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Orange&White

Orange&White 5528

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56 minutes ago, Bevo said:

Going to the Clay Pit in a few hours. Are there some good Indian drinks?

I always get whatever their gin and tonic made with Empress gin is. I think it’s called Mumbai Nights.

Edit: And don’t pass on the jalapeño, cream cheese stuffed naan.

Edited by Orange&White
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AUS-97HORN
AUS-97HORN

For the love of Christ woman,  stop posting the same fucking thing every 20 mins just to make your neurotic self feel better.     Bring something useful to the thread other than your inane babbli

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InkaUtexas
InkaUtexas

I volunteered today. Log/Admin role to replace people for 30-60 days. The operation is in the west, or should the Orcs win will be pulled back behind the NATO wall. Either way the humanitarian effort

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atomheartbevo

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https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-aircraft-carrier-admiral-kuznetsov-delayed-again-2022-6

2024-2025 before Russia has its carrier back.
 

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The Russian Navy's sole aircraft carrier, which has been waylaid by years of malfunctions and maintenance issues, will require another year before it can return to service from ongoing repair and modernization work, a military source told Russian state media on Tuesday.

Designated a "heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser," Admiral Kuznetsov was built in the late 1980s and entered service in 1990, though it wasn't fully operational until 1995. With recent upgrades, it can carry roughly two dozen fighter jetsand 12 helicopters and is armed with anti-ship and anti-aircraft missiles.

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The carrier has been undergoing work at shipyards in northern Russia since 2017. Officials planned to return Kuznetsov to service in 2022, but in 2021 that was pushed to 2023.

The military source told the official TASS news agency this week that defects had been found in work being done on the carrier and that delivery would now be "no earlier than in 2024."

Quote

A fire on board as it sailed near Turkey in 2009 killed a crew member. A month later, an accident while it refueled off the coast of Ireland spilled 300 tons of oil into the ocean.

Kuznetsov has become known for the dark black smoke it emits and the tugboats that accompany it in case of breakdown — both of which were on display when it sailed to Syria in 2016 for its only combat deployment.

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During that deployment, two jets crashed into the ocean while attempting to land, prompting its air wing to redeploy to a base in Syria.

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The refit begun in 2017 was meant to extend Kuznetsov's service life another two decades, removing missile silos and adding new electronics and anti-aircraft systems as well as allowing it to carry 50 aircraft. Since then, however, Kuznetsov has only had more problems.

In 2018, a floating dry dock holding the carrier sank, bringing down a 70-ton crane that smashed a hole in the deck and killing one worker. A year later, a fire broke out while workers were welding in the engine room, killing two and injuring 11.

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Despite numerous proposals, including for a nuclear-powered carrier, the Soviet and Russian navies haven't fielded carriers with the size or capabilities of US carriers, in part because Moscow had competing priorities and limited resources.

Gotta be all that corruption, although incompetence also helps.

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dimyh

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5 hours ago, MillerEP said:

^Spin off thread, but as a big reader myself, I thought the whole thread was fascinating, y'all should take a look at the entire thing. Either way interesting to see the dominate pop culture in Russia is "Woe is us, we're so great and amazing and yet everybody shits all over us, so let's show them by going back and time and kill everyone."

As bullshit it may be, I can understand some of the sentiment. Personally I feel entirely weak and ineffectual watching this shit rage on in Ukraine. Aside from donating a little cash, I feel like I'm pacing the sidelines, unable to do anything but keep up with news reports. So I daydream about making my own story, fighting the good fight, or better yet, a game that allows me to live in that fantasy. In that regards I do have a game pitch to sell to a developer like Naughty Dog. A game like the Last of Us: a linear storyline with survival gameplay mechanics.

It would be inspired by Man on Fire, Apocalypse Now, and Going After Cacciato. Basically a revenge story but mixed with alt-history fantasy of trying to survive in a major warzone as an average citizen.

Prologue: You start out as a normal Ukrainian dad, with wife and a couple of kids, living in Odesa. You have a normal office type job, possibly a software engineer, someone moderately well off but not an exceptional individual. A typical Ukrainian everyman. There are rumors of the Russian invasion but you are blowing it off as just a political scare and not a real threat. Which is shattered on Feb 24th and you quickly have to scramble on a plan to evacuate your family and figure out what you are going to be doing. A tearful goodbye to your family as you ship them off on a bus ride to Lviv and eventually over the border to Poland (with an Easter egg of @Brisketexan's kid handing out breakfast burritos and chatting up the ladies in the background). The local militia doesn't have any concrete plans for you so you take the opportunity to go check on the rest of your family: your parents and your brother living in Kherson.

Act 1: As you journey east, you keep checking on news updates as you struggle to figure out what is going on and what best to do. Tidbits of news are dropped at different checkpoints. Finally making it into Kherson you find your parent but your brother has already moved east to report to duty in Mariupol. After a long discussion you can't convince them to evacuate, they think they are safe as long as they don't do anything wrong. You decide to push on to Mariupol to find your brother. Now you are starting to see more of war first hand, Russian troops are setting up checkpoints, you are seeing protestors stymy the invaders, some light shelling of cars and residents, and you are having to be more careful moving east. Eventually you make your way to Mariupol only to find it surrounded and under siege. You manage to find your way in, making connections with resistance groups and running various missions to help civilians in need while you still are trying to figure out what happened to your brother. You get to witness first hand some of brutality as you are still not enlisted to fight but simply someone trying to help people where needed. You are running around, bedding down in various places each night, meeting new people and hearing their stories when you get captured by a couple of Russians. They are marching you back when you get rescued by a couple of Azov guys and your...brother.

 

Act 2: Reunited with your sibling you find he's been learning from a few of the Azov guys and fighting throughout the city but everything is clamping down. Morale is down and while many are still steadfast they understand if people can get out then they won't hold it against them. So y'all hear about some of the humanitarian corridors and plan to sneak out that way but witness first hand the Russians reneging on the deal. It becomes one clusterfuck after another, sneaking through lines, but finally escaping from the city only to find y'all bouncing from town to town, trying to stay clear of the heavy action. You get picked up by a couple of Ukrainian soldiers making a resupply run to Sievierodonetsk where you connect with the other defensive forces in the area. Again caught in the action, you are running small missions supporting the regular ops teams, and learning to handle rifles and seeing NLAWS in action. Everything seems to be holding fine when a Russian artillery barrage catches everyone by surprise. Y'all are both knocked unconscious and wake up to find yourself firmly behind Russian lines as POWs. Also with you is a Russian deserter who is being held for refusing to fight. Between torture sessions that you and your brother are going through, you find out more of the perspective of the Russian soldier - originally a conscript deceived into signing a contact and never quite understood the full magnitude of the "special operation". Things are looking bleak when a counterattack levels part of the base and all 3 of y'all manage to escape. Deep in enemy territory y'all continue to evade forces until a Ukrainian drone strike ends up killing your brother. Now its just you and the deserter in a full panic fire drill.

 

Act 3: Y'all manage to escape to a calm zone. You are crushed, seeing your brother fragged right in front of your eyes. You are sick of all the bullshit witnessed first hand and you see the only way to make it stop is to cut the head off the snake --- kill Putin. The Russian is sick of the war too and he just wants to go home. So y'all concoct a new plan: help each other get through Russia until y'all reach his hometown of Kursk. Once there you will be on your own to infiltrate Moscow and perform the impossible. Y'all do make it to Kursk and you get to meet his parents with you disguised as a fellow soldier that was "released" from duty. However his parents are full propaganda swallowers and don't believe their own son's description of the war. Sick of his refusal to fight they kick y'all out. Now he is crushed too and decides to join you on the crazy assassination mission. Working into Moscow you do find out that there is a growing resistance movement upset about all of the crackdowns ("Once you have taken away our voices all we have left are our fists"). Y'all manage to hook up with this group and take on some sabotage missions and getting some precious intel on Putin's estate. With the resistance growing into a full bloom near civil war, you and the Russian deserter manage to make it into the compound. Putin's security forces are lighter than normal due to either busy dealing with protesters/resistance attacks or simply being paid off/jumping ship due to Putin's treatment, you have a slim chance of success.  Artfully working your way through the compound, hiding under dramatically long tables, you manage to take out the guards and corner Putin where you proceed to: Bash. His. Disgusting. Goblin. Face. In.

 

Epilogue: Once the climatic thrill of the kill subsides, you and your new Russian buddy realize it is not going fix everything but it is a big step to ending this nonsensical war. You invite him back to your home, to start up a new life in Ukraine, and rebuild from this misery. Y'all leave Moscow with Z symbols crashing down or being burned away to make it back to Kyiv where you wife and kids are returned. After a nice tearful reunion, the whole gang loads up in a car for a road trip back to Odesa, with new uncle Yuri laughing it up with your kids.

 

So yeah a full-fledged happy ending but hopefully a sobering journey through the helplessness of war. Gameplay is not going to be a Call of Duty run-n-gun type of action game but more focused on stealth and survival against the backdrop of a near total war. There should be enough time to meet the other common citizens caught in the crossfires and to hear their personal stories.  The first half of the game could be very factual, including real events from the conflict so that those stories are not forgotten. Plus interspersed nuggets such as the Bucha massacres to highlight that this is the first major war to fully include social media. Towards the midpoint it will veer into alt-history territory, where we can imagine your little journey becoming this epic assassination mission. At a meta level the story would have an underlying theme of how media/propaganda can be manipulated. Gamers should check out the events in the game and try to figure out which events were based on real moments and which ones were just pure fiction. Because one thing is very clear about this entire war: manipulating the propaganda to entice the population is dangerous enough, but for Putin to buy-in so deeply as well is catastrophic. Not all Russians buy-in to this nonsense but enough do to make this war possible. Getting people to (rationally) think for themselves is an important first defense against willful misinformation.

 

 

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Chad Fuck

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As bullshit it may be, I can understand some of the sentiment. Personally I feel entirely weak and ineffectual watching this shit rage on in Ukraine. Aside from donating a little cash, I feel like I'm pacing the sidelines, unable to do anything but keep up with news reports. So I daydream about making my own story, fighting the good fight, or better yet, a game that allows me to live in that fantasy. In that regards I do have a game pitch to sell to a developer like Naughty Dog. A game like the Last of Us: a linear storyline with survival gameplay mechanics.
It would be inspired by Man on Fire, Apocalypse Now, and Going After Cacciato. Basically a revenge story but mixed with alt-history fantasy of trying to survive in a major warzone as an average citizen.
Prologue: You start out as a normal Ukrainian dad, with wife and a couple of kids, living in Odesa. You have a normal office type job, possibly a software engineer, someone moderately well off but not an exceptional individual. A typical Ukrainian everyman. There are rumors of the Russian invasion but you are blowing it off as just a political scare and not a real threat. Which is shattered on Feb 24th and you quickly have to scramble on a plan to evacuate your family and figure out what you are going to be doing. A tearful goodbye to your family as you ship them off on a bus ride to Lviv and eventually over the border to Poland (with an Easter egg of [mention=593]Brisketexan[/mention]'s kid handing out breakfast burritos and chatting up the ladies in the background). The local militia doesn't have any concrete plans for you so you take the opportunity to go check on the rest of your family: your parents and your brother living in Kherson.
Act 1: As you journey east, you keep checking on news updates as you struggle to figure out what is going on and what best to do. Tidbits of news are dropped at different checkpoints. Finally making it into Kherson you find your parent but your brother has already moved east to report to duty in Mariupol. After a long discussion you can't convince them to evacuate, they think they are safe as long as they don't do anything wrong. You decide to push on to Mariupol to find your brother. Now you are starting to see more of war first hand, Russian troops are setting up checkpoints, you are seeing protestors stymy the invaders, some light shelling of cars and residents, and you are having to be more careful moving east. Eventually you make your way to Mariupol only to find it surrounded and under siege. You manage to find your way in, making connections with resistance groups and running various missions to help civilians in need while you still are trying to figure out what happened to your brother. You get to witness first hand some of brutality as you are still not enlisted to fight but simply someone trying to help people where needed. You are running around, bedding down in various places each night, meeting new people and hearing their stories when you get captured by a couple of Russians. They are marching you back when you get rescued by a couple of Azov guys and your...brother.
 
Act 2: Reunited with your sibling you find he's been learning from a few of the Azov guys and fighting throughout the city but everything is clamping down. Morale is down and while many are still steadfast they understand if people can get out then they won't hold it against them. So y'all hear about some of the humanitarian corridors and plan to sneak out that way but witness first hand the Russians reneging on the deal. It becomes one clusterfuck after another, sneaking through lines, but finally escaping from the city only to find y'all bouncing from town to town, trying to stay clear of the heavy action. You get picked up by a couple of Ukrainian soldiers making a resupply run to Sievierodonetsk where you connect with the other defensive forces in the area. Again caught in the action, you are running small missions supporting the regular ops teams, and learning to handle rifles and seeing NLAWS in action. Everything seems to be holding fine when a Russian artillery barrage catches everyone by surprise. Y'all are both knocked unconscious and wake up to find yourself firmly behind Russian lines as POWs. Also with you is a Russian deserter who is being held for refusing to fight. Between torture sessions that you and your brother are going through, you find out more of the perspective of the Russian soldier - originally a conscript deceived into signing a contact and never quite understood the full magnitude of the "special operation". Things are looking bleak when a counterattack levels part of the base and all 3 of y'all manage to escape. Deep in enemy territory y'all continue to evade forces until a Ukrainian drone strike ends up killing your brother. Now its just you and the deserter in a full panic fire drill.
 
Act 3: Y'all manage to escape to a calm zone. You are crushed, seeing your brother fragged right in front of your eyes. You are sick of all the bullshit witnessed first hand and you see the only way to make it stop is to cut the head off the snake --- kill Putin. The Russian is sick of the war too and he just wants to go home. So y'all concoct a new plan: help each other get through Russia until y'all reach his hometown of Kursk. Once there you will be on your own to infiltrate Moscow and perform the impossible. Y'all do make it to Kursk and you get to meet his parents with you disguised as a fellow soldier that was "released" from duty. However his parents are full propaganda swallowers and don't believe their own son's description of the war. Sick of his refusal to fight they kick y'all out. Now he is crushed too and decides to join you on the crazy assassination mission. Working into Moscow you do find out that there is a growing resistance movement upset about all of the crackdowns ("Once you have taken away our voices all we have left are our fists"). Y'all manage to hook up with this group and take on some sabotage missions and getting some precious intel on Putin's estate. With the resistance growing into a full bloom near civil war, you and the Russian deserter manage to make it into the compound. Putin's security forces are lighter than normal due to either busy dealing with protesters/resistance attacks or simply being paid off/jumping ship due to Putin's treatment, you have a slim chance of success.  Artfully working your way through the compound, hiding under dramatically long tables, you manage to take out the guards and corner Putin where you proceed to: Bash. His. Disgusting. Goblin. Face. In.
 
Epilogue: Once the climatic thrill of the kill subsides, you and your new Russian buddy realize it is not going fix everything but it is a big step to ending this nonsensical war. You invite him back to your home, to start up a new life in Ukraine, and rebuild from this misery. Y'all leave Moscow with Z symbols crashing down or being burned away to make it back to Kyiv where you wife and kids are returned. After a nice tearful reunion, the whole gang loads up in a car for a road trip back to Odesa, with new uncle Yuri laughing it up with your kids.
 
So yeah a full-fledged happy ending but hopefully a sobering journey through the helplessness of war. Gameplay is not going to be a Call of Duty run-n-gun type of action game but more focused on stealth and survival against the backdrop of a near total war. There should be enough time to meet the other common citizens caught in the crossfires and to hear their personal stories.  The first half of the game could be very factual, including real events from the conflict so that those stories are not forgotten. Plus interspersed nuggets such as the Bucha massacres to highlight that this is the first major war to fully include social media. Towards the midpoint it will veer into alt-history territory, where we can imagine your little journey becoming this epic assassination mission. At a meta level the story would have an underlying theme of how media/propaganda can be manipulated. Gamers should check out the events in the game and try to figure out which events were based on real moments and which ones were just pure fiction. Because one thing is very clear about this entire war: manipulating the propaganda to entice the population is dangerous enough, but for Putin to buy-in so deeply as well is catastrophic. Not all Russians buy-in to this nonsense but enough do to make this war possible. Getting people to (rationally) think for themselves is an important first defense against willful misinformation.
 
 

Tl;dr
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Bevo

Bevo 13577

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1 hour ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

France is Frenching and Germany is cunting. 

I think the board was hoping for Macron to win elections in France because Macron would give more support to Ukraine than the opposition candidate.

 

 

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956 Worldwide

956 Worldwide 34715

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8 hours ago, Grade of D as in David said:

Fuck Emanuel, it let's negotiate. Give Russia France if they leave Ukraine.

The article by Ondrej Kundra is a good one. The key to understanding Putin is that he will engage in diplomacy only if he thinks he can get a better deal that way than on the battlefield or by other subversive or hostile means.  He’s completely insensitive to Ukrainian lives, of course, and more or less insensitive to the damage he inflicts on Russians. The moment you notice that Putin is serious about negotiations is the moment you know he thinks he’s going to lose. 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105139

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The article by Ondrej Kundra is a good one. The key to understanding Putin is that he will engage in diplomacy only if he thinks he can get a better deal that way than on the battlefield or by other subversive or hostile means.  He’s completely insensitive to Ukrainian lives, of course, and more or less insensitive to the damage he inflicts on Russians. The moment you notice that Putin is serious about negotiations is the moment you know he thinks he’s going to lose. 

This. I posted above about some opponents who you have to defeat, either into total submission or who you have to bloody so badly that they seek peace (but they won’t seek it until they see that they are likely to suffer a brutal outcome). That is a real way of thinking. It’s stupid and destructive, but real. So….you have to fight brutally until those conditions are met. That’s it. That’s the entire game. You trying to play it any other way is how you lose.
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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11819

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30 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:


This. I posted above about some opponents who you have to defeat, either into total submission or who you have to bloody so badly that they seek peace (but they won’t seek it until they see that they are likely to suffer a brutal outcome). That is a real way of thinking. It’s stupid and destructive, but real. So….you have to fight brutally until those conditions are met. That’s it. That’s the entire game. You trying to play it any other way is how you lose.

The Ukrainian people understand this.   They have been, and continue to be brutalized by a schizophrenic big brother.   

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105139

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The Ukrainian people understand this.   They have been, and continue to be brutalized by a schizophrenic big brother.   

Exactly. They know their enemy very well. Better than the west does. We should learn from their experience and perspective.
We made the fatal mistake of assuming our enemy was just like us, values things like we do, etc. Russian perspective - particularly when it’s on speed, like Putin’s - is more alien to western perspective and thinking than the Chinese, or Iranian, or Turkish perspectives. The Russian way is super-unique….and very fucked up. Centuries of history backs that up. We should read some of it.
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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11819

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2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:


Exactly. They know their enemy very well. Better than the west does. We should learn from their experience and perspective.
We made the fatal mistake of assuming our enemy was just like us, values things like we do, etc. Russian perspective - particularly when it’s on speed, like Putin’s - is more alien to western perspective and thinking than the Chinese, or Iranian, or Turkish perspectives. The Russian way is super-unique….and very fucked up. Centuries of history backs that up. We should read some of it.

I had the good fortune to study under some really unique people at our Alma Mater.   One valuable thing I learned is that our values don’t necessarily translate.   You can ship all the tractors you want over to India, but their biggest resource is manpower and those tractors not only don’t feed people, they take away jobs.    

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MillerEP

MillerEP 30455

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The spontaneous market of Mariupol, where people sell everything they have left to survive

Watching in our online cinema is free, but for the "ticket" you can leave as much as you appreciate our work.
 The artist should not be hungry, the artist needs money for paints)
 Details of our artists' union https://t.me/valerii_markus/572

Occupied Popasna, Luhansk region.

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InkaUtexas

InkaUtexas 25938

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Just want to say this thread kicks ass. Perhaps the best one we have maintained on the Surl. Hats off to those who contribute meaningful information. Great coverage on all components of the war. Makes me proud to be a Longhorn. Smart surly basteges. 

@MillerEP

@atomheartbevo

@956 Worldwide

If I forgot ya, sorry, day drinking to get ready for the Texas game. Let's keep it up. There is a good CR thread as well. But this one kicks ass. 

Hook Em! 

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956 Worldwide

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1 minute ago, InkaUtexas said:

Just want to say this thread kicks ass. Perhaps the best one we have maintained on the Surl. Hats off to those who contribute meaningful information. Great coverage on all components of the war. Makes me proud to be a Longhorn. Smart surly basteges. 

@MillerEP

@atomheartbevo

@956 Worldwide

If I forgot ya, sorry, day drinking to get ready for the Texas game. Let's keep it up. There is a good CR thread as well. But this one kicks ass. 

Hook Em! 

I’m not a Longhorn but glad to be a Surly Bastard. Good luck agains the east coast hillbillies. 

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