he was.

It kind of sounds like he was a somewhat normal guy. And to me that's the scariest part. 

Yeah I have a coworker that fits the first part of this description to a T.  Hell he even admittedly plays shooter games nonstop by himself all weekend long when he's not on the phone with his daughter across the country who lives with his ex wife. But guess what... dude is one of the most stable people I know. Honestly if a shooter ever entered my building I'd make sure to find this guy and stick with him.