Русский корабль - иди нахуй

[MissingInAction 25140]

1 hour ago, Viper said:

 

 

 

 

Thank you.

[Chad Fuck 17712]

11 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

Are you being serious, or purposefully silly? How many NATO countries want to actively send in troops to kick Russia out of there? The US certainly doesn't. 

I do agree with others that Poland and the Baltic States are probably rarin' to go, but virtually the rest of NATO has no desire to send their own troops in there. In the US, politically it would be a disaster for the president and political party that did such a thing.

I do feel alarmist about the power plant right now, particularly after what happened with the dam, but I'm not seeing the kind of rhetoric from the US and other countries I'd like to about the issue. Mostly we're still collectively dithering about whether it was Ukraine or Russia that blew it up (narrator: It was Russia). 

Anyway, that's not going to be a realistic option. Remember, one member nation can veto any new member. That's why Turkiye can keep Sweden of all places out of NATO. There's simply no way you're going to get every NATO country to agree to such a deal. 

Call me crazy, but I feel like in spite, or perhaps in addition to, the Poles deep seated animosity towards the Russians, part of the reason they're so all-in for helping Ukraine is it takes the attention away from the fact that they have been traveling down the authoritarian track for a while.  In my mind, they're basically Hungary with a hard-on to kill Russians.  Which is fine, for now.

[Deej 76873]

44 minutes ago, Grade of D as in David said:

Poland is licking their chops to jump in and kick Russian ass.

I don't know who hates Russia more. Poles or Ukraine.

Poland:

 

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

 

10 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

Are you being serious, or purposefully silly? How many NATO countries want to actively send in troops to kick Russia out of there? The US certainly doesn't. 

I do agree with others that Poland and the Baltic States are probably rarin' to go, but virtually the rest of NATO has no desire to send their own troops in there. In the US, politically it would be a disaster for the president and political party that did such a thing.

I do feel alarmist about the power plant right now, particularly after what happened with the dam, but I'm not seeing the kind of rhetoric from the US and other countries I'd like to about the issue. Mostly we're still collectively dithering about whether it was Ukraine or Russia that blew it up (narrator: It was Russia). 

Anyway, that's not going to be a realistic option. Remember, one member nation can veto any new member. That's why Turkiye can keep Sweden of all places out of NATO. There's simply no way you're going to get every NATO country to agree to such a deal. 

It was mostly said in jest. It's not the right time to make that move but I know it would improve the situation in Ukraine and expedite the end of this war (in their territory anyways). It also shows the world (China), that we really won't abide these types of transgressions. By jumping into one war, you may stop another. Maybe not. Yall need to chill, just throwing a hypothetical out there. 

[SL Xpress 7517]

Lots of indications by completely untrustworthy twitter posters that there's a massive night offensive going on towards Tokmak. 

Apparently there's 6 layers of defense between the frontline and the town itself. 

I guess we'll see. Just as likely to be more probing. 

[bolverk 29705]

 

Really good thread giving detailed info about the possible Ukrainian push toward Mariupol.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1666513162928005127.html

This GOOGLE MAP LINK will be helpful for finding the names of towns identified in the above analysis.

[Rimbo 26028]

uhh

i don't know who this gandalf is but everyone else is retweeting him

[bolverk 29705]

My previous post covers the Eastern attack. Tokmak direction is the western one.

 

 

Edited June 7, 2023 by bolverk

[Rimbo 26028]

GO GET EM BOYS

[BamaATL 16593]

You know, I'm thinking the next 24 hours or so are going to be good on a lot of fronts

Ah skeet skeet skeet motherfucker

[BamaATL 16593]

11 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

uhh

i don't know who this gandalf is but everyone else is retweeting him

He just got evicted from his grandmother's basement

[bolverk 29705]

11 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

uhh

i don't know who this gandalf is but everyone else is retweeting him

 

I'm unfamiliar with him too, but he seems to be on the front with a good following (and maybe recently promoted).

Earlier tweets:

[bolverk 29705]

4 minutes ago, BamaATL said:

He just got evicted from his grandmother's basement

But this is probably more right.

[Hefeweizen 5328]

He just got to the shire and Bilbo kicked his ass out.

[Nivek 16951]

3 hours ago, KYHorn said:

https://twitter.com/albafella1/status/1666523483222822916?t=JCrtzQ8yiazJAvByCqdT5A&s=19b 

Is there a version of the Cajun Navy available out there?  

[SL Xpress 7517]

22 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

uhh

i don't know who this gandalf is but everyone else is retweeting him

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illia_Samoilenko_(officer)

Spoiler

Illia Samoilenko (officer)

Illia Samoilenko (Ukrainian: Ілля Сергійович Самойленко; born 10 July 1994[1]) is a Ukrainian serviceman, an intelligence officer of the Azov Regiment[2][3][4] of the National Guard of Ukraine,[5][6] and a participant in the Russian-Ukrainian war.

 

Biography[edit]

Samoilenko studied at the Faculty of History of the Taras Shevchenko National University of Kyiv. He dreams of completing his studies after the war. His callsign is Gandalf.[7][8]

In 2015, he began military service in the ATO/OOS zone as part of the Azov Regiment when he was 21 years old. He lost his left arm and right eye during the fighting (he now has a titanium mechanical prosthesis and an artificial eye).[9]

Since the beginning of the blockade of Mariupol, he and his colleagues were in the Azovstal iron and steel works. From the basement of the plant, Samoilenko gave several news updates.[10] On May 8, 2022, he held a press conference for representatives of foreign media in English.[11][12]

He was captured on May 20, 2022.[13] In an interview to the BBC he said that he was held in solitary confinement in Russia for 120 days.[14]

On September 21, 2022, he was released from captivity.[15][16]

Here's the BBC interview referenced in the Wikipedia entry:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63231457

Spoiler

Ukraine Azovstal: Released man says Azov fighters kept in inhumane conditions by Russia

• Published
  13 October 2022

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Related Topics

• Russia-Ukraine war

 

Image caption,

Illia Samoilenko was released in a prisoner exchange last month

By Hugo Bachega

BBC News, Kyiv

 

Ukrainian fighters who surrendered after weeks besieged deep under the Azovstal steelworks in the port city of Mariupol were kept in inhumane conditions by Russia, a released fighter has told the BBC.

Lt Illia Samoilenko told the BBC that he had been held in Russia in solitary confinement for 120 days and feared he would never return to Ukraine.

Russian forces, he said, confiscated his prosthetic arm after his capture.

The Azov Regiment fighter was released in a prisoner swap last month.

Lt Samoilenko, who is 28, lost his right eye and left arm after ammunition exploded in his hand while he was on a Ukrainian military mission against Russian-backed separatists in the eastern Donbas region, in 2018.

The first thing he bought when he returned to Ukraine was a pack of cigarettes, "to feel alive," he said.

 

"I'm happy to see the people who've been waiting for me, and the tears of joy in their faces and their smiles".

In the first international media interview by an Azov fighter since some were released in a major, and surprising, prisoner swap between Russia and Ukraine last month, he claimed some of his fellow fighters held separately had been tortured and denied adequate medical treatment and food.

"Obvious things" happened, Lt Samoilenko told me in Kyiv, where he was recovering after being freed. "Obvious things that people who are captured are tortured by the Russians".

Russia denies torturing or mistreating prisoners of war, although Ukrainian officials say fighters have suffered abuse in Russian captivity.

 

IMAGE SOURCE,REUTERS Image caption,

Ukrainian fighters were holed up in the steelworks in Mariupol for weeks

Lt Samoilenko was among the hundreds of troops who were besieged by the Russian military in the underground tunnels and bunkers of the vast Azovstal steelworks, under relentless bombing.

They refused to surrender until an order came from Ukraine's top military commanders, which put an end to the battle for the port city of Mariupol, the deadliest and most destructive in this war so far.

 

The fighters left the city carrying few personal belongings, looking exhausted and with visible wounds. Some were walking on crutches. They were taken on buses to Russian-controlled territory.

They were first taken on buses to Olenivka, a prison in an area of Donetsk controlled by Russian-backed separatists, Lt Samoilenko said.

Days later, he and others, mostly Azov leaders, were transferred to an undisclosed location in Russia. He says he was kept alone in a cell, he recalled, where he did push-ups and sit-ups and kept track of the time by mentally counting the days.

"[But] I wasn't physically tortured," he said, "so it was far from the things people suffered in other places".

Those who were sent to other locations, he alleged, faced conditions that were "very, very poor", which worsened "with each new week".

Some of those released last month told him they had been given limited amounts of water, and that some were malnourished.

 

 

IMAGE SOURCE,REUTERS Image caption,

The exhausted Ukrainian fighters were taken by bus to Olenivka prison after they surrendered

In July, an explosion at Olenivka killed dozens of Ukrainian prisoners. Russia said the site was attacked by Ukraine, an allegation the Ukrainian government dismissed as cynical, accusing Russia of trying to destroy evidence of torture and killing.

Russia, Lt Samoilenko said, ignored the rules of war. "They didn't care about the Geneva [Conventions]. They don't care about the lives of people." However, he said he could not share more details yet.

"The Russians are also watching these interviews," he said. "When they see our happy faces, they're becoming more mad."

Days before the Azovstal surrender in May, Lt Samoilenko led a news conference that was broadcast live from a bunker beneath the steel works. For almost two hours, he described the desperate conditions for wounded fighters, and said he and all the others saw themselves as "dead men".

In Russia, the Azov Regiment to which he belongs is vilified by many because of its initial roots as a militia with links to the far-right, and it is used in Russia propaganda to justify President Vladimir Putin's baseless claim that he is "de-Nazifying" Ukraine. After their capture, some Russians defended harsh prison sentences for the Azov fighters; others called for their execution.

But in Ukraine, the fighters are symbols of the resistance against the Russian invasion, and celebrated on billboards. "I don't think personally that I am a hero," Lt Samoilenko told me.

Their release, which saw 215 Ukrainians and 55 Russians exchanged, was seen as a victory for President Volodymyr Zelensky, and a source of national jubilation. The deal happened amid embarrassing Russian setbacks on the battlefield, and how it was brokered remains a mystery.

But the release was bittersweet, Lt Samoilenko said, as many of his "comrades and battle brothers" remained in captivity, and "the Russians were still torturing them, keeping them in inhumane conditions".

Living with his family in Kyiv, his hometown, Lt Samoilenko is waiting for a new prosthetic hand, and receiving psychological counselling. Because soon, he said, "we have to return to the battlefield".

 

[SL Xpress 7517]

11 minutes ago, bolverk said:

But this is probably more right.

No. He's pretty much a badass. But he's part of the Azov Battalion, so he ends up getting entwined with the neo Nazi propaganda that group gets associated with. He still may be in his grandmother's basement right now, but it's without an eye and with a prosthetic left arm suffered in combat, neither of which stopped him from serving in Mariupol in the Azovstal Steelworks, until their surrender. 

[BamaATL 16593]

2 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

No. He's pretty much a badass. But he's part of the Azov Battalion, so he ends up getting entwined with the neo Nazi propaganda that group gets associated with. He still may be in his grandmother's basement right now, but it's without an eye and with a prosthetic left arm suffered in combat, neither of which stopped him from serving in Mariupol in the Azovstal Steelworks, until their surrender. 

Just for the record, I was joking, i hope he's right.  If the Bradley's are in play, it's going to be a fucking slaughter.  

[Rimbo 26028]

2 minutes ago, BamaATL said:

Just for the record, I was joking, i hope he's right.  If the Bradley's are in play, it's going to be a fucking slaughter.  

[SL Xpress 7517]

All the twitter warriors telling posters to be quiet about the offensive. Give me a fucking break. Making sure everyone on twitter stays quiet about a major offensive underway is as likely as holding water with a sieve. 

[SL Xpress 7517]

Horrific article about what is occurring on the Russian occupied side of the Dnipro River. 

"...the Russians allegedly destroyed people's means of escape. Serhiy's parents told him the Russians went through the town and rounded up or destroyed all the boats they could find in the weeks before triggering the explosion that caused Ukraine's most lurid catastrophe in decades.

"They stole the boats before all this... all the landings, they carried out all the boats," said Serhiy, paraphrasing what his parents told him. "It's like they were preparing for this to specially create a situation so that no one could escape."

"We thought they were looting. Now I understand that there was a specific command to remove all means of flotation so that people couldn't save themselves."

Oleh said that his aunt told him a similar story.

"They (the boats) were taken away," he said, quoting her. "People whose houses were locked kept their boats. The ones on the pier were smashed, shot up, or taken away."

https://kyivindependent.com/they-are-destroying-us-people-plea-to-escape-flooded-russian-occupied-areas/

Allegedly Oleshky, a town of 24,000 pre invasion, is expected to be completely submerged.

Spoiler

After destroying the Nova Kakhovka dam and stranding thousands of Ukrainians in the catastrophic flood zone, Russians prevented people in occupied territories from fleeing or rescuing others, multiple accounts revealed on June 7.

About 80 settlements and 16,000 people were estimated to be in the critical areas. The lower eastern bank of the Dnipro, occupied by Russia, suffered the worst of the damage.

The town of Hola Prystan was 85% flooded by mid-afternoon and was expected to be completely flooded by the end of the day, with the water reaching 3.5 meters, according to the city's military administration director Svitlana Linnik. There were 6,000 people in the city when the dam was blown up.

Oleshky, a city with a pre-invasion population of 24,000 people, is likely to be completely submerged as well. It's expected to be days before the waters recede, letting people take stock of the damage. Many lost all their belongings, including their legal documents.

Social media is flooded with photos and videos of people sitting on rooftops as the water laps around them, with dwindling supplies and no way to escape. A woman pulling a small, frightened dog out of the murky floodwaters before trying to save what things she could. Occasional boats pass between the roofs and treetops that break through the surface.

The Kyiv Independent spoke with family members of people living under Russian occupation in Oleshky and collected accounts that residents posted on social media from the affected occupied areas.

They spoke of being trapped, either lacking the vehicles or fuel to escape or being blocked from leaving by the Russian occupying forces.

Russian news service TASS at 9:10 a.m. on June 7 claimed that 1,300 people were evacuated. Russia's top collaborator in Kherson Oblast, Volodymyr Saldo, stated that people who endured material losses will get financial aid and that children are being transported to occupied Kherson Oblast and Crimea to "good holiday camps."

But people in the area or their relatives said there was no evacuation to speak of whatsoever.

"Right now, many people are sitting on the roofs in Oleshky," said Oleh – he has an aunt and a disabled nephew in the town. He described what they had been doing until their eventual rescue.

"They have neither food nor water. People helped to carry the son upstairs, and they did not take anything with them," he said. "They're sitting there waving some red rag. Boats are passing by, but no one has picked them up yet."

A photograph published by a local Telegram channel shows people escaping the flooding on a rooftop in a Russian-occupied settlement in Kherson Oblast. (Nykolaevskyi Vanek/Telegram)

Serhiy, whose parents are trapped in Oleshky, shared a voice message from one of his acquaintances with the Kyiv Independent. This woman, who did not reveal her name, said the situation in the town is critical, with many children, elderly and disabled people stuck on their roofs for many hours.

She said Russian troops set up checkpoints in the less-flooded areas to "prevent" locals from escaping the disaster area or saving others, and she heard of people drowning.

"They are destroying (us)," she cried.

The water rose in a matter of hours, said Serhiy. Many people are sitting on the upper floors, while some residents are trying to rescue their loved ones.

The victims' attempts to escape by boat or otherwise were thwarted by Russian forces, who wouldn't let anyone leave if they didn't have a Russian passport. Numerous people even reported being fired upon when they tried to escape the flooded areas.

Politico reported that Russian forces blocked people who tried to flee immediately after the dam's destruction, forcing them to wait at home for an official list of evacuees that would be bussed out of the area.

What are the consequences of the Kakhovka dam’s demolition?

"The orcs abandoned the city," said Yevhen Rischuk, Oleshky's mayor in exile. "People are sitting on the roofs of houses. There are no boats in the city. The curfew is not canceled. Genocide."

Worse, the Russians allegedly destroyed people's means of escape. Serhiy's parents told him the Russians went through the town and rounded up or destroyed all the boats they could find in the weeks before triggering the explosion that caused Ukraine's most lurid catastrophe in decades.

"They stole the boats before all this... all the landings, they carried out all the boats," said Serhiy, paraphrasing what his parents told him. "It's like they were preparing for this to specially create a situation so that no one could escape."

"We thought they were looting. Now I understand that there was a specific command to remove all means of flotation so that people couldn't save themselves."

Oleh said that his aunt told him a similar story.

"They (the boats) were taken away," he said, quoting her. "People whose houses were locked kept their boats. The ones on the pier were smashed, shot up, or taken away."

The occupation authorities themselves have vanished from Oleshky, Serhiy said. But civilians trying to flee were blocked from doing so.

"Yesterday, people tried to escape, so (the Russians) fired assault rifles in the air, and didn't allow anyone to leave," Oleh said.

Only people with Russian passports were being allowed to leave, multiple people confirmed.

Tetiana Akhtemenko, a resident of Antonivka, told Ukrainian TV that her family members spoke of a "very bad situation – the water keeps rising, but they're forbidding evacuation, shooting at people's legs. There were a few attempts to throw grenades" at people if they saw them attempting to escape.

Russians are also blocking volunteers from trying to help people, Ukrainian news site Texty reported, citing a woman whose residents are in the flood zone. The Russian forces have not explained to the locals the reason behind their actions. Even Russian volunteers, who arrived to help people from Crimea, were halted at the Russian checkpoints, according to Ukrainian volunteer Andriy Kniga, whose family members are in the disaster area.

With electrical outages and no mobile connections in affected towns, many people lost track of their trapped family members, many of whom are seniors or have mobility issues.

Telegram chats are filled with hundreds of people begging anyone available to rescue their loved ones, describing their situations as critical. Many of these pleas describe people sitting in attics and on rooftops in the villages of Kardashynka, Solontsy, and others. Volunteers ask people to geotag locations where trapped Ukrainians need evacuation.

One of them says that three families of seven people, with a dog and a parrot, are stuck on the rooftop somewhere in the village of Krynky with little food and drinking water.

"If only somebody could provide them with some supplies," the message on one of the local Telegram chats reads.

Another message says that two women and a retiree who can not move without support are trying to save themselves by hiding on a rooftop of a two-storied building in Hola Prystan. Like many others, they are stuck there with little food and water.

"Please help to evacuate people. The water is coming, and the current is increasing," the message reads.

 

[SL Xpress 7517]

Not endorsing the message in the tweet, but the video is horrific. 

Here's a "better" video:

 

Edited June 8, 2023 by SL Xpress

[Deej 76873]

Give Ukraine whatever they need.

[atomheartbevo 89770]

1 hour ago, SL Xpress said:

All the twitter warriors telling posters to be quiet about the offensive. Give me a fucking break. Making sure everyone on twitter stays quiet about a major offensive underway is as likely as holding water with a sieve. 

Especially when Russian-language social media is full of tons of stuff from Russian soldiers.

[Auto Driller 2506]

4 hours ago, Rimbo said:

who the fuck is "auto driller" and why is he negging this

did we just find GRU's new sock?

Explain to me, if you will, why Russia “needs” buffer states for their security? They don’t need shit. Fuck rationalizing and sympathizing why they attack their neighbors. I’m more confused why people pos-repped this post.

[Auto Driller 2506]

4 hours ago, Rimbo said:

You're thinking far too short-term. Russia has been invaded twice in the past 250 years alone, surviving by torching their own infrastructure and due to shit weather. There are no natural borders between Western Europe and Moscow to otherwise slow down another invasion.

Whatever the current political reality, this geography will not ever change, and will always be a security problem for whatever regime is in charge in Moscow.

But it works both ways. It's also a problem for Western Europe.

Russia should do what every other country does and use their military to defend their own borders. You don’t have to attack and take over your neighbors house to make sure no one steals your car out of the garage. I imagine the 200,000+ dead and wounded in Ukraine probably would have been able to defend Belgorod.

The idea that Moscow needs buffer states for their own security is pure Putin/FSB propaganda.

 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5797]

2 hours ago, SL Xpress said:

I read it as more of a threat to places like France and Germany, if countries like Hungary and Turkiye try to slow everyone's roll. 

It's very difficult for me to see Poland sending in troops in the near term. 

 

[Born to Run 6569]

Explain to me, if you will, why Russia “needs” buffer states for their security? They don’t need shit. Fuck rationalizing and sympathizing why they attack their neighbors. I’m more confused why people pos-repped this post.

They don't, and I think it's important that Nato doesn't directly enter the fight for Ukraine -as much as I'd like to stop the genocide. They are not Nato. If Russia triggers Article 5 then light em up. If Nato starts annexing non Nato countries and Nato starts telling Russia to leave or we Annex , it completely invalidates the strength of Article 5 and reinforces Russian and Chinese positions and propaganda and is a great way to start WW3 with a couple coalitions annexing chess pieces and making threats.

[Rimbo 26028]

9 minutes ago, Auto Driller said:

Russia should do what every other country does and use their military to defend their own borders. You don’t have to attack and take over your neighbors house to make sure no one steals your car out of the garage. I imagine the 200,000+ dead and wounded in Ukraine probably would have been able to defend Belgorod.

The idea that Moscow needs buffer states for their own security is pure Putin/FSB propaganda.

 

Amazing.

You managed to be wrong about nearly every single thing.

It's not pro-Putin propaganda. It should be pretty clear I'm the furthest thing from that, since my conclusion from this is that Moscow needs to be eliminated entirely or colonized.

[The Dog 44073]

[atomheartbevo 89770]

[dimyh 1874]

24 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

Amazing.

You managed to be wrong about nearly every single thing.

It's not pro-Putin propaganda. It should be pretty clear I'm the furthest thing from that, since my conclusion from this is that Moscow needs to be eliminated entirely or colonized.

Umm I think you're misreading his msg. Auto is saying that Putin's strategic logic for external buffer states is bullshit. If Russia simply focused on not being an asshole to its neighbors and simply focused on basic border security then they wouldn't have all of these mythical "threats" to their national security.

[atomheartbevo 89770]

[Homesickhorn 2208]

6 hours ago, Post Oak said:

Same could be said for aggie

Hasn't this poor woman been through enough already.

Her accent, and penchant for watching videos of Russians being blown up, just have a hold on me.

[Viper 12111]

4 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

[Auto Driller 2506]

9 minutes ago, dimyh said:

Umm I think you're misreading his msg. Auto is saying that Putin's strategic logic for external buffer states is bullshit. If Russia simply focused on not being an asshole to its neighbors and simply focused on basic border security then they wouldn't have all of these mythical "threats" to their national security.

Exactly. Russia’s idea of a security threat is a country that won’t allow themselves to be controlled politically and economically.

Today’s “buffer states” eventually become “security threats” when the people get tired of eating Russian shit sandwiches. So they have to be taken over. Now they are “border regions”. Naturally, these regions need some buffer states for security reasons. This is how Russian imperialism works.

Yes, Russia has been invaded a few times over the last 300 years. Cry me a fucking river. So has everyone else. 

[texastough 1129]

If you accept that nobody is going to invade Russia, even if its military is wiped off the map in Ukraine -- short of that, the free world should be focusing on de-nuking Russia. Maintain sanctions and starve the entire country until complete denuclearization. 

[Pato del Muerto 52545]

Overture, curtain, lights
This is it, the night of nights 
No more rehearsing and nursing a part 
We know every part by heart 
Overture, curtain, lights 
This is it, we'll hit the heights 
And oh what heights we'll hit 
On with the show this is it.

Tonight what heights we'll hit. 
On with the show, this is it!

[MagicSoccerSpray 1732]

 

[Rimbo 26028]

1 hour ago, Born to Run said:

1 hour ago, Auto Driller said:

Explain to me, if you will, why Russia “needs” buffer states for their security? They don’t need shit. Fuck rationalizing and sympathizing why they attack their neighbors. I’m more confused why people pos-repped this post.

They don't, and I think it's important that Nato doesn't directly enter the fight for Ukraine -as much as I'd like to stop the genocide. They are not Nato. If Russia triggers Article 5 then light em up. If Nato starts annexing non Nato countries and Nato starts telling Russia to leave or we Annex , it completely invalidates the strength of Article 5 and reinforces Russian and Chinese positions and propaganda and is a great way to start WW3 with a couple coalitions annexing chess pieces and making threats.

 

58 minutes ago, dimyh said:

Umm I think you're misreading his msg. Auto is saying that Putin's strategic logic for external buffer states is bullshit. If Russia simply focused on not being an asshole to its neighbors and simply focused on basic border security then they wouldn't have all of these mythical "threats" to their national security.

 

44 minutes ago, Auto Driller said:

Exactly. Russia’s idea of a security threat is a country that won’t allow themselves to be controlled politically and economically.

Today’s “buffer states” eventually become “security threats” when the people get tired of eating Russian shit sandwiches. So they have to be taken over. Now they are “border regions”. Naturally, these regions need some buffer states for security reasons. This is how Russian imperialism works.

Yes, Russia has been invaded a few times over the last 300 years. Cry me a fucking river. So has everyone else. 

 

OK. Let's start from the beginning here.

#1: This is not a Putin thing. It is a Russian thing.

It doesn't matter who is in charge in Moscow. It could be Putin, it could be the Soviets, it could be the Tsar, it could be a liberal democratic institution (ha!), it could be a dried up packet of Sea Monkeys -- any authority in Moscow is going to believe, with a great many centuries' worth of history proving this belief, that their Western border is vulnerable, and the only way (also perceived correctly) to mitigate this risk is to extend that border as far West as possible.

#2: Denying #1 is as much vatnik/tankie/pro-Kremlin bullshit as believing that #1 justifies what Russia has done.

If you deny it, you've opened the door to Russia invading Eastern Europe yet again because you're not going to properly recognize the threat that Moscow will always be towards Eastern Europe. Outside of a literal tectonic shift altering the geography between Moscow and Belgorod, this is a constant that anyone in Moscow will be painfully aware of, no matter how much you or anyone else wants to pretend it's not.

Our choice here is not whether #1 is true or false. It's true, and anyone who says otherwise is hopelessly naive. Our choice, once we've accepted #1 is true, is to decide what we must do about it. Because what it means is...

#3: Because #1 is true, any power in Moscow, no matter what, will always be an existential threat to Europe.

This is what Eastern European states understand that Western European states, and the USA, struggle with. Well, we didn't so much struggle with it under Reagan; Reagan understood the threat, at least to a point. Patton, with his deep knowledge of military history, understood the threat. Poland understands the threat. Ukraine has been under Moscow's yoke for a long, long time, and isn't going to want to be in that position again.

This is why, while I enjoy seeing the Russian rebels hitting Belgorod, the fact that some of them are legit Jew-hating swastika-bearing Nazis doesn't concern me nearly as much as the fact that any new Russian government they found will pose the same threat that Putin's regime did, that Stalin's regime did, that Peter the so-called Great's regime did.

#4: Because of #1 and #3, we should do what Patton said we should've done.

We should put troops on the ground to help Ukraine, and once we get to the Russian border, we should keep going until we hit Moscow.

Edited June 8, 2023 by Rimbo

[SL Xpress 7517]

5 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

 

Exports are cheaper. Money sent back home will go further  

I’ll also say that at least by every account I’ve read the ballots were counted fairly. That shouldn’t be taken for granted, especially in a country where one man has amassed as much power as Erdogan has. Obviously Erdogan’s party controls all state organs including the media, but the opposition could have run a better race, too. He’ll never be as vulnerable as he was in this election. It’s a shame they couldn’t win. 

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

1 hour ago, Auto Driller said:

Explain to me, if you will, why Russia “needs” buffer states for their security? They don’t need shit. Fuck rationalizing and sympathizing why they attack their neighbors. I’m more confused why people pos-repped this post.

If Russia wants buffer states they can concede their own fucking land for them.

[The Dog 44073]

[JesusSweatDuck 17787]

4 minutes ago, Grade of D as in David said:

If Russia wants buffer states they can concede their own fucking land for them.

I think that's exactly what he's saying

[The Dog 44073]

Still no signs of Bradleys yet…

[JesusSweatDuck 17787]

2 minutes ago, The Dog said:

[Parliament 14278]

Perhaps if Russia had spent the last 250 years trading with, helping and befriending their neighboring countries, they wouldn't NEED a buffer.  Like don't invade, rape and pillage.  Maybe Poland, Latvia, Finland, etc. wouldn't have all their weapons pointed east.

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

1 hour ago, The Dog said:

An article about stockpiling ammunition, just like the article the other day about the tip of the spear being NATO trained Ukrainian troops, this is to give more reasons/cover for the upcoming success of the counteroffensive.

 

I would bet some aircraft makes an appearance, and it's blitzkrieg 2.0. 

At this point I'm more concerned about getting Ukraine to stop at their borders and not go through to Moscow.

 

 

 

[Rimbo 26028]

2 minutes ago, The Dog said:

Still no signs of Bradleys yet…

[atomheartbevo 89770]

Edited June 8, 2023 by atomheartbevo